Is religion ruining today's soceity?

[F32]

Well, religion has had alot of press lately in different forms; but has it gone too far?

Religion used to mean you believed in different things and such, but now it's turning into an excuse for everything.

Is it right for muslims to tell us British how to run our christian-led country?

We don't go over to Pakistan and tell them what to do, do we?

I'm sure it's like this in the USA.

So, the question of today is... Is religion ruining today's soceity?

[RedStratocas]

We don't go over to Pakistan and tell them what to do, do we?

Actually, we do.

[benjamin]

yes, in my opinion it is causing the main conflict in the world

[F32]

Actually, we do.
Really?

You got an article on this or anything? Could be an interesting read.

[YoManGo!]

Yo dude, Pakistan is an ally of the west... Sayin'
Today's society has ruined religion and caused its current state.

[@xP]

Religion is gay, how can someone be special and magic.. no one to day is its all made up.

[YoManGo!]

Religion is gay, how can someone be special and magic.. no one to day is its all made up.
Prove it
I have an Irish great-aunt who claims to have been visited by the Virgin Mary, we all reckon she'd had a few too many, but how can we say she's wrong?

[benjamin]

Prove it
I have an Irish great-aunt who claims to have been visited by the Virgin Mary, we all reckon she'd had a few too many, but how can we say she's wrong?
you can quite easily say she's wrong if you don't believe in the virgin mary.

[RedStratocas]

Really?

You got an article on this or anything? Could be an interesting read.

Here (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,251-2369505,00.html). By "we" I mean the U.S.

[Smiddy]

Of course Religion is a factor or ruining today's soceity, it always has been. Atheist Philosophers used to be *Can't actually remember, am sure FlyingJesus will fill it in* i think, sent away from the country if they gave anti-theist views.

Today it's more inter-religious "battles" though, and I don't see why we should (or they should) have to change the grounds which our countries were formed upon to become less racist, it's not racism, it's being patriotic. -.-

[YoManGo!]

Most 'inter-religious' battles aren't fought over religious views, they're fought over issues to do with intergration in communities, it has very little to do with religion, asides from the fact the sides have generally different religions, which doesn't come into the argument.

Religion is a pretty nice scapegoat tbh.

[F32]

What will become of this religious "war" - will one religion be superior to all or will we all become athiests?

[Smiddy]

Most 'inter-religious' battles aren't fought over religious views, they're fought over issues to do with intergration in communities, it has very little to do with religion, asides from the fact the sides have generally different religions, which doesn't come into the argument.

Religion is a pretty nice scapegoat tbh.
I was using battle as a metaphor for ethnic disputes, hence the "'s!

Religion is defiantly a scapegoat.

[summer]

without religion there would be no war.

but you can never get rid of religion.

[YoManGo!]

I was using battle as a metaphor for ethnic disputes, hence the "'s!

Religion is defiantly a scapegoat.

yeah, that wasn't an attack at you or anything
i just think (like you??) that the main problem is people think the arguments are about religion when they're not.


without religion there would be no war.

but you can never get rid of religion.

yeah...
neither of the world wars were about religion
the war Britain and America are in at the moment has nothing to do with religion
unless you count ancient crusades as wars, a small proportion of wars are about religion

make sure you know what you're typing about is correct!

[Smiddy]

without religion there would be no war.

but you can never get rid of religion.
This is very true. Unfortuantly.

yeah, that wasn't an attack at you or anything
i just think (like you??) that the main problem is people think the arguments are about religion when they're not.
Fair enough. And yeah that is also what I think.

What will become of this religious "war" - will one religion be superior to all or will we all become athiests?
There's always been "superior" religions by the amount of people who believe in them, always has been, always will be. If it does all turn to Atheism, then some wise crack will try to be clever and rediscover religion. :)

[joshuar]

I am strong athesist, and believe that religion should be scrapped. I know this won't happen, but I don't think its right that people worship a "higher being".

[F32]

Athiesm, in my opinion, should take over.

Then we can have sensible laws.

[YoManGo!]

@joshuarr: actually god came down in the form of Jesus so he could live just like a human being, 'to serve, not to be served upon.'

Seriously, get your facts right, people!

[F32]

Do you have any proof of this?

The only proof you have is a book; that some guy wrote one day when he was bored.

[Smiddy]

Would you honestly want a set rule for the whole of the world?

That's half the fun of this world, the fact there is so many different rules for different countries, some we frown upon, some we absolutely adore and wish we could have.
Athiesm, in my opinion, should take over.

Then we can have sensible laws.

[YoManGo!]

I don't want to believe in Atheism.
I'm not religious, but I'm certainly a spiritual kinda person, who's to say Atheism would bring more sensible rules? What does religion actually have to do with any rules in the majority of the world?

[joshuar]

Yeah I took the end bit out. I thought people could think a way around it, so I took it away.

But I do strongly believe that religion should go, but I don't say "Your sick" if you do believe in a religion, as its your choice.

[YoManGo!]

Of course it's your choice.
My problem with these arguments is you can't possibly prove anything, and then people turn to insults and try to act informed about religions and make themselves look stupid.
Plus, any Science loyalists will surely know the point of Science is to prove something correct, not incorrect, surely?

[F32]

We don't need proof to say that religion isn't real, all you have is books; we have common sense.

Why would one dude decide to build a world one day?

[YoManGo!]

Why wouldn't he?

[Smiddy]

We don't need proof to say that religion isn't real, all you have is books; we have common sense.

Why would one dude decide to build a world one day?
Does your common sense match his Omnipotent presense?

There is quite logical idea's behind god, but I quite like the problem of evil argument, why would an omnibenvolent/omnipotent god create a world with evil, or even just stop it?

Why should he, what have we ever done for him? Caused him problems, aren't we great.

[FlyingJesus]

Of course Religion is a factor or ruining today's soceity, it always has been. Atheist Philosophers used to be *Can't actually remember, am sure FlyingJesus will fill it in* i think, sent away from the country if they gave anti-theist views.

Unlikely that the rulers of the times would bother trying to deport them, as it's quite easy to get smuggled about in the ancient world. Most likely they'd have been executed instead (like Socrates was, by stoning, for "corrupting the youth of Athens" with his athiest teachings).

I don't think religion "ruins" things, it is rather the fact that leaders use religion to stage their own actions in a supposedly divine arena. Like YoManGo!, I am not religious but am interested in all things spiritual. I'm an active agnostic (that is, I do enjoy the study of religion and philosophy, and use it to further my knowledge and understanding of life in general), hence it is my belief that each religion holds some sort of key to the truth, but no one earthly religion has got anything like the full true story.

Religion is one of the most interesting things that exist in the world, and no offense to those who hold the view I'm about to denounce but I think that to say that religion should be abolished is about as useful as saying that we should destroy all history books.


edit: in reference to the theory that the presence of evil counters the existence of a benevolent god, I would answer that as I stated above, no earthly religion has it quite right. Why does this god character have to be benevolent? I certainly wouldn't be if I was a god.

[YoManGo!]

Does your common sense match his Omnipotent presense?

There is quite logical idea's behind god, but I quite like the problem of evil argument, why would an omnibenvolent/omnipotent god create a world with evil, or even just stop it?

Why should he, what have we ever done for him? Caused him problems, aren't we great.

Who said this is an omnibenvolent/omnipotent god?

[F32]

This is what makes the discussion of religion so great.

Different people have different views & conflicts which makes excellent discussions.

I am an athiest through & through.

But, there's questions that need answering really.

So, back onto the topic at hand; what will become of the world?

[Smiddy]

Unlikely that the rulers of the times would bother trying to deport them, as it's quite easy to get smuggled about in the ancient world. Most likely they'd have been executed instead (like Socrates was, by stoning, for "corrupting the youth of Athens" with his athiest teachings).

edit: in reference to the theory that the presence of evil counters the existence of a benevolent god, I would answer that as I stated above, no earthly religion has it quite right. Why does this god character have to be benevolent? I certainly wouldn't be if I was a god.
Ah yeah, that's the 1. Slipped my mind!

Indeed, that was pretty much what I was trying to say with my reply to it.

Who said this is an omnibenvolent/omnipotent god?
Who's proved there isn't 1? people who do believe in christian (depending on their own views) do believe God is perfect, this would require him to be omnibenevolent/potent/present/whatever! If God was perfect, why would he create evil?

[YoManGo!]

So, back onto the topic at hand; what will become of the world?

Starbucks finally take over in about 20 years, you can stop worrying then.


Anyway, you should never abolish religion, as it gives hope to the most vulnerable people on Earth, if and old lady or any lonely person can find consolidation in religion surely it is a force for good?

[FlyingJesus]

This is what makes the discussion of religion so great.

Different people have different views & conflicts which makes excellent discussions.

I am an athiest through & through.

But, there's questions that need answering really.

So, back onto the topic at hand; what will become of the world?

No offense to your atheist views, but from this thread it does seem that you only take the Christian God into account when trying to "prove" the nonexistence of such a being. I'm all for religious debate, and if (as that post appears to state) you also enjoy such discussion, I would suggest that you read up on other religions.

As I said, that's not meant in an offensive way like "GO LEARN STUFF", just a suggestion if you do find the topic interesting, as I do.

[YoManGo!]

Mmm I have to say it's a bit silly going out all guns blazing with the 'I'm a trve atheist' without (seeming!) to know much about the facts/other sides of the argument.


Who's proved there isn't 1? people who do believe in christian (depending on their own views) do believe God is perfect, this would require him to be omnibenevolent/potent/present/whatever! If God was perfect, why would he create evil?

many reasons! generally people believe He created evil to test us.

[F32]

as interesting as religion is to read up on; i fail to see the realism into it.

that's where my views come from.

[FlyingJesus]

To give a really annoying argument (and one which I don't believe can actually be countered successfully), it can be said that as God (meaning the Christian divine being) is omnipotent, He can overcome paradoxes and therefore do things which we would see as otherwise impossible. To take your example, He could create evil and still be perfect because He can do anything at all, with no exception.

This works for any argument against Christianity, and it's a bit of a boring one (and not one that I really believe myself), but it certainly does work as an impenetrable defence.

[YoManGo!]

as interesting as religion is to read up on; i fail to see the realism into it.

that's where my views come from.

you don't have to believe it to show a bit of respect for people.

[F32]

Of course I show respect to people's beliefs.

[YoManGo!]

from some of your earlier posts you'd think otherwise
''all you have is books, we have common sense''
common sense has nothing to do with it, it's something you either choose to believe or not, there's no right or wrong choice.

[:Hazel]

for some people religion plays a huge part- and they can make it that way by following a certain relgion; others it doesnt really affect them in their every day to day lives.

[YoManGo!]

for some people religion plays a huge part- and they can make it that way by following a certain relgion; others it doesnt really affect them in their every day to day lives.

that's erm... a nice look at different attitudes to religion
w.e i've lost my groove and drive to have religious arguments for tonight. i'll be back tomorrow im sure.

[:Hazel]

that's erm... a nice look at different attitudes to religion
w.e i've lost my groove and drive to have religious arguments for tonight. i'll be back tomorrow im sure.

basically religion and all that don't affect me i don't believe in anything or have any strong views towards it.

[YoManGo!]

ah i get you know
it just sounded like you were saying ''some people have religion and some people don't'' heh.