Security alert on Heathrow Airport plane

[xxMATTGxx]

Police are attending a security alert at London's Heathrow Airport, a spokesman has said.

A Scotland Yard source confirmed an incident occurred on a Dubai-bound plane, believed to be an Emirates jet.

A spokesman for the Met said: "We are aware of a security incident at Heathrow. The airport and terminal remains open."

It is being reported that there had been two arrests and the remaining passengers remained on the jet.

"We have not found anything," the source added.

An airport spokesman said: "I can confirm there has been an incident on the EK004 flight to Dubai."

"Police are attending. It's not affecting the rest of the airport which remains open."

The incident comes amid heightened tension at airports across the world following the botched Christmas Day bombings.

Extra bag checks, body searches and on board regulations have seen travellers in London wait up to three hours before taking off.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8449696.stm

[Bun]

oooooo interesting

[Tash.]

It's been updated today, there were 3 men aged 58, 48 and 36 and all were apparently British. This either shows that anyone can be a terrorist or some people have a terrible sense of humour if they didn't mean it "/ I personally wouldn't want to be flying anywhere right now. Despite knowing that these incidents are few and far between when you consider how many flights actually take place every single day, it's so frightening.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8449696.stm

[myke]

it's really strange, since the detroit thing all the time on twitter there's always news of aircraft being grounded because of security alerts. makes you wonder.

[Yoshimitsui]

So what exactly did they do?

[Alkaz]

I was thinking the same ^ dont explain it.

[-:Undertaker:-]

It's been updated today, there were 3 men aged 58, 48 and 36 and all were apparently British. This either shows that anyone can be a terrorist or some people have a terrible sense of humour if they didn't mean it "/ I personally wouldn't want to be flying anywhere right now. Despite knowing that these incidents are few and far between when you consider how many flights actually take place every single day, it's so frightening.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8449696.stm

Anyone cannot be a terrorist, as we all know; terrorists tend to be from Africa or the Middle East - if not and born here in the west, they still have roots back in Africa/the Middle East and are mainly (modern) from the Islamic relgion. Enough of this political correctness.

What we need to do is have better searches on people depending on their nationality, just like Israel does. A elderly British grandmother is not going to be a terrorist, whereas a young-Pakistani man is far more likely to pose a threat.

[Alkaz]

But the way this country works, we cant be ''racist'' and single certain people out, would have to be for all.

[-:Undertaker:-]

That is the point I am making, its not racist at all. No it isn't nice, but its necessary whereas searching old ladies is not necessary. This country needs to just get some common sense and stop being afraid of hurting the minority, when at the end of the day - it helps both the minority and the majority.

[Alkaz]

It doesnt hurt anyone, this country needs to grow a pair and deport everyone.

[myke]

It doesnt hurt anyone, this country needs to grow a pair and deport everyone.

what do you mean by everyone?

[Tash.]

Anyone cannot be a terrorist, as we all know; terrorists tend to be from Africa or the Middle East - if not and born here in the west, they still have roots back in Africa/the Middle East and are mainly (modern) from the Islamic relgion. Enough of this political correctness.

What we need to do is have better searches on people depending on their nationality, just like Israel does. A elderly British grandmother is not going to be a terrorist, whereas a young-Pakistani man is far more likely to pose a threat.

I hate to tell you this, but if you read the link I provided at least one of these men was white. So to me that does not suggest they were african or asian at all. I wasn't trying to be politically correct, I was using the information I was given.

Everyone should be searched, there should be no exceptions. That way nobody can be blamed for letting someone slip can they? It's common sense.

[-:Undertaker:-]

I hate to tell you this, but if you read the link I provided at least one of these men was white. So to me that does not suggest they were african or asian at all. I wasn't trying to be politically correct, I was using the information I was given.

Everyone should be searched, there should be no exceptions. That way nobody can be blamed for letting someone slip can they? It's common sense.

These men don't appear to be terrorists though, they didn't have a bomb - all it was was a empty threat as has been done in the past.

[Alkaz]

what do you mean by everyone?
Well by everyone I didnt mean like all indians or what ever, like all people here that are just here for the moniez and we know they are. We need to show some strength of this country will just be dragged deeper into the mud weve been sinking into for years.

[Jordy]

Bare in mind these searches aren't just for terrorists, they're for things such as smuggling of drugs as well. I've read stories in the past of people in their 50s and 60s smuggling drugs into the country to make a fortune to retire on.

And here's a thought, currently everyone is searched as intensively as possible without being stripped. Stopping the grannies being searched intensively won't stop the terrorists seeing as they're still being searched as intensively as they currently are. So although not searching grannies might speed up the check in procedure, in reality it won't make it any safer at all, seeing as the terrorists are still being searched. It also increases the chances of corrupt officials being able to wave certain people through.

[myke]

Well by everyone I didnt mean like all indians or what ever, like all people here that are just here for the moniez and we know they are. We need to show some strength of this country will just be dragged deeper into the mud weve been sinking into for years.

the country decided it wanted to be multi ethnic, it is, in one way or another "our fault", that would be the case if we were asked if we wanted to be multi ethnic, were we asked? no. so it's the governments fault that in the words of you "people are just here for the moniez"

if people react with terrorism because they don't like the way the country is ran, then that's their problem. they chose to be here. you don't see these problems in places such as, idk, say russia, because they're not striving to become a multi ethnic society.

that's just the way i see it. idk. i have no idea how my post here relates to terrorism, but, ok.

this is my way of seeing the problem with "moniez"...

in the end it boils down to politics, i hate politics. :) it's difficult.

[Tash.]

These men don't appear to be terrorists though, they didn't have a bomb - all it was was a empty threat as has been done in the past.

I don't care if they had a bomb on them at the time or not, you don't board an aeroplane nowadays and threaten to detonate a bomb, it's an idiotic thing to do. They could easily have had a bomb, and the fact that it turned out they didn't won't have been any consolation to those people who were on board that plane when it happened. They'll have been scared nonetheless. I stick by what I said, this shows anyone of any race, colour, religion, nationality, age or gender can be a terrorist and therefore every single person should be checked. If you have nothing to hide you should embrace this as a measure to keep you and everyone else safe from madmen who want to kill you. A bit of time to be searched is the least you can give to ensure you keep your life.

Oh and not searching little old women? Oh yes, lets make all those elderly people targets for devices to be planted on them why don't we :rolleyes:

[Alkaz]

If this country didnt look so delicious to people from difficult countries then they wouldnt be here. Its to do with money, free NHS etc etc. Its a massive kick in the teeth when they do come here, claim everything and then blow us up. How about that man who hates England, hes been here for years and claims something like £30,000 a year in benefits, how ******* wrong is that. We've become so namby pamby about things, its our country, we need to take it back and if these 'terrorists' or what ever dont like it and want to do something, kill them.

[Black_Apalachi]

It's been updated today, there were 3 men aged 58, 48 and 36 and all were apparently British. This either shows that anyone can be a terrorist or some people have a terrible sense of humour if they didn't mean it "/ I personally wouldn't want to be flying anywhere right now. Despite knowing that these incidents are few and far between when you consider how many flights actually take place every single day, it's so frightening.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8449696.stm

I'd rather not give into terrorism. Just because there have been recent bomb scares doesn't make it more likely for a bomb to go off at this time. A bomb can be planted and detonated at any time in the future. If you alter your life because of these people, then you're letting them win.

[xxMATTGxx]

Anyone cannot be a terrorist, as we all know; terrorists tend to be from Africa or the Middle East - if not and born here in the west, they still have roots back in Africa/the Middle East and are mainly (modern) from the Islamic relgion. Enough of this political correctness.

What we need to do is have better searches on people depending on their nationality, just like Israel does. A elderly British grandmother is not going to be a terrorist, whereas a young-Pakistani man is far more likely to pose a threat.


Wrong. Anyone can be a terrorist in this country. All they have to do is learn how to do some things and believe. Anyway, making bomb threats in pubic is one big silly thing to do. Especially when people can hear it and then things have to be delayed while Police come and arrest them etc etc.

[Yoshimitsui]

Anyone cannot be a terrorist, as we all know; terrorists tend to be from Africa or the Middle East - if not and born here in the west, they still have roots back in Africa/the Middle East and are mainly (modern) from the Islamic relgion. Enough of this political correctness.

What we need to do is have better searches on people depending on their nationality, just like Israel does. A elderly British grandmother is not going to be a terrorist, whereas a young-Pakistani man is far more likely to pose a threat.

So if i make a bomb and go to the airport intent on using it I'm not a terrorist? Yes certain people from ethnic backgrounds are more likely to be a terrorist than many people in this country but anyone can still be a terrorist. At an airport everyone is treated the same unless they arouse suspicion or are believed to be a threat.

[-:Undertaker:-]

the country decided it wanted to be multi ethnic, it is, in one way or another "our fault", that would be the case if we were asked if we wanted to be multi ethnic, were we asked? no. so it's the governments fault that in the words of you "people are just here for the moniez"

if people react with terrorism because they don't like the way the country is ran, then that's their problem. they chose to be here. you don't see these problems in places such as, idk, say russia, because they're not striving to become a multi ethnic society.

that's just the way i see it. idk. i have no idea how my post here relates to terrorism, but, ok.

this is my way of seeing the problem with "moniez"...

in the end it boils down to politics, i hate politics. :) it's difficult.

Thank you, hit the nail on the head. The majority of this country don't have a problem with proper, controlled immigration - but what we have now is far from it.


I don't care if they had a bomb on them at the time or not, you don't board an aeroplane nowadays and threaten to detonate a bomb, it's an idiotic thing to do. They could easily have had a bomb, and the fact that it turned out they didn't won't have been any consolation to those people who were on board that plane when it happened. They'll have been scared nonetheless. I stick by what I said, this shows anyone of any race, colour, religion, nationality, age or gender can be a terrorist and therefore every single person should be checked. If you have nothing to hide you should embrace this as a measure to keep you and everyone else safe from madmen who want to kill you. A bit of time to be searched is the least you can give to ensure you keep your life.

Oh and not searching little old women? Oh yes, lets make all those elderly people targets for devices to be planted on them why don't we :rolleyes:

It doesn't show anyone can be a terrorist, they got through security bomb-less and didn't have a bomb anyway. The likelyhood is that they were drunk, so no it doesn't show anyone can be a terrorist, it shows anyone can get pissed and do a stupid thing which gets them in a lot of trouble.

On older people, oh please. Aren't you yourself all for the open borders this government promotes? - if so, then please don't preach security to me.


I'd rather not give into terrorism. Just because there have been recent bomb scares doesn't make it more likely for a bomb to go off at this time. A bomb can be planted and detonated at any time in the future. If you alter your life because of these people, then you're letting them win.

Thank you, why should our civil liberties be sacrificed? - the answer is that they shouldn't ever be sacrificed, what was the point in hundreds of years of British history from the Magna Carta which developed early freedom and democracy, only to throw it away in a matter of years - especially when we have a government which has no control over its own borders.


Wrong. Anyone can be a terrorist in this country. All they have to do is learn how to do some things and believe. Anyway, making bomb threats in pubic is one big silly thing to do. Especially when people can hear it and then things have to be delayed while Police come and arrest them etc etc.

Oh I must of missed the latest Taliban-Granny bombers.

[xxMATTGxx]

Thank you, hit the nail on the head. The majority of this country don't have a problem with proper, controlled immigration - but what we have now is far from it.



It doesn't show anyone can be a terrorist, they got through security bomb-less and didn't have a bomb anyway. The likelyhood is that they were drunk, so no it doesn't show anyone can be a terrorist, it shows anyone can get pissed and do a stupid thing which gets them in a lot of trouble.

On older people, oh please. Aren't you yourself all for the open borders this government promotes? - if so, then please don't preach security to me.



Thank you, why should our civil liberties be sacrificed? - the answer is that they shouldn't ever be sacrificed, what was the point in hundreds of years of British history from the Magna Carta which developed early freedom and democracy, only to throw it away in a matter of years - especially when we have a government which has no control over its own borders.



Oh I must of missed the latest Taliban-Granny bombers.

They can be forced you know? All they have to do is strap bombs or whatever to the person and then they are a suicidal bomber. Anyone can do it, I'm sorry but it’s true. It might not be the main terrorists we see at the moment but it can happen.

[Alkaz]

I see your point, and they could think along the lines of ''shes 70, shes gonna die soon she might aswell help us -straps bomb-''

[xxMATTGxx]

I see your point, and they could think along the lines of ''shes 70, shes gonna die soon she might aswell help us -straps bomb-''

It's possible. If they know they aren't going to search them, they could easily do some plans to make sure they by-pass it like they do. If they want to cause damage, they will do anything they can. We can prevent it with these new scanners but the threat will always be there.

[Hecktix]

Anyone cannot be a terrorist, as we all know; terrorists tend to be from Africa or the Middle East - if not and born here in the west, they still have roots back in Africa/the Middle East and are mainly (modern) from the Islamic relgion. Enough of this political correctness.

What we need to do is have better searches on people depending on their nationality, just like Israel does. A elderly British grandmother is not going to be a terrorist, whereas a young-Pakistani man is far more likely to pose a threat.

Of course anybody can be a terrorist. The Taliban and Al Qaeda aren't the only terrorist networks in the world, ever heard of the IRA or other CHRISTIAN fundamentalist groups who BOMB PEOPLE or CAUSE TERROR, this making them TERRORISTS.

Your stereotypical attitude is absolutely despicable.

You need to do some research into fundamentalism because at the end of the day it was white Christians who were militant way before Islamic fundamentalism came about. Stop wasting your breath spurting out media indoctrinated garbage and go find some facts.

[Tash.]

It doesn't show anyone can be a terrorist, they got through security bomb-less and didn't have a bomb anyway. The likelyhood is that they were drunk, so no it doesn't show anyone can be a terrorist, it shows anyone can get pissed and do a stupid thing which gets them in a lot of trouble.

On older people, oh please. Aren't you yourself all for the open borders this government promotes? - if so, then please don't preach security to me.


Yes it does. You nor I know what these 3 people meant when they did this, you don't know they were drunk, you don't know their politics and you don't know their issues.

What does open borders have to do with me saying that elderly people not being searched makes them susceptible to having bombs planted on them? Nothing thats what. You know i'm right so you divert this onto a different issue and it's not washing with me. Your views are becoming midly prejudice so i'd really watch what you write.

[myke]

If this country didnt look so delicious to people from difficult countries then they wouldnt be here. Its to do with money, free NHS etc etc. Its a massive kick in the teeth when they do come here, claim everything and then blow us up. How about that man who hates England, hes been here for years and claims something like £30,000 a year in benefits, how ******* wrong is that. We've become so namby pamby about things, its our country, we need to take it back and if these 'terrorists' or what ever dont like it and want to do something, kill them.

no. that is wrong. you're ASSUMING that people who come here from other countries are ALL going to blow us up.

[Seatherny]

Oh I must of missed the latest Taliban-Granny bombers.

I really hope that we never have people with similar beliefs to you running any country. Because if we did, there would be planes dropping from the sky everyday.
What you are doing is creating a security flaw. There needs to be the strictest security at airports, we dont need security flaws. Oh look, that kid is a baby but has something which looks like a gun in his hand. Must be a toy, leave it. :rolleyes:

If you do it so you cant search grannies, terrorists will easily slip stuff in their luggage, get on the plane, get it out and bye bye.

[-:Undertaker:-]

It's possible. If they know they aren't going to search them, they could easily do some plans to make sure they by-pass it like they do. If they want to cause damage, they will do anything they can. We can prevent it with these new scanners but the threat will always be there.

The threat is not there, its like right now a terrorist could blow up a bus in Liverpool - anything can happen, the fact is that it hasn't happened and shows no signs on happening. We are surrendering liberty for something which is barely a threat, and the threat is not being helped by this governments refusal to impose any form of control over our own borders.


Of course anybody can be a terrorist. The Taliban and Al Qaeda aren't the only terrorist networks in the world, ever heard of the IRA or other CHRISTIAN fundamentalist groups who BOMB PEOPLE or CAUSE TERROR, this making them TERRORISTS.

Your stereotypical attitude is absolutely despicable.

You need to do some research into fundamentalism because at the end of the day it was white Christians who were militant way before Islamic fundamentalism came about. Stop wasting your breath spurting out media indoctrinated garbage and go find some facts.

I never said we didn't have Christian terrorists, or another type of terrorist so do not put words in my mouth. We right now, live in 2010 and not 1992 - that means that the threat of the IRA has gone, and right now (if you opened your eyes and took some notice) you would wake up and find that we now face islamic extremism and not the IRA.

I NEVER EVER EVER EVER said anything about white christians not being terrorists, I said the threat we face today is from typically African/Middle Eastern young lads who are followers of islamic. I think you need to pull your head out of the sand and just realise this very simple fact instead of going around like a headless chicken who seems determined to make me out to be some racist media-orientated evil facist. I'm not suprised though, because i've been called everything on this forum;

xenophobic because I want to leave the European Union.
racist because I want some form of control over immigration.
homophobic because I don't agree with gay adoption/marriage.


Yes it does. You nor I know what these 3 people meant when they did this, you don't know they were drunk, you don't know their politics and you don't know their issues.

What does open borders have to do with me saying that elderly people not being searched makes them susceptible to having bombs planted on them? Nothing thats what. You know i'm right so you divert this onto a different issue and it's not washing with me. Your views are becoming midly prejudice so i'd really watch what you write.

They were most likely drunk and thought it would be funny to shout bomb, or as someone I was with in London a few years ago did; he shouted 'BOMB' as a joke on the Tube and then realised what he'd said although luckily nothing happened. On my views, no sorry - I am not singling anything so do not dare attempt to link me to racism. I'd advise you to watch what you write, don't try and be sneaky by linking me to racism or facism as others have done in the past when there is nothig racist or facist about what I am writing.

I am strongly against racism and facism, and that includes PC facists of which you sadly seem to be falling under increasingly, especially judging by this post.


I really hope that we never have people with similar beliefs to you running any country. Because if we did, there would be planes dropping from the sky everyday.
What you are doing is creating a security flaw. There needs to be the strictest security at airports, we dont need security flaws. Oh look, that kid is a baby but has something which looks like a gun in his hand. Must be a toy, leave it. :rolleyes:

If you do it so you cant search grannies, terrorists will easily slip stuff in their luggage, get on the plane, get it out and bye bye.

I really hope we don't have people like you.. oh wait we already do, both in government and the European Union imposing your thoughts and laws on us and even worse, destroying our liberty at a cost which really makes me wonder what we are actually defending. On terrorism itself - you are making it up now as you go along. If a old aged 80 year old pensioner is walking through an airport, is she a potential terrorist threat and does she need to be searched? - no she doesn't.

That is the point I am making, its just common sense.

[Jordy]

They can still smuggle drugs into the country if they're not searched. Quite a few old people have already tried this, if they weren't going to be searched, who do you think the drug dealers would use to smuggle in all kinds of illegal substances and even weapons?

And there is the chance of them being duped into carrying explosives, liquids etc, which could then change over hands after going through security.

Not forgetting that having people judge who's safe and who isn't makes it more likely a terrorist could be waved through by a corrupt official.

The only real advantage of allowing grannies through without being searched is it'll save time. Saving time isn't worth it when you could be saving lives.

[-:Undertaker:-]

They can still smuggle drugs into the country if they're not searched. Quite a few old people have already tried this, if they weren't going to be searched, who do you think the drug dealers would use to smuggle in all kinds of illegal substances and even weapons?

And there is the chance of them being duped into carrying explosives, liquids etc, which could then change over hands after going through security.

Not forgetting that having people judge who's safe and who isn't makes it more likely a terrorist could be waved through by a corrupt official.

The only real advantage of allowing grannies through without being searched is it'll save time. Saving time isn't worth it when you could be saving lives.

..so what really are we suggesting here? - ever more security so its impossible to pass through and airport without having to be searched both naked and also be probed because that is the only only only way we will ever eliminate any threat of drugs or terrorism from our airports. On corruption, well then that just ends it then. Instead of assuming everyone is working with the terrorists and that that means we need more and more freedoms taken away, we need to come back to the real world and realise this is not the case.

[Kronics]

Everyone gets checked when they go through security, when I went to Africa last year I got checked.

One way or another, no-one is special. Everyone gets checked whatever age they may be. Don't forget people can change their looks for anything.

[Jordy]

..so what really are we suggesting here? - ever more security so its impossible to pass through and airport without having to be searched both naked and also be probed because that is the only only only way we will ever eliminate any threat of drugs or terrorism from our airports. On corruption, well then that just ends it then. Instead of assuming everyone is working with the terrorists and that that means we need more and more freedoms taken away, we need to come back to the real world and realise this is not the case.I'm not suggesting anything new, I'm suggesting the system remains as it is and new technologies in scanning for liquids, substances, metal etc which provide increased security are implemented.

It is not impossible to pass through naked scanners, they've been successfully tested at Manchester and Heathrow and will soon be implemented nation-wide. If every single person has to pass through the scanners, it eliminates the chances of a corrupt official having the power to do anything.

[Seatherny]

I really hope we don't have people like you.. oh wait we already do, both in government and the European Union imposing your thoughts and laws on us and even worse, destroying our liberty at a cost which really makes me wonder what we are actually defending. On terrorism itself - you are making it up now as you go along. If a old aged 80 year old pensioner is walking through an airport, is she a potential terrorist threat and does she need to be searched? - no she doesn't.

That is the point I am making, its just common sense.

Did you even read what I said? Typical of you, always ignore the point I made. Re-read what I said. I said she could be used, not that she is a terrorist - actually anyone can be a terrorist, simple as. :rolleyes:

[-:Undertaker:-]

Did you even read what I said? Typical of you, always ignore the point I made. Re-read what I said. I said she could be used, not that she is a terrorist - actually anyone can be a terrorist, simple as. :rolleyes:

The same applies still, an old woman is not going to ignore a man standing there putting a bomb in her bloomers is she? - seriously now, some common sense. A terrorist could do a number of things but in reality most of the suggestions/scenarios people here are coming up with are from fairytale land.

[Seatherny]

The same applies still, an old woman is not going to ignore a man standing there putting a bomb in her bloomers is she? - seriously now, some common sense. A terrorist could do a number of things but in reality most of the suggestions/scenarios people here are coming up with are from fairytale land.

Oh my. Its easier to put things into their hand luggage or suitcases :S Hence doing it so you dont check them at all is a security flaw. "Its common sense". :rolleyes:

If we had your way, terrorists would be blowing up a plane everyday.
Terrorists could probably easily find old Muslims or whatever who hate USA/UK, persuade them to take a bomb.

I swear you just love arguing even the silliest of things.

[Jordy]

The same applies still, an old woman is not going to ignore a man standing there putting a bomb in her bloomers is she? - seriously now, some common sense. A terrorist could do a number of things but in reality most of the suggestions/scenarios people here are coming up with are from fairytale land.For a few grand I'm sure most elderly people would happily bring a few KG of Heroin into the country, especially if there's no risk of them being searched. Another instance could be a terrorist using his son to bring the bomb into the airport and then after security, it could be transferred to the terrorist. It's unheard of children bombing planes so under your plans they wouldn't be searched.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Oh my. Its easier to put things into their hand luggage or suitcases :S Hence doing it so you dont check them at all is a security flaw. "Its common sense". :rolleyes:

If we had your way, terrorists would be blowing up a plane everyday.
Terrorists could probably easily find old Muslims or whatever who hate USA/UK, persuade them to take a bomb.

I swear you just love arguing even the silliest of things.

Again, at what price does liberty get sacrificed for this 'war on terror' - if you had your way (which we have at present) you support allowing mass immigration into this country with the obvious dangers and extremism it brings, yet don't seem to mind our liberty being taken away to protect us from the very thing we are allowing through the backdoor.

It is like locking your house up with alarms and locks, only to leave the burgular inside with yourself.

You seem to make it out as if I support terrorists blowing up planes when I have never said that. I am simply stating that its not a big threat, and the threat posed needs to be dealt with in a proper way; not at the cost of our freedoms.


For a few grand I'm sure most elderly people would happily bring a few KG of Heroin into the country, especially if there's no risk of them being searched. Another instance could be a terrorist using his son to bring the bomb into the airport and then after security, it could be transferred to the terrorist. It's unheard of children bombing planes so under your plans they wouldn't be searched.

I do not know what old people you have met. Again this is all speculative, none of this has happened or shown any signs on happening. A terrorist could blow up an Arriva bus in Liverpool - what are we going to do!?

[Seatherny]

I am simply stating that its not a big threat, and the threat posed needs to be dealt with in a proper way; not at the cost of our freedoms.

It will be a big threat if the goverment said "right, we are never going to search old people".
Like I said, if we had your way, hundreds, if not thousands of people will die all because you don't want to search old people.

[Tash.]

They were most likely drunk and thought it would be funny to shout bomb, or as someone I was with in London a few years ago did; he shouted 'BOMB' as a joke on the Tube and then realised what he'd said although luckily nothing happened. On my views, no sorry - I am not singling anything so do not dare attempt to link me to racism. I'd advise you to watch what you write, don't try and be sneaky by linking me to racism or facism as others have done in the past when there is nothig racist or facist about what I am writing.

I am strongly against racism and facism, and that includes PC facists of which you sadly seem to be falling under increasingly, especially judging by this post.


Can you categorically tell me that they were drunk? No you cannot so you might want to think about what sort of people you might be attempting to defend here? They could actually have meant what they said, in which case how stupid would you feel then?

And on your views, I didn't even use the word racist or the word fascist so where you got those from i'll never know. I said you were verging upon your views becoming a prejudice. I didn't try to link you to racism or facism at all, now who's misrepresenting what someone else is writing? You. Yet again you see fit to bunch me together with the PC groups, I aren't PC. All I said was that you cannot say elderly people shouldn't be searched. For one thing, what would the cut off age be? 50? 60? 70? 80? Not only this, but by suggesting that elderly people shouldn't be searched because of their age now who's being PC?

And finally, i'm going to say this just once more:

You don't know me, you don't know my politics and you don't know all of my views so kindly stop presuming that you do.

[Jordy]

I do not know what old people you have met. Again this is all speculative, none of this has happened or shown any signs on happening. A terrorist could blow up an Arriva bus in Liverpool - what are we going to do!?You seem to avoid my points at any rate, after posting a few times you did answer but with the usual tripe, you're no better than all these other politicians who don't directly answer questions. Your argument is incredibly flawed and would actually make things more unsafe than they currently are.

It's not spectacular to blow up a bus in Liverpool. Blowing something up over the Atlantic with hundreds of people on board will upset the nations of North America & Europe and will get the worlds media attention. Blowing up a bus in Liverpool will kill around 10 people and will hardly be a devastating message from Al Qaeda, common sense really.

[-:Undertaker:-]

It will be a big threat if the goverment said "right, we are never going to search old people".
Like I said, if we had your way, hundreds, if not thousands of people will die all because you don't want to search old people.

I must of missed the thousands of older people waiting to blow up airlines, or even the thousands of islamic terrorists who seem to be eager for older people to stop being searched so they can plant bombs in the OAPs knickers.


You seem to avoid my points at any rate, after posting a few times you did answer but with the usual tripe, you're no better than all these other politicians who don't directly answer questions.

It's not spectacular to blow up a bus in Liverpool. Blowing something up over the Atlantic with hundreds of people on board will upset the nations of North America & Europe and will get the worlds media attention. Blowing up a bus in Liverpool will kill around 10 people and will hardly be a devastating message from Al Qaeda, common sense really.I have answered your points, if theres a point you'd like me to go into more then please do post it. I can only say so much on this subject, its a pretty black and white subject. On the terrorism, yes of course - the fact is that we have no granny bombers and all this thread seems to be is speculation on how old people could potentially blow us all up over the Atlantic.

That is not common sense, its fiction.


Can you categorically tell me that they were drunk? No you cannot so you might want to think about what sort of people you might be attempting to defend here? They could actually have meant what they said, in which case how stupid would you feel then?

And on your views, I didn't even use the word racist or the word fascist so where you got those from i'll never know. I said you were verging upon your views becoming a prejudice. I didn't try to link you to racism or facism at all, now who's misrepresenting what someone else is writing? You. Yet again you see fit to bunch me together with the PC groups, I aren't PC. All I said was that you cannot say elderly people shouldn't be searched. For one thing, what would the cut off age be? 50? 60? 70? 80? Not only this, but by suggesting that elderly people shouldn't be searched because of their age now who's being PC?

And finally, i'm going to say this just once more:

You don't know me, you don't know my politics and you don't know all of my views so kindly stop presuming that you do.

I did not say they were definetley drunk, I speculated. I feel stupid for you because you seem to think I am telling you that 100% in my mind they were drunk - wrong. The PC factor, yes you are PC. Your post attempted to link me to racism and warned me of it, well I don't need warning thanks because I know what is racist, and what isn't racist ~ not to mention the fact i've never posted a racist comment on this forum in the years I have been here.

The cut-off age wouldn't exist, its common sense - an old woman, hobbling along in an airport - I can clearly tell she is not a threat. A loud 60 year old? - perhaps and they would be searched if any doubt entered my mind about them.

I know you are left-wing, and nothing you have said so far seems to point me away from that.

[Seatherny]

It seems if you dont agree with UT, you lack common sense.


I must of missed the thousands of older people waiting to blow up airlines, or even the thousands of islamic terrorists who seem to be eager for older people to stop being searched so they can plant bombs in the OAPs knickers.

Oh my. The terrorists can brain wash anyone. What do you not understand? You frustrate me so much. You ignore what people are saying just like all the politicians. NO ONE HERE AGREES WITH YOU. But we must all lack common sense.

If the terrorists find that OAP's are no longer being searched, they will make use of it. It feels like I am arguing with a wall here. Going to get no where.

I cannot even believe you are arguing about this.

[-:Undertaker:-]

It seems if you dont agree with UT, you lack common sense.

Oh my. The terrorists can brain wash anyone. What do you nto understand? You frustrate me so much. You ignore what people are saying just like all the politicians. NO ONE HERE AGREES WITH YOU. But we must all lack common sense.

If the terrorists find that OAP's are no longer being searched, they will make use of it. It feels like I am arguing with a wall here. Going to get no where.

I cannot even believe you are arguing about this.

*REMOVED*, just as you lacked common sense in other threads where you seem to think things which are not racist are racist. My opinion, so don't go running off to report it asap because we know you have a history of that.

Terrorists cannot brain-wash anyone, total and utter garbage. Jordy may be on your 'side' in this discussion, but I can assure you that your opinions on other subjects from what I have seen don't merit much support mate. OAPS WILL NOT TURN INTO ISLAMIC TERRORISTS - I cannot believe that you have deluded yourself into thinking that the Taliban are recruiting old aged British pensioners into blowing up planes - it sounds like a fictional blockbuster movie.

Edited by MattGarner (Acting Assistant General Manager): Please do not be rude towards forum members.

[Jordy]

I must of missed the thousands of older people waiting to blow up airlines, or even the thousands of islamic terrorists who seem to be eager for older people to stop being searched so they can plant bombs in the OAPs knickers.



I have answered your points, if theres a point you'd like me to go into more then please do post it. I can only say so much on this subject, its a pretty black and white subject. On the terrorism, yes of course - the fact is that we have no granny bombers and all this thread seems to be is speculation on how old people could potentially blow us all up over the Atlantic.

That is not common sense, its fiction.It is not fiction that Al Qaeda (and similar groups) want to create spectacular displays to the world (The bad kind obviously). Bringing down buildings, blowing up the tube network, killing crowds of people and bringing down planes. They're not interested in killing just a few people, they're trying to get the worlds attention to make a statement.

There's lots of holidaymakers who bring drugs into the UK, they're not bad people, they're just being paid an awful lot to do it, their desperate for money and take the risk.

And just a few weeks ago we would of called it fairytail to put a bomb in your pants yet we now know it's a very real possibility. It's a bit like last October you didn't think there was any real chance of another terrorism attack, hence why you didn't see why further scanners should be introduced.

Yet as soon as the christmas day attempt happened, you called for greater things to be done. You're not all that different to these politicians you continually dispise.

Currently your only suggestion is to stop searching grannies, which will just speed up queue times. It won't make any difference in stopping the terrorists unlike the new scanners which you oppose.

[-:Undertaker:-]

It is not fiction that Al Qaeda (and similar groups) want to create spectacular displays to the world (The bad kind obviously). Bringing down buildings, blowing up the tube network, killing crowds of people and bringing down planes. They're not interested in killing just a few people, they're trying to get the worlds attention to make a statement.

There's lots of holidaymakers who bring drugs into the UK, they're not bad people, they're just being paid an awful lot to do it, their desperate for money and take the risk.

And just a few weeks ago we would of called it fairytail to put a bomb in your pants yet we now know it's a very real possibility. It's a bit like last October you didn't think there was any real chance of another terrorism attack, hence why you didn't see why further scanners should be introduced.

Yet as soon as the christmas day attempt happened, you called for greater things to be done. You're not all that different to these politicians you continually dispise.

Currently your only suggestion is to stop searching grannies, which will just speed up queue times. It won't make any difference in stopping the terrorists unlike the new scanners which you oppose.

I called for security to be tightend yes, on people with different nationality. I do not agree with personal liberties being taken away. Do not try and brand me a hypocrite because the lines between my opinions have stayed pretty clear all along. It is you who is like the politician, twisting my words into something they are not.

More searches based on nationality? - yes
More searches on everyone regardless? - no
Body scanners introduced? - no
Borders controlled? - yes

[Seatherny]

*REMOVED* just as you lacked common sense in other threads where you seem to think things which are not racist are racist. My opinion, so don't go running off to report it asap because we know you have a history of that.

Terrorists cannot brain-wash anyone, total and utter garbage. Jordy may be on your 'side' in this discussion, but I can assure you that your opinions on other subjects from what I have seen don't merit much support mate. OAPS WILL NOT TURN INTO ISLAMIC TERRORISTS - I cannot believe that you have deluded yourself into thinking that the Taliban are recruiting old aged British pensioners into blowing up planes - it sounds like a fictional blockbuster movie.

I have reported you twice before and I was correct considering you were warned both times :)

They can brain wash anyone. How do you know they cant? Have they tried it on you? They have managed to turn normal people into terrorists in a few months. We are on about this topic, and I clearly said no one agrees with you. Its common sense I mean in this thread if I say it in this thread. I swear you never read what people say and just presume people said it.

Terrorists can turn OAP into terrorists as there are many Islamic ones here who would turn into one. If they cant, they will make use of them and put something in their suitcase without them realising.

[Tash.]

I did not say they were definetley drunk, I speculated. I feel stupid for you because you seem to think I am telling you that 100% in my mind they were drunk - wrong. The PC factor, yes you are PC. Your post attempted to link me to racism and warned me of it, well I don't need warning thanks because I know what is racist, and what isn't racist ~ not to mention the fact i've never posted a racist comment on this forum in the years I have been here.

The cut-off age wouldn't exist, its common sense - an old woman, hobbling along in an airport - I can clearly tell she is not a threat. A loud 60 year old? - perhaps and they would be searched if any doubt entered my mind about them.

I know you are left-wing, and nothing you have said so far seems to point me away from that.

Right i'm at a loss as to how to speak to you really, you don't listen to what I say if I write it in paragraphs so i'm going to go for numbers:


1. The problem with speculation is, it's often wrong. In this case the difference between being wrong and right would be life and death. Not something really worth speculating over.

2. I didn't use the word racist. If I did, show me it and i'll eat my damn words but you won't find them, because I didn't say it.

3. So you're going to let airport staff use their judgement to decide whether or not to search people yes? How dangerous are you wanting flying to be? Seriously, that's as stupid a suggestion as i've ever heard. Others have said this to you, you're opening airports to terrorists and saying "Welcome, please come in and plant something on the person of an elderly lady/gentleman. We won't search them so it's fine" :rolleyes:

4. You don't listen, I just asked you not to decide my political leaning and you just did it the post after. What the.. I am not left wing.

[Jordy]

I called for security to be tightend yes, on people with different nationality. I do not agree with personal liberties being taken away. Do not try and brand me a hypocrite because the lines between my opinions have stayed pretty clear all along. It is you who is like the politician, twisting my words into something they are not.

More searches based on nationality? - yes
More searches on everyone regardless? - no
Body scanners introduced? - no
Borders controlled? - yesYou still have not suggested an idea on how to stop the terrorists.

Even if you just searched people of a certain nationality, unless you implemented more scanners then they would go through the current system which has been proved as not working.

[-:Undertaker:-]

I have reported you twice before and I was correct considering you were warned both times :)

They can brain wash anyone. How do you know they cant? Have they tried it on you? They have managed to turn normal people into terrorists in a few months. We are on about this topic, and I clearly said no one agrees with you. Its common sense I mean in this thread if I say it in this thread. I swear you never read what people say and just presume people said it.

Terrorists can turn OAP into terrorists as there are many Islamic ones here who would turn into one. If they cant, they will make use of them and put something in their suitcase without them realising.

Terrorists cannot brain-wash anybody oh my god I cannot believe you are saying this. If a terrorist tried, could he brainwash me? - no he couldn't, because my mind is my own and I don't claim my mind is anybody elses responsibility. It is mine, nobody elses.

On terrorists, if you think terrorists go around recruiting people from law-abiding citzens into terrorists ready to commit Jihad then you are really living on an entirely different planet.


Right i'm at a loss as to how to speak to you really, you don't listen to what I say if I write it in paragraphs so i'm going to go for numbers:


1. The problem with speculation is, it's often wrong. In this case the difference between being wrong and right would be life and death. Not something really worth speculating over.

2. I didn't use the word racist. If I did, show me it and i'll eat my damn words but you won't find them, because I didn't say it.

3. So you're going to let airport staff use their judgement to decide whether or not to search people yes? How dangerous are you wanting flying to be? Seriously, that's as stupid a suggestion as i've ever heard. Others have said this to you, you're opening airports to terrorists and saying "Welcome, please come in and plant something on the person of an elderly lady/gentleman. We won't search them so it's fine" :rolleyes:

4. You don't listen, I just asked you not to decide my political leaning and you just did it the post after. What the.. I am not left wing.

You didn't mention the word racist, and never did I say you did. You implied it.


You still have not suggested an idea on how to stop the terrorists.

Even if you just searched people of a certain nationality, unless you implemented more scanners then they would go through the current system which has been proved as not working.

I have given all the security measures I think will greatly reduce the threat of terrorism, the threat of terrorism can never be gone and to think so would be foolish. I have said earlier on, the only way to be pretty 100% safe from an outside job opposed to an inside job would be a naked body search and a probe - which ain't gonna happen.

[Seatherny]

Terrorists cannot brain-wash anybody oh my god I cannot believe you are saying this. If a terrorist tried, could he brainwash me? - no he couldn't, because my mind is my own and I don't claim my mind is anybody elses responsibility. It is mine, nobody elses.

On terrorists, if you think terrorists go around recruiting people from law-abiding citzens into terrorists ready to commit Jihad then you are really living on an entirely different planet.


Yes they can. If you dont believe it then I must ask, which planet are you in?

Why dont you comment on the fact that they could make use of the OAP's, put something in their luggage?

[-:Undertaker:-]

Yes they can. If you dont believe it then I must ask, which planet are you in?

Why dont you comment on the fact that they could make use of the OAP's, put something in their luggage?

What planet are you on, is your mind so weak that it does what its told?

On luggage, lugage is searched so even if a terrorist did (somehow) get hold of a OAPs luggage, the luggage goes through a scanner which would detect anything like that.

[Invent]

Just to agree with what's been previously said, everyone should get searched equally. An OAP is just as likely to carry a bomb on to a plane as anyone else. If we didn't search them, then, as many other people have said, terrorists would exploit this. It's just stupid to say they shouldn't be searched because you couldn't imagine an OAP carrying a bomb.

Oh and -Undertaker- I'm sure a terrorist could easily brandwash you if they tried just as they've probably brainwashed hundreds of other people.

[Seatherny]

What planet are you on, is your mind so weak that it does what its told?

On luggage, lugage is searched so even if a terrorist did (somehow) get hold of a OAPs luggage, the luggage goes through a scanner which would detect anything like that.

What about OAP's who are dependant on others to take full care of them, that includes dress them? Easily put a bomb on them.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Just to agree with what's been previously said, everyone should get searched equally. An OAP is just as likely to carry a bomb on to a plane as anyone else. If we didn't search them, then, as many other people have said, terrorists would exploit this.

Oh and -Undertaker- I'm sure a terrorist could easily brandwash you if they tried just as they've probably brainwashed hundreds of other people.

I must of missed the countless OAP terrorists then, I really should watch the news more often I guess.

On the brainwashing part, not they could not. We live in 2010 the real world, not Harry Potter.


What about OAP's who are dependant on others to take full care of them, that includes dress them? Easily put a bomb on them.Mary "yeah abdul could you dress me for my trip to the airport"
Abdul "yeah sure thing mary love"
Mary "whats this weird packet of explosive liquid your puttin' in me knickerz luvvy??"
Abdul "yeah erm thats just to make your flight more comfortable, and when your over the atlantic make sure you light it"

[Invent]

I must of missed the countless OAP terrorists then, I really should watch the news more often I guess.

On the brainwashing part, not they could not. We live in 2010 the real world, not Harry Potter.

There is no way to explain how idiotic you're acting -Undertaker-. If OAPs didn't get searched, then they would be exploited by terrorists. It's as simple as that. If you don't understand this then there is no point in anyone to continue replying to you.

How do you have any idea if anyone could brainwash you? Brainwashing isn't magic, it's a real thing..

[-:Undertaker:-]

There is no way to explain how idiotic you're acting -Undertaker-. If OAPs didn't get searched, then they would be exploited by terrorists. It's as simple as that. If you don't understand this then there is no point in anyone to continue replying to you.

How do you have any idea if anyone could brainwash you? Brainwashing isn't magic, it's a real thing..

How do I have any idea? - because I know their beliefs are a load of absolute rubbish, are against everything I believe in and the fact they are complete nutters. Normal people do not blow up planes mate, and if you think they do then you really are on the planet zog. Extremism is a complex thing, and to define it as you are is downright wrong.

[Invent]

How do I have any idea? - because I know their beliefs are a load of absolute rubbish, are against everything I believe in and the fact they are complete nutters. Normal people do not blow up planes mate, and if you think they do then you really are on the planet zog.

You obviously don't understand brainwashing then. Your fundamental self beliefs don't mean a thing if you're brainwashed, it's a form of torture for gods sake :rolleyes:. You won't even think about your UKIP/etc beliefs if you were brainwashed.

[Seatherny]

There is no way to explain how idiotic you're acting -Undertaker-. If OAPs didn't get searched, then they would be exploited by terrorists. It's as simple as that. If you don't understand this then there is no point in anyone to continue replying to you.

How do you have any idea if anyone could brainwash you? Brainwashing isn't magic, it's a real thing..

I would +rep you if I could!


How do I have any idea? - because I know their beliefs are a load of absolute rubbish, are against everything I believe in and the fact they are complete nutters. Normal people do not blow up planes mate, and if you think they do then you really are on the planet zog. Extremism is a complex thing, and to define it as you are is downright wrong.

Do you actually know what brainwashing is? I am pretty confident after reading that post, that you have no idea what it means. May I point you towards www.dictionary.com?

[Yoshimitsui]

I must of missed the countless OAP terrorists then, I really should watch the news more often I guess.

On the brainwashing part, not they could not. We live in 2010 the real world, not Harry Potter.

Mary "yeah abdul could you dress me for my trip to the airport"
Abdul "yeah sure thing mary love"
Mary "whats this weird packet of explosive liquid your puttin' in me knickerz luvvy??"
Abdul "yeah erm thats just to make your flight more comfortable, and when your over the atlantic make sure you light it"

It's ironic that you should refer to the terrorist in your little role play as someone not likely of a british background.

It seems you assume anyone not from this country should be immediately thought of as a terrorist and anyone who is can do what they wish and all live in happy land.

[Seatherny]

It's ironic that you should refer to the terrorist in your little role play as someone not likely of a british background.

It seems you assume anyone not from this country should be immediately thought of as a terrorist and anyone who is can do what they wish and all live in happy land.

Haha indeed. Its all getting silly now.

[-:Undertaker:-]

You obviously don't understand brainwashing then. Your fundamental self beliefs don't mean a thing if you're brainwashed, it's a form of torture for gods sake :rolleyes:. You won't even think about your UKIP/etc beliefs if you were brainwashed.

Terrorists now have a magical ability to change anyones opinion? - you cannot be brainwashed if your fundamental beliefs are strong. On UKIP - it seems you yourself have been brainwashed by what others have said on this forum, UKIP has nothing to do with this conversation so lets not mention it.


I would +rep you if I could!

Do you actually know what brainwashing is? I am pretty confident after reading that post, that you have no idea what it means. May I point you towards www.dictionary.com? (http://www.dictionary.com?)

Yes I do, and i'm eager to meet one of these magical terrorists who seem to have the ability to change my opinions from hot to cold/cold to hot straight away it seems.

Not in the real world though, only in your world.


It's ironic that you should refer to the terrorist in your little role play as someone not likely of a british background.

It seems you assume anyone not from this country should be immediately thought of as a terrorist and anyone who is can do what they wish and all live in happy land.

I am not sure where you have been exactly since 9/11, but regardless it shows exactly what I am up against here. The threat we face now is not Irish extremism, it is Islamic extremism.

In popular culture, Abdul is considered to be a name linked with the east/non-western countries so the name Abdul would be used, as it makes more sense rather than me using the name Paddy. Just as when we were fighting Irish extremism I am sure nobody gave an example of a terrorist being called Muhammed or Abdul.

[nat965]

My dad's always saying "why don't they have police on board planes, and better security checks" :rolleyes: He doesn't seem to know that they are working to try & combat it :@

[Seatherny]

Yes I do, and i'm eager to meet one of these magical terrorists who seem to have the ability to change my opinions from hot to cold/cold to hot straight away it seems.

Not in the real world though, only in your world.

Like I said, you have no clue what brainwashing means. Its pointless even replying to you now.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Like I said, you have no clue what brainwashing means. Its pointless even replying to you now.

I know what brainwashing means, and I have just said that it is near to next impossible to convert ordinary folk into terrorists. You make it out as though terrorists are magicians waiting in the dark, ready to pounce upon the British public of whom will then get on their nearest airline and blow it up.

Extremism does not work like that.

[Seatherny]

I know what brainwashing means, and I have just said that it is near to next impossible to convert ordinary folk into terrorists. You make it out as though terrorists are magicians waiting in the dark, ready to pounce upon the British public of whom will then get on their nearest airline and blow it up.

Extremism does not work like that.

If you brainwash someone, you force them to believe something by continually telling them that it is true, and preventing them from thinking about it properly.

Yeah, they can brainwash people.

[Yoshimitsui]

It works dependent on the background you are brought up in, people who have been taught to believe in such extremist views from the moment they are born, from their parents to their grandparents and so on. They believe it also due to simply having nothing else to believe in or to work or fight for, they often live in the hardest of conditions and turn to fight their 'special cause'. However, it only takes one person who has been turned to ruins in anger, hate, love and war for them to take up a foolish and horrific act in terrorism.

Thus proving the point anyone can become a terrorist, you speak of the IRA, yet its acts pretty faded away spar the few who have again been brought up in its beliefs and take on the information as it is simply all they know and not that of right or wrong.

It takes one persons heart to be destroyed and they can create the suffering of thousands.

[-:Undertaker:-]

If you brainwash someone, you force them to believe something by continually telling them that it is true, and preventing them from thinking about it properly.

Yeah, they can brainwash people.

You cannot force somebody to think something, thats why dictatorships never work in the end and crumble and thats why socialism didn't work.


It works dependent on the background you are brought up in, people who have been taught to believe in such extremist views from the moment they are born, from their parents to their grandparents and so on. They believe it also due to simply having nothing else to believe in or to work or fight for, they often live in the hardest of conditions and turn to fight their 'special cause'. However, it only takes one person who has been turned to ruins in anger, hate, love and war for them to take up a foolish and horrific act in terrorism.

Thus proving the point anyone can become a terrorist, you speak of the IRA, yet its acts pretty faded away spar the few who have again been brought up in its beliefs and take on the information as it is simply all they know and not that of right or wrong.

It takes one persons heart to be destroyed and they can create the suffering of thousands.

Totally correct on how terrorism lives, and totally agree. The thing I do not agree with is the message which seems to be that people can suddenly become terrorists by other terrorists somehow brainwashing them.

Extremism is deep within somebody, it doesn't come from your local terrorist as I have been saying all along in this thread.

[Yoshimitsui]

What about those under duress? It's not always a group holding someones family and saying commit this act or we will kill them. You find that its family that will often force their equals to commit acts they believe in but not necessarily the beliefs of the child, individual or other. People with power over others or simply knowing something about them that they do not wish others to know, people can be easily coerced into the darkest of evils, and before you know it they have grown into it.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Things like that will always be a threat, theres only so much a government can and should intrude into to stop crime/terrorism.

[Invent]

You cannot force somebody to think something, thats why dictatorships never work in the end and crumble and thats why socialism didn't work.

WHAT?! Brainwashing is completely different to dictatorship. They are two completely different things when it comes down to the way they're performed :S

[-:Undertaker:-]

WHAT?! Brainwashing is completely different to dictatorship. They are two completely different things when it comes down to the way they're performed :S

I never said they were the same, although they are both linked. A dictatorship works on the belief that intially force must be used to start power, and to continue power brainwashing must be used. See the Khamer Rogue & Pol Pot.

[Invent]

I never said they were the same, although they are both linked. A dictatorship works on the belief that intially force must be used to start power, and to continue power brainwashing must be used. See the Khamer Rogue & Pol Pot.

You're saying that it won't work because dictatorship doesn't. The two aren't linked in the most important way - the way they are performed. Brainwashing is performed on an individual and is a very personal thing in terms of the way they'd actually get in to your mind to brainwash you.

[-:Undertaker:-]

You're saying that it won't work because dictatorship doesn't. The two aren't linked in the most important way - the way they are performed. Brainwashing is performed on an individual and is a very personal thing in terms of the way they'd actually get in to your mind to brainwash you.

Brasinwashing doesn't work, not on a state level or a individual level. Yeah you can fool someone, even mellow their opinion to an extent. The point you are getting across though; a terrorist cannot brainwash you, me or and other sane person into blowing up a plane.

[Seatherny]

You cannot force somebody to think something, thats why dictatorships never work in the end and crumble and thats why socialism didn't work.



Totally correct on how terrorism lives, and totally agree. The thing I do not agree with is the message which seems to be that people can suddenly become terrorists by other terrorists somehow brainwashing them.

Extremism is deep within somebody, it doesn't come from your local terrorist as I have been saying all along in this thread.

Yeah you can, and thats called brainwashing. Like I said, you don't seem to know what brainwashing means ...


I never said they were the same, although they are both linked. A dictatorship works on the belief that intially force must be used to start power, and to continue power brainwashing must be used. See the Khamer Rogue & Pol Pot.

If you know they aren't the same, then why compare them?
Brainwashing is them changing your opinion etc. Dictatorship is "You will do what I say regardless of what you think". They don't go around trying to change peoples mind. Its "what I say happens, forget what you think".

They can brainwash anyone. You obviously don't know how any of this works.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Yeah you can, and thats called brainwashing. Like I said, you don't seem to know what brainwashing means ...

If you know they aren't the same, then why compare them?
Brainwashing is them changing your opinion etc. Dictatorship is "You will do what I say regardless of what you think". They don't go around trying to change peoples mind. Its "what I say happens, forget what you think".

They can brainwash anyone. You obviously don't know how any of this works.

I do understand very well thanks, brainwashing is not automatic as you seem to think it is. Brain-washing can only occur if somebody has deep feelings within that are similar, a terrorist cannot sit me down and convince me to blow up a plane it just does not happen.

On dictatorship, again you don't get the point. A dictatorship relys to survive on the notion of 're-education' aka brainwashing. It does not work. I suggest you go and read about the Khamer Rogue & Pol Pot, the Nazis and wartime propaganda and China under Chairman Mao and maybe then you will get what I mean - none of it worked, yes they kept power but they never had anybody genuinely convinced to be on their side.

[Seatherny]

I do understand very well thanks, brainwashing is not automatic as you seem to think it is. Brain-washing can only occur if somebody has deep feelings within that are similar, a terrorist cannot sit me down and convince me to blow up a plane it just does not happen.

On dictatorship, again you don't get the point. A dictatorship relys to survive on the notion of 're-education' aka brainwashing. It does not work. I suggest you go and read about the Khamer Rogue & Pol Pot, the Nazis and wartime propaganda and China under Chairman Mao and maybe then you will get what I mean - none of it worked, yes they kept power but they never had anybody genuinely convinced to be on their side.

Like I said, in dictatorship its different. They dont concentrate on 1 person and keep working on that one person. Brainwashing is more personal and they can brainwash anyone. You have obviously never read up on it or done psychology.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Like I said, in dictatorship its different. They dont concentrate on 1 person and keep working on that one person. Brainwashing is more personal and they can brainwash anyone. You have obviously never read up on it or done psychology.

They cannot brainwash you - just like married couples who have been together all their lives, one may support the Conservatives and the other may support Labour - they could debate/discuss their points to eachother everyday and it still wouldn't change the others opinion.

I think this was on whether or not terrorists could brainwash OAPs? - no, they couldn't to put it simply.

[Seatherny]

They cannot brainwash you - just like married couples who have been together all their lives, one may support the Conservatives and the other may support Labour - they could debate/discuss their points to eachother everyday and it still wouldn't change the others opinion.

I think this was on whether or not terrorists could brainwash OAPs? - no, they couldn't to put it simply.

Yeah sorry I forgot every couple who have different views try and use brainwashing techniques on each other.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Oh so terrorists have special techniques, infact are almost magical in their brainwashing that they could brainwash almost anyone? - If you hold that type of view, then we don't have a chance against terrorism.

[Seatherny]

Oh so terrorists have special techniques, infact are almost magical in their brainwashing that they could brainwash almost anyone? - If you hold that type of view, then we don't have a chance against terrorism.

Oh my. Terrorists use brainwashing techniques. They are specific things which they do. Most normal people don't know what they are. Couples most certainly do not use brainwashing techniques. ROFL. I cant believe you are even considering it.

[-:Undertaker:-]

A terrorist could not brainwash me, or any other sane person to blow up an aeroplane. If brainwashing techniques like this existed as you say they do, then surely we'd have people acting under others orders - infact that just reminds me of the Imperius curse on Harry Potter - fictional.

[Tash.]

A terrorist could not brainwash me, or any other sane person to blow up an aeroplane. If brainwashing techniques like this existed as you say they do, then surely we'd have people acting under others orders - infact that just reminds me of the Imperius curse on Harry Potter - fictional.

The problem here is, we may not be talking about me or you who are most likely very much stuck with what we believe and know right and wrong. Nor are we necessarily talking about sane people. When we're discussing the types of people terrorists target for this kind of 'mission' they target people who are vulnerable. With this in mind, do you not think that they might be a teeny tiny bit at risk? As for OAP's it has been proven that as your mind ages you become more agreeable because often you are depending on others. So no, terrorists don't have magical brainwashing powers but for the people they target they do not need them. There are OAP's out there, infact i'm sure there are many, that have all their wits about them and aren't likely to be susceptible to being duped by a terrorist, but for all these people there is at least one who is no longer of sound mind or no longer capable of caring for themselves, and these people are certainly at risk no matter what you say.

[hah]

Anyone cannot be a terrorist, as we all know; terrorists tend to be from Africa or the Middle East - if not and born here in the west, they still have roots back in Africa/the Middle East and are mainly (modern) from the Islamic relgion. Enough of this political correctness.

What we need to do is have better searches on people depending on their nationality, just like Israel does. A elderly British grandmother is not going to be a terrorist, whereas a young-Pakistani man is far more likely to pose a threat.

The IRA where terrorists and they where not from "Africa or the Middle East" :S?

[[Jay]]

I like the fact how no religon was mentioned because its obvious they are christian however had they been muslim it would be a diffrent story. Something like "Muslim terrorists aressted at heathrow airport"

[-:Undertaker:-]

The problem here is, we may not be talking about me or you who are most likely very much stuck with what we believe and know right and wrong. Nor are we necessarily talking about sane people. When we're discussing the types of people terrorists target for this kind of 'mission' they target people who are vulnerable. With this in mind, do you not think that they might be a teeny tiny bit at risk? As for OAP's it has been proven that as your mind ages you become more agreeable because often you are depending on others. So no, terrorists don't have magical brainwashing powers but for the people they target they do not need them. There are OAP's out there, infact i'm sure there are many, that have all their wits about them and aren't likely to be susceptible to being duped by a terrorist, but for all these people there is at least one who is no longer of sound mind or no longer capable of caring for themselves, and these people are certainly at risk no matter what you say.

OAPs will not carry out terrorist attack, you are painting a picture like something from a James Bond movie or Harry Potter. Extremism cannot be driven onto you, extremism is born through an event that occurs;- for example, the invasion of Iraq made people sympathetic to resistance against the western world and quite frankly I do not blame them. I know if I lived in Iraq and my country was invaded under a lie, my family murdererd, my country ruined - i'd fight back aswell.

That is how extremism occurs, not through terrorists in old folks homes telling them to blow up an airline.


The IRA where terrorists and they where not from "Africa or the Middle East" :S?

Yes, I said modern terrorists; "and are mainly (modern) from the Islamic religon" - the IRA are defunct now, so it would be as much use me mentiong the IRA as it would be me mentioning the Khamer Rogue as a threat in Asia today, in the modern world.

[Tash.]

OAPs will not carry out terrorist attack, you are painting a picture like something from a James Bond movie or Harry Potter. Extremism cannot be driven onto you, extremism is born through an event that occurs;- for example, the invasion of Iraq made people sympathetic to resistance against the western world and quite frankly I do not blame them. I know if I lived in Iraq and my country was invaded under a lie, my family murdererd, my country ruined - i'd fight back aswell.

That is how extremism occurs, not through terrorists in old folks homes telling them to blow up an airline.



Yes, I said modern terrorists; "and are mainly (modern) from the Islamic religon" - the IRA are defunct now, so it would be as much use me mentiong the IRA as it would be me mentioning the Khamer Rogue as a threat in Asia today, in the modern world.

You've ignored the main point of my post yet again. I didn't say they would carry it out willingly, I said that some may be duped into it. It's not something out of a James Bond film at all, this is just knowing to what extremes these people will go to to prove a point. You didn't even address the point about non-sane people who are very much at risk no matter what their age is. You cannot open up loopholes in security and frankly if you were to suggest this to any security expert, regardless of their politics they would laugh you out of the building.

It is not worth risking the lives of hundreds of people aboard an aeroplane just so that you can rush a few OAP's through the security checks. They should be checked along with everyone else.

[-:Undertaker:-]

You've ignored the main point of my post yet again. I didn't say they would carry it out willingly, I said that some may be duped into it. It's not something out of a James Bond film at all, this is just knowing to what extremes these people will go to to prove a point. You didn't even address the point about non-sane people who are very much at risk no matter what their age is. You cannot open up loopholes in security and frankly if you were to suggest this to any security expert, regardless of their politics they would laugh you out of the building.

It is not worth risking the lives of hundreds of people aboard an aeroplane just so that you can rush a few OAP's through the security checks. They should be checked along with everyone else.

I have not ignored anything in your posts, I find it very strange that because I disgaree with you I seem to 'ignore your posts' - back to the topic, they cannot dupe or force you into blowing up an airline, that is not the real world. On the security, i'm not saying they shouldn't be checked. I am saying that any searches taken at an airport should not be random, they should target shifty people, not OAPs who quite clearly have not got a jihad against the western world.

[Tash.]

I have not ignored anything in your posts, I find it very strange that because I disgaree with you I seem to 'ignore your posts' - back to the topic, they cannot dupe or force you into blowing up an airline, that is not the real world. On the security, i'm not saying they shouldn't be checked. I am saying that any searches taken at an airport should not be random, they should target shifty people, not OAPs who quite clearly have not got a jihad against the western world.

You cannot say that though, you don't always know just based on someone's appearance whether or not they have a grievance. That's why every single person should be checked. And ok, you didn't ignore the post, you chose not to address a key part of it. You said that a sane person wouldn't just change their opinions and try to blow up a plane. But what about those who are not of sound mind? They might.

[-:Undertaker:-]

You cannot say that though, you don't always know just based on someone's appearance whether or not they have a grievance. That's why every single person should be checked. And ok, you didn't ignore the post, you chose not to address a key part of it. You said that a sane person wouldn't just change their opinions and try to blow up a plane. But what about those who are not of sound mind? They might.

Those of non-sound mind I would question why they are out of the street/allowed to fly, people who are a danger to this country and the public belong inside and not outside. On policy as it stands in modern times, I would make it compulsory for those with mental conditions to possibly be searched if that is the case, but as I said earlier, anyone who have the ability/is of not sound-mind I would question what they are doing out at large in the first place.

[Tash.]

Those of non-sound mind I would question why they are out of the street/allowed to fly, people who are a danger to this country and the public belong inside and not outside. On policy as it stands in modern times, I would make it compulsory for those with mental conditions to possibly be searched if that is the case, but as I said earlier, anyone who have the ability/is of not sound-mind I would question what they are doing out at large in the first place.

That's fair enough then, that I agree with. But this also extends to your OAP policy. Those with Parkinsons disease or dementia often don't know who the people around them are and therefore are at risk of being exploited.

[-:Undertaker:-]

That's fair enough then, that I agree with. But this also extends to your OAP policy. Those with Parkinsons disease or dementia often don't know who the people around them are and therefore are at risk of being exploited.

The same should go for anyone with a criminal record aswell.