Slow news day? Woman calls a letter from the PM an "insult"

[GommeInc]

Just been watching the news on TV, does anyone else think this woman is a waste of time and space in the news?


Gordon Brown has telephoned a bereaved mother to apologise after apparently misspelling the name of her dead soldier son in a letter of sympathy.

Guardsman Jamie Janes, 20, from Brighton, East Sussex, was killed in an explosion in Afghanistan in October.

The Sun newspaper said his mother Jacqui had called the prime minister's letter a "hastily scrawled insult".

But Mr Brown's spokesman said he was "very sorry for the way that Mrs Janes feels about the letter".

He added the prime minister was "deeply mortified to think he may have offended the family".

Guardsman Janes, of 1st Battalion The Grenadier Guards, was killed in an explosion while on foot patrol in Helmand province.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8349757.stm

I'm not a fan of Gordon Brown, but this isn't an insult. She should be glad the Prime Minister wrote her a letter of condolence about the loss of her son, not barking and biting back because he misspelt "Janes" as "James". He's only human, and in the real world (something her somewhat deluded mind cannot understand), no-one would give a rats arse about their surname, or forename being misspelt, so what makes this woman special? Nothing :/ What, does she expect to frame it and tell everyone "Look! I've had a letter from Gordon Brown!" The ungrateful woman should of kindly written back that the letter had the wrong name on it. In the news report, the ungrateful woman even told the news that she "disregarded" reading the rest of the letter, just because of the small spelling mistakes and poor handwriting.

Yes, her son was killed in the war, it's kinda expected and the PM wrote a handwritten letter, that should be enough. Her complaints that it was hard to read are stupid too, his handwriting is naturally terrible, possibly due to his eyesight. Even if it wasn't, who cares? Again, she expects this man to be perfect in body and of mind, and write a letter in perfect form. I've had letters that don't meet my expectations of clarity, but I don't winge about them because it is the meaning and emotion behind the words that count. He writes in felt-tip all the time, the BBC even shown library footage of him writing in felt-tip pen in speeches and conferences!

I pity anyone who is dyslexic or arthritic who comes in contact with this woman :/ Especially when she writes to The Sun about it, who will lap it up even though it goes against basic human decency and gratitude.

Seriously, what on earth is wrong with people now-a-days? If she uses the "mourning card", she needs a slap.

EDIT: Letter to the woman. "(something)" means "I have no idea what word he meant".



Dear Mrs James (Janes)

It is with the greetst? (greatest) of
sadness that I write to offer
you and yur (your) family my
personal condolencs (condolences) on
the death of your son, Jamie, I heard?
from colleagus (colleages) that Jamie was
a brave, selfless and wholly
professional soldier who was hels
in high request (something) and
regard by all who worked
with him. I hope that
words can offer little comfort
at a time of grief
but I hope that, with time,
you will find some
comfort in your son's
great courage and bravery
and in the huge (something)
he made to the security
of our country. If I can
help in any way, please
tell me.

My sincere condolences,
Yours sincerely


Gordon Brown

It is badly worded and some words you can only barely make out, but it's disgusting she takes into no account that Prime Minister is offering out a hand of help (near the end of the letter) and completely chucks it back in his face :/ Loads of people on The Sun website agree, she's ungrateful :/

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/campaigns/our_boys/2720283/Prime-Minister-Gordon-Brown-couldnt-even-get-our-name-right.html

[Callum.]

he did spell a lot of things incorrectly, including he put james instead of janes.

and he didn't bow for something or other.

make news out of nothing these days.

[GommeInc]

he did spell a lot of things incorrectly, including he put james instead of janes.

and he didn't bow for something or other.

make news out of nothing these days.
At least he went to the ceremony :/ Again, they overlook simple facts and in this day and age, bowing doesn't show anything, you could be thinking about porn while bowing and people would think you're a saint.

[Jack.Lfc]

Brown has very poor eyesight, and it's long since been acknowledged that he suffers from dyslexia.

Atleast she got a letter, she's just after the publicity.

[Nixt]

Quite frankly I think it is ridiculous that this woman is responding in such a way. At a time she should be grieving her son she is getting all hung up about a few misspellings on a letter that was written out of kindness and good intent. It really is something that the PM has taken the time to hand write such a letter. She should be grateful, I most certainly would be.

[Jack.Lfc]

Dr Mrs James :lol:

[Nixt]

Dr Mrs James :lol:

Always though 'Dr' is used as an abbreviation for 'dear' sometimes.

[Jack.Lfc]

Yeh it is but Her names Janes not James

[Nixt]

Yeh it is but Her names Janes not James

Yes I got that much - it's kinda the point of the thread. Lol.

[FlyingJesus]

It really is something that the PM has taken the time to hand write such a letter.

That's the bit that got me when I heard it (on me radiogrammastereophone) I was like what I didn't even know they did hand written letters and she's like YOU SHOULD HAVE JUST WORD PROCESSED IT as though that would have corrected her name for him... because Janes is obviously more common a word than James. Ridiculous

[GommeInc]

She said that?! Then it's settled then, she's just one of these miserable people who hate, beyond anything else, her name being mis-spelt and she has some sort of pure hatred against the name James, which is proven to be more common than Janes. She's an anti-fact woman, clearly :P

[Ardemax]

as if there's nothing better to complain about

[-:Undertaker:-]

Oh well, if he can't write the letters maybe he or Tony Blair should of had the courage to at least once, go to the view the coffins coming home from Iraq and Afghanistan.

[FlyingJesus]

Come off it Dan even you have to admit that hand writing the letters is a really nice touch when he could quite easily order a standardised printoff with [fill in name here]

[Hecktix]

I think she's rudely taking the piss.

Yes it's proven Gordon Brown has issues with eyesight however can anyone else not see that some of the spelling mistakes could have just come from the handwriting?

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00924/SNN0904GX3-280_924722j.jpg

I personally think "greatest" is spelt correctly, but his handwriting tends to just merge certain letters together. You can certainly tell the difference from "your" and you", "security" evidently spelled correctly too.
As many have already said, for the Prime Minister to send a HAND WRITTEN letter to someone it's quite an honour as he's a very busy man. I purely think it's just his handwriting that has caused the issue.

I agree that it is quite bad that he mispelt the name, however he can only see out of one eye, maybe he saw the data he had as saying James?

I think this is outrageous, and all my support goes to Gordon and I think that sending a handwritten letter is very respectful. Keep it up Gordo!

[-:Undertaker:-]

Come off it Dan even you have to admit that hand writing the letters is a really nice touch when he could quite easily order a standardised printoff with [fill in name here]

They should not be in Iraq or Afghanistan, so while the letter is not his fault at all, the death of that womans son lays at the feet of the Bush Administration and the Blair-Brown government who lied to parliament and sent our men and women into a warzone (unequipped) and to fight for what?

[Ardemax]

They should not be in Iraq or Afghanistan, so while the letter is not his fault at all, the death of that womans son lays at the feet of the Bush Administration and the Blair-Brown government who lied to parliament and sent our men and women into a warzone (unequipped) and to fight for what?

we're not on about whether we should be in afghanistan or not

we're on about the rudeness of this woman

[StefanWolves]

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00924/SNN0904GX3-280_924722a.jpg
Imagine your son had just died in a war that we shouldn't even be fighting, and then the PM of the country sends you a letter looking like that? terrible handwriting, pathetic spelling, 5cm spaces between words and saying that you're son is 'ONLY ONE OF 220'? how would that make YOU feel? I mean come on, my 5 year old brother could write better than that - and to a women who has just lost her son to a NON-WORTHY cause, it is DISGUSTING.

To all you people saying 'this woman is pathetic, she should be grateful' just shut up, just shut up, just do it now. That's a pathetic excuse of a comment, she has just lost her son, how do you think she'd feel reading that pile of crap?

She has EVERYTHING to complain about, if he has bad eye site and whatnot then he should have got someone else to write it. Bad eye sight or not - I'm sure he has glasses? then is no excuse for such a pathetic insult.

Some of you people commenting in here saying 'whats she complaining about!!!' should be disgusted with yourselves. It's people like you who are driving this country down even deeper into darkness.

[Jordy]

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00924/SNN0904GX3-280_924722a.jpg
Imagine your son had just died in a war that we shouldn't even be fighting, and then the PM of the country sends you a letter looking like that? terrible handwriting, pathetic spelling, 5cm spaces between words and saying that you're son is 'ONLY ONE OF 220'? how would that make YOU feel? I mean come on, my 5 year old brother could write better than that - and to a women who has just lost her son to a NON-WORTHY cause, it is DISGUSTING.

To all you people saying 'this woman is pathetic, she should be grateful' just shut up, just shut up, just do it now. That's a pathetic excuse of a comment, she has just lost her son, how do you think she'd feel reading that pile of crap?

She has EVERYTHING to complain about, if he has bad eye site and whatnot then he should have got someone else to write it. Bad eye sight or not - I'm sure he has glasses? then is no excuse for such a pathetic insult.

Some of you people commenting in here saying 'whats she complaining about!!!' should be disgusted with yourselves. It's people like you who are driving this country down even deeper into darkness.What use is it someone else writing it? It shows Gordon Brown has spent his time hearing about this individual case (and all of the deaths in Afghanistan it would seem) and personally writing a letter to her. He is the prime minister and he's had the time to do that, it also shows how grateful and caring he is. The letter was not out to offend anyone at all, he clearly had good intensions and if you think he wrote the letter to take the piss out of her then you can be the first member added to my ignore list (I'm sure others will agree with me there).

Like others in this thread, I was also disgusted by this news. Not only that the media have milked for all it's worth (It's the BBC Headline for god sake!). I think she's embarrassed herself and her son, just to have a poke at Gordon Brown and earn a nice bit of money. It's the ridiculous media and idiots like her which is the reason 'The countries going down the pan', not us lot.

[StefanWolves]

What use is it someone else writing it? It shows Gordon Brown has spent his time hearing about this individual case (and all of the deaths in Afghanistan it would seem) and personally writing a letter to her. He is the prime minister and he's had the time to do that, it also shows how grateful and caring he is.
What use it it someone else writing it? I'll tell you - a well stuctured and well worded letter, the poor women is not going to know the difference between Brown writing it or someone else sitting next to him handwriting what he is saying? it's just common sense - if he isn't up to writing it, then get someone else to write what you are saying, it really isn't rocket science.


The letter was not out to offend anyone at all, he clearly had good intensions and if you think he wrote the letter to take the piss out of her then you can be the first member added to my ignore list (I'm sure others will agree with me there).That's not the point at all - yes he had good intentions, but his execution was lazy. Of course he didn't write the letter to take the piss, now you are just getting the wrong end of the stick. Go on, add me to it, I really couldn't care, Just put yourself in her situation, I'm sure you'd feel very disrespected.


Like others in this thread, I was also disgusted by this news. Not only that the media have milked for all it's worth (It's the BBC Headline for god sake!). I think she's embarrassed herself and her son, just to have a poke at Gordon Brown and earn a nice bit of money.I understand where people are coming from, but come on. Put yourself in that ladies position, you'd be absolutely mortified and disrespected if someone spelled your sons name wrong, and wrote a letter that looks more like he tried to write it with his toes.

It isn't like this is a 'special case', he writes to all the families who have lost soldiers. I'm sure all the others have been fine, but on this one it just looks like he hasn't been bothered at all, and looks like he wrote it within two minutes to just get it out the way. I know I certainly wouldn't like it if MY SON DIED, would you?

Jordy, I'm sorry if you don't like me giving my opinion, I'm sure I'll feel very comfy in your ignore list. :)

[-:Undertaker:-]

we're not ohttp://www.habboxforum.com/images/editor/separator.gifn about whether we should be in afghanistan or not

we're on about the rudeness of this woman

I know what we are on about, and I am saying that the issue over a letter is nothing and that they shouldn't be there anyway, regardless of letters sent by Gordon Brown.

..being lectured by Ardemax on whether my posts are valid, what next.

[GommeInc]

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00924/SNN0904GX3-280_924722a.jpg
Imagine your son had just died in a war that we shouldn't even be fighting, and then the PM of the country sends you a letter looking like that? terrible handwriting, pathetic spelling, 5cm spaces between words and saying that you're son is 'ONLY ONE OF 220'? how would that make YOU feel? I mean come on, my 5 year old brother could write better than that - and to a women who has just lost her son to a NON-WORTHY cause, it is DISGUSTING.

To all you people saying 'this woman is pathetic, she should be grateful' just shut up, just shut up, just do it now. That's a pathetic excuse of a comment, she has just lost her son, how do you think she'd feel reading that pile of crap?

She has EVERYTHING to complain about, if he has bad eye site and whatnot then he should have got someone else to write it. Bad eye sight or not - I'm sure he has glasses? then is no excuse for such a pathetic insult.

Some of you people commenting in here saying 'whats she complaining about!!!' should be disgusted with yourselves. It's people like you who are driving this country down even deeper into darkness.
Way to make up the article :rolleyes: He never said anything about "1 of 220", so why don't you shut up, just shut up, shut up now :rolleyes:

It's a hand-written letter with heart-felt condolences and emotion. What does she want? A golden coffin with Elton John mounted on top of it? Don't be silly, he fought in a war which is expected of being a soldier, working in the army. You're missing the point, HE wrote the letter. Not someone else, why should "someone else" write the letter, a letter that Gordon Brown should do himself? Again, you miss the point and immediately bum-huff The Sun and take the side of a clearly clueless woman. If it was word-processed, should would of complained that the letter was impersonal, if Gordon Brown had someone else write it, it would be impersonal. Again, you miss the point that Gordon Brown wrote this letter, and not someone else. Sod his hand-writing, it would appear it's how he always writes anyway. I have a Princess Diana Award certificate with his signature on it, and it is the spitting image of his natural hand-writing in this article, and funnily enough it is written in felt-tip (though the signature is a photocopy put onto the paper, which is expected).

So yeah, re-read what you have written, and laugh at this lady. No-one is taking her seriously - she's disgusting, she's recently lost her son but cares more about a letter that was sincere and honourable, but she thinks it a better idea to piss on her sons honour and rant about how terrible of a person she is to the government (that's the impression). It's people like her who have no right to walk in the air of this country, because she's too inconsiderate and rude. She's pissed on the hand of the Prime Minister, who had offered a personal invitation of help and a letter of sincere condolences. It's not us who are the problem, it's people like you who do not recognise kindness in the community, people like you who will grow up to be old people who won't thank a youngster for giving way to you or letting you sit on a seat on the bus.


I know what we are on about, and I am saying that the issue over a letter is nothing and that they shouldn't be there anyway, regardless of letters sent by Gordon Brown.

..being lectured by Ardemax on whether my posts are valid, what next.
You are totally missing the point dear. This argument is about how a vile woman has rejected the thanks of someone, because of a few words that she could not read, yet the majority of the country can read what that person said anyway. The war is completely unrelated, as this argument is simply about common decency and kindness, which this lady lacks. Turn off the government rador for this thread m'love ;)

[Jordy]

What use it it someone else writing it? I'll tell you - a well stuctured and well worded letter, the poor women is not going to know the difference between Brown writing it or someone else sitting next to him handwriting what he is saying? it's just common sense - if he isn't up to writing it, then get someone else to write what you are saying, it really isn't rocket science.

That's not the point at all - yes he had good intentions, but his execution was lazy. Of course he didn't write the letter to take the piss, now you are just getting the wrong end of the stick. Go on, add me to it, I really couldn't care, Just put yourself in her situation, I'm sure you'd feel very disrespected.

I understand where people are coming from, but come on. Put yourself in that ladies position, you'd be absolutely mortified and disrespected if someone spelled your sons name wrong, and wrote a letter that looks more like he tried to write it with his toes.

It isn't like this is a 'special case', he writes to all the families who have lost soldiers. I'm sure all the others have been fine, but on this one it just looks like he hasn't been bothered at all, and looks like he wrote it within two minutes to just get it out the way. I know I certainly wouldn't like it if MY SON DIED, would you?

Jordy, I'm sorry if you don't like me giving my opinion, I'm sure I'll feel very comfy in your ignore list. :)You've changed your tone from all this "just shut up, just shut up, just do it now. That's a pathetic excuse of a comment, she has just lost her son, how do you think she'd feel reading that pile of crap?" and "it is DISGUSTING." to now understanding where people are coming from, strange isn't it?

He has dyslexia, and has one eye remaining with very poor eye sight, I would certainly take that into account if I was the mother, he is also a very busy man and I'm afraid we lose soldiers in Afghanistan almost every day, yet he still sends out personal and hand-written letters, having it written by his secretary is completely meaningless, it's like me sending her a letter about the loss of a son. I have nothing to do with her, nor does the secretary. The prime minister is obviously the most important man in the country and is at the forefront of things to do with Afghanistan, therefore a letter from him means something.

She's cashed in on his mistake also which is probably the most ludicrous part of it all.

[-:Undertaker:-]

You are totally missing the point dear. This argument is about how a vile woman has rejected the thanks of someone, because of a few words that she could not read, yet the majority of the country can read what that person said anyway. The war is completely unrelated, as this argument is simply about common decency and kindness, which this lady lacks. Turn off the government rador for this thread m'love ;)

The woman just lost her son because her son and others men and women was/are out there fighting for a corrupt government in Kabul/unjust war in Iraq. I think calling the woman vile especially when she has just lost her son is out of order, because it was not her who sent thousands of our men and women out there to be killed for no reason what so ever.

[StefanWolves]

The woman just lost her son because her son and others men and women was/are out there fighting for a corrupt government in Kabul/unjust war in Iraq. I think calling the woman vile especially when she has just lost her son is out of order, because it was not her who sent thousands of our men and women out there to be killed for no reason what so ever.
This.

Jordy, just looking up the full letter and I'll prove my point hopefully in a minute, I'm sure I read somewhere about 1 of 220 or something along those lines. :)

[Inseriousity.]

At least he sent a letter. He could have just made excuses that he's busy with some 'important government business.' He's just in a lose-lose situation where he can't win. He sends a letter, he gets abuse. He doesn't send a letter, he gets abuse.

I'm sure she's upset over the loss of her son but there isn't any need for her to use someone's disability against them.

[GommeInc]

The woman just lost her son because her son and others men and women was/are out there fighting for a corrupt government in Kabul/unjust war in Iraq. I think calling the woman vile especially when she has just lost her son is out of order, because it was not her who sent thousands of our men and women out there to be killed for no reason what so ever.
Her son has free will, if he wanted a job in the army, then war is expected to be on the agenda ;) And it's not disgusting, it's honest. She is not arguing about her son going to war, or the war in general, she's moaning about a letter which she cannot read and a mis-spelt name, hardly the end of the world and hardly worth the paper it was printed on. The silly woman should of done this quietly, by asking the Prime Minister to possibly re-write this on a word processor, or just simply fix the name. She's disgusting because she takes the kind words he wrote in this letter, urinated on them (so basically urinated on her son's honour) and disregards it, all because she's a petty little woman :/


This.

Jordy, just looking up the full letter and I'll prove my point hopefully in a minute, I'm sure I read somewhere about 1 of 220 or something along those lines. :)
Way to go, you've just admitted your original post was aload of rubbish.

For anyone interested in his signature:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b70/gommeinc/GordonBrownSignature.jpg

Since when was his name "Gorda Bum"? :O See, I can play the hand-writing critic :D

[StefanWolves]

And how did I do that?

@The person up their also criticising me; what? can't I say that I don't agree with the way the mother went about? yes she may have gone about it the wrong way, but I have a lot of support for her, the letter is disgusting.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Her son has free will, if he wanted a job in the army, then war is expected to be on the agenda ;) And it's not disgusting, it's honest. She is not arguing about her son going to war, or the war in general, she's moaning about a letter which she cannot read and a mis-spelt name, hardly the end of the world and hardly worth the paper it was printed on. The silly woman should of done this quietly, by asking the Prime Minister to possibly re-write this on a word processor, or just simply fix the name. She's disgusting because she takes the kind words he wrote in this letter, urinated on them (so basically urinated on her son's honour) and disregards it, all because she's a petty little woman :/

...war has to be expected on the agenda yes, but theres a very big gap between fighting a just war and a war that was wrong in the first place and only exists to prop up some backward government in Kabul who rigged the elections.

I certainly wouldn't say her sons honour is in any letter belonging to Tony Blair/Gordon Brown, especially when they are one of the principle reasons why her son is dead.

[GommeInc]

And how did I do that?
Because nothing in your original post, other than "her son went to war and died" was in Undertaker's post, the rest of your post was pure dribble which you seem to just want to ignore now (he shouldn't of written it, he should lie etc etc).


...war has to be expected on the agenda yes, but theres a very big gap between fighting a just war and a war that was wrong in the first place and only exists to prop up some backward government in Kabul who rigged the elections.

I certainly wouldn't say her sons honour is in any letter belonging to Tony Blair/Gordon Brown, especially when they are one of the principle reasons why her son is dead.
Again, this has nothing to do with war... This whole discussion is revolving around common courtesy and basic human kindness, qualities Mrs. Janes lacks. Also, honour is in the eye of the beholder, much like beauty, heroics and so forth. Gordon Brown says he is an honourable and "great" man, these are qualities which can only label a man if they come from someone else (Mr. Janes could not call himself honourable, there needs to be reasons both in action and what is perceived, his friends called him honourable, as with family and someone with a high-status). She literally just urinated on someone calling him honourable and great, not something you should do to your son :rolleyes: Basically like saying "Cheryl Cole is a very beautiful woman" and then someone else saying "this is an insult!" which in turn looks like the person who is "insulted" disagrees with the fact, as Mrs. Janes has done with her son, she took no acknowledgement in the letter other than his arguably "poor" writing. She's a vile woman.

So yeah, get off the war and government argument, it's totally irrelevant, this is about a woman who is too up her own bottom to take the kind words of an individual, simply because of a few minor issues. It's pathetic.

[StefanWolves]

he should lie? ***, I NEVER said that? I advise you go re-read my posts as I didn't say he should lie. I said he should have got someone else to write what he was saying. Instead of writing 'dribble' like that.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Again, this has nothing to do with war... This whole discussion is revolving around common courtesy and basic human kindness, qualities Mrs. Janes lacks. Also, honour is in the eye of the beholder, much like beauty, heroics and so forth. Gordon Brown says he is an honourable and "great" man, these are qualities which can only label a man if they come from someone else (Mr. Janes could not call himself honourable, there needs to be reasons both in action and what is perceived, his friends called him honourable, as with family and someone with a high-status). She literally just urinated on someone calling him honourable and great, not something you should do to your son :rolleyes: Basically like saying "Cheryl Cole is a very beautiful woman" and then someone else saying "this is an insult!" which in turn looks like the person who is "insulted" disagrees with the fact, as Mrs. Janes has done with her son, she took no acknowledgement in the letter other than his arguably "poor" writing. She's a vile woman.

So yeah, get off the war and government argument, it's totally irrelevant, this is about a woman who is too up her own bottom to take the kind words of an individual, simply because of a few minor issues. It's pathetic.

I wouldn't call the woman vile/unhuman compared to Gordon Brown and more so Tony Blair, because all she did was make a petty complaint about a letter, whereas they sent her son to his death for no reason what so ever. That is my point, and its pretty simple; a unjust war which causes death is far more important to be moaning about than a womans opinions on a letter.

[GommeInc]

he should lie? ***, I NEVER said that? I advise you go re-read my posts as I didn't say he should lie. I said he should have got someone else to write what he was saying. Instead of writing 'dribble' like that.

Unlike you, I remember arguments. You suggested that Gordon Brown should have got someone else to write the letter on his behalf:


What use it it someone else writing it? I'll tell you - a well stuctured and well worded letter, the poor women is not going to know the difference between Brown writing it or someone else sitting next to him handwriting what he is saying? it's just common sense - if he isn't up to writing it, then get someone else to write what you are saying, it really isn't rocket science.

You are suggesting someone else write the letter, with his name signed at the bottom. This is lying. He would infact be lying if the letter was signed by him, but not written by him. If he was next to the writer, it would of said "From the Office of the Prime Minister", not signed "Gordon Brown, Prime Minister" for this would be lying to the receiver, for it is not from Gordon Brown himself.

So don't say I was typing dribble, because what you said in your original two posts was exactly that ;) You've discredited those posts, which suggests they were not thought through.


I wouldn't call the woman vile/unhuman compared to Gordon Brown and more so Tony Blair, because all she did was make a petty complaint about a letter, whereas they sent her son to his death for no reason what so ever. That is my point, and its pretty simple; a unjust war which causes death is far more important to be moaning about than a womans opinions on a letter.
Again, you miss the point and keep mentioning war, this has nothing to do with war :/ She is discrediting a letter, that's it. If it was Tony Blair, Gordon Brown or The Queen who wrote that letter, disregarding it is a disgusting thing to do all because of something trivial like bad spelling/writing. Who cares if "they sent him to war", that's irrelevant to the central argument. The central argument is about decency and basic human kindness and indeed respect. You're adding the war to make it relevant, but no one other than you has mentioned the war. I might as well go ahead and mention the Royal Mail :/ It would be totally irrelevant.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Again, you miss the point and keep mentioning war, this has nothing to do with war :/ She is discrediting a letter, that's it. If it was Tony Blair, Gordon Brown or The Queen who wrote that letter, disregarding it is a disgusting thing to do all because of something trivial like bad spelling/writing. Who cares if "they sent him to war", that's irrelevant to the central argument. The central argument is about decency and basic human kindness and indeed respect. You're adding the war to make it relevant, but no one other than you has mentioned the war. I might as well go ahead and mention the Royal Mail :/ It would be totally irrelevant.

No you have it wrong, I am making the point that while you call her vile while shes just lost her son and seem to have a lot to say over her having some petty issue over a letter, if she is vile for making a fuss over a letter then where do you place Gordon Brown and Tony Blair because they were the ones who sent her son to his death for no reason what so ever. If you want respect as a human being then you don't send a mothers son into a unjust war.

..and no, her son was not fighting the Royal Mail, her son was fighting in Afghanistan, so you are right, the Royal Mail doesn't have anything to do with it.

[GommeInc]

No you have it wrong, I am making the point that while you call her vile while shes just lost her son and seem to have a lot to say over her having some petty issue over a letter, if she is vile for making a fuss over a letter then where do you place Gordon Brown and Tony Blair because they were the ones who sent her son to his death for no reason what so ever. If you want respect as a human being then you don't send a mothers son into a unjust war.

..and no, her son was not fighting the Royal Mail, her son was fighting in Afghanistan, so you are right, the Royal Mail doesn't have anything to do with it.
Again, pointless to the argument for they did not send her son to war. Gordon Brown didn't physically drive, fly and then kick him out into the desert. Saying "I think Gordon Brown and Tony Blair are vile" would be ignorant, as they are not the only ones behind this war. Also, if my maths is correct, he joined the military while the war was happening, so yeah, it is even more irrelevant to the discussion, saying he was kicked when he happily walked into it himself (unless he joined the army when he was 11?) ;)

[-:Undertaker:-]

Again, pointless to the argument for they did not send her son to war. Gordon Brown didn't physically drive, fly and then kick him out into the desert. Saying I think Gordon Brown and Tony Blair are vile would be ignorant, as they are not the only ones behind this war. Also, if my maths are correct, he joined the military while the war was happening, so yeah, it is even more irrelevant to the discussion, saying he was kicked when he happily walked into it himself (unless he joined the army when he was 11?) ;)

He could of walked out, you are right, maybe he enjoyed his job - i'm not disputing that he didn't. I am saying that in my opinion Tony Blair and Gordon Brown are the vile ones for sending these young men and women to war for an unjust cause, without correct equipment and to support a puppet regime which is corrupt and rigs elections - whereas the woman is just being petty.

[StefanWolves]

Unlike you, I remember arguments. You suggested that Gordon Brown should have got someone else to write the letter on his behalf:



You are suggesting someone else write the letter, with his name signed at the bottom. This is lying. He would infact be lying if the letter was signed by him, but not written by him. If he was next to the writer, it would of said "From the Office of the Prime Minister", not signed "Gordon Brown, Prime Minister" for this would be lying to the receiver, for it is not from Gordon Brown himself.

So don't say I was typing dribble, because what you said in your original two posts was exactly that ;) You've discredited those posts, which suggests they were not thought through.


Again, you miss the point and keep mentioning war, this has nothing to do with war :/ She is discrediting a letter, that's it. If it was Tony Blair, Gordon Brown or The Queen who wrote that letter, disregarding it is a disgusting thing to do all because of something trivial like bad spelling/writing. Who cares if "they sent him to war", that's irrelevant to the central argument. The central argument is about decency and basic human kindness and indeed respect. You're adding the war to make it relevant, but no one other than you has mentioned the war. I might as well go ahead and mention the Royal Mail :/ It would be totally irrelevant.

Go read it again, ARE YOU BLIND?


What use it it someone else writing it? I'll tell you - a well stuctured and well worded letter, the poor women is not going to know the difference between Brown writing it or someone else sitting next to him handwriting what he is saying? it's just common sense - if he isn't up to writing it, then get someone else to write what you are saying, it really isn't rocket science.

A well written letter written by someone besides the prime minister, but taken from the prime ministers actual words is much better than a letter written by himself in a messy fashion. It would still be FROM him, he would still be SAYING it, just not writing it down. It's still HIS words.

[GommeInc]

Go read it again, ARE YOU BLIND?
Read what I wrote, are you BLIND as well as a 6 letter S word? ;)

You are suggesting someone else write the letter with his name at the bottom. This would be lying, as he personally writes the letters and always has done, if he didn't he would be lying to the person(s), especially as his hand-writing is clearly recognisable. HE writes the letters, get HE in that little head of yours ;) Having someone else write them, with him next to them, would be lying, he is not writing them merely dictating what should be said. This isn't him writing them, he is merely speaking the words in order to be written.

Just leave this argument, as you appear to have lost when Jordy corrected you ages ago. Calling the woman a "poor women" is quite a bad thing to say when you're suggesting someone else writes the letter, because she "is not going to know the difference between Brown writing it or someone else sitting next to him". That is lying :eusa_whis He didn't write the letter, someone else did.

I've noticed how you're not denying the letter was bad, only the handwriting, so yes, you have no central argument as you seem to be hell-bent on the style of his writing and NOT the content. The content of the letter was very good and quite heart-felt. So yes... You're one of these people who, upon receiving a letter from a sweet-heart, will judge how much she cares on the style of hand-writing, and not the content inside. You little teaser ;)

[StefanWolves]

WHERE DID I SAY SOMEONE ELSE WRITE IT WITH HIS NAME AT THE BOTTOM?

All I was saying was that some one else should WRITE what he is SAYING. This is NOT lying, I also said NOTHING about the signage at the bottom, stop making it up as you go along lol.

[GommeInc]

WHERE DID I SAY SOMEONE ELSE WRITE IT WITH HIS NAME AT THE BOTTOM?

All I was saying was that some one else should WRITE what he is SAYING. This is NOT lying, I also said NOTHING about the signage at the bottom, stop making it up as you go along lol.
You didn't, you're suggesting a woman is given a letter by some un-named informant and not Gordon Brown. Well done, that will confuse the poor woman. Gordon Brown always writes these letters, and signs them on behalf of himself. And the signage is how you know who it comes from, dear ;)

And again, you're only caring about the handwriting, not the content of the letter. You're as bad as the woman, blind. The content of the letter is what matters, and the handwriting wasn't even that bad. You're just making it up as you go along it seems.

Can I ask you, why you think this letter "is an insult"? Because I'm getting the idea you don't actually know...

[StefanWolves]

The letter is an insult because:
- It obviously hasn't been written with emotion, or thought, it has simply been rushed.
- The handwriting, look at it? is that about 50 words on ONE PAGE?
- The spelling, come on? he couldn't spell condolences? He's meant to be a highly educated person.
- He spelled his name WRONG? yes, it's something little, but it's still unacceptable.

Yes, I agree, the way the woman has gone to the papers etc is wrong, and stupid, but its up to her, I know I'd be a bit pissed off if I received that letter if I was in her situation, just put yourself in her position and you recieved that pile of crap.

Yes, I agree the Prime Minister had all the best intentions, and I know he has problems with his eyes and has dyslexia, but still, it is a bit bad, and I do feel sorry for him, as it shouldn't have gone to the papers. But I'm sure it isn't to hard for him to get help with writing it or have someone else writing it for him, which I don't care what you say - is his own words and ISN'T lies.

If someone else writing the letter for him from what he is saying is such lies, then tell me this - what about all these students who have DYSLEXIA, at school like Gordon Brown does - get to have people to write out their essays for them in tests like GCSE's and SATs? if it isn't their own words? It's the same sort of thing, it is their words, just someone else writing it for them. These students also sign the front of the examination paper off to show that it is there work, so, are they lying too? because they didn't write it? because that's what you saying about my idea of the PM having someone write what he is saying.

So yes. That's it, I can't be bothered arguing anymore because you obviously are NOT putting yourself in the mothers shoes. I'm sure you'd be the same as she is, you would have just gone about it in a different way - like trying to contact the PM somehow.

[Japan]

I don't think we should point fingers at anyone tbh.
The mother is going to be extremely distraught; when my grandma died I attacked everyone and everything. Her son has just died so I think we should give her a break.
Gordon brown has dyslexia and it was nice of him to send a letter, even if it wasn't a very good one. Something is, after all, better than nothing.

[GommeInc]

The letter is an insult because:
- It obviously hasn't been written with emotion, or thought, it has simply been rushed. False - his writing is always like this. Also, handwriting doesn't show emotion, words do. Read the words, they're deep and full of emotion. "I hope that, with time, you will find some comfort in your son's great courage and bravery and in the huge contribution he made to the security of our country. If I can help in any way, please tell me." What do you mean by emotion, kissing the arse of the mother? These words are acceptable, you're moaning for the sake of moaning :/
- The handwriting, look at it? is that about 50 words on ONE PAGE? Condolences aren't meant to be lecture. He said what needed to be said.
- The spelling, come on? he couldn't spell condolences? He's meant to be a highly educated person.He's got dyslexia :rolleyes: And it's hardly the end of the world. I've seen business reports with bad spelling. This is not an insult.
- He spelled his name WRONG? yes, it's something little, but it's still unacceptable. Not worth blabbing to The Sun and making a big deal out of nothing, she should of just wrote back saying the name was wrong like a normal human being, and being grateful she actually got a letter in the first place - the letter was fine, it said what needed to be said. If she is too pathetic of a human being, then she needs to sort her life out. Yes, her son died in a war, but this attitude is totally unacceptable.


Yes, I agree, the way the woman has gone to the papers etc is wrong, and stupid, but its up to her, I know I'd be a bit pissed off if I received that letter if I was in her situation, just put yourself in her position and you recieved that pile of crap.
It's not a pile of crap at all. It said what needed to be said. How is it a pile of crap? I received a letter from the hospital when my father died, I didn't call it a piece of crap. Like this letter, it said what needed to be said. I didn't judge the hand-writing, infact it was nice it was personal, like this letter. Is hand-writing really such a big deal to you? Because you seem to be focusing on that, and not the content of the letter :rolleyesL


Yes, I agree the Prime Minister had all the best intentions, and I know he has problems with his eyes and has dyslexia, but still, it is a bit bad, and I do feel sorry for him, as it shouldn't have gone to the papers. But I'm sure it isn't to hard for him to get help with writing it or have someone else writing it for him, which I don't care what you say - is his own words and ISN'T lies.
It would be lies, when he personally writes the letters but gets someone else the write the letters in his name - notice the error in that sentence? That's why it cannot be done ;) Anyone in the world would rather have a personal letter, not an impersonal one like you're suggesting. Again, you're moaning for the sake of moaning and don't appear to care about the content of the letter. He didn't need help anyway, it was readable - you don't appear to have noticed alot of people have been able to read it. Not everyone has perfect writing, but it takes a good brain in your head to understandable what someone is trying to say. If this woman is too lazy to take the time to read it, then I pity her and her dull, puny brain. The words were there, they made sense. That is the end of it :/


If someone else writing the letter for him from what he is saying is such lies, then tell me this - what about all these students who have DYSLEXIA, at school like Gordon Brown does - get to have people to write out their essays for them in tests like GCSE's and SATs? if it isn't their own words? It's the same sort of thing, it is their words, just someone else writing it for them. These students also sign the front of the examination paper off to show that it is there work, so, are they lying too? because they didn't write it? because that's what you saying about my idea of the PM having someone write what he is saying.
Don't be stupid. An essay doesn't have to be personal. Gordon Brown writes the letters personally. Understand that and you may actually know what you're talking about and understand this argument. No-one should write the letters on behalf of the PM, if you found out you'd be annoyed because he didn't write it personally. Understand what "personally" or "personal" means, because Gordon Brown personally writes these letters, he shouldn't get someone to write the letters on behalf of him :/ His writing isn't that bad and you know it isn't, and so do many others.


So yes. That's it, I can't be bothered arguing anymore because you obviously are NOT putting yourself in the mothers shoes. I'm sure you'd be the same as she is, you would have just gone about it in a different way - like trying to contact the PM somehow.
The woman IS stupid, why would I put myself in an idiots shoes? I've had letters from companies and people about my father's death. Some were oddly written (like one sent to my mother addressed to Mrs. <father's name> <surname> sent by American uncle), it was a salt in the wound, but hardly anything to over-react or care about. I've had letters with the wrong names on, it takes a few seconds to sort out. If this horrible woman feels the need to act the cow and tell the world, then she's made a fool of herself (and she has, loads of people have found her behaviour appauling, and on another forum I use, swearing was involved, and it came from alot of people who have lost families in wars :P). She is a disgrace, there's no denying it. She's receiving a letter in good will, and completely rejected it without even thinking about the content. She's a horrible woman, and doesn't deserve the attention she's getting (even though the majority is bad attention). Heck, on the radio the way it's reported, she is being made to sound like a complete idiot. "A woman has got Gordon Brown to apologize over a spelling mistaking in a letter." It's pathetic, she's pathetic :/


I don't think we should point fingers at anyone tbh.
The mother is going to be extremely distraught; when my grandma died I attacked everyone and everything. Her son has just died so I think we should give her a break.
Gordon brown has dyslexia and it was nice of him to send a letter, even if it wasn't a very good one. Something is, after all, better than nothing.
Considering Gordon Brown has done nothing wrong in this situation, and that this woman has made a complete fool of herself, then yes, fingers should be pointed at a woman who seems to either have too much time on her hands, or not care about her son. If someone wrote a letter saying "Your son is a brave, couragious young man. He will be deeply missed", no-one should ever say "Handwriting is crap, this is an insult" as it kinda suggesting having her son called brave by someone is an insult :P This letter was not an insult, and hopefully it will be drummed into her. I hope she reads The Sun's website, because alot of people disagree with her and I hope she goes on alot of news forums, because quite alot of them involve swearing and calling her a shambles and disgrace to the honour of her son, and that's coming from alot of wives, mothers, husbands and so on who have lost family in wars.

[alexxxxx]

barely an issue. it's not like gordon hasn't had to deal with personal tradgedies, he lost a child and one has cystic fibrosis. it's a miracle cameron and him have even been able to put these things behind them and continued to work as politicians.

[Nixt]

hey got loads of work to do so didn't read everything but just to point out to those people who are like "ya disrespecting the kid that died" well HOW DARE YOU. HOW VERY ******* DARE you say that to me - someone who has served in the armed forces and has had someone I knew killed and a couple more injured. I am not at all disrespecting him or his mother. If anything she should be the one grieving not worrying about what was actually a thoughtful letter.

Again. HOW DARE YOU :@

[Spiffing]

If I got a scrappy letter like that, I'd be like "well, he could have put some effort into it" but it's the thought that counts. And hardly something to moan to the news about.

[Black_Apalachi]

I wouldn't call the woman vile/unhuman compared to Gordon Brown and more so Tony Blair, because all she did was make a petty complaint about a letter, whereas they sent her son to his death for no reason what so ever. That is my point, and its pretty simple; a unjust war which causes death is far more important to be moaning about than a womans opinions on a letter.

^

If he doesn't have very good handwriting, fair enough but a letter such as this is pretty important so I would have imagined you'd take the utmost care in making it as presentable as possible rather than like a school report. If there are in fact spelling mistakes, that is unacceptable regardless of any medical conditions; I'm pretty sure the Prime Minister isn't short of people to proof read a letter for him. Likewise with where he spelled the name wrong and had to go over the last letter; if I made a mistake like that on any letter/greeting card I'd automatically start over on a new sheet of paper.

[GommeInc]

Kinda difficult for a man who is busy and has to write things all the time. And Undertaker's quote seems to have nothing to do with what you said :P

It's amazing he even personally writes these letters. The Queen apparently has someone else do it for her :S

[Black_Apalachi]

Kinda difficult for a man who is busy and has to write things all the time. And Undertaker's quote seems to have nothing to do with what you said :P

It's amazing he even personally writes these letters. The Queen apparently has someone else do it for her :S

I know lol, but his quote was part of what I wanted to say, so it saved repeating him and I just added the rest of my comment under it.

[Ardemax]

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00924/SNN0904GX3-280_924722a.jpg
Imagine your son had just died in a war that we shouldn't even be fighting, and then the PM of the country sends you a letter looking like that? terrible handwriting, pathetic spelling, 5cm spaces between words and saying that you're son is 'ONLY ONE OF 220'? how would that make YOU feel? I mean come on, my 5 year old brother could write better than that - and to a women who has just lost her son to a NON-WORTHY cause, it is DISGUSTING.

To all you people saying 'this woman is pathetic, she should be grateful' just shut up, just shut up, just do it now. That's a pathetic excuse of a comment, she has just lost her son, how do you think she'd feel reading that pile of crap?

She has EVERYTHING to complain about, if he has bad eye site and whatnot then he should have got someone else to write it. Bad eye sight or not - I'm sure he has glasses? then is no excuse for such a pathetic insult.

Some of you people commenting in here saying 'whats she complaining about!!!' should be disgusted with yourselves. It's people like you who are driving this country down even deeper into darkness.

ooo maybe mr. brown has more important things to do than right a letter to lots of different people

maybe he could just sit in his office and do that

but no, he tries to be nice, and he gets flamed

damnit if you've got something against him, yet he tries to be nice, you shouldn't really complain

[Black_Apalachi]

ooo maybe mr. brown has more important things to do than right a letter to lots of different people

maybe he could just sit in his office and do that

but no, he tries to be nice, and he gets flamed

damnit if you've got something against him, yet he tries to be nice, you shouldn't really complain

I can't really think of anything much more important. This woman gave up her son for this "war" that's quite frankly nothing to do with her.

[StefanWolves]

And then receives a pathetic attempt of a letter.

[GommeInc]

And then receives a pathetic attempt of a letter.
Again, why? It said what needed to be said - it was thoughtful (the grammar was near accurate), he used meaningful words and called the son brave, self-less and a "professional soldier". Calling the letter pathetic is like calling the son pathetic. If she doesn't like her son be complimented, then in a sense she's a pathetic excuse for a human being. I watched the video on The Sun website last night, and I consider her and even more pathetic woman - it wasn't an insult, you're (the woman) an insult and she starts making up aload of turd towards the end :/

So the handwriting was terrible, big deal. It's the thought that counts, but sadly this woman is so materialistic she can't be saved.


I can't really think of anything much more important. This woman gave up her son for this "war" that's quite frankly nothing to do with her.
Indeed, though arguably he took the time to write the letter himself is a selfless act, a good thing. He could just of had a generic letter format, and he just fills in the words when a soldier is named.

[StefanWolves]

Tbh, who do you think you are? do you really think a letter of a Prime Minister who's Government took their son to a un-needed war which subsequently killed her son is any sort of compensation? I agree, yes, she's moaning, she's going about it COMPLETELY the WRONG way, but she has every rite to moan if she wants to, after all, her son was in a war which we should NOT be fighting.

[Ardemax]

wolves if you so much support this woman, then why did she complain again at Gordon Brown's apology?

damnit can't you people give him a break

[Black_Apalachi]

... Indeed, though arguably he took the time to write the letter himself is a selfless act, a good thing. He could just of had a generic letter format, and he just fills in the words when a soldier is named.

Yeah about 30 seconds of his precious time. A couple more minutes to make it at least look sincere wouldn't have brought the country to a stand-still.

[StefanWolves]

Again, I totally agree.

[GommeInc]

Tbh, who do you think you are? do you really think a letter of a Prime Minister who's Government took their son to a un-needed war which subsequently killed her son is any sort of compensation? I agree, yes, she's moaning, she's going about it COMPLETELY the WRONG way, but she has every rite to moan if she wants to, after all, her son was in a war which we should NOT be fighting.
The government never took him to war, he took himself to war. Unless you're suggesting he went to war when he was 11? Well, you'd be completely wrong. He knew the consequences, he could see what the war was like :/ So yeah, you're trying to pick at this unknown argument of yours.

And the letter was sincere. There are no levels of sincerity like "a little sincere" or "very sincere", it was a sincere letter. Full stop. He didn't need to waste time on it, if she is too ungrateful to accept a letter of condolence from the Prime Minister, then she is a very pathetic woman, especially when he was paying a compliment to his hard work. What she said, is an insult to her son's honour. You wouldn't bite the head off someone paying respects to your father, saying words like "your father was a kind, generous man. He will be deeply missed" and then you reply "INSULT" like she was. She's quite a bad mother in terms of respecting her son, and she a terrible human being for biting the head off someone paying their respect. There was no need for her to say what she said, especially when he was showing the utmost respect for him. It's distasteful and disgusting, and alot of people agree with this.


wolves if you so much support this woman, then why did she complain again at Gordon Brown's apology?

damnit can't you people give him a break
I don't think he actually knows, he seems to think Gordon Brown was insulting this boy, yet there is no evidence other than handwriting, and handwriting shows no emotion, only words do, and the words he used were meaningful and emotional, praising the son :/

[Nixt]

Tbh, who do you think you are? do you really think a letter of a Prime Minister who's Government took their son to a un-needed war which subsequently killed her son is any sort of compensation? I agree, yes, she's moaning, she's going about it COMPLETELY the WRONG way, but she has every rite to moan if she wants to, after all, her son was in a war which we should NOT be fighting.

Don't be silly. I joined the army with the intention of going to Afghanistan. I know loads of people who volunteered to go out to Afghanistan - because they wanted to go out there and fulfil a purpose. It makes you feel ******* good to go out to a country like Afghanistan and try and make a difference. It was his choice to join the army knowing he could and most probably would enter conflict. He made that decision off of his own back and he lost his life for it. We should be celebrating his life and giving him every ounce of respect he deserves not bickering over a letter that had every intention of kindness and respect.

[StefanWolves]

I know that, and It is why we should be so very proud of them. Yes, I agree, the mother is just moaning now and she should shut up, and she shouldn't have gone to the media, but she does have a point.

[GommeInc]

Not really, criticising handwriting over-shadows the point of the letter, and handwriting should neither be the end all or be all of a letter, words speak the emotion and tone, not the handwriting :P Especially when she appears to over-look all the major things.

[StefanWolves]

That's your opinion, and your entitled to it, I just see if differently, I'm just imagining how I'd feel If I got a letter like that off the current Prime Minister of a Government that took my son into an unworthy war.

But yeah, she's babbling on bout it to much now, obviously motivated by money or something.

[GommeInc]

That's your opinion, and your entitled to it, I just see if differently, I'm just imagining how I'd feel If I got a letter like that off the current Prime Minister of a Government that took my son into an unworthy war.

But yeah, she's babbling on bout it to much now, obviously motivated by money or something.
But that's the point, the Government didn't take the son into this unworthy war! The war would of been going for a good few years before he went, so the family and the son knew exactly what they were in for. Saying the Government took the son into an unworthy war, is like saying a recently employed Ford engineer would have to work on a car that was released 2 years prior, the engineer should and would know what they were in for. That's not the opinion, it's fact :P

And she doesn't seem to mention about the war, she only mentions his poor spelling and handwriting. Talking about the war is kinda irrelevant this :P

If she's doing it for money, she's only adding fuel on top of the firewood that is disrepect for her son :P The fuel being money, and the firewood being the way she called a compliment to her son an insult :P

[Ardemax]

did the government make her son join the army?

well there we go then