Shooting in Nevada

[Phil]

Came home tonight and mam told me about this, I can't believe it. A TWELEVE YEAR OLD BOY took a gun into school killed a teacher and wounded two other students before taking his own life.


Officials in the city of Sparks have not identified the boy but believe the weapon came from his home.
He opened fire at Sparks Middle School on Monday, killing maths teacher and Afghanistan veteran Michael Landsberry.Police say Landsberry, 45, was shot as he tried to coax the boy to drop the gun.School District Police Chief Mike Mieras said Landsberry walked towards the boy with the gun, enabling the children on the playground to flee."I cannot express enough appreciation for Mr Landsberry," Washoe County Schools Superintendent Pedro Martinez said on Tuesday. "He truly is a hero."Officials also said the boy with the gun was unable to enter the school building, which was crowded with students, because staff followed security procedures.
Officials are still working to determine how the boy, who was enrolled at the school, gained access to a semi-automatic handgun.The two wounded children are expected to recover.Police say the boy's parents are co-operating with investigators."We have been in contact with the parents of the suspect in this matter and out of respect for them, we will not be releasing the identity of the shooter," Sparks Deputy Police Chief Tom Miller said at a news conference."They are grieving parents and are going through a very challenging, difficult time."When asked if the parents would face charges, Mr Miller said, "That is basically a question for the local prosecutor. But the potential is there."The incident occurred at 07:15 local time on Monday (14:15 GMT) shortly before the scheduled start of classes.As many as 200 police officers responded to the scene, authorities said.

Source:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-24631668

[Absently]

Yeah saw this on my phone :( so crazy!! He's only a kid... Well done to the man though! What a hero.


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[Kardan]

Tragic.

Inb4 Undertaker says the 12 year old was on drugs/taking medication/had mental issues/would be better if teachers had guns.

[MKR&*42]

Inb4 this turns into debate over gun legality

Anyway, awful incident :(

[Samantha]

What an awful incident, to say he is only 12 too makes you wonder what is happening in the world seriously. What a good deed by the veteran though.

[Lucy]

This sort of news is becoming all too common, and I can't see it slowing down any-time soon.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Tragic.

Inb4 Undertaker says the 12 year old was on drugs/taking medication/had mental issues/would be better if teachers had guns.

Isn't that the rational question to ask rather than calling for more gun free zones which nearly all of the shootings have taken place on?

Logic and common sense before hot headed emotion.

[Kardan]

Isn't that the rational question to ask rather than calling for more gun free zones which nearly all of the shootings have taken place on?

Logic and common sense before hot headed emotion.

Well what if we didn't have a gun free zone? What would we have had in this situation? A teacher shooting a child? What would happen if another member of staff heard shots and walked in on seeing a teacher shooting down a child? I always imagine that one of these days, the person that shoots down the attacker will be confused as the attacker themselves...

[Stephen]

inb4 underta.. nevermind

http://i.imgur.com/RhnGFv5.png

Edited by j0rd (Forum Moderator): Please do not post pointlessly

[-:Undertaker:-]

Well what if we didn't have a gun free zone? What would we have had in this situation? A teacher shooting a child? What would happen if another member of staff heard shots and walked in on seeing a teacher shooting down a child? I always imagine that one of these days, the person that shoots down the attacker will be confused as the attacker themselves...

Only somebody completely bonkers could twist reality like you just have.

What is so hard to understand about this? gun free zones, the only people who obey them are law abiding citizens whereas the only people who don't pay attention to them are the insane maniacs (usually drugged up) who are out to kill people. So it's a realllyyyyyyyy simple choice: either you allow the law abiding people to arm themselves against the crazy people or you don't and instead rely on the Police who take minutes to get there.

That's all this comes down to and you know deep down yourself that faced with a lunatic, you'd rather have a gun rather than cower in the corner and be shot.

[AgnesIO]

The problem is quite simply guns being too readily available in the USA - less people need guns, not more. Sadly, I think the culture over there is already too developed to simply say "get rid of your guns"...

Sent from my HTC One X

[sexpot]

The problem is quite simply guns being too readily available in the USA - less people need guns, not more. Sadly, I think the culture over there is already too developed to simply say "get rid of your guns"...

Sent from my HTC One X

If less people have guns, crime and shootings like this are still going to happen because criminals are going to get guns no matter what. all you're doing is taking them away from law abiding citizens.

[AgnesIO]

If less people have guns, crime and shootings like this are still going to happen because criminals are going to get guns no matter what. all you're doing is taking them away from law abiding citizens.

Can you explain why this always happens in the USA, and very very rarely in the UK, then? Is it that the USA just have more criminal evil bags or?

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[sexpot]

Can you explain why this always happens in the USA, and very very rarely in the UK, then? Is it that the USA just have more criminal evil bags or?

Sent from my HTC One X

I would assume so, the USA is much larger than the UK so obviously there are going to be more shooting crimes.

[AgnesIO]

I would assume so, the USA is much larger than the UK so obviously there are going to be more shooting crimes.

Within reason, but there are disproportionately more. This is an issue the USA faces, and the sooner more people wake up and smell the coffee, the better.

Sent from my HTC One X

[Absently]

the idea of a world where everybody just freely has guns really haunts me, it's like some sort of horror film or one of those weird action films :/ nty.

[karter]

FREAKIN. 12. WHAT THE ****

[AgnesIO]

the idea of a world where everybody just freely has guns really haunts me, it's like some sort of horror film or one of those weird action films :/ nty.

Same here.

I think my issue is that I really don't trust anyone anyway, I mean obviously there are a few - but I think my friends are much more trusting of others than I am. Therefore, the thought of walking past people armed with guns is slightly daunting..

[Futz]

Damn, this really reminds me of the sons of anarchy episode a few weeks ago

mad how a 12 year old comes to the decision to kill people then take his own life
be interesting to see how he got hold of the gun

[-:Undertaker:-]

the idea of a world where everybody just freely has guns really haunts me, it's like some sort of horror film or one of those weird action films :/ nty.

That's because you have an irrational fear of guns and don't understand that somewhere like the US, hundreds of millions of people own firearms and never use them on other people - it's just a small percentage which get used and of those that get used, the vast majority are used by law abiding citizens to defend themselves from scumbags.

My biggest and a much worse fear than yours is if there is ever government tyranny - because what will we have to fight back with? It was only in the living memory of our older generations that there were groups of unarmed people being exterminated in Germany.

[AgnesIO]

That's because you have an irrational fear of guns and don't understand that somewhere like the US, hundreds of millions of people own firearms and never use them on other people - it's just a small percentage which get used and of those that get used, the vast majority are used by law abiding citizens to defend themselves from scumbags.

My biggest and a much worse fear than yours is if there is ever government tyranny - because what will we have to fight back with?

The Syrian's seem to have done pretty well there, and I don't think they all had RPG's before they fought.

[-:Undertaker:-]

The Syrian's seem to have done pretty well there, and I don't think they all had RPG's before they fought.

Uh what's the point your trying to make here?

Syria to my knowledge has very strict gun laws (I am not even sure they are even legal there) and consquently has been ruled by the same family for decades with an iron fist - and i'd be willing to bet that if anything, gun laws would have been made stricter during the time that the Assad's have ruled Syria for the simple fact that an armed people ultimately cannot be enslaved.

Nearly all regimes have sought to ban or very much restrict guns as soon as they attain power.

[AcarioRuiz]

This is why 12 year-olds should not be allowed mature games.

[AgnesIO]

Uh what's the point your trying to make here?

Syria to my knowledge has very strict gun laws (I am not even sure they are even legal there) and consquently has been ruled by the same family for decades with an iron fist - and i'd be willing to bet that if anything, gun laws would have been made stricter during the time that the Assad's have ruled Syria for the simple fact that an armed people ultimately cannot be enslaved.

Nearly all regimes have sought to ban or very much restrict guns as soon as they attain power.

Isn't my point obvious? You said (and I quote);


My biggest and a much worse fear than yours is if there is ever government tyranny - because what will we have to fight back with?

Now, correct me if I am wrong, but the Syrians have a pretty impressive opposition - who have an incredibly assortment of weapons. We do not need guns to protect ourselves against the government, and suggesting that we may do one day is hypocritical of you to say the least (after all, our First Past the Post system protects the big parties, doesn't it? Or at least, that is what you would argue if this were a political debate!)

Hasn't it been proven, that if you carry a knife you are more likely to be injured by one? That clearly therefore applies to guns. Furthermore, the evidence is ALREADY THERE, why not check out an excellent list of US school shootings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States) - and once you've done that, you can compare it to the list of UK school shootings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_school_massacre). Now, the USA is a bigger country than the UK - but lets wipe that argument out now shall we, when I point out if we start since 1996 (the Dunblane Shooting) there has been 1 shooting in the UK versus over 80 (possibly more, I lost count) in the USA! In contrast, the USA's population is about 5 times bigger than the UK.

[Kardan]

Only somebody completely bonkers could twist reality like you just have.

What is so hard to understand about this? gun free zones, the only people who obey them are law abiding citizens whereas the only people who don't pay attention to them are the insane maniacs (usually drugged up) who are out to kill people. So it's a realllyyyyyyyy simple choice: either you allow the law abiding people to arm themselves against the crazy people or you don't and instead rely on the Police who take minutes to get there.

That's all this comes down to and you know deep down yourself that faced with a lunatic, you'd rather have a gun rather than cower in the corner and be shot.

Considering we're talking about the US where guns are pretty widespread, you would be right in most cases. But in this case, where it was a 12 year old boy - who clearly didn't get a gun legally it's pretty clear that if his parents didn't have a gun, this wouldn't have happened. Hence why we don't have any 12 year olds going around shooting kids in the UK.

Also, I totally called the fact you'd say that gunners are usually drugged up :P

[-:Undertaker:-]

Now, correct me if I am wrong, but the Syrians have a pretty impressive opposition - who have an incredibly assortment of weapons. We do not need guns to protect ourselves against the government, and suggesting that we may do one day is hypocritical of you to say the least (after all, our First Past the Post system protects the big parties, doesn't it? Or at least, that is what you would argue if this were a political debate!)

Uhhhh yes they do. But the point is, and the entire point in the gun amendment in the US constitution is, to firstly prevent tyranny from happening and if tyranny does occur then the people then have the capacity to repel the regime. Syria clearly lacks this as it's been ruled now by the Assad family for decades - with thousands over the years being targeted, tortured and killed - something that, if guns were protected, the regime would have to be more careful doing. The entire reason, if you read what the US Founders wrote, why guns are put in the constitution is because the Founders rightly saw that the threat of tyranny always comes from within a nation rather than outside of a nation.

As for FPTP - yes our system is a good system and it does protect against tyranny. But it's not infallible.


Hasn't it been proven, that if you carry a knife you are more likely to be injured by one? That clearly therefore applies to guns. Furthermore, the evidence is ALREADY THERE, why not check out an excellent list of US school shootings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States) - and once you've done that, you can compare it to the list of UK school shootings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_school_massacre). Now, the USA is a bigger country than the UK - but lets wipe that argument out now shall we, when I point out if we start since 1996 (the Dunblane Shooting) there has been 1 shooting in the UK versus over 80 (possibly more, I lost count) in the USA! In contrast, the USA's population is about 5 times bigger than the UK.

But then I could also compare cities in the US with strict gun controls with ones with more lax gun controls and point out how cities such as Detroit (where guns are basically banned) have a much higher rate than more lax cities. I could also point out how statistics showing the many more lives saved by guns every year are never given any airtime.


Considering we're talking about the US where guns are pretty widespread, you would be right in most cases. But in this case, where it was a 12 year old boy - who clearly didn't get a gun legally it's pretty clear that if his parents didn't have a gun, this wouldn't have happened. Hence why we don't have any 12 year olds going around shooting kids in the UK.

Then the solution is to punish those who don't take care of their guns rather than disarming and thereby punishing the vast majority of law abiding gun owners who are sensible with their guns.


Also, I totally called the fact you'd say that gunners are usually drugged up :P

Indeed, because it's true.