A method to get rid of trolls and crapposters

[Agnostic Bear]

Basically here's the idea: you have some kind of system set up to allow public banning of people, e.g they vote for who they want banned.

It would have to be private (e.g they can't see who's voted for who, nobody's allowed to tell anybody who's voted for who etc) and have admin / smod approval, but it would stop at least 80% of the crapposters on this forum that constantly annoy people.

So say they don't like someone, they go and vote for them to be banned, when say, 30 people have voted for this one person an admin goes through, make sure there's no fake users setup for the purpose of banning and looks around at their posts, makes sure they're getting negative responses on most of their posts, then says yes and the user gets kicked out of the forum (and can't return, would be good) this would simply allow for the forum to sort itself out and get rid of the worst posters improving both the forum atmosphere & the quality of posts.

Although it would have to be moderated on a neutral basis, something I doubt most of the admins / smods on this forum could do (favouritism with members of the forum etc)

VOTE ON THE POLL.
VOTE THREAD 5.
(then go hog wild)

[Leetzgirl]

No comment, but i just disagree with you.

xx

[Dentafrice]

No thanks.

[Axel]

Or, reports their posts.

[SS-Host.com]

No - this can become bias.

[Wootzeh]

no thanks

[buttons]

Or, reports their posts.
yeah, report them till they get enough infractions & BAN.

[Lycan]

In most cases its obvious what such a post is, but if your system was abused to get rid of someone a small majority disliked or simply disliked the meaning of the post... or were simply "working towards" understanding the post. then that woudn't be far.

Everyone has a right to share their opinion... if there opinion is complete rubbish aimed at attension seeking then true their opinion should be moved to another area of the forum and the member who posted it sent physiological help.

But the current infractions & Ban system although flawed in quite a few ways still works

[drama]

*Removed*

Edited by Kaotix12 (Forum Super Moderator): Please do not create troll posts.

[Decode]

*Removed*

Edit by Professor-Alex (Moderation Manager): Bullying is not allowed.

[Niall!]

No comment, but i just disagree with you.

xx

Only cuz ud be gone in a matter of minutes

[msb.]

*Removed*
No need, grow up please, I don't think this will do anything but cause caos, people may just make a new acc or something and then get worser but I don't know why you had the urge to mention me because I spoke the truth.:rolleyes:

[SHOPLIFTER]

crap idea

Edited by Kaotix12 (Forum Super Moderator): Please do not create troll posts.

[Nick-]

Or, reports their posts.
To put it simply ^^

If their posts break the rules all you have to do is report them, if they're blatantly a troll deliberately here to stir up a bit of trouble they can be banned instantly, regardless of infractions/warnings, perhaps even added to the auto ban list if they continue to be a problem.

There's a couple of problems with this idea too, it's not exactly fair on the person who is voted out of the forum. Without naming names it's clear who would end up being 'evicted' from the forum despite the fact that they probably haven't broken enough rules (if any) to warrant a ban which would cause protest in the support system and all we would have to say in response to the complaints is that they've been forcibly removed because of a majority vote which doesn't sound like a good enough reason to me. ;)

Secondly, there's the issue of selection, who or what decides who is up for eviction? Does someone just decide to place their name up on a poll or does it need the approval of Staff before a vote can even begin? Either way, there's another couple of problems, Moderators are trained to be as 'by the book' (not necessarily strict but to follow a procedure) as possible therefore, to justify a ban by means of vote the person would have had to break enough rules which defeats the point of the vote because they would be banned anway. Also there is probably going to be an element of opinion added to the ban process which leaves it open to all sorts of bias although Moderators are observed for evidence of favouritism, anyone caught can be warned and/or sacked because it defeats the point of being a Moderator but that still doesn't guarantee that it won't happen.

Thirdly, as Lycan pointed out, it's open to abuse. A majority of legitimate members could band together away from the forum (MSN, social networking sites etc) and organise for one specific member to be forcibly removed from the forum over something small and trivial such as a small argument that's flared up in the Spam section, for example, even though the unfortunate victim hasn't broken any rules and, if the plan worked, the person would be removed from the forum for no valid reason other than because the majority of the forum don't like them. Although it seems like quite a big issue to claim that this forum has, an individual users power and position in the hierarchy could potentially play a role, if one particularly well respected and well liked member of the forum wanted someone banned they could quite easily persuade others to rally behind him/her to get an innocent user removed from the forum which isn't exactly fair. :(

There's also the problem of what defines a majority vote, are we talking about the majority of the forums active users? (total number is impossible to define because some aren't as active as others, some hasn't been on for years, some are on every day etc) Are we talking about the majority of people who decided to vote? (Not fair on all users, some newer users may not have been provoked or encountered the evictee and can't really pass an educated vote on whether to ban them or not) Or the entire forum? (While we can get an accurate number of members who could potentially vote it would be impossible to ever gain a majority because the majority of registered members aren't active any more. ;))

Although your input is appreciated and it's always good to see members trying to make the forum a better place to post, this idea has too many problems, too many opportunities for abuse and is too complicated to set up in comparison to the current ban system. :)

[cocaine]

no, simply because if a lot of people dont like one individual then they're gone.

[Agnostic Bear]

To put it simply ^^

If their posts break the rules all you have to do is report them, if they're blatantly a troll deliberately here to stir up a bit of trouble they can be banned instantly, regardless of infractions/warnings, perhaps even added to the auto ban list if they continue to be a problem.

There's a couple of problems with this idea too, it's not exactly fair on the person who is voted out of the forum. Without naming names it's clear who would end up being 'evicted' from the forum despite the fact that they probably haven't broken enough rules (if any) to warrant a ban which would cause protest in the support system and all we would have to say in response to the complaints is that they've been forcibly removed because of a majority vote which doesn't sound like a good enough reason to me. ;)

Secondly, there's the issue of selection, who or what decides who is up for eviction? Does someone just decide to place their name up on a poll or does it need the approval of Staff before a vote can even begin? Either way, there's another couple of problems, Moderators are trained to be as 'by the book' (not necessarily strict but to follow a procedure) as possible therefore, to justify a ban by means of vote the person would have had to break enough rules which defeats the point of the vote because they would be banned anway. Also there is probably going to be an element of opinion added to the ban process which leaves it open to all sorts of bias although Moderators are observed for evidence of favouritism, anyone caught can be warned and/or sacked because it defeats the point of being a Moderator but that still doesn't guarantee that it won't happen.

Thirdly, as Lycan pointed out, it's open to abuse. A majority of legitimate members could band together away from the forum (MSN, social networking sites etc) and organise for one specific member to be forcibly removed from the forum over something small and trivial such as a small argument that's flared up in the Spam section, for example, even though the unfortunate victim hasn't broken any rules and, if the plan worked, the person would be removed from the forum for no valid reason other than because the majority of the forum don't like them. Although it seems like quite a big issue to claim that this forum has, an individual users power and position in the hierarchy could potentially play a role, if one particularly well respected and well liked member of the forum wanted someone banned they could quite easily persuade others to rally behind him/her to get an innocent user removed from the forum which isn't exactly fair. :(

There's also the problem of what defines a majority vote, are we talking about the majority of the forums active users? (total number is impossible to define because some aren't as active as others, some hasn't been on for years, some are on every day etc) Are we talking about the majority of people who decided to vote? (Not fair on all users, some newer users may not have been provoked or encountered the evictee and can't really pass an educated vote on whether to ban them or not) Or the entire forum? (While we can get an accurate number of members who could potentially vote it would be impossible to ever gain a majority because the majority of registered members aren't active any more. ;))

Although your input is appreciated and it's always good to see members trying to make the forum a better place to post, this idea has too many problems, too many opportunities for abuse and is too complicated to set up in comparison to the current ban system. :)

not reading this essay, guessing it says it wont work and to just report. If just reporting worked hxf wouldn't be in this situation which leads to either: a) the mods are incompetent (which seems most likely) b) the mods are incompetent (which also seesms most likely)

[Nick-]

There's no need to make that sort of unjust assumption. Sometimes it really is impossible to win with some people, you don't appreciate it when we reply with short posts because it appears as though we're just 'brushing ideas under the rug' yet when we offer an in depth reply you can't be bothered to read it. :S
What reply would please his Highness more? Would one prefer a reply praising his idea, claiming it to be the greatest idea to ever grace the Feedback section? Perhaps a reply stating that it will become my sole purpose as an Administrator to do everything I possibly can to implement this idea no matter how absurd some of the problems encountered become would please sir more? Or perhaps you would be more content with a thought through, logical and practical reply in which you would see why this idea cannot and will not be added.

If you won't listen to a Management reply I'm not entirely sure what you want from this thread. You claim to be trying to make the forum a better place yet you're too lazy to even read a response that could potentially see your idea through to a working system. :S

What situation are you talking about? As far as I'm aware the banning system has been working fine, it has been working to say the least since Habbox Forum opened. Granted, no system is without it's flaws but your system is just adding more to the mix.

At least one thing is for sure, I won't be taking any more of your ideas seriously if you won't take my replies seriously.

[Lycan]

There's no need to make that sort of unjust assumption. Sometimes it really is impossible to win with some people, you don't appreciate it when we reply with short posts because it appears as though we're just 'brushing ideas under the rug' yet when we offer an in depth reply you can't be bothered to read it. :S
What reply would please his Highness more? Would one prefer a reply praising his idea, claiming it to be the greatest idea to ever grace the Feedback section? Perhaps a reply stating that it will become my sole purpose as an Administrator to do everything I possibly can to implement this idea no matter how absurd some of the problems encountered become would please sir more? Or perhaps you would be more content with a thought through, logical and practical reply in which you would see why this idea cannot and will not be added.

If you won't listen to a Management reply I'm not entirely sure what you want from this thread. You claim to be trying to make the forum a better place yet you're too lazy to even read a response that could potentially see your idea through to a working system. :S

What situation are you talking about? As far as I'm aware the banning system has been working fine, it has been working to say the least since Habbox Forum opened. Granted, no system is without it's flaws but your system is just adding more to the mix.

At least one thing is for sure, I won't be taking any more of your ideas seriously if you won't take my replies seriously.

Pfft, i read it.. referenced me in a possitive way... been a while since thats happened... mainly because i havn't been on for a while.

[FlyingJesus]

not reading this essay, guessing it says it wont work and to just report. If just reporting worked hxf wouldn't be in this situation which leads to either: a) the mods are incompetent (which seems most likely) b) the mods are incompetent (which also seesms most likely)

The situation isn't so bad anyway :S ok, some people don't like msb., but that doesn't mean he should be banned. I find him entertaining myself and find there are certain other users who are annoying, some of whom are liked by others - so I'd be stuck with losing a guy who I think is pretty funny while the rejects who just post memes and poorly constructed innuendo stay on.

The best way to handle this is through user-moderation of a sort, but not banning. I know the "old days" argument gets thrown around a lot but seriously, in the old days you could get rid of unwanted people by just bullying them enough to make them go away. I liked this style because 1) it mimicked reality and proper society quite nicely and of course 2) I was never on the receiving end of it, which helped. Either way though I think that the way mods often let it be when people attack msb. should apply to all common hate figures and not just the ones they don't like either. Also I guess the old rep system worked better as a form of user-moderation, because like it or not (and sad as it may be) people did care about green blocks and numbers.

As a last point, calling mods incompetent got old in 2006

[Dentafrice]

not reading this essay, guessing it says it wont work and to just report. If just reporting worked hxf wouldn't be in this situation which leads to either: a) the mods are incompetent (which seems most likely) b) the mods are incompetent (which also seesms most likely)

You say there is a problem with HxF, but yet when one replies, you can't have the decency enough to read through his/her post responding to your idea?

Yeah.. there is a problem with HxF, people like you.

[msb.]

You say there is a problem with HxF, but yet when one replies, you can't have the decency enough to read through his/her post responding to your idea?

Yeah.. there is a problem with HxF, people like you.


I am glad you focused on that point more, tbh I don't really understand why some people are aiming this thread at me. I ain't actually been very active lately LOL. Something messed must be going on to say that.

It kinda sickens me that you made this thread and never ATLEAST had the effort to read the post Nick- posted. I read every single bit of it and I am glad I did. The idea would never work as it is unfair for users that are doing nothing wrong except making a few posts? Some people may find something wrong with you but do they mention it? The answer to that is simply no... have you even tried asking the person to STOP whatever they are doing to annoy you? I don't think you understand the difference between constructive posts and troll posts.


IF AT ALL it is me (not saying it is) then please pm and provide links to what I have done and what has annoyed you.

[Leetzgirl]

There's no need to make that sort of unjust assumption. Sometimes it really is impossible to win with some people, you don't appreciate it when we reply with short posts because it appears as though we're just 'brushing ideas under the rug' yet when we offer an in depth reply you can't be bothered to read it. :S
What reply would please his Highness more? Would one prefer a reply praising his idea, claiming it to be the greatest idea to ever grace the Feedback section? Perhaps a reply stating that it will become my sole purpose as an Administrator to do everything I possibly can to implement this idea no matter how absurd some of the problems encountered become would please sir more? Or perhaps you would be more content with a thought through, logical and practical reply in which you would see why this idea cannot and will not be added.

If you won't listen to a Management reply I'm not entirely sure what you want from this thread. You claim to be trying to make the forum a better place yet you're too lazy to even read a response that could potentially see your idea through to a working system. :S

What situation are you talking about? As far as I'm aware the banning system has been working fine, it has been working to say the least since Habbox Forum opened. Granted, no system is without it's flaws but your system is just adding more to the mix.

At least one thing is for sure, I won't be taking any more of your ideas seriously if you won't take my replies seriously.


Dont bother with replying to threads, Now i know why the management cant be arsed.

[today]

*Removed*

Edit by Professor-Alex (Moderation Manager): Bullying is not allowed.

[GommeInc]

Surely voting for people to be banned will show the voters are horrible, negative people? Some members of this forum look above the annoying trollers, rather than sink close to their level :P Although in some cases, I will have to agree because some members certainly don't have a right to use this forum with the amount of toot they post and lie about.

[Dentafrice]

I am glad you focused on that point more, tbh I don't really understand why some people are aiming this thread at me. I ain't actually been very active lately LOL. Something messed must be going on to say that.

It kinda sickens me that you made this thread and never ATLEAST had the effort to read the post Nick- posted. I read every single bit of it and I am glad I did. The idea would never work as it is unfair for users that are doing nothing wrong except making a few posts? Some people may find something wrong with you but do they mention it? The answer to that is simply no... have you even tried asking the person to STOP whatever they are doing to annoy you? I don't think you understand the difference between constructive posts and troll posts.


IF AT ALL it is me (not saying it is) then please pm and provide links to what I have done and what has annoyed you.

I have to actually agree with that, +REP ;) [have to spread.]

[PaintYourTarget]

Let's trial it,
Should Jewish Bear stay or go?

[Dentafrice]

LOL I vote go.

[Funya Chin]

To put it simply ^^

If their posts break the rules all you have to do is report them, if they're blatantly a troll deliberately here to stir up a bit of trouble they can be banned instantly, regardless of infractions/warnings, perhaps even added to the auto ban list if they continue to be a problem.

There's a couple of problems with this idea too, it's not exactly fair on the person who is voted out of the forum. Without naming names it's clear who would end up being 'evicted' from the forum despite the fact that they probably haven't broken enough rules (if any) to warrant a ban which would cause protest in the support system and all we would have to say in response to the complaints is that they've been forcibly removed because of a majority vote which doesn't sound like a good enough reason to me. ;)

Secondly, there's the issue of selection, who or what decides who is up for eviction? Does someone just decide to place their name up on a poll or does it need the approval of Staff before a vote can even begin? Either way, there's another couple of problems, Moderators are trained to be as 'by the book' (not necessarily strict but to follow a procedure) as possible therefore, to justify a ban by means of vote the person would have had to break enough rules which defeats the point of the vote because they would be banned anway. Also there is probably going to be an element of opinion added to the ban process which leaves it open to all sorts of bias although Moderators are observed for evidence of favouritism, anyone caught can be warned and/or sacked because it defeats the point of being a Moderator but that still doesn't guarantee that it won't happen.

Thirdly, as Lycan pointed out, it's open to abuse. A majority of legitimate members could band together away from the forum (MSN, social networking sites etc) and organise for one specific member to be forcibly removed from the forum over something small and trivial such as a small argument that's flared up in the Spam section, for example, even though the unfortunate victim hasn't broken any rules and, if the plan worked, the person would be removed from the forum for no valid reason other than because the majority of the forum don't like them. Although it seems like quite a big issue to claim that this forum has, an individual users power and position in the hierarchy could potentially play a role, if one particularly well respected and well liked member of the forum wanted someone banned they could quite easily persuade others to rally behind him/her to get an innocent user removed from the forum which isn't exactly fair. :(

There's also the problem of what defines a majority vote, are we talking about the majority of the forums active users? (total number is impossible to define because some aren't as active as others, some hasn't been on for years, some are on every day etc) Are we talking about the majority of people who decided to vote? (Not fair on all users, some newer users may not have been provoked or encountered the evictee and can't really pass an educated vote on whether to ban them or not) Or the entire forum? (While we can get an accurate number of members who could potentially vote it would be impossible to ever gain a majority because the majority of registered members aren't active any more. ;))

Although your input is appreciated and it's always good to see members trying to make the forum a better place to post, this idea has too many problems, too many opportunities for abuse and is too complicated to set up in comparison to the current ban system. :)
Or you could've put it simply yourself and said no? Why write an essay there's no point -rep.

No, anyway.

[Dentafrice]

If you were being serious, and -repping him, that's pretty stupid.

At least he is explaining the reason behind the no, unlike other staff who would have said.. 'sorry no we ain't doin that'.

[Funya Chin]

If you were being serious, and -repping him, that's pretty stupid.

At least he is explaining the reason behind the no, unlike other staff who would have said.. 'sorry no we ain't doin that'.
The reason is pretty clear to even the stupidest forum member, it would be abused.

[Dentafrice]

Yeah, but his reply was explaining it more in depth, it might be a stupid idea.. but he was explaining why it wouldn't work.

Nothing wrong with that.. I'd rather have a staff member that actually takes the time to do that, then a stupid reply from staff..

[Nick-]

If you were being serious, and -repping him, that's pretty stupid.

At least he is explaining the reason behind the no, unlike other staff who would have said.. 'sorry no we ain't doin that'.
He was perfectly serious.
It's ironic that I've just touted a system that would rid the forum of trolls, or, as the OP has so eloquently put it, 'crapposters' yet in the very same thread there is a prime example of someone who would undoubtedly suffer if this system was introduced, which would be such a loss, such a terrible loss to this forum...

[Dentafrice]

He was perfectly serious.
It's ironic that I've just touted a system that would rid the forum of trolls, or, as the OP has so eloquently put it, 'crapposters' yet in the very same thread there is a prime example of someone who would undoubtedly suffer if this system was introduced, which would be such a loss, such a terrible loss to this forum...

LOL! +REP.

It's pretty pathetic nowadays.

[today]

what system lol?

[cocaine]

what system lol?

the system jew bear posted in the first post

[Agnostic Bear]

jesus christ it was just to see if you like it not to cause a 4 post crapfest (which is what the user moderation would have been to stop)