Lisbon Treaty Ratified by all

[Jordy]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8340664.stm

Mr Klaus of the Czech Republic has finally ratified it seems, oddly going against what the courts suggested.

The Treaty should come into force early 2010 I believe?

[-:Undertaker:-]

A free and democratic Europe, 1945 to 2009 and 1991 to 2009.

Well done politicians across Europe, I hope you are happy. You have signed away over 84% of your powers to unelected officals in Brussels and have just laid down the foundations for a superstate in which it will be incredibly hard to get out of, if not impossible in the near future. I do think Klaus put up a good fight but the threats and bullying that followed I guess he had to give in in the end. I am waiting for Cameron now, either give the people a say on the Lisbon Treaty and the EU itself or face losing 60 seats thanks to UKIP at the next election, and if you do lose an election win because of that and we end up with another Labour government/hung parliament - then you deserve it.

To anyone who even thinks the European Union is remotely democratic then ask yourselves how a unelected union which makes 84% of our laws is anywhere near democratic.

[Pyroka]

Undertaker Conservatives will win the next election, regardless of whether they give this option or not. However its the next general election where the effects of the EU will be more noticable (as its a longer period of time), where parties like the UKIP may just come out and dominate.

I'm not happy with this result at all... but hey, itll all come down to what happens in the next year or so which will really rock the world about, especially if someone reconsiders (if they can?)

[-:Undertaker:-]

Undertaker Conservatives will win the next election, regardless of whether they give this option or not. However its the next general election where the effects of the EU will be more noticable (as its a longer period of time), where parties like the UKIP may just come out and dominate.

I'm not happy with this result at all... but hey, itll all come down to what happens in the next year or so which will really rock the world about, especially if someone reconsiders (if they can?)

If nearer the election the Labour votes pick up (as the lower parties in the polls such as Labour and Liberal Democrat) always do, then it will mean that the Conservatives will already have to fight a very close election just to win this incredibly unpopular government. If you add UKIP into the picture and the BNP, it means that yet more votes in swing seats are lost from the Conservatives and will not effect the Labour vote. In affect you will end up with something like this in many seats;

Labour 9,000
Conservative 7,000
UKIP 1,500
BNP 800

..meaning that thanks to disenchanted voters (and the EU is a big decider to right wing voters) the Conservatives would lose that seat thanks to a surge in support for UKIP and the BNP. This in effect means the Conservatives lose a seat whereas they should of easily won that seat. It happened in 2005 (and bear in mind the EU wasn't such a big issue then) when it is estimated that the Conservatives lost out on winning 20+ seats thanks to the UKIP votes.

Mr Cameron says he cannot do anything because by then it will become EU law, well heres a thought Dave; do what the people want and allow the United Kingdom to be governed by British law. On the reconsidering option, EU supporters claim that the Lisbon Treaty makes it easier for nations to leave the EU and its infact absolute rubbish, the treaty only makes it harder for a nation to leave as it sets requirements, as before a government could technically just scrap the old EEC act and be done with the whole dammned thing.

[Pyroka]

If nearer the election the Labour votes pick up (as the lower parties in the polls such as Labour and Liberal Democrat) always do, then it will mean that the Conservatives will already have to fight a very close election just to win this incredibly unpopular government. If you add UKIP into the picture and the BNP, it means that yet more votes in swing seats are lost from the Conservatives and will not effect the Labour vote. In affect you will end up with something like this in many seats;

Labour 9,000
Conservative 7,000
UKIP 1,500
BNP 800

..meaning that thanks to disenchanted voters (and the EU is a big decider to right wing voters) the Conservatives would lose that seat thanks to a surge in support for UKIP and the BNP. This in effect means the Conservatives lose a seat whereas they should of easily won that seat. It happened in 2005 (and bear in mind the EU wasn't such a big issue then) when it is estimated that the Conservatives lost out on winning 20+ seats thanks to the UKIP votes.

Mr Cameron says he cannot do anything because by then it will become EU law, well heres a thought Dave; do what the people want and allow the United Kingdom to be governed by British law. On the reconsidering option, EU supporters claim that the Lisbon Treaty makes it easier for nations to leave the EU and its infact absolute rubbish, the treaty only makes it harder for a nation to leave as it sets requirements, as before a government could technically just scrap the old EEC act and be done with the whole dammned thing.

So what you're saying is UKIP is growing in popularity and membership? :P Because if thats true then yeah I do see them being contenders in the next general election, too early to say for that though. Its a possibility Labour could lose though, its always there.

[-:Undertaker:-]

So what you're saying is UKIP is growing in popularity and membership? :P Because if thats true then yeah I do see them being contenders in the next general election, too early to say for that though. Its a possibility Labour could lose though, its always there.

UKIP is growing and so is the BNP, due to issues such as these which the main parties dodge/tell us lies about. They will not gain many seats (if any) though because of our First Past The Post system we use, however as you can see; my point is that if Cameron turns Conservative voters away to UKIP and the BNP it could cost him a general election as them lost votes in swing seats that would normally go to the Conservatives have gone to UKIP/the BNP because of the European issue, meaning that the Conservative vote then drops under the normally stable Labour vote - thus handing Labour the seat.

Do you see what I mean?

In 2005 when the EU wasn't such a big issue, the Conservatives lost over an estimated 20 seats thanks to the same thing happening as I have given an example of, and its being estimated that this time around that figure could be anything from 20 to 60 seats lost - if it is a close election which it seems it could very well be, that could very easily rob Cameron of a strong majority or even the ability to form a government.

[hah]

You probably wont wanna hear this then :P

Tories Abandon EU Treaty Referendum

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Politics/Conservatives-Abandon-Promised-Referendum-On-EU-Lisbon-Treaty/Article/200911115430785?lpos=Politics_Carousel_Region_2&lid=ARTICLE_15430785_Conservatives_Abandon_Promise d_Referendum_On_EU_Lisbon_Treaty

[-:Undertaker:-]

You probably wont wanna hear this then :P

Tories Abandon EU Treaty Referendum

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Politics/Conservatives-Abandon-Promised-Referendum-On-EU-Lisbon-Treaty/Article/200911115430785?lpos=Politics_Carousel_Region_2&lid=ARTICLE_15430785_Conservatives_Abandon_Promise d_Referendum_On_EU_Lisbon_Treaty

..then he has just simply given up hundreds of thousands, if not a few million votes to the British National Party and the United Kingdom Independance Party because now people can see there really is no difference between the Lib/Lab/Con ruling elite, all in it for themselves, all cannot hold a promise even if its made of 'cast-iron' - Camerons words not mine.


It is believed he could pledge to repatriate some powers from Europe and hold a referendum on any future treaty.

..not good enough Dave, the Lisbon Treaty held all the amendments needed for the EU to grow itself without the need of consent from national governments. What is the point in forming the next government when 84% of our laws are made in Brussels by unelected government?

[Bun]

yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy <3 the eu.

[Alkaz]

Its disgusting how we've signed away everything. Next thing you know, we will all become states and taken over by America.

[Blinger1]

As a Swiss citizen I am glad we aren't part of the EU !

[alexxxxx]

Its disgusting how we've signed away everything. Next thing you know, we will all become states and taken over by America.

yes because that makes sense.

[BlueTango]

An absolutely horrendous thing for this country!

We might not be able to get out of it; so if we have to be in it - we need to fight for one of the top jobs to go to a Brit!

[alexxxxx]

An absolutely horrendous thing for this country!

We might not be able to get out of it; so if we have to be in it - we need to fight for one of the top jobs to go to a Brit!

well seeing at the LT outlines a method of exiting the EU that's a bit unfounded.

[-:Undertaker:-]

yes because that makes sense.

A better comparison would be the European Union and the Soviet Union, both gained members to 'help' their members, and them members eventually all joined up to create a superstate, both also didn't give the people a say on it either. Numerous politicians still state even though they are not supposed to that the ultimate aim is a superstate, one economy, one social union and one political union.


well seeing at the LT outlines a method of exiting the EU that's a bit unfounded.

Actually it makes it harder, the old treaty the orginal EEC could of been scrapped at any time, now I have heard their are 'requirements' for members wishing to leave. What the EU doesn't understand and doesn't ever appear to have the intention to understand, is that when no means no, it means no.