Graphics Card

[AgnesIO]

Hey,

Sorry this should be my final question.

I now have Around £125 to get a decent graphics card for my pc. It would preferabl be £100 - £150 - no more.

Any links from eBuyer or dabs as a reccomendation? :)

Cheers!


Closed by Catzsy [Forum Super Moderator]: Thread closed as it wenr way off-topic from orginal question and to prevent further heated debate.

[Pyroka]

http://www.ebuyer.com/product/160748

This. It's massive mind you so check the dimensions of your case before you try to buy it, but its a bloody good card.

[AgnesIO]

http://www.ebuyer.com/product/160748

This. It's massive mind you so check the dimensions of your case before you try to buy it, but its a bloody good card.


Funnily enough thats the one I saw!

(I didn't wan tto purchase as I like to check :P)

And thanks :)

+Rep

[Flisker]

Funnily enough thats the one I saw!

(I didn't wan tto purchase as I like to check :P)

And thanks :)

+Rep
I would go with the one Ryan suggested I have the one down from that, the GTS 250 and it fits in my regular mid-tower case perfectly.

[Stephen!]

Try and get the 216 core version instead of the 192.

[Recursion]

Has the 216 core and is cheaper.

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-167-AS&groupid=701&catid=56&subcat=927

EDIT: Infact look at the first few http://www.overclockers.co.uk/productlist.php?&groupid=701&catid=56&subid=927&sortby=priceAsc

[AgnesIO]

Has the 216 core and is cheaper.

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-167-AS&groupid=701&catid=56&subcat=927

EDIT: Infact look at the first few http://www.overclockers.co.uk/productlist.php?&groupid=701&catid=56&subid=927&sortby=priceAsc


Its not cheaper by the way - £2 more expensive!1111 :P

Would 216 core be a better buy then?

Cheers guys.

[Pyroka]

Oh my god wow, I'd get that Asus one instead of the one I suggested, the cores are worth it for the extra 2 quid, you'll probably notice it. Deffo that one.

[AgnesIO]

Oh my god wow, I'd get that Asus one instead of the one I suggested, the cores are worth it for the extra 2 quid, you'll probably notice it. Deffo that one.


Also just noticed you get Terminator Salvation with it :o :o :o :o :o :o


:)

Probs gonna start ordering on Saturday!

EDIT: Because of going over my £900 I think I am going to downsize in PC screen :P

£937 is a lot afterall :)

[ElliottThompson]

I would highly recommend this graphics card

I can play crysis warhead on gamer settings and x4 AA on with a perfectly smooth fps
http://www.play.com/PC/PCs/4-/10500348/Sapphire-Radeon-HD-4870-1GB-PCI-Express-2-0-Graphics-Card/Product.html

Its close to the price of the others but its a highly rated card with great performance!
Btw im running a 1650 x 1050 screen which would be just under or just over the resolution of a screen you would be getting.
Its a large card aswel so make sure your case can fit it in, also think about the psu cable lengths and where the psu houses in your case because it can give you alot of troubles if you get it wrong, I learnt the hard way lol.
edit: It also comes with brilliant software which can let you overclock it straight out the box without worrying about overheating as it shows you everything and will stop you before you begin to blow anything up :) Also I think you were looking at asus mb's which I really like aswel, the software you get with asus mb's really compliment this gfx card.

[Describe]

Also just noticed you get Terminator Salvation with it :o :o :o :o :o :o


:)

Probs gonna start ordering on Saturday!

EDIT: Because of going over my £900 I think I am going to downsize in PC screen :P

£937 is a lot afterall :)

You can get a computer with a terabyte of memory and a decent graphics card for sixty three pounds more.

[ElliottThompson]

You can get a computer with a terabyte of memory and a decent graphics card for sixty three pounds more.
do you mean a manufactured pc, because that would become redundant in a few years and there would be nothing he can do about it

[GommeInc]

do you mean a manufactured pc, because that would become redundant in a few years and there would be nothing he can do about it
Same with a custom built one :S Both pre-made and custom built PCs use similar sort of components, and the components go out of date quickly... And of course it would become redundant in a few years, why regret buying something in the present when it will be outdated "in a few years". May as well not buy anything for the fear of it becoming redundent!

[Recursion]

It's easier to upgrade custom built PCs IMO.

[AgnesIO]

You can get a computer with a terabyte of memory and a decent graphics card for sixty three pounds more.


Yeh but making your own does a number of things:


Makes you feel like it 'yours' a little bit more.
Fun
You still save £63 :P
I don't want to hit the £1000 mark if possible.
Quality of components is likely not to be so good with a already made one, as you are mainly paying for the brand (dell/sony/hp etc)
Just my opinion :)

[Jahova]

Can you repost your whole (dream) systems' specs and also the graphics card so I can see how it should run. Thanks.

[AgnesIO]

Can you repost your whole (dream) systems' specs and also the graphics card so I can see how it should run. Thanks.

Here we go :D

1tb HardDrive - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/143288
8gb RAm - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/149202 x2
Quad Core Processor - http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-167-AS
LG Bluray Drive - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/139985
LG Normal Drive - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/149313
Asus Motherboard - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/167046
896mb Graphics Card - http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-167-AS
TV Card - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/100017
Keyboard + Mouse - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/128028
Case - Now out of stock :rolleyes:
PSU - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/135514

:)

[Recursion]

The Intel "I" series is the way forward :P

[AgnesIO]

The Intel "I" series is the way forward :P

The only one they have is i7 isn't it? (And thats around £200 alone) :P

[Recursion]

i7, i5, i3 (well, soon anyway).

[AgnesIO]

i7, i5, i3 (well, soon anyway).


I'll look into it in a month or so - atm there is only i7!

[Jahova]

Your list is wrong, what CPU are you getting as it shows a graphics card?

[ElliottThompson]

Same with a custom built one :S Both pre-made and custom built PCs use similar sort of components, and the components go out of date quickly... And of course it would become redundant in a few years, why regret buying something in the present when it will be outdated "in a few years". May as well not buy anything for the fear of it becoming redundent!
the whole point of getting a custom pc is that it can be modified! When a component you have becomes outdated you can simply add to it or replace it with a newer one without the need of purchasing a whole new PC.

Manufactured pc's from dell and the likes leave literally no space for upgrading, usually use a completely unknown form factor for the components and besides, in manufactured pc's you will be getting 8 gigs of ram when they say you are but the quality of the product you are getting you have no choice over, when picking 8 gigs of ram for a custom pc you can check the overclockability, if it has a heatsink and the quality and durability of a product instead of just seeing that it has 8 gigs of ram and being content.

[Robbie]

Your list is wrong, what CPU are you getting as it shows a graphics card?

Mobo and processor come together - http://www.ebuyer.com/product/167046

[Jahova]

Looks good but I would go for a better processor if i'm honest.

[AgnesIO]

Looks good but I would go for a better processor if i'm honest.


Reccomendations?

Only downside is I will have to buy motherboard seperate :D

[GommeInc]

the whole point of getting a custom pc is that it can be modified! When a component you have becomes outdated you can simply add to it or replace it with a newer one without the need of purchasing a whole new PC.
...You can do this with one in the shop? My Advent PC from PC World has a Graphics Card I added myself, and there was plenty of room... You make it look as though NO pre-made computers can be upgraded, when infact most are/all can be :/


Manufactured pc's from dell and the likes leave literally no space for upgrading, usually use a completely unknown form factor for the components and besides, in manufactured pc's you will be getting 8 gigs of ram when they say you are but the quality of the product you are getting you have no choice over, when picking 8 gigs of ram for a custom pc you can check the overclockability, if it has a heatsink and the quality and durability of a product instead of just seeing that it has 8 gigs of ram and being content.
I think you're going off the point, you said that a pre-made PC would become redundant, so would a custom built PC. Both can be upgraded, you're generalising that all pre-made PCs can't be upgraded because the manfacteurers leave no room for upgrades, even though all my PCs have been upgraded. In fact, RAM can be upgraded on most, if not, ALL pre-made PCs - it's very unlikely a computer company would cover up RAM slots considering they usually stick upwards (when placed on the side). Graphics cards are the only thing that maybe of some concern, because some can be incredibly long, though it's very unlikely that the case of a pre-made PC would be too small to fit it and most of the time the solution is moving some wires around...

Anyway, I feel this conversation is getting in the way of Dom's thread. Sorry about that Dom :P

[AgnesIO]

...You can do this with one in the shop? My Advent PC from PC World has a Graphics Card I added myself, and there was plenty of room... You make it look as though NO pre-made computers can be upgraded, when infact most are/all can be :/


I think you're going off the point, you said that a pre-made PC would become redundant, so would a custom built PC. Both can be upgraded, you're generalising that all pre-made PCs can't be upgraded because the manfacteurers leave no room for upgrades, even though all my PCs have been upgraded. In fact, RAM can be upgraded on most, if not, ALL pre-made PCs - it's very unlikely a computer company would cover up RAM slots considering they usually stick upwards (when placed on the side). Graphics cards are the only thing that maybe of some concern, because some can be incredibly long, though it's very unlikely that the case of a pre-made PC would be too small to fit it and most of the time the solution is moving some wires around...

Anyway, I feel this conversation is getting in the way of Dom's thread. Sorry about that Dom :P


No worries :D

I probably need top make another thread anyway (annoying me too) as I have numerous questions to ask! (That having nothing to do with a graphics card (A bit like this thread haha :D))

[ElliottThompson]

...You can do this with one in the shop? My Advent PC from PC World has a Graphics Card I added myself, and there was plenty of room... You make it look as though NO pre-made computers can be upgraded, when infact most are/all can be :/


I think you're going off the point, you said that a pre-made PC would become redundant, so would a custom built PC. Both can be upgraded, you're generalising that all pre-made PCs can't be upgraded because the manfacteurers leave no room for upgrades, even though all my PCs have been upgraded. In fact, RAM can be upgraded on most, if not, ALL pre-made PCs - it's very unlikely a computer company would cover up RAM slots considering they usually stick upwards (when placed on the side). Graphics cards are the only thing that maybe of some concern, because some can be incredibly long, though it's very unlikely that the case of a pre-made PC would be too small to fit it and most of the time the solution is moving some wires around...

Anyway, I feel this conversation is getting in the way of Dom's thread. Sorry about that Dom :P
You must have got lucky then because most manufacturers get cases that are large enough for the parts they have put in instead of what people could put in in the future and I wouldn't like to update a motherboard plus cpu in a manufactured pc, that would be hell.

Oh an besides just opening up the case of a manufactured pc voids the warranty lol

[Recursion]

You must have got lucky then because most manufacturers get cases that are large enough for the parts they have put in instead of what people could put in in the future and I wouldn't like to update a motherboard plus cpu in a manufactured pc, that would be hell.

Oh an besides just opening up the case of a manufactured pc voids the warranty lol

I know it doesn't on Dell, HP, RM and Apple computers for a fact actually....

[GommeInc]

I know it doesn't on Dell, HP, RM and Apple computers for a fact actually....
I've only ever seen warranty stickers and the like on Acers :S Dell computers used to solder things down (or glue, both possibly) - they don't now though. Besides, why would you need warranty? Computers are horrifically easy to fix :P All the computers in this house have been easy to play around in :D Not directed at you Mr. Android ;)

[Mentor]

You must have got lucky then because most manufacturers get cases that are large enough for the parts they have put in instead of what people could put in in the future and I wouldn't like to update a motherboard plus cpu in a manufactured pc, that would be hell.

Oh an besides just opening up the case of a manufactured pc voids the warranty lol
You dont get a warranty at all on a custom build so whats your point? Go for the cheapest way to get the parts you need, be it putting em together yourself or buying em pre assembled o.0

Cases are cheap anyway, if you gonna change a mobo, you may as well just buy a whole new pc and leave the old one, in its case as it is. Other than usb 3.0 etc cant think of much thats likely to change on mobos in the near future anyway o.0

[ElliottThompson]

You dont get a warranty at all on a custom build so whats your point? Go for the cheapest way to get the parts you need, be it putting em together yourself or buying em pre assembled o.0

Cases are cheap anyway, if you gonna change a mobo, you may as well just buy a whole new pc and leave the old one, in its case as it is. Other than usb 3.0 etc cant think of much thats likely to change on mobos in the near future anyway o.0
sigh- every single piece of hardware you buy for your custom pc comes with its own warranty, which you can claim for without affecting the rest of your pc. Your on a rampage tonight!

[Mentor]

sigh- every single piece of hardware you buy for your custom pc comes with its own warranty, which you can claim for without affecting the rest of your pc. Your on a rampage tonight!

Yes, indeed they can have warranties. Just because the components can have a warranty, it does not mean they do. I'm not the one claiming every pre-built pc comes with a non-standard size mobo, or that opening the case of em voids any warranty (which has been pointed out to be untrue, at least with the majority of standard manufactures)

[Recursion]

I am also pretty sure Dell stopped using non-standard motherboard layouts too, not 100% on that one though.

[Mentor]

I am also pretty sure Dell stopped using non-standard motherboard layouts too, not 100% on that one though.

I have a few 3 year old dell,s mobos are standard in em and tbh, i dont ever remember seeing one in a dell that wasn't? old or new.

[ElliottThompson]

Yes, indeed they can have warranties. Just because the components can have a warranty, it does not mean they do. I'm not the one claiming every pre-built pc comes with a non-standard size mobo, or that opening the case of em voids any warranty (which has been pointed out to be untrue, at least with the majority of standard manufactures)
Oh sorry for using my personal knowledge of working at a computer sales store at which I spent time sticking those stickers on such PC's. Just looking at two dell pc's and an advent pc in my house they all have holographic stickers on them stating that if this seal is broken the warranty will be void.
And it's a legal requirement to offer a warranty with a product, whether it be an express warranty or an implied warranty companies cant just sell products "as is" unless were talking about market stalls lol.

Last point: Why do you constantly feel the need to shove words into my mouth, Manufactured pc's are more likely to use non standardised mobo sizes in pc's as they are looking to sell a pc as it is, not one that can be customised afterwards. Manufactured pc's are sold to a mainstream audience, my grandma recently bought a manufactured pc from dell, she will not even be thinking about upgrading her pc afterwards. Manufacturers know that they will also be dealing with these people and build accordingly, manufacturers who build parts know they won't have this problem.

http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/desktop-studio-slim/pd.aspx?refid=desktop-studio-slim&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&~ck=mn
http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/desktop-studio-one-19/pd.aspx?refid=desktop-studio-one-19&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&~ck=mn
http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/desktop-inspiron-545s/pd.aspx?refid=desktop-inspiron-545s&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&~ck=mn
http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/desktop-studio-hybrid/pd.aspx?refid=desktop-studio-hybrid&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&~ck=mn
I think its clear to see that companies like dell arn't always thinking on the lines of upgradable pc's.
In no way shape or form are those examples as best adapted to upgrading as a custom built pc that I have thought about and considered how future proof it is. Oh and besides, dell isnt even as kind as to show the mobo's form factor, great so I won't even know the mobo form factor untill I've bought it :L
And btw a big reason to want to upgrade your mobo is the cpu socket, as If i want an i7 chip that wont be possible without a new mobo :L

[Recursion]

Actually they are a case standard, ever heard of "Low profile" for links 1 and 3? :|

And for 2 and 4 you picked the products targetted at people who aren't so computer savvy, in actual fact I should think number 4 is upgradable, possibly even number 2 to an extent.

I have NEVER Seen these holographic warranty stickers on, please do post pictures? "Your personal knowledge" is like me saying I know about air traffic control because I did two weeks work experiance in a control tower, just no.

Flisker upgraded his Dell from changing the case, to the RAM, to the PSU and GPU, just as an example.

I have just found Dell do indeed use ATX, mATX and BTX motherboards, all of which are standards.

[Mentor]

Oh sorry for using my personal knowledge of working at a computer sales store at which I spent time sticking those stickers on such PC's. Just looking at two dell pc's and an advent pc in my house they all have holographic stickers on them stating that if this seal is broken the warranty will be void.
Wow, thats odd, none of the dells or advents i own have these stickers. Maybe since my prebuilt computers came in the box's you did have a chance to stick your stickers on them...

Generally the manufacture does the warrenty, not the seller, so why you in a sales job are attaching these stickers i dont know.


And it's a legal requirement to offer a warranty with a product, whether it be an express warranty or an implied warranty companies cant just sell products "as is" unless were talking about market stalls lol.
Actually, no. just no. Your talking out your ass here. A warranty is not required and is often sold as an extra. It is in addition to your normal statutory rights.

feel free to take a read: http://www.lawguarantee.com/consumer-protection-articles/guarantee-warranty-law-uk.html


Last point: Why do you constantly feel the need to shove words into my mouth, Manufactured pc's are more likely to use non standardised mobo sizes in pc's as they are looking to sell a pc as it is, not one that can be customised afterwards. Manufactured pc's are sold to a mainstream audience, my grandma recently bought a manufactured pc from dell, she will not even be thinking about upgrading her pc afterwards. Manufacturers know that they will also be dealing with these people and build accordingly, manufacturers who build parts know they won't have this problem.

http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/desktop-studio-slim/pd.aspx?refid=desktop-studio-slim&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&~ck=mn
http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/desktop-studio-one-19/pd.aspx?refid=desktop-studio-one-19&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&~ck=mn
http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/desktop-inspiron-545s/pd.aspx?refid=desktop-inspiron-545s&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&~ck=mn
http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/desktop-studio-hybrid/pd.aspx?refid=desktop-studio-hybrid&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&~ck=mn
I think its clear to see that companies like dell arn't always thinking on the lines of upgradable pc's.
In no way shape or form are those examples as best adapted to upgrading as a custom built pc that I have thought about and considered how future proof it is. Oh and besides, dell isnt even as kind as to show the mobo's form factor, great so I won't even know the mobo form factor untill I've bought it :L
And btw a big reason to want to upgrade your mobo is the cpu socket, as If i want an i7 chip that wont be possible without a new mobo :L

Yea... atx aint the only mobo size, they all look standard to me. Pc's use standard components as they are cheaper, easier to work with and saves dell having to create a new manufacturing plant every time they wana do a new pc range.

Seeing as a cpu generally covers at least a 3rd of a pc's total cost, and the mobo especially in i7's not far behind, if your gonna pretty much be buying a new pc, why not just buy a new one and have two instead of scraping a perfectly good mobo and cpu? By the time u upgrade em chances are any gfx card you have would be out of date anyway. Tech moves fast after all..

If you wana pick me up on things i get wrong, try targeting the bits im wrong on.

[ElliottThompson]

I clearly said that these companies are obviously not as adept at making product's that have upgradability in mind compared to actually buying the parts yourself, especially a company that had this as their flagship model at one point:
http://img.alibaba.com/photo/105685688/Lot_Dell_Desktop_Computer.jpg
I think you guys may be getting a little sidetracked, I didn't say that they arn't I said that they are a little harder to upgrade as they are not aimed specifically at pc builders who are the people most likely to upgrade.

And here are some examples of those stickers:
http://img.alibaba.com/photo/105685688/Lot_Dell_Desktop_Computer.jpg
http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/8769/dsc00083yx1.jpg
http://www.case-badges.com/images/tamper-evident-labels-before-after.jpg

Oh and remind me never to make a point again as I will obviously be hounded by people desperate to prove me wrong and change the debate into something its clearly wasn't.
lol at the seal btw :>

"It’s important to remember that manufacturers’ guarantees are in addition to your statutory responsibilities as a supplier under the Sale of Goods Act. A supplier cannot, for instance, refuse to deal with a customer’s complaint about a faulty product simply on the grounds that the product is outside its guarantee period."
All that means is that guarantee's don't affect your statutory rights, It gives a clear example there, that show's in no way that its not a legal requirement. Meaning that after a guarantee has expired a company still has to see to the customers statutory rights, that does not mean that the guarantee is a non necessary addition.
I'm not going to continue with this, weve moved onto an argument over warranties, I won't be visiting this thread again.

[Recursion]

Funny, my mum's lower school is getting rid of those old Dell GX50s, lasted well, were a standard motherboard size in a standard Low Profile case, fine for upgrading the RAM, CPU, HDD, Optical drive etc etc.

In your last link that fails to be on a computer and actually it reminded me of the ones you get on new mobile phone boxes.

The Acer one we cannot read as it is half cut off, get a decent image.

[ElliottThompson]

Funny, my mum's lower school is getting rid of those old Dell GX50s, lasted well, were a standard motherboard size in a standard Low Profile case, fine for upgrading the RAM, CPU, HDD, Optical drive etc etc.

In your last link that fails to be on a computer and actually it reminded me of the ones you get on new mobile phone boxes.

The Acer one we cannot read as it is half cut off, get a decent image.
I shouldnt have been bothered to take that picture and upload it to prove a point in an argument that has changed directions and causes 20 times.

"The Acer one we cannot read as it is half cut off, get a decent image."
http://foskett.ws/u/file_dir/1247438956.jpg
I love it how its nearly identical to the stickers I posted before but you still desperately claimed that they were used for mobile phone boxes, I wish you actually looked as the url which said Case Badges and if you looked at the homepage it was a PC Case dedicated site lol. I don't post things for the fun of it.
Goodbye

[Mentor]

I clearly said that these companies are obviously not as adept at making product's that have upgradability in mind compared to actually buying the parts yourself, especially a company that had this as their flagship model at one point:
http://img.alibaba.com/photo/105685688/Lot_Dell_Desktop_Computer.jpg
I think you guys may be getting a little sidetracked, I didn't say that they arn't I said that they are a little harder to upgrade as they are not aimed specifically at pc builders who are the people most likely to upgrade.

I have 3 of that model, there incredibly easy to upgrade, more so than most stand alone hardware, everything clips in, so you dont have to fiddle around screwing bits in inside the case?

I've made multiple upgrades to that type of pc and had no trouble?


And here are some examples of those stickers:
http://img.alibaba.com/photo/105685688/Lot_Dell_Desktop_Computer.jpg
http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/8769/dsc00083yx1.jpg
http://www.case-badges.com/images/tamper-evident-labels-before-after.jpg

Oh and remind me never to make a point again as I will obviously be hounded by people desperate to prove me wrong and change the debate into something its clearly wasn't.
lol at the seal btw :>
Sorry to say but i dont see the sticker except in the last instance where it isnt attached to anything o.0


"It’s important to remember that manufacturers’ guarantees are in addition to your statutory responsibilities as a supplier under the Sale of Goods Act. A supplier cannot, for instance, refuse to deal with a customer’s complaint about a faulty product simply on the grounds that the product is outside its guarantee period."
All that means is that guarantee's don't affect your statutory rights, It gives a clear example there, that show's in no way that its not a legal requirement. Meaning that after a guarantee has expired a company still has to see to the customers statutory rights, that does not mean that the guarantee is a non necessary addition.
I'm not going to continue with this, weve moved onto an argument over warranties, I won't be visiting this thread again.
Read down further and it covers warranties under the guarantees section. How you can sell something legally required as an optional extra though, i dont know. The fact products sometimes explicitly state they come with no warranty aslo doesn't help your case.

Finally, i never claimed the warranty void badges didnt exist, just that they aint attached to any of the computers i have brought/obtained in the past. Dell, HP, Zoocom, etc and advents being among them. Didnt you just say you wernt returning to this thread btw?

[Recursion]

I shouldnt have been bothered to take that picture and upload it to prove a point in an argument that has changed directions and causes 20 times.

"The Acer one we cannot read as it is half cut off, get a decent image."
http://foskett.ws/u/file_dir/1247438956.jpg
I love it how its nearly identical to the stickers I posted before but you still desperately claimed that they were used for mobile phone boxes, I wish you actually looked as the url which said Case Badges and if you looked at the homepage it was a PC Case dedicated site lol. I don't post things for the fun of it.
Goodbye

I did not claim this, I said they reminded me of, please do be more careful about how you interpret things.