New Rule please (Runescape Topic)

[DarkPharoh]

I have, like most of us recieved a pm saying you have recieved a black mark or w/e. Althought few (if any) of us care they build up and we can become banned. Is that fair considering we're trying to prevent scamming?

It would be nice if we were allowed to call people scammers in order to warn others.

Edited by Elkaa (Forum Moderator): Moved from Runescape to Questions/Comments about Habbox due to the nature of the topic.

[Elkaa]

Hey DarkPharoh,

They're called warning, or infractions. The reason we do not allowed "name and shame" on the Forum is because, if we did, then the entire section would be full of people calling one and other scammers, and nobody would get anywhere. It would be a very unpleasent place and people wouldn't like to visit. Would you like to be called a scammer, even if you're inocent?

If you do name and shame, you will be either warned by PM, given a formal warning or an infraction. Once you gain so many of these, your account will be banned from posting for a certain number of days.

You can talk to other users by PM about who to trust, but the public posting of, and naming a scammer is not allowed. :)

Elkaa (Moderator)

[Braniac]

even if we show proof we get infractions it's rediculous!

[Elkaa]

even if we show proof we get infractions it's rediculous!

Proof can easily be edited, meaning that it is not solid.

[Sly]

I don`t think we r as sad as u think we r.
We only call people scammers when they rly do scam

[DarkPharoh]

I don`t think we r as sad as u think we r.
We only call people scammers when they rly do scam

exactly

[raspberrys]

Elkaa, have you even tried out letting us name scammers?

Just give it a trial, see what happens.

[Elkaa]

I don`t think we r as sad as u think we r.
We only call people scammers when they rly do scam

Never called you sad, never insinuated that you were sad - Your words, not mine.

Re-read my first post and it explains some reasons why it is not allowed.


Elkaa, have you even tried out letting us name scammers?

Just give it a trial, see what happens.

I believe this was tried in the past, and didn't work. Now that YouHeard has become a Super Moderator, it means that I am on my lone-some in this section of the Forum (obviously with the support of the Smod team). What I have noticed already is the alarming amount of people that post about scammers, and even more the people who post the other person scammed, just because person A said that person B did.

I trial would result in 30 threads a day being made about someone being a scammer, or someone being safe and then called a scammer. Your best plan is to put ALOT of thought into the Safe Traders thread and try to work off that.

Even if you choose to ignore all that, it is not in my power to remove a rule in a section, even for a trial.

[Redmoon Evil]

Proof can easily be edited, meaning that it is not solid.

It cannot be easily edited, it can be edited but it will take a good few hours to get fool proof even for the most experianced of artists,

and we should be allowed to have our say, would you rather loads of people getting scammed and getting well depressed and crap, or rather only 100% n00** getting scammed and a few less trade being made.

now I know the above sentence didn't make total sense but if your have a brain you can probabily understand what I am saying

[Elkaa]

It cannot be easily edited, it can be edited but it will take a good few hours to get fool proof even for the most experianced of artists,

and we should be allowed to have our say, would you rather loads of people getting scammed and getting well depressed and crap, or rather only 100% n00** getting scammed and a few less trade being made.

now I know the above sentence didn't make total sense but if your have a brain you can probabily understand what I am saying

That is exactly why I suggested putting effort into the Safe List, and making that work. You have 99% more chance of that working, than you do of protesting for the Name and Shame rule to be lifted.

[raspberrys]

Create a 'name scammers' forum - let people post their expieriences, and not moderate it - it is then the users choice to trust a certain user.

[Redmoon Evil]

Good reply, the thing with the trusted list would be that if the person is persistant he/she could probabily get on, the thing what you tried before was highering the bar like so much proof needed the problem with this is if the bar is too high no one will be on it like in the past.

Really were neve going to rid the scammers even if we can name and shame them, trades can be done over pm and if the scammer picks the right target he will be able to pull it off without anyone saying so and so scams
--------------------------------

I've totally gone back on my previous post but oh well thats just me I change my mind all the time lmao

[Jord]

I don`t think we r as sad as u think we r.
We only call people scammers when they rly do scam

You readmy mine bbz.

[raspberrys]

Also, i think if someone has screenshot or video proof of someone scamming - people should be able to post picture and video proof of a scammer.

If there is no proof of scamming, the thread is void.

[Rashelly]

To be fair, Elkaa, the runescape is already a " very unpleasent place" since the rules of account selling have been changed.
This forum used to be a lot different, it used to to be very tight community full of trustworthy members, besides a few, but now the forum is just full of scammers.
And another point I have to add - the safe list. It isn't a good idea, and has been done, and deleted before. People abuse their status when they're on the safe list, I hear countless stories of people on the safe list who have scammed...It just isn't accurate, and no one should refer to it as a good way to trade.

I think, the only way to stop all this scamming, is to just stop all RL, cross game trading all together. I know habbox wont do that, because it'll mean the runescape section wont get used as much. But it's fairly hypocritical of them, they don't allow habbox accounts to be sold/traded etc, but allow habbo and runescape to be - which are against the rules of Habbo and Jagex.

It's only a matter of time before habbox hears from Jagex or Sulake (if they haven't done so already) I know that this forum has been reported by many runescape player mods, and probably other people.

As for naming scammers, I think it's a bad idea, there are some very untrustworthy people out there, who will just scam and accuse the other person of scamming, and there really isnt any proof that can't be edited.

Sorry for the long post, I rambled on.

[Elkaa]

Create a 'name scammers' forum - let people post their expieriences, and not moderate it - it is then the users choice to trust a certain user.

The absolute moment you mentioned don't moderate it, the post was never going to happen. No moderation = No rules.


Good reply, the thing with the trusted list would be that if the person is persistant he/she could probabily get on, the thing what you tried before was highering the bar like so much proof needed the problem with this is if the bar is too high no one will be on it like in the past.

Really were neve going to rid the scammers even if we can name and shame them, trades can be done over pm and if the scammer picks the right target he will be able to pull it off without anyone saying so and so scams
--------------------------------

I've totally gone back on my previous post but oh well thats just me I change my mind all the time lmao

Trust is earnt, not given. Even with a trusted list, the person trading would still need to trust that person. It might help abit, though, if the rules for getting on it were strict.


You readmy mine bbz.

See my above post.


Also, i think if someone has screenshot or video proof of someone scamming - people should be able to post picture and video proof of a scammer.

If there is no proof of scamming, the thread is void.

Screenshots can be edited in a matter of seconds. Videos can be edited in a matter of hours. No matter which way you swing it, it can be edited, and as such, could result in honest people being called a scammer.


To be fair, Elkaa, the runescape is already a " very unpleasent place" since the rules of account selling have been changed.
This forum used to be a lot different, it used to to be very tight community full of trustworthy members, besides a few, but now the forum is just full of scammers.
And another point I have to add - the safe list. It isn't a good idea, and has been done, and deleted before. People abuse their status when they're on the safe list, I hear countless stories of people on the safe list who have scammed...It just isn't accurate, and no one should refer to it as a good way to trade.

I think, the only way to stop all this scamming, is to just stop all RL, cross game trading all together. I know habbox wont do that, because it'll mean the runescape section wont get used as much. But it's fairly hypocritical of them, they don't allow habbox accounts to be sold/traded etc, but allow habbo and runescape to be - which are against the rules of Habbo and Jagex.

It's only a matter of time before habbox hears from Jagex or Sulake (if they haven't done so already) I know that this forum has been reported by many runescape player mods, and probably other people.

As for naming scammers, I think it's a bad idea, there are some very untrustworthy people out there, who will just scam and accuse the other person of scamming, and there really isnt any proof that can't be edited.

Sorry for the long post, I rambled on.

You make alot of good points there. I would just like to correct that Habbo account trades, are not allowed.

With regards to what you've written, and think that the Trusted list has alot of positives, but also alot of negatives. It's hard to say whether it would be a bad idea, so long as it was managed correctly. So much of each trade, relys on the user trusting the other user. As, even if you had the safe list and someone scammed who was on the safe list - How would they get removed? Remember; you wouldn't be able to name the scammer, still.

As for the trading of Runescape accounts, or Runescape money for real money - I can't comment on that.

[Teh Wub]

Well after what happened over serenity - This forum is dead meat. I think that the whole trading section should be deleted. People only use it to sell member pins and accounts which is against the rules apart from that most people use runescapecommunity or the runescape forums. Personally - to save habboxforum and the runescape section the trading section should go. Also, scammers will think - darn i cant scam, off to fagex.

Also rach about the trusted members ages ago. Ezzie, Sean(Other one), Mark and so on. Those were the days. But i think after mark pulled off that big fake video and screenie everyone was like.. woah. So no effidence is true or not. The safe list is pathetic. People like Devils_eyes Got on that list and he/her is a total.. So i think SUPER MODS' should put people they know or have 10+ vouches with proof to be put onto it.

I think there should be a STICKIED thread for people who scam (with proof) so that we can name and shame people. This thread wont be needed if we hijack the Trading section.




To be fair, Elkaa, the runescape is already a " very unpleasent place" since the rules of account selling have been changed.
This forum used to be a lot different, it used to to be very tight community full of trustworthy members, besides a few, but now the forum is just full of scammers.
And another point I have to add - the safe list. It isn't a good idea, and has been done, and deleted before. People abuse their status when they're on the safe list, I hear countless stories of people on the safe list who have scammed...It just isn't accurate, and no one should refer to it as a good way to trade.

I think, the only way to stop all this scamming, is to just stop all RL, cross game trading all together. I know habbox wont do that, because it'll mean the runescape section wont get used as much. But it's fairly hypocritical of them, they don't allow habbox accounts to be sold/traded etc, but allow habbo and runescape to be - which are against the rules of Habbo and Jagex.

It's only a matter of time before habbox hears from Jagex or Sulake (if they haven't done so already) I know that this forum has been reported by many runescape player mods, and probably other people.

As for naming scammers, I think it's a bad idea, there are some very untrustworthy people out there, who will just scam and accuse the other person of scamming, and there really isnt any proof that can't be edited.

Sorry for the long post, I rambled on.

[Rashelly]

Well after what happened over serenity - This forum is dead meat. I think that the whole trading section should be deleted. People only use it to sell member pins and accounts which is against the rules apart from that most people use runescapecommunity or the runescape forums. Personally - to save habboxforum and the runescape section the trading section should go. Also, scammers will think - darn i cant scam, off to fagex.

Also rach about the trusted members ages ago. Ezzie, Sean(Other one), Mark and so on. Those were the days. But i think after mark pulled off that big fake video and screenie everyone was like.. woah. So no effidence is true or not. The safe list is pathetic. People like Devils_eyes Got on that list and he/her is a total.. So i think SUPER MODS' should put people they know or have 10+ vouches with proof to be put onto it.

I think there should be a STICKIED thread for people who scam (with proof) so that we can name and shame people. This thread wont be needed if we hijack the Trading section.

I agree, even though I don't know who you are...Unless you're under a different name?

[Teh Wub]

I agree, even though I don't know who you are...Unless you're under a different name?

Benn :) They changed my name so there sorting it out at the moment. And Elkaa im waiting for a reply. :8

[Elkaa]

Also rach about the trusted members ages ago. Ezzie, Sean(Other one), Mark and so on. Those were the days. But i think after mark pulled off that big fake video and screenie everyone was like.. woah. So no effidence is true or not. The safe list is pathetic. People like Devils_eyes Got on that list and he/her is a total.. So i think SUPER MODS' should put people they know or have 10+ vouches with proof to be put onto it.

I think there should be a STICKIED thread for people who scam (with proof) so that we can name and shame people. This thread wont be needed if we hijack the Trading section.

Unfortuntely with what you just posted, you gave the flaw in having a sticky where people can post about scammers. No proof is solid, and that is one of the reasons name and shame is not allowed. Also, how do you mean hijack the section?


Benn :) They changed my name so there sorting it out at the moment. And Elkaa im waiting for a reply. :8

Give me chance, lol - Trying to keep involved with this thread, but I do also have a job to do on the Forum! :P

[Teh Wub]

I suppose about your first point. I mean hijack as in get rid of, i should of just said that shouldnt i? But i really think serenity and jagex are going to put an complaint in sooner or later. Watch this space.


Unfortuntely with what you just posted, you gave the flaw in having a sticky where people can post about scammers. No proof is solid, and that is one of the reasons name and shame is not allowed. Also, how do you mean hijack the section?

[Elkaa]

I suppose about your first point. I mean hijack as in get rid of, i should of just said that shouldnt i? But i really think serenity and jagex are going to put an complaint in sooner or later. Watch this space.

I thought you meant spam the Forum - My appologies, I was getting ready for a hell of a night! :P

With regards to Jagex getting a complaint in, that's another thing I can not comment on, as I do not deal with that.

[Teh Wub]

Haha, as regarding the jagex - your job as a moderator would be loss. Surely you would feel downfallen by that? You can stop this but to be honest, your only a moderator somone with higher power needs to deal with this situation.


I thought you meant spam the Forum - My appologies, I was getting ready for a hell of a night! :P

With regards to Jagex getting a complaint in, that's another thing I can not comment on, as I do not deal with that.

[Elkaa]

Haha, as regarding the jagex - your job as a moderator would be loss. Surely you would feel downfallen by that? You can stop this but to be honest, your only a moderator somone with higher power needs to deal with this situation.

I've forwarded this thread to a SMod to take a look at, but I feel they are going to say the same that I have, through my various replies. I also think I should of moved this to Habbox Comments/Questions about.. 15 posts ago? :P

[Teh Wub]

Hah, so you are a funny moderator when you want to be huh :P. Yes this is more of an debate rather than a "Do this or ill do that" type of thread. Thanks for your replys and +rep for being understandable :)


I've forwarded this thread to a SMod to take a look at, but I feel they are going to say the same that I have, through my various replies. I also think I should of moved this to Habbox Comments/Questions about.. 15 posts ago? :P

[Elkaa]

Not a problem. We're here for more than just being the mean guys who dish out infractions and warnings!

Moved to Questions about Habbox. :)

[Teh Wub]

Yeh i think some people think the same. Harlot = Conorx, Benn = Me

(22:26:39) <+Benn> Elkaa is quite nice.
(22:27:40) <+Conorx> He doesnt give infractions
(22:27:43) <+Conorx> he just gives u a om
(22:27:44) <+Conorx> saying
(22:27:51) <+Conorx> *** iv had to edit 14 of ur posts today
(22:27:53) <+Conorx> stop spammin
(22:29:07) <+Benn> He nice aye connor
(22:29:09) <+Benn> Better than alex.
(22:29:13) <+Benn> COGUH
(22:30:03) <+Conorx> much beter
(22:30:26) <+Benn> Yeh, and he actualy listens to what i say and gives me a decent answer.

Goodluck for the future.


Not a problem. We're here for more than just being the mean guys who dish out infractions and warnings!

Moved to Questions about Habbox. :)

[Neversoft]

^ He does give infractions. I got one from him when he first became a mod. -.-


Moved to Questions about Habbox. :)

You're not suppost to leave redirects. Well, when I was a moderator we had to PM the thread starter and tell them their thread had been moved. Dunno if it's different now.

[Seren]

We were allowed to name scammers before, it wasn't very fun. Many people got wrongly accused and then had their rep ruined because of these false accusations.


I have, like most of us recieved a pm saying you have recieved a black mark or w/e. Althought few (if any) of us care they build up and we can become banned. Is that fair considering we're trying to prevent scamming?

It would be nice if we were allowed to call people scammers in order to warn others.

Edited by Elkaa (Forum Moderator): Moved from Runescape to Questions/Comments about Habbox due to the nature of the topic.

Because proof can easily be tampered with.


even if we show proof we get infractions it's rediculous!

Not all the time.


I don`t think we r as sad as u think we r.
We only call people scammers when they rly do scam

Many of us have seen what happens. The Runescape section is already ruined. The trading accounts idea was crap and now increased the number of scams.


Elkaa, have you even tried out letting us name scammers?

Just give it a trial, see what happens.

You don't really need to be good at pixel art and what not to fake a scam. It may take hours but believe me, some people will do it. They have before, I could easily fake a scam right now and make it look like I have solid proof.

If you see someone you know that scams and are trying to scam again, simply PM the user to let them know that they have a good chance of being scammed. That will save you the infraction.


It cannot be easily edited, it can be edited but it will take a good few hours to get fool proof even for the most experianced of artists,

and we should be allowed to have our say, would you rather loads of people getting scammed and getting well depressed and crap, or rather only 100% n00** getting scammed and a few less trade being made.

now I know the above sentence didn't make total sense but if your have a brain you can probabily understand what I am saying

That's an okish idea I suppose, it could be like the "report serious rulebreakers" forum Habbox have where Smods+ deal with some issues that normal mods can't. I can't see it happening though.


Create a 'name scammers' forum - let people post their expieriences, and not moderate it - it is then the users choice to trust a certain user.

Hey Benn xD.


Benn :) They changed my name so there sorting it out at the moment. And Elkaa im waiting for a reply. :8






All in all, the naming scammers thing is a bad idea. As I said before, back in '05 and early '06 we were allowed to name scammers but every trade thread had "blah blah scams" so it was pot luck if you had a successful trade.

[:Jamie]

And so there is once again another thread about this, sticky a topic already about it?

[deagle]

Pictures arent good proof, as you said, edited in a matter of minutes


Videos are edited in a matter of hours. So make them post proof in a matter of minutes then. If its not posted in less than 10 minutes, invalid.

And trading account idea, I wasnt on the forum for a while and didnt see it coming. I think its the most stupid idea yet.(keeping scams down)
In my own gains, no one is trading pins anymore
For other people, more people are getting scammed.


And whos this Serenity. Seems like to you that person is very important?

[le harry]

It's pretty easy to tell if somebody is going to scam you ^.^, just make a "is that person trusted" thread in the RS section, usually the people who have been scammed by him will be more then happy to confess for an infraction.

[Rashelly]

And whos this Serenity. Seems like to you that person is very important?

Serenity is a clan that many of us got kicked out of, because they found out that we're associated with this forum, which is full of serious Jagex rule breaking. There are tons of P mods in the clan, so they've more than likely informed Jagex of this forum.

[Teh Wub]

Serenity is a clan that many of us got kicked out of, because they found out that we're associated with this forum, which is full of serious Jagex rule breaking. There are tons of P mods in the clan, so they've more than likely informed Jagex of this forum.

Yeh they even banned me because my account was level 3 and then got accused of trading accounts.

[mat64]

Close threads and infract those who don't provide solid proof, That's how it works on other forums.

[DarkPharoh]

Pictures arent good proof, as you said, edited in a matter of minutes


Videos are edited in a matter of hours. So make them post proof in a matter of minutes then. If its not posted in less than 10 minutes, invalid.

And trading account idea, I wasnt on the forum for a while and didnt see it coming. I think its the most stupid idea yet.(keeping scams down)
In my own gains, no one is trading pins anymore
For other people, more people are getting scammed.


And whos this Serenity. Seems like to you that person is very important?


Some of us cannot edit or make vids though

[Mr.OSH]

This is a bad idea as it encourages fighting and bullying of members. Also many people would use it as an opportunity to get another member bullied by multiple members of the forum even if the person didn't do anything. Its a bad idea because people can forge proof of accusing someone of scamming and many people would just do it to bully other members. True, some people would give out correct information but others wouldn't, making this idea bad. It would just encourage a rise in rule breaking. I myself witness people accusing other people in the "Web Market" section and it just leads to distressed users and fighting, which I have to deal with. If this was allowed it would only encourage more fighting to occur. Sorry but I have to disagree with this idea.

[Rashelly]

Going back to the point I made in a previous post. To easily solve all these solutions - just don't allow RL/cross game trading.

[deagle]

Some of us cannot edit or make vids though


If you dont know how to make videos, use hypercam.

Dont know how to edit videos? Good.

[:Jamie]

If you dont know how to make videos, use hypercam.

Dont know how to edit videos? Good.

Let the thread die. :rolleyes:

[---MAD---]

even if we show proof we get infractions it's rediculous!
There is no real "proof". Any screen shot or video can be edited in minutes so that doesn't work.

Also, most ways you get scammed are trading in ways which are not recommended by the game you are trading in. I.E. RS - Habbo trades. Both games are highly against those trades so if you do go ahead with the trade, it is a risk you are taking that no-one recommends. The reason we allow these trades is because its up to you (the account owner) to make the decision and the responsibility lies in your hands :).

[Neversoft]

There is no real "proof". Any screen shot or video can be edited in minutes so that doesn't work.

Also, most ways you get scammed are trading in ways which are not recommended by the game you are trading in. I.E. RS - Habbo trades. Both games are highly against those trades so if you do go ahead with the trade, it is a risk you are taking that no-one recommends. The reason we allow these trades is because its up to you (the account owner) to make the decision and the responsibility lies in your hands :).

A screenshot can be edited in minutes but a video would take longer. Who is going to want to spend their free time editing a screenshot/video to frame an innocent person anyway? Every time someone posts that another person has scammed them/is a scammer, they are mostly always correct. The only reason this suggestion has been brought up is because there have been so many people scammed recently due to account trading/selling now being allowed. Scamming has gone up like 90%. To reslove this I suggest you put things back to how they were and don't allow people to sell their accounts anymore. That will reslove this matter and a bunch of other stuff too.

[Jambe]

You get infractions if you brake the rules... lol