Complaints Forum

[redtom]

Why can only certain staff and the thread starter post in the threads, it seems silly if one person has a complaint its likely others will feel the same.

Many times I've clicked to add a message only to be not allowed its incredibly annoying, especially since what I want to say is actually a valid point.

[Catzsy]

Well it depends whether it is a complaint on something specific or a thread to discuss the wider implications of the subject matter. Complaints in any area of life are dealt with on a one-to-one basis. If you have a valid point to make regarding it you can always pm the management or if you feel it needs wider discussion post a feedback thread on the subject yourself.

[Eoin247]

Why can only certain staff and the thread starter post in the threads, it seems silly if one person has a complaint its likely others will feel the same.

Many times I've clicked to add a message only to be not allowed its incredibly annoying, especially since what I want to say is actually a valid point.


Agreed, it's really frustrating when i want to imput some valid information.

[xxMATTGxx]

Well it depends whether it is a complaint on something specific or a thread to discuss the wider implications of the subject matter. Complaints in any area of life are dealt with on a one-to-one basis. If you have a valid point to make regarding it you can always pm the management or if you feel it needs wider discussion post a feedback thread on the subject yourself.

This and if you want to give your view on a certain complaint then it's never stopped you from creating another thread within that section.

[GommeInc]

Blame the thread creator, although personally if it's just between one member and the staff it should be hidden. I don't entirely know why you have it viewable to everyone when the only reason for having it that away appears to be public member bashing :P

[Hecktix]

Blame the thread creator, although personally if it's just between one member and the staff it should be hidden. I don't entirely know why you have it viewable to everyone when the only reason for having it that away appears to be public member bashing :P

I quite agree really, I've never understood why the complaints forum isn't private however I believe it was something to due to the reason so everyone could see it and understand the matter rather than a lot of people post similar complaints - quite a grey area I believe.

I think what's important is to highlight the difference between complaints and feedback, yes complaints are a type of feedback however if there is an issue with a service that we provide it will be taken as a complaint and dealt with like a complaint, as Catzsy has said complaints are one-on-one and as Matt said if you agree, either PM the member of management dealing with said complaint or create a new complaint.

If the thread isn't complaining about something specific, i.e. a moderators decision, implementation of certain rules then feedback threads can be posted for discussion - however feedback threads aren't to complain in but to debate opinion. Complaints are to submit a complaint in which you expect a reply from Management and ideally expect a result from that member of Management.

[redtom]

Okay the majority of complaints are not relevant to anyone but the thread starter, but from time to time there are complaints which other people see to effect them too, but they can't join in with the conversation.

Instead you suggest PMing a member of staff? Which would seem like an okay idea but the fact that in these more complex matters more than one member of staff replies. So which one would a pm have to be sent to? You are also removing the whole point of the complaints section, that is that complaints in there are public, as soon as it goes in a private message it is no longer public.

All I'm suggesting is that certain complaints effect more than one person, and like in other areas of life complains effecting more than one person are not always dealt with on a one-to-one bases.

Effectively what your saying is complaints effecting more than one person should be place in the feedback section to be debated, instead of being complained about :S thus leaving the complaints section only open to complaints about something only effecting the one person complaining.

[Hecktix]

Okay the majority of complaints are not relevant to anyone but the thread starter, but from time to time there are complaints which other people see to effect them too, but they can't join in with the conversation.

Instead you suggest PMing a member of staff? Which would seem like an okay idea but the fact that in these more complex matters more than one member of staff replies. So which one would a pm have to be sent to? You are also removing the whole point of the complaints section, that is that complaints in there are public, as soon as it goes in a private message it is no longer public.

All I'm suggesting is that certain complaints effect more than one person, and like in other areas of life complains effecting more than one person are not always dealt with on a one-to-one bases.

Effectively what your saying is complaints effecting more than one person should be place in the feedback section to be debated, instead of being complained about :S thus leaving the complaints section only open to complaints about something only effecting the one person complaining.

Not precisely, no - as Matt said if you want to add to a complaint you can either make a new one, PM the member of Management for a direct response or I guess you could even PM the complainant and tell them to add certain bits.

The majority of complaints don't need more than one person complaining and for reasons stated by Catzsy and others the complaints forum will remain a one-to-one thing.

[Inseriousity.]

I often answer complaints about my department via PM as only general management are able to reply. If I wanted to add something about a complaint, I'd make a thread about it in here. It's been done before. For example, the controversy surrounding someone with the Nazi name :)

[Josh]

If I agree with the complaint, I just +rep it.. and heaps of others too. I'm sure (A)GMs see the +20 in the corner and realise the complaint has a bit of backing.

[Cwmbran]

Why can only certain staff and the thread starter post in the threads, it seems silly if one person has a complaint its likely others will feel the same.

Many times I've clicked to add a message only to be not allowed its incredibly annoying, especially since what I want to say is actually a valid point.
I completly agree.

Just because the thread starter has posted it in complaints doesn't mean they are the only one who has that complaint.
Take this one for example http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=684134 I hate to make this thread into a discussion about that topic but Callum is correct.
Even though the complaint has been dealt with if someone was to create a thread about that topic in feedback wouldn't it just get closed with a link to that thread saying something along the lines of "Already been dealt with here."

If I see a complaint I agree with I want to get my point across, and really shouldnt have to make a whole new thread just to do that. Fair enough if its a one-on-one complaint then make it completely private, but in that thread there is two members of staff dealing with the complaint by pretty much denying anything like that ever happened.

Thats not the way to handle things.

[redtom]

That thread would be the perfect example of what I mean.

[Hecktix]

I completly agree.

Just because the thread starter has posted it in complaints doesn't mean they are the only one who has that complaint.
Take this one for example http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=684134 I hate to make this thread into a discussion about that topic but Callum is correct.
Even though the complaint has been dealt with if someone was to create a thread about that topic in feedback wouldn't it just get closed with a link to that thread saying something along the lines of "Already been dealt with here."

If I see a complaint I agree with I want to get my point across, and really shouldnt have to make a whole new thread just to do that. Fair enough if its a one-on-one complaint then make it completely private, but in that thread there is two members of staff dealing with the complaint by pretty much denying anything like that ever happened.

Thats not the way to handle things.

The way that thread was dealt with was fine, it was a complaint about moderation in the first instance and later it turned into an issue about the rules (where people probably wanted to reply) if a thread turns into something that it wasn't in the first place we can't help that - collectively among our team we have a lot of experience at Habbox and Callums query was suitably answered by myself and the Forum Manager after we had research into the topic area conducted in times like that others posting saying "YES THIS DID HAPPEN B4, I USED TO DO IT" would be no use because if you read our post we acknowledge there was a short period where such practices were allowed and we also acknowledge that sometimes things slip under the net. There is no need for more people to post in those instances as collectively as Management we have access to resources (this includes people) who can provide the full picture, so your posts saying "i used to do this" blah blah blah wouldn't have been useful at all, because as I've said - we are aware it has happened in the past.

[redtom]

Allot of people have valid points to make, I'm not asking for the ability to reply to these threads only to post irrelevantly.

[Cwmbran]

The way that thread was dealt with was fine, it was a complaint about moderation in the first instance and later it turned into an issue about the rules (where people probably wanted to reply) if a thread turns into something that it wasn't in the first place we can't help that - collectively among our team we have a lot of experience at Habbox and Callums query was suitably answered by myself and the Forum Manager after we had research into the topic area conducted in times like that others posting saying "YES THIS DID HAPPEN B4, I USED TO DO IT" would be no use because if you read our post we acknowledge there was a short period where such practices were allowed and we also acknowledge that sometimes things slip under the net. There is no need for more people to post in those instances as collectively as Management we have access to resources (this includes people) who can provide the full picture, so your posts saying "i used to do this" blah blah blah wouldn't have been useful at all, because as I've said - we are aware it has happened in the past.


That thread inparticular, personally I don't think it was handled correctly. Nicola stated it never happened. Possibly she hadnt done any research on the topic before posting and making that claim. Yes you indeed cleared it up later on and actually accepted it did happen (although it was going on for much longer than you acknowledged and moderators at the time micky.blue.eyes and something dan also posted in them threads if my memory serves me correctly).

Anyway this isnt about that topic, this is about the complaints section and as I stated before if I see a complaint I agree with I shouldn't have to create a new thread on the same topic, when theres a possibility it would get locked because its already been dealt with. I agree with you that some replys such as "I used to do it blahblah" are pointless and not needed but if people could back up the complaint with evidence surely they should have a voice and not just spoken to as if the complaint is false.

[Hecktix]

That thread inparticular, personally I don't think it was handled correctly. Nicola stated it never happened. Possibly she hadnt done any research on the topic before posting and making that claim. Yes you indeed cleared it up later on and actually accepted it did happen (although it was going on for much longer than you acknowledged and moderators at the time micky.blue.eyes and something dan also posted in them threads if my memory serves me correctly).

Anyway this isnt about that topic, this is about the complaints section and as I stated before if I see a complaint I agree with I shouldn't have to create a new thread on the same topic, when theres a possibility it would get locked because its already been dealt with. I agree with you that some replys such as "I used to do it blahblah" are pointless and not needed but if people could back up the complaint with evidence surely they should have a voice and not just spoken to as if the complaint is false.

I accept that people want to share views on particular topics however if you scour the complaints forum most threads wouldn't be suitable for multi-reply, some would however as this is a minority it's not something that should change, because I promise you if we made the complaints forum so everybody could post we would get a lot of hassle - everybody knows this so please, I have little hair as it is I don't want to lose more due to Habbox :P In the event you want to add to a complaint please PM the member of staff dealing with it, if you want them to mention your views within the complaint - they will. We aren't the opposition, we're here to work to make Habbox better and that means liaising with members in these particular situations.

[Cwmbran]

I accept that people want to share views on particular topics however if you scour the complaints forum most threads wouldn't be suitable for multi-reply, some would however as this is a minority it's not something that should change, because I promise you if we made the complaints forum so everybody could post we would get a lot of hassle - everybody knows this so please, I have little hair as it is I don't want to lose more due to Habbox :P In the event you want to add to a complaint please PM the member of staff dealing with it, if you want them to mention your views within the complaint - they will. We aren't the opposition, we're here to work to make Habbox better and that means liaising with members in these particular situations.

First off you can have some of my hair if you want as I've got plenty, I'll send you some in a bag next time I go to the hairdressers. Yes?

So if I was to PM the member of staff that is dealing with my complaint and asked that they quoted me into a reply on that complaint they would? If so I'm happy to do that but it's still a hassle, I'm sure most of the staff dealing with complaints have enough PM's to deal with anyway. Plus what if they are not online, or simply forget to add my point I don't want to be hassling that member of staff to put my point across for me.

I just think it would be so much easier to let us post in the complaints section

[redtom]

Surely you could open them to reply, but make the rules extremely strict. or maybe have tags open or closed on each thread, if the thread starter wants other people to reply they select the open tag, if not closed and if anyone replies who is not a member of staff in a relevant position they get beat with a stick?

[Hecktix]

First off you can have some of my hair if you want as I've got plenty, I'll send you some in a bag next time I go to the hairdressers. Yes?

So if I was to PM the member of staff that is dealing with my complaint and asked that they quoted me into a reply on that complaint they would? If so I'm happy to do that but it's still a hassle, I'm sure most of the staff dealing with complaints have enough PM's to deal with anyway. Plus what if they are not online, or simply forget to add my point I don't want to be hassling that member of staff to put my point across for me.

I just think it would be so much easier to let us post in the complaints section

Oh trust me, I know it's more hassle however I know it'd cause a lot of hassle if all complaints could be replied to by everybody considering it's a minority of complaints that would be suitable for multi-reply (if this wasn't the case, i'd create two different complaints forums). Yes if you PM a member of staff asking a question about a complaint or say you want to add something into it, they will quote whatever you ask in the complaint and link it to the complaint - they shouldn't forget etc as staff should be dealing with PMs and complaints constantly :)

[Catzsy]

First off you can have some of my hair if you want as I've got plenty, I'll send you some in a bag next time I go to the hairdressers. Yes?

So if I was to PM the member of staff that is dealing with my complaint and asked that they quoted me into a reply on that complaint they would? If so I'm happy to do that but it's still a hassle, I'm sure most of the staff dealing with complaints have enough PM's to deal with anyway. Plus what if they are not online, or simply forget to add my point I don't want to be hassling that member of staff to put my point across for me.

I just think it would be so much easier to let us post in the complaints section

I don't understand this - it is not your complaint? If you do have one why not post it yourself?
Irl you wouldn't be able to intervene in somebody's complaint about the service they are receiving or not receiving so why a free for all on here?

[Hecktix]

Surely you could open them to reply, but make the rules extremely strict. or maybe have tags open or closed on each thread, if the thread starter wants other people to reply they select the open tag, if not closed and if anyone replies who is not a member of staff in a relevant position they get beat with a stick?

As then I guaruntee there'd be complaints about what complaints people can reply to and cannot reply to :P

[redtom]

I don't understand this - it is not your complaint? If you do have one why not post it yourself?
Irl you wouldn't be able to intervene in somebody's complaint about the service they are receiving or not receiving so why a free for all on here?

Really? you've never even heard of a group of people complaining about something together?


As then I guaruntee there'd be complaints about what complaints people can reply to and cannot reply to :P

That's a good point, you got me beat there :(

[Cwmbran]

Surely you could open them to reply, but make the rules extremely strict. or maybe have tags open or closed on each thread, if the thread starter wants other people to reply they select the open tag, if not closed and if anyone replies who is not a member of staff in a relevant position they get beat with a stick?
I like it, couldn't something like this be implemented?


I don't understand this - it is not your complaint? If you do have one why not post it yourself?
Irl you wouldn't be able to intervene in somebody's complaint about the service they are receiving or not receiving so why a free for all on here?
But if I agree with the complaint and it affects me I should be allowed to get my point across without making another thread.
Again I'm going to have to use this thread as an example http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=684134. This affects a group of people not just the thread starter, maybe he should have posted it in feedback but I believe feedback and complaints to be a different thing. I see that thread, I agree with it and want to get my point across. I'm not then going to go and create the exact same thread above it just to get my point across its not needed when I could simply post in that thread, besides as I've said before if I'm going to make a carbon copy complaint of another complaint which has just been dealt with isn't mine going to get locked with a reply saying "its been dealt with here"?

Oh and people do intervene in other peoples complaints irl, last week I was working and had a lady come and complain to me about the service she was recieving from one of my waitresses then a lady sat on a nearby table came up and joined us and said "I wasn't going to bring this up because I just thought it happened to me, but if its happening reguarly then something should be done." So it does happen irl :P

[Catzsy]

Really? you've never even heard of a group of people complaining about something together?



That's a good point, you got me beat there :(

Not as a rule. Unless you are talking about a protest? I am talking about a written complaint on a single issue.

@Cwmbran - actually the lady was making her own complaint.

[Hecktix]

Alternatively, I think i've said this but I can't remember and I've started typing now so I won't scroll up - if you think someone is right in complaining there's nothing to stop you PMing them either, they can then add your points to strengthen their complaint :)

[Cwmbran]

Not as a rule. Unless you are talking about a protest? I am talking about a written complaint on a single issue.

@Cwmbran - actually the lady was making her own complaint.
No she wasn't... She was complaining about the same waitress, about her attitude. Just wasn't going to speak up on her own.


Alternatively, I think i've said this but I can't remember and I've started typing now so I won't scroll up - if you think someone is right in complaining there's nothing to stop you PMing them either, they can then add your points to strengthen their complaint :)

I will be doing that from now on, thanks.

[redtom]

When I came to make this thread I didn't know where to post it in the complaints section or in here, if I posted it in the complaints section Cwmbran would never have been able to post and bring the points he made to the thread, all of which have been valid.

I think if you want people to PM other users/staff to add to a complaint then you should create a thread stating that in the complaints section and have it pinned so everyone will know to do that in future.


Not as a rule. Unless you are talking about a protest? I am talking about a written complaint on a single issue.

@Cwmbran - actually the lady was making her own complaint.

Yes protest count but people do complain together, for example I was watching Rip Of Britain the other night (Not something I was normally :P) and a group of people working in a church were complaining about how they had to have CRB checks done on them. (they wrote to the CRB people together.)

Say you go to the cinema and the wrong films being played you don't just watch it anyway, you go and complain, as does everyone else in the cinema, you don't cue up and complain individually you complain as a group.

[Hecktix]

When I came to make this thread I didn't know where to post it in the complaints section or in here, if I posted it in the complaints section Cwmbran would never have been able to post and bring the points he made to the thread, all of which have been valid.


You see I wouldn't class this a complaint, I'd class this an idea - most complaints consist of issues with something that has been done by Habbox or a member of Habbox Staff.

[Catzsy]

No she wasn't... She was complaining about the same waitress, about her attitude. Just wasn't going to speak up on her own.

Yes but it was her own complaint she wasn't trying to intervene on behalf of the other person?
As I said I was talking about written complaints we all know about people ganging up as as crowd to have a go at somebody/something. Totally different scenario. The lesson to be learned I believe is to think about what and where one posts, whether it is a complaint about one action or whether it is a general unhappiness/ disatisfaction about a policy/rule which they would like others views on and post in the correct place. If that happens there should be no need to be able to post in the complaints forum unless you have a complaint.


When I came to make this thread I didn't know where to post it in the complaints section or in here, if I posted it in the complaints section Cwmbran would never have been able to post and bring the points he made to the thread, all of which have been valid.

I think if you want people to PM other users/staff to add to a complaint then you should create a thread stating that in the complaints section and have it pinned so everyone will know to do that in future.



Yes protest count but people do complain together, for example I was watching Rip Of Britain the other night (Not something I was normally :P) and a group of people working in a church were complaining about how they had to have CRB checks done on them. (they wrote to the CRB people together.)

Say you go to the cinema and the wrong films being played you don't just watch it anyway, you go and complain, as does everyone else in the cinema, you don't cue up and complain individually you complain as a group.

See above - my reply to cwmbran. :)

[Nicola]

Surely you could open them to reply, but make the rules extremely strict. or maybe have tags open or closed on each thread, if the thread starter wants other people to reply they select the open tag, if not closed and if anyone replies who is not a member of staff in a relevant position they get beat with a stick?

This would be even more hassle than just PMing someone to add in your opinion or creating a relevant thread as it will just cause more complaints, and we really don't need anymore rules!


When I came to make this thread I didn't know where to post it in the complaints section or in here, if I posted it in the complaints section Cwmbran would never have been able to post and bring the points he made to the thread, all of which have been valid.

I think if you want people to PM other users/staff to add to a complaint then you should create a thread stating that in the complaints section and have it pinned so everyone will know to do that in future.



Yes protest count but people do complain together, for example I was watching Rip Of Britain the other night (Not something I was normally :P) and a group of people working in a church were complaining about how they had to have CRB checks done on them. (they wrote to the CRB people together.)

Say you go to the cinema and the wrong films being played you don't just watch it anyway, you go and complain, as does everyone else in the cinema, you don't cue up and complain individually you complain as a group.

Feedback is for ideas and suggestions whereas in complaints people don't tend to give suggestions, they tend to state what they think is wrong or what shouldn't be happening, and then request a response to why it has happened and request that it doesn't happen again.

[Cwmbran]

Yes but it was her own complaint she wasn't trying to intervene on behalf of the other person?
As I said I was talking about written complaints we all know about people ganging up as as crowd to have a go at somebody/something. Totally different scenario. The lesson to be learned I believe is to think about what and where one posts, whether it is a complaint about one action or whether it is a general unhappiness/ disatisfaction about a policy/rule which they would like others views on and post in the correct place. If that happens there should be no need to be able to post in the complaints forum unless you have a complaint.


Its hardly her own complaint when she was complaining and agreeing with something the affects her. I don't understand how you don't see its the same complaint. Yes its the same complaint from two different people but everything was the same. Thats what I've been trying to say in this thread, if I have a complaint which is the same as someone elses complaint and it affects us both why can't I post in that thread other than creating a duplicate of the complaint thread. Which would surely get closed as its the same complaint as one that had just been dealt with.

Yes written complaints are different, and normally only the person making the complaint can see them along with the person dealing with it, in the complaints forum its there for everyone to see. That way everyone that is affected by it is going to have an opinion.

I'm not meaning to be rude but if you come up with another "its not the same complaint" post I'm not even going to waste my time in replying as it just feels like im talking to a parrot that wears an eye patch.

[Catzsy]

Its hardly her own complaint when she was complaining and agreeing with something the affects her. I don't understand how you don't see its the same complaint. Yes its the same complaint from two different people but everything was the same. Thats what I've been trying to say in this thread, if I have a complaint which is the same as someone elses complaint and it affects us both why can't I post in that thread other than creating a duplicate of the complaint thread. Which would surely get closed as its the same complaint as one that had just been dealt with.

Yes written complaints are different, and normally only the person making the complaint can see them along with the person dealing with it, in the complaints forum its there for everyone to see. That way everyone that is affected by it is going to have an opinion.

I'm not meaning to be rude but if you come up with another "its not the same complaint" post I'm not even going to waste my time in replying as it just feels like im talking to a parrot that wears an eye patch.

LOL love the analogy. It is a complaint about the same thing but nevertheless a different complaint. If two people wrote to the gasboard complaining that there meters had been read incorrectly then it would be a complaint about the same thing but not the same complaint. :)
If you don't get what I am saying probably best to agree to disagree. :P :)

[Grig]

I think it is human nature to want to agree on a valid complaint, once it is made. However, I must say that is lucky people can even view that forum, yet alone post. I myself want to post on a few, however, I know it is a complaints forum and I feel strongly on an issue, I will create a thread in feedback.

Each forum serves it's purpose and is there for a reason, complaints have always been formated like this and will I assume continue to be in such a format in the long-run.

[GommeInc]

I quite agree really, I've never understood why the complaints forum isn't private however I believe it was something to due to the reason so everyone could see it and understand the matter rather than a lot of people post similar complaints - quite a grey area I believe.

I think what's important is to highlight the difference between complaints and feedback, yes complaints are a type of feedback however if there is an issue with a service that we provide it will be taken as a complaint and dealt with like a complaint, as Catzsy has said complaints are one-on-one and as Matt said if you agree, either PM the member of management dealing with said complaint or create a new complaint.

If the thread isn't complaining about something specific, i.e. a moderators decision, implementation of certain rules then feedback threads can be posted for discussion - however feedback threads aren't to complain in but to debate opinion. Complaints are to submit a complaint in which you expect a reply from Management and ideally expect a result from that member of Management.
Complaints are a type of feedback, you can gain feedback from complaints. If a member is having an individual issue with Habbox and the service it provides, then it's a one-to-one issue that can be taken privately. At the moment it is just a one-to-one public feedback forum that in many ways involves the whole Habbox community as quite a few complaints aren't explicitly an issue with that member and the service and that member only. You also do not learn much from them as, again, Habbox is a community website and the complaints usually involve issues that would be of interest to the community in general.

If a complaint is made, see how many agree or disagree with it, don't expect members to have to make threads :P

At the moment the complaints forum isn't being used for the reason you stated last - if a member is having a problem with a member of management, make it private as it becomes a soap opera where you get the member of management having filth thrown at them or vice versa (usually the latter). It does seem a wiser choice to have it open to all members, or remove the whole forum in general as it isn't being used for what it should be - a possible problem with the members themselves and the fact it is, as you said, a place to make individual complaints which do not concern anyone else - because if they did, then anyone should be allowed to argue a point, especially when the excuse "you could always make your own (in feedback or complaints) which doesn't seem at all productive. and many members are far too lazy to make their own threads when there are threads already going.

Also, suggesting a feedback forum exists purely to share opinions is a bit silly - complaints are negative opinions - not all opinions are positive :P

[---MAD---]

Blame the thread creator, although personally if it's just between one member and the staff it should be hidden. I don't entirely know why you have it viewable to everyone when the only reason for having it that away appears to be public member bashing :P
The reason it was set up like that is so it doesn't look like Habbox is hiding complaints by moving them to a private forum. It also shows Habbox is open to people complaining and takes criticism seriously and deals with matters appropriately to address any complaints and concerns members have. On top of that, it allows members to see how they are dealt with and how quickly.

[GommeInc]

The reason it was set up like that is so it doesn't look like Habbox is hiding complaints by moving them to a private forum. It also shows Habbox is open to people complaining and takes criticism seriously and deals with matters appropriately to address any complaints and concerns members have. On top of that, it allows members to see how they are dealt with and how quickly.
So a feedback forum but only one person moaning on behalf of a couple of hundred people? You could have complaints in the feedback forum, just don't move them. You'd get far better feedback worth something if you can get people contributing to "complaint" threads. The sub-forums are okay, but the main forum just seems like a wasted space for potentially decent topics of feedback:

Runescape Feedback somehow turned into a "complaint" thread - http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=684134&page=2

Infact, going through them a lot of them seem to be "Habbox Queries" which should go in this forum, in the first sub-forum:

Someone not getting VIP for a competition they won, not a complaint a query - http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=683348
Someone didn't get their rep points, again a query - http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=683121
Someone didn't get their prize, again another query - http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=683098
Possibly the only complaint, though anyone can reply to that and it'd be suitable for all to reply to, see if they have experienced a lack of staff (therefore more viable feedback, not one persons word) - http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=683681
Someone didn't get their staff permissions removed, not a complaint - a query. Infact, shouldn't this guy of been told who his manager was? This just suggests staff are not told anything to be honest :P - http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=683771

I could go on and on and on about the Complaints Queries Forum but I'd probably die of exhaustion. It just seems to be a wasted forum for queries :/

[nvrspk4]

The Complaints Forum was initially created because members could email complaints to management but that wasn't checked very often. As MAD said, we also wanted people to be aware that we weren't "hiding" complaints, and also to show that we actively responded to, and if necessary dealt with them. This has the effect of encouraging more people to speak up if they have an issue.

What purpose does it serve? Well, first of all it can be used for more individual issues, yes like prizes and other things like that. Often it's used when a number of people could provide a response, or because the person that provides a response normally isn't responding. Those are just two examples, though. Other than that, there isn't a great line between Complaints and Feedback, but it's to the moderators to decide (though the policy I followed and it seems that Matt and Oli follow is for the most part allowing the members to self-regulate where they want to post and for the most part leaving it where they choose.)

What is the difference between the two forums? I'd say mostly the type of discussion you want to have. Simply put, feedback discussions have a tendency to spiral off or to become vitriolic. If you want to have a frank discussion on the issues with guaranteed replies from General Management, the Complaints forum is the place to go. If you're upset with an issue but only really think that the General Management can address the issue, then you might post it in Complaints. Complaints is a section for a more straightforward and to-the-point discussion without pages of obscuring and nonfactual posts. Do a lot of the posts in Feedback verge on complaints? Yes, sometimes, and when they go too far towards the Complaints idea it may be moved there, but for the most part it's a member decision on what kind of discussion they're seeking.

That's what I think about it anyway.

[GommeInc]

The Complaints Forum was initially created because members could email complaints to management but that wasn't checked very often. As MAD said, we also wanted people to be aware that we weren't "hiding" complaints, and also to show that we actively responded to, and if necessary dealt with them. This has the effect of encouraging more people to speak up if they have an issue.
Nearly all of them are queries. Complaints don't exist in that forum. If they were complaints, they wouldn't be written out as a question - HUGE difference.


What purpose does it serve? Well, first of all it can be used for more individual issues, yes like prizes and other things like that. Often it's used when a number of people could provide a response, or because the person that provides a response normally isn't responding. Those are just two examples, though. Other than that, there isn't a great line between Complaints and Feedback, but it's to the moderators to decide (though the policy I followed and it seems that Matt and Oli follow is for the most part allowing the members to self-regulate where they want to post and for the most part leaving it where they choose.)
No, they're queries. Asking why you haven't received your VIP is a query - posing a question to receive a response. A complaint is literally "I HAVE NOT RECEIVED MY VIP WHEN I WAS TOLD TO, I WANT DISCIPLINARY ACTION". A query is "I appear to have not/I haven't received my VIP for a competition I won a few weeks ago, when will this be?" This could be done through a PM (which would actually make management useful, accountable and personable), or through the "Questions/Queries about Habbox" forum which is where these "complaints" should go. Besides, last time I checked, complaints are private - if you complain about McDonalds you send a form in. The idea it should be public is silly, when as we all know by now, the "complaints" in that "complaints" forum are in actual fact queries. It seems a wiser idea to remove the parent forum (where the open complaints are) and leave the two private forums where you complain about a member of staff and abuse in place.


What is the difference between the two forums? I'd say mostly the type of discussion you want to have. Simply put, feedback discussions have a tendency to spiral off or to become vitriolic. If you want to have a frank discussion on the issues with guaranteed replies from General Management, the Complaints forum is the place to go. If you're upset with an issue but only really think that the General Management can address the issue, then you might post it in Complaints. Complaints is a section for a more straightforward and to-the-point discussion without pages of obscuring and nonfactual posts. Do a lot of the posts in Feedback verge on complaints? Yes, sometimes, and when they go too far towards the Complaints idea it may be moved there, but for the most part it's a member decision on what kind of discussion they're seeking.

That's what I think about it anyway.
Not usually, and if they do they're easy to follow. If a member of management can't read a thread they should be fired, locked up in a box and chucked out to sea for incompetence, especially when most of the time the threads are filled with usual feedback. The complaints forum isn't the place to go for a one-on-one place to discuss things because, as stated, it's being used as an exact copy of the "Ask a Habbox Staff Member" and "Questions/Queries about Habbox" forums, the complaints forum is exactly the same as these two, with a name that doesn't go with the use. And complaints in feedback threads should not be moved to the complaints forum, as I keep stating, if there is a huge problem with something, the more complaints make the reason of the original complaint more valid and a reason for action to be taken - they are essential feedback ;)

[Catzsy]

Nearly all of them are queries. Complaints don't exist in that forum. If they were complaints, they wouldn't be written out as a question - HUGE difference.


No, they're queries. Asking why you haven't received your VIP is a query - posing a question to receive a response. A complaint is literally "I HAVE NOT RECEIVED MY VIP WHEN I WAS TOLD TO, I WANT DISCIPLINARY ACTION". A query is "I appear to have not/I haven't received my VIP for a competition I won a few weeks ago, when will this be?" This could be done through a PM (which would actually make management useful, accountable and personable), or through the "Questions/Queries about Habbox" forum which is where these "complaints" should go. Besides, last time I checked, complaints are private - if you complain about McDonalds you send a form in. The idea it should be public is silly, when as we all know by now, the "complaints" in that "complaints" forum are in actual fact queries. It seems a wiser idea to remove the parent forum (where the open complaints are) and leave the two private forums where you complain about a member of staff and abuse in place.


Not usually, and if they do they're easy to follow. If a member of management can't read a thread they should be fired, locked up in a box and chucked out to sea for incompetence, especially when most of the time the threads are filled with usual feedback. The complaints forum isn't the place to go for a one-on-one place to discuss things because, as stated, it's being used as an exact copy of the "Ask a Habbox Staff Member" and "Questions/Queries about Habbox" forums, the complaints forum is exactly the same as these two, with a name that doesn't go with the use. And complaints in feedback threads should not be moved to the complaints forum, as I keep stating, if there is a huge problem with something, the more complaints make the reason of the original complaint more valid and a reason for action to be taken - they are essential feedback ;)

I can't remember the last time I removed or saw a thread moved from Feedback to the Complaints forum so I don't think that is the issue. He wants the complaints forum opened up so anybody can add their views. Essentially therefore I agree with you if there is a complaint about a single issue it can be resolved in the complaints forum but if somebody wants to file a feedback thread on a wider issue then they can. The runescape complaint was filed in the Runescape forum and was a specific complaint about a thread being removed not a thread about the implications of the Runecape T&Cs. Perhaps members should think about whether it is a complaint about a single issue or feedback and post them in the right place or ask for guidence if they are not sure?

[GommeInc]

I can't remember the last time I removed or saw a thread moved from Feedback to the Complaints forum so I don't think that is the issue. He wants the complaints forum opened up so anybody can add their views.
Me or someone else? I think the forum should be removed, it's purpose doesn't exist as it does exactly what the Queries/Questions forum should be - and in some cases, is - doing. With the forum closed you'd get more activity in this forum, and any boring queries sent off to the queries forum. I honestly do not see why the complaints forum exists, when there are literally no complaints and the style they're written in is exactly the same as the feedback forum and the queries forum, except you lack any real feedback and what the community want to say.

[Catzsy]

Me or someone else? I think the forum should be removed, it's purpose doesn't exist as it does exactly what the Queries/Questions forum should be - and in some cases, is - doing. With the forum closed you'd get more activity in this forum, and any boring queries sent off to the queries forum. I honestly do not see why the complaints forum exists, when there are literally no complaints and the style they're written in is exactly the same as the feedback forum and the queries forum, except you lack any real feedback and what the community want to say.

Anybody who needs guidance I guess. I cannot see you having a problem with
knowing what and where to post it though. :P

Okay I see your point about them mostly being queries but they are not moved there - the members post them there. We have no tools to move them to queries so can't help there. I also don't think that complaints should be on view either. I can't think of anywhere in the real world where complaints are made public. I do not think there is any restriction on members being able to say what they want to say, within the rules. I would say that is more open in respect of that than it ever was - I can remember a certain senior member *cough* being banned for doing just that but luckily sense was seen.

[Ajthedragon]

Maybe have Public and Private complaints forums?

that way it's the user choice.

[Inseriousity.]

Often queries can be interpreted as a complaint hence the many queries in the complaints forum. Someone asking where their VIP is for example just the same as a customer complaining why their meal hasn't come in a restaurant. Sometimes I wish that people would just PM me as sometimes it's just a misunderstanding (why hasn't my rep come for example is a common one because the number changes and people often don't notice) but everyone has a right to complain.

I think it's a lot better public as often people may have the same problem/criticism. I do think the previous suggestions (PM the user who made the complaint to add yours, PM the management member involved to include yours or +rep the user who complained) are more 'cleaner' ways of adding your point to the discussion without having to ruin the flow of the complaint. :)

[The Don]

Not precisely, no - as Matt said if you want to add to a complaint you can either make a new one, PM the member of Management for a direct response or I guess you could even PM the complainant and tell them to add certain bits.

The majority of complaints don't need more than one person complaining and for reasons stated by Catzsy and others the complaints forum will remain a one-to-one thing.


But the issue with creating a new thread based around the same topic in feedback will get moved to complaints and/or deleted as there is already a thread on it. I don't think anyone has yet given a decent enough reason for others not to be able to comment in the complaints section.

[Hecktix]

But the issue with creating a new thread based around the same topic in feedback will get moved to complaints and/or deleted as there is already a thread on it. I don't think anyone has yet given a decent enough reason for others not to be able to comment in the complaints section.

I've given a decent enough reason and that's because it's only a minority of complaints others would need to reply to and in other cases people would reply and it would cause a lot of trouble and piss a lot of people off. There has been a viable solution put forward therefore I suggest that's used.

[The Don]

I've given a decent enough reason and that's because it's only a minority of complaints others would need to reply to and in other cases people would reply and it would cause a lot of trouble and piss a lot of people off. There has been a viable solution put forward therefore I suggest that's used.

It's hardly a minority, i've seen more than enough complaint threads that I fully agree with, and other people in this thread have said the same. maybe an option to stop public responses when posting in that section? that way everyones happy...

[GommeInc]

Anybody who needs guidance I guess. I cannot see you having a problem with
knowing what and where to post it though. :P

Okay I see your point about them mostly being queries but they are not moved there - the members post them there. We have no tools to move them to queries so can't help there. I also don't think that complaints should be on view either. I can't think of anywhere in the real world where complaints are made public. I do not think there is any restriction on members being able to say what they want to say, within the rules. I would say that is more open in respect of that than it ever was - I can remember a certain senior member *cough* being banned for doing just that but luckily sense was seen.
Of course many aren't moved there, but you may as well stop people posting queries in that forum. Seems more suitable to do that than keep a forum which isn't used for its purpose, it looks scruffy :P Any one-to-one complaints (or complaints that only effect an individual), should probably be kept to PM or the private forums. The rest, where all users will be effected, may as well be posted here - removing the forum would encourage users to post their feedback here, their queries in the Queries forum and one-to-one complants in the complaints forum (or PM). Infact, maybe I could suggest having each competition/event thread with a link to PM the event/competition manager or staff who made that competition? It would make the staff seem more approachable, and the PM system is there for a reason.


Often queries can be interpreted as a complaint hence the many queries in the complaints forum. Someone asking where their VIP is for example just the same as a customer complaining why their meal hasn't come in a restaurant. Sometimes I wish that people would just PM me as sometimes it's just a misunderstanding (why hasn't my rep come for example is a common one because the number changes and people often don't notice) but everyone has a right to complain.

I think it's a lot better public as often people may have the same problem/criticism. I do think the previous suggestions (PM the user who made the complaint to add yours, PM the management member involved to include yours or +rep the user who complained) are more 'cleaner' ways of adding your point to the discussion without having to ruin the flow of the complaint. :)
Bit in bold - They're still queries, not complaints. That's like saying a cat that's wearing a prostitutes clothing is a prostitute or should be interpreted as one. It isn't and it's wrong, just like interpreting obvious queries as complaints :P

And no-one wants to PM, they may have a valid point that may change the outcome of the complaint, which is useful. You want all feedback, from everyone who is involved - you make a discussion. Holding it in a private forum is useless.

And since when do people get pee'd off if someone comes into their feedback thread? If people are pointless posting tell them to stop posting. I've never seen an example of this, and if that's the case, PM if it obviously doesn't involve everyone. If a complaint is made about a particular part of the forum (let's say, the Complants Forum), then you need to find who supports them or who doesn't, what's the point keeping it one-to-one? The member making the thread could be a complete idiot who doesn't understand a word they are saying and is merely talking for themselves and not the community :P

[Inseriousity.]

I never said they weren't queries lol "hence the many queries in the complaints forum" Your cat analogy makes no sense with this because complaints are completely subjective. If someone wanted to add their thoughts to the complaint, they could PM. If they don't want to, they're obviously not that bothered about it after all then. The problem with feedback threads is that they often go away from the point naturally and move onto another topic of discussion to criticise. It's far cleaner to keep it one-to-one to keep the original complaint intact.

[Hecktix]

It's hardly a minority, i've seen more than enough complaint threads that I fully agree with, and other people in this thread have said the same. maybe an option to stop public responses when posting in that section? that way everyones happy...

There's agreeing with a complaint and there's the need to add your opinion - these are two different things and this could cause trouble, not only for the thread starter but for those dealing with the complaint - sometimes you only need one viewpoint on a complaint to act upon it.

Inseriousity's post covers the rest quite well.

[nvrspk4]

Hey,

Let me start by backtracking and withdrawing the majority of my previous post. What I meant to say was in there...somewhere...but I said it badly. I had to think on it for a few minutes to be able to actually classify it. So let me take a second shot at this:

The Complaints forum is different from feedback in two ways:

1) It can be used for individual issues/question that don't pertain to the greater forum
2) It is used to question situations where policy is violated, but NOT when policy should be changed.

When people are lobbying for policy to be changed then obviously the Feedback forum is the right place to do so. One caveat I should make is that members can choose to post appeals to change policy in Complaints if they want to speak directly to General Management and only are really seeking a reply from General Management. If they do so, that is their choice and there are very few situations where it would not be permitted.

[Those with TL : DR Syndrome can read up to here. Below are justifications/further explanations for the above]

Now, why do you need the Complaints forum (in the format of only thread starter and management can reply) for reasons 1 and 2?

1) Individual Question - A user may have a question for, or need something done by the management team but may not know who to go to or any member of General Management could deal with their issue, so they post in this forum, because other users' replies would only be able to direct them where to get help, instead of being able to give help (admittedly the "Password" thread does not fit this, it was posted in the wrong forum as Hecktix noted, but it require a one sentence response which took as much effort as moving it, so no harm IMO).

2) Policy Question - This is when a user is questioning the interpretation of a specific policy or the enforcement of a specific policy. IE: "You are not following policy A" or "You should be doing this according to policy A". Now it won't always be said like that but in essence most of the threads conform to this or one (proof comes later, don't worry.) The reason that only GM replies to this is mainly because only the General Management response matters. What??? The users don't count??? Blasphemy, dictatorship, overthrow the tyrants!!!! No, it's just that when a policy isn't being followed, that should just be pointed out to management and dealt with. Having users throw in their two cents is often more destructive than constructive as threads get derailed. If users have additional instances of not following policy A to report, they can PM the thread starter or create their own, but the system has more benefits than detriments.

The second reason only General Management should reply is if it's a policy interpretation (ie: "Policy A says you shouldn't be doing this", or "Under policy A isn't this disallowed?") is because only the General Management's interpretation of the policy is relevant, because what GM interprets the policy to be is what the policy is being enforced as. Now, if you disagree with that, you can take it to the Feedback Forum where you can now work on a policy change. Isn't this a roundabout way, requiring two threads in two different forums when we could just delete complaints and use Feedback? No, because the ability to clarify what the current policy is allows the debate to be much more focused and prevents multiple pages of inflammatory posts/misinformed hypotheses to confuse the issue. If the policy is confirmed in complaints, then you can move forward in Feedback, whereas otherwise there might be 5-6 pages of misinformed posts before General Management can get their point clear about the current policy, at which time discussion will shift and it's just plain confusing.


Now, to ensure that I wasn't just babbling as I did a little bit before, I did some checking to back up my hypothesis, and picked the following random pages to browse the threads of pages: 1, 11, 13, 17, 21, 24

The vast majority were individual issues, questions of policy, complaints that policy wasn't being followed (contesting ban reasons, reporting misconduct, complaining that things weren't being done fast enough [I consider this an issue of policy not being followed as it is a policy to be prompt as possible], etc.)

So those are the two main purposes the Complaints Forum serves apart from the Feedback forum, in addition to Feedback where the member only wants to hear from General Management (in which case if you know how to post Feedback you could get a concurrent thread going about changing it here). I've also provided the reasons why I think that they need to be separate from the Feedback forum, in a forum where only General Management can post.

Hopefully this makes a lot more sense than the last post :P

Also as a disclaimer, I said that the discussion of whether we should CHANGE the policy should go to feedback. I will acknowledge that sometimes the thread evolves from questioning the policy to demanding change in the policy, but it started with questioning the policy. I do however think it would be sensible for General Management to say (once they have clarified the policy) "That's what the policy is. If you want it to be changed, feel free to make a post in the Feedback Forum". I think for the most part the divide is being kept, though.

Second disclaimer, I understand Gomme's rhetorical point about the naming of the complaints forum, we can be technical about what each post is, technically a query etc. That said, I could also argue that a question about where someone's VIP is is implicitly a complaint, even if it's explicitly a query. My suggestion here would be to not worry about the semantics unless they were legitimately confusing to a majority of members. In this case, I believe the point of Complaints is sufficiently clear that a renaming isn't that necessary.

[GommeInc]

Hey,

Let me start by backtracking and withdrawing the majority of my previous post. What I meant to say was in there...somewhere...but I said it badly. I had to think on it for a few minutes to be able to actually classify it. So let me take a second shot at this:

The Complaints forum is different from feedback in two ways:

1) It can be used for individual issues/question that don't pertain to the greater forum
2) It is used to question situations where policy is violated, but NOT when policy should be changed.

When people are lobbying for policy to be changed then obviously the Feedback forum is the right place to do so. One caveat I should make is that members can choose to post appeals to change policy in Complaints if they want to speak directly to General Management and only are really seeking a reply from General Management. If they do so, that is their choice and there are very few situations where it would not be permitted.

[Those with TL : DR Syndrome can read up to here. Below are justifications/further explanations for the above]

Now, why do you need the Complaints forum (in the format of only thread starter and management can reply) for reasons 1 and 2?

1) Individual Question - A user may have a question for, or need something done by the management team but may not know who to go to or any member of General Management could deal with their issue, so they post in this forum, because other users' replies would only be able to direct them where to get help, instead of being able to give help (admittedly the "Password" thread does not fit this, it was posted in the wrong forum as Hecktix noted, but it require a one sentence response which took as much effort as moving it, so no harm IMO).

2) Policy Question - This is when a user is questioning the interpretation of a specific policy or the enforcement of a specific policy. IE: "You are not following policy A" or "You should be doing this according to policy A". Now it won't always be said like that but in essence most of the threads conform to this or one (proof comes later, don't worry.) The reason that only GM replies to this is mainly because only the General Management response matters. What??? The users don't count??? Blasphemy, dictatorship, overthrow the tyrants!!!! No, it's just that when a policy isn't being followed, that should just be pointed out to management and dealt with. Having users throw in their two cents is often more destructive than constructive as threads get derailed. If users have additional instances of not following policy A to report, they can PM the thread starter or create their own, but the system has more benefits than detriments.

The second reason only General Management should reply is if it's a policy interpretation (ie: "Policy A says you shouldn't be doing this", or "Under policy A isn't this disallowed?") is because only the General Management's interpretation of the policy is relevant, because what GM interprets the policy to be is what the policy is being enforced as. Now, if you disagree with that, you can take it to the Feedback Forum where you can now work on a policy change. Isn't this a roundabout way, requiring two threads in two different forums when we could just delete complaints and use Feedback? No, because the ability to clarify what the current policy is allows the debate to be much more focused and prevents multiple pages of inflammatory posts/misinformed hypotheses to confuse the issue. If the policy is confirmed in complaints, then you can move forward in Feedback, whereas otherwise there might be 5-6 pages of misinformed posts before General Management can get their point clear about the current policy, at which time discussion will shift and it's just plain confusing.


Now, to ensure that I wasn't just babbling as I did a little bit before, I did some checking to back up my hypothesis, and picked the following random pages to browse the threads of pages: 1, 11, 13, 17, 21, 24

The vast majority were individual issues, questions of policy, complaints that policy wasn't being followed (contesting ban reasons, reporting misconduct, complaining that things weren't being done fast enough [I consider this an issue of policy not being followed as it is a policy to be prompt as possible], etc.)

So those are the two main purposes the Complaints Forum serves apart from the Feedback forum, in addition to Feedback where the member only wants to hear from General Management (in which case if you know how to post Feedback you could get a concurrent thread going about changing it here). I've also provided the reasons why I think that they need to be separate from the Feedback forum, in a forum where only General Management can post.

Hopefully this makes a lot more sense than the last post :P

Also as a disclaimer, I said that the discussion of whether we should CHANGE the policy should go to feedback. I will acknowledge that sometimes the thread evolves from questioning the policy to demanding change in the policy, but it started with questioning the policy. I do however think it would be sensible for General Management to say (once they have clarified the policy) "That's what the policy is. If you want it to be changed, feel free to make a post in the Feedback Forum". I think for the most part the divide is being kept, though.

Second disclaimer, I understand Gomme's rhetorical point about the naming of the complaints forum, we can be technical about what each post is, technically a query etc. That said, I could also argue that a question about where someone's VIP is is implicitly a complaint, even if it's explicitly a query. My suggestion here would be to not worry about the semantics unless they were legitimately confusing to a majority of members. In this case, I believe the point of Complaints is sufficiently clear that a renaming isn't that necessary.
It's a shame that your entire post still points to the Queries forum. So my reply is:

http://www.habboxforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8

Your hypothesis where you browsed random pages all fall under the one-to-one discussions with staff, which are at the top of this forum (Questions and Queries about Habbox > Department Forums). If anything, you just add a "General Management" forum and you've got the idea behind the complaints forum there, with the bonus that these one-to-one queries appear alongside the feedback threads. Infact, it would make it easier for members as any point of contact is all in one area, seeing as the Complaints forum IS just mimicking the actions of the Query forums where you ask staff for answers.

The complaints forum has no complaints in it, and when they do they fizzle out because it's either one member who doesn't understand what they are doing, or because the member wants the ideas of other members and their feedback. Callum himself in his thread that was pointlessly moved to the complaints forum sub-complained that it was wrong to move it to that forum because no-one else could post:

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=684134&page=2

^ And that's the only complaints thread, because it was a wrong action taken by a forum staff member because the feedback taken by the members of the community went overlooked.

You also completely missed my point that the Queries forum (which is seperate to the Feedbacks forum) does exactly what the complaints forum does except in perfect context.

[Catzsy]

It's a shame that your entire post still points to the Queries forum. So my reply is:

http://www.habboxforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8

Your hypothesis where you browsed random pages all fall under the one-to-one discussions with staff, which are at the top of this forum (Questions and Queries about Habbox > Department Forums). If anything, you just add a "General Management" forum and you've got the idea behind the complaints forum there, with the bonus that these one-to-one queries appear alongside the feedback threads. Infact, it would make it easier for members as any point of contact is all in one area, seeing as the Complaints forum IS just mimicking the actions of the Query forums where you ask staff for answers.

The complaints forum has no complaints in it, and when they do they fizzle out because it's either one member who doesn't understand what they are doing, or because the member wants the ideas of other members and their feedback. Callum himself in his thread that was pointlessly moved to the complaints forum sub-complained that it was wrong to move it to that forum because no-one else could post:

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=684134&page=2

^ And that's the only complaints thread, because it was a wrong action taken by a forum staff member because the feedback taken by the members of the community went overlooked.You also completely missed my point that the Queries forum (which is seperate to the Feedbacks forum) does exactly what the complaints forum does except in perfect context.

No it wasn't Gomme, It was posted in the Runescape forum and was a complaint about a removed thread not about Runescape T&Cs. In any event there was already a feedback thread that the OP could have posted in.