Abuse: Parents smacking children. [Archive]

Phil

31-12-2013, 07:02 PM

ya but i just think giving your child i little tap on the bum or the arm and say "don't do that" is just better . its not even child abuse . abuse is when you're hitting them for no reason leaving marks and cuts

You can result to that if you don't know how to discipline a child but you shouldn't resort to that straight away. Giving them "a little tap on the bum" is in no way better? At first you might think it shows that you have the authority and it's showing the child that they have done something wrong but then they may think it's okay to hit other children in daycare, school etc. when they do something wrong or something your child doesn't agree with

Shar

31-12-2013, 07:10 PM

It's wrong but it happens, it shouldn't but it does

Lewis

31-12-2013, 07:14 PM

ya but i just think giving your child i little tap on the bum or the arm and say "don't do that" is just better . its not even child abuse . abuse is when you're hitting them for no reason leaving marks and cuts

You never said a tap, but it's wrong either way. And when we talk about a tap, surely that only applies for the likes of a two year old? Hitting your children is not needed and is the lazy way for parenting --- most of the time it doesn't always succeed too. I can understand back many years ago when it was seen as the correct and only way to discipline your child, but times have changed.

Everything dilusionate said above, too.

karter

31-12-2013, 07:19 PM

People who are supporting smacking have only two arguments for it

1. Children are annoying and they sometimes need a good lesson
2. I WAS SMACKED WHEN I MISBEHAVED AND LOOK AT ME NOW!!!!!

and obviously ignoring the fact that child psychologists (who obviously have vast knowledge on this topic) do not prefer this method

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 07:19 PM

You can result to that if you don't know how to discipline a child but you shouldn't resort to that straight away. Giving them "a little tap on the bum" is in no way better? At first you might think it shows that you have the authority and it's showing the child that they have done something wrong but then they may think it's okay to hit other children in daycare, school etc. when they do something wrong or something your child doesn't agree with

You never said a tap, but it's wrong either way. And when we talk about a tap, surely that only applies for the likes of a two year old? Hitting your children is not needed and is the lazy way for parenting --- most of the time it doesn't always succeed too. I can understand back many years ago when it was seen as the correct and only way to discipline your child, but times have changed.

Everything dilusionate said above, too.

but see everyone has different ways of disciplining their child . do whats yours
removing toys? you're just going make them sit there on the floor for 2 hours crying over and over

karter

31-12-2013, 07:22 PM

you're just going make them sit there on the floor for 2 hours crying over and over

wha......the same could happen if you smack them too?

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 07:24 PM

wha......the same could happen if you smack them too?

i said a tap . but you would obv teach your kid not to hit others.. ya you can remove toys but then all its going to cause is a fit.

Phil

31-12-2013, 07:29 PM

but see everyone has different ways of disciplining their child . do whats yours
removing toys? you're just going make them sit there on the floor for 2 hours crying over and over

Everyone has their own way yeah but no kid likes to be hit, no matter how hard. You say that they could cry for two hours for taking away a toy? Some time you could get so frustrated and hit them to hard and will be scarred for life. They're going to cry no matter how you discipline them, might as well do it the way you're not hitting them?

Lewis

31-12-2013, 07:29 PM

but see everyone has different ways of disciplining their child . do whats yours
removing toys? you're just going make them sit there on the floor for 2 hours crying over and over

And hitting them won't? Yeah, you're right, everyone has different ways of disciplining their child. Hitting should not be one of them. If it is, that parent clearly isn't a fit parent in today's time.

Phil

31-12-2013, 07:30 PM

i said a tap . but you would obv teach your kid not to hit others.. ya you can remove toys but then all its going to cause is a fit.

You'll try explain to a child that they're not allowed to hit others while you're hitting them...ok

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 07:34 PM

Everyone has their own way yeah but no kid likes to be hit, no matter how hard. You say that they could cry for two hours for taking away a toy? Some time you could get so frustrated and hit them to hard and will be scarred for life. They're going to cry no matter how you discipline them, might as well do it the way you're not hitting them?

And hitting them won't? Yeah, you're right, everyone has different ways of disciplining their child. Hitting should not be one of them. If it is, that parent clearly isn't a fit parent in today's time.

You'll try explain to a child that they're not allowed to hit others while you're hitting them...ok

im still waiting on you 2 to explain to me how you would do it ..
but like i said. the views are different look at this

• 94% of 3- and 4-year-olds have been spanked at least once during the past year, according to one study.

• 74% of mothers believe spanking is acceptable for kids ages 1 to 3, says another study.

• 61% of parents condone spanking as a "regular form of punishment" for young children, according to a different study.

Phil

31-12-2013, 07:40 PM

im still waiting on you 2 to explain to me how you would do it ..
but like i said. the views are different look at this

I'd use the time out and I have done for the past three years of working in childcare.

What's the source you quoted that from?

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 07:43 PM

I'd use the time out and I have done for the past three years of working in childcare.

What's the source you quoted that from?

http://www.parenting.com/article/is-it-okay-to-spank

ya but see in child care you're not allowed to hit some one else's kid that's Assault . but when its your own kid it's different

Lewis

31-12-2013, 07:43 PM

im still waiting on you 2 to explain to me how you would do it ..
but like i said. the views are different look at this

I'm sorry but what do percentages have ANYTHING to do with this? :P. This is about right and wrong - not the percentage of people that do the wrong.

Ages 6 or less:
Naughty corner. First time will be hard, they may continue for over an hour of tantrums and constantly running away. Just keep putting them back until they've served their 20 minutes, even if it takes three hours. Tell them nicely what they've done just once until they serve their time.

Ages 7-13:
Take away their consoles, stuff you've bought them. No tv, no contact with friends other than at school. Take it away until a sincere apology and for a set time alongside that. Even if it takes a month, they'll eventually regret it and be sincere with an apology.

Ages 14 plus:
Same as above, but be a lot more tough with them. No physical abuse though, nor physical threats. If they themselves become such troubling, you are allowed to contact the police to have a word with them.

Of course there's a lot more to it than that, but all children can be raised correctly without hitting. It's whether or not the parent has the patience for the beginning steps to it.

- - - Updated - - -

ya but see in child care you're not allowed to hit some one else's kid that's Assault . but when its your own kid it's different

Clearly his way works in childcare, ultimately meaning that violence to children is bad parenting and completely unnecessary?

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 07:47 PM

I'm sorry but what do percentages have ANYTHING to do with this? :P. This is about right and wrong - not the percentage of people that do the wrong.

Ages 6 or less:
Naughty corner. First time will be hard, they may continue for over an hour of tantrums and constantly running away. Just keep putting them back until they've served their 20 minutes, even if it takes three hours. Tell them nicely what they've done just once until they serve their time.

Ages 7-13:
Take away their consoles, stuff you've bought them. No tv, no contact with friends other than at school. Take it away until a sincere apology and for a set time alongside that. Even if it takes a month, they'll eventually regret it and be sincere with an apology.

Ages 14 plus:
Same as above, but be a lot more tough with them. No physical abuse though, nor physical threats. If they themselves become such troubling, you are allowed to contact the police to have a word with them.

Of course there's a lot more to it than that, but all children can be raised correctly without hitting. It's whether or not the parent has the patience for the beginning steps to it.

- - - Updated - - -

Clearly his way works in childcare, ultimately meaning that violence to children is bad parenting and completely unnecessary?

Take away their consoles, stuff you've bought them. No tv, no contact with friends other than at school. Take it away until a sincere apology and for a set time alongside that. Even if it takes a month, they'll eventually regret it and be sincere with an apology.
so what you're saying here is that as long as your kid says sorry they will get it back . that doesn't teach anything. you're going to take away a toy and your kid will just say sorry and you will give it back. and your kid will keep doing the same thing over and over.
And yes i have to admit you have some very good ideas there.

Phil

31-12-2013, 07:47 PM

ya but see in child care you're not allowed to hit some one else's kid that's Assault . but when its your own kid it's different

I haven't time to read that right now but I will tomorrow and talk about it then but I had a quick glimpse at the comments underneath and most disagreed with the article. Who cares if it's in a childcare setting? It still works? I'm not going to use time out technique in work and go home to my kids and beat them around the place because they're mine and I can do whatever

Lewis

31-12-2013, 07:48 PM

so what you're saying here is that as long as your kid says sorry they will get it back . that doesn't teach anything. you're going to take away a toy and your kid will just say sorry and you will give it back. and your kid will keep doing the same thing over and over.
And yes i have to admit you have some very good ideas there.

No I did not. I said as long as they're giving sincere apologies ALONGSIDE a time, perhaps a week slowly building up higher the more trouble they cause.

Phil

31-12-2013, 07:48 PM

so what you're saying here is that as long as your kid says sorry they will get it back . that doesn't teach anything. you're going to take away a toy and your kid will just say sorry and you will give it back. and your kid will keep doing the same thing over and over.
And yes i have to admit you have some very good ideas there.

That's why you put a time limit or a chore to it by saying "you will get this back in 3 days so long as are well behaved" or "You will get this once you've completed a chore when you are asked" or something.

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 07:53 PM

I haven't time to read that right now but I will tomorrow and talk about it then but I had a quick glimpse at the comments underneath and most disagreed with the article. Who cares if it's in a childcare setting? It still works? I'm not going to use time out technique in work and go home to my kids and beat them around the place because they're mine and I can do whatever

Beating is a whole different term here now. my friend use to get the belt when he was a kid. so compare the belt to a spank . you would pick the spank. for a time out chair i don't see how it works. i use to watch a lot of nanny911 (good show) and every time they put the kid on the time out chair they kid would get up and run. i'm not going to sit there with my child for 20 min while hes on time out. every kid is different . yes the time out chair may work . but other kids will think its a joke.

Phil

31-12-2013, 08:00 PM

Beating is a whole different term here now. my friend use to get the belt when he was a kid. so compare the belt to a spank . you would pick the spank. for a time out chair i don't see how it works. i use to watch a lot of nanny911 (good show) and every time they put the kid on the time out chair they kid would get up and run. i'm not going to sit there with my child for 20 min while hes on time out. every kid is different . yes the time out chair may work . but other kids will think its a joke.

Okay, for using time out, you have a chair/cool down area or whatever it may be, really doesn't matter as long as it has no toys.
If a child is misbehaving, you warn them by saying something like "If you do that/misbehave again, you will go into time out"
If they do it again, you put them there for one minute per years old. So a 6 year old child would get six minutes.

You take them over and you sit them down, explain what they have done and why it is wrong and walk away - no interaction when in the chair
If they get up before their six minutes is up, you take them back and say "You need to stay here until I tell you it is okay to join the group or I will have to bring you back" and they start the six minutes again.

You obviously have to be patient as this can literally take hours sometimes.

Eventually the child will just realise that the only way they'll be allowed back to the group is if they do the time allotted.
When they have finished, you go to them and say "You have been put in time out because you hit Johnny with a wrench and that it wrong, we can't hit people, if you're upset with someone, you tell us and we will deal with it" and ask the child to apologise to Johnny and give him a hug

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 08:07 PM

Okay, for using time out, you have a chair/cool down area or whatever it may be, really doesn't matter as long as it has no toys.
If a child is misbehaving, you warn them by saying something like "If you do that/misbehave again, you will go into time out"
If they do it again, you put them there for one minute per years old. So a 6 year old child would get six minutes.

You take them over and you sit them down, explain what they have done and why it is wrong and walk away - no interaction when in the chair
If they get up before their six minutes is up, you take them back and say "You need to stay here until I tell you it is okay to join the group or I will have to bring you back" and they start the six minutes again.

You obviously have to be patient as this can literally take hours sometimes.

Eventually the child will just realise that the only way they'll be allowed back to the group is if they do the time allotted.
When they have finished, you go to them and say "You have been put in time out because you hit Johnny with a wrench and that it wrong, we can't hit people, if you're upset with someone, you tell us and we will deal with it" and ask the child to apologise to Johnny and give him a hug

if 2 kids fight why would u make them hug that's just stupid . when 2 grown up fights you see the police making them hug out their differences.
but you see parents don't have " hours " to make sure their child in going to sit in the time out chair . parents have to cook dinner clean the house make sure they have everything ready for tomorrow make sure everyone is ready for bed. yes the time out chair does work sometimes but if your kid is just going to keep moving and its going to take you " hours" then you need a different solution

Phil

31-12-2013, 08:23 PM

if 2 kids fight why would u make them hug that's just stupid . when 2 grown up fights you see the police making them hug out their differences.
but you see parents don't have " hours " to make sure their child in going to sit in the time out chair . parents have to cook dinner clean the house make sure they have everything ready for tomorrow make sure everyone is ready for bed. yes the time out chair does work sometimes but if your kid is just going to keep moving and its going to take you " hours" then you need a different solution

Not sure if the bolded bit was actually serious or not?

UHMM yeah but if parents don't have hours (hours would be rare, only with extreme kids like the ones on nanny911 or w.e) that doesn't mean they should resort to hitting?

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 08:25 PM

Not sure if the bolded bit was actually serious or not?

UHMM yeah but if parents don't have hours (hours would be rare, only with extreme kids like the ones on nanny911 or w.e) that doesn't mean they should resort to hitting?

spanking.. hitting and beating and spanking are 3 different things . it wouldn't hurt the child

Phil

31-12-2013, 08:27 PM

spanking.. hitting and beating and spanking are 3 different things . it wouldn't hurt the child

Okay lets just assume when I say hitting I mean spanking because we don't really say spanking over here :P Yeah but whether you hurt the child or not, you're still teaching the child that it's okay to hit others when they have done wrong. Even if you're not hurting the child, if a child decides to copy your actions on another child, that child can be hurt. Children don't realise their own strength.

karter

31-12-2013, 08:29 PM

spanking.. hitting and beating and spanking are 3 different things . it wouldn't hurt the child

But you do realise that 'just spanking' could escalate to hitting and beating and serious abuse later on?

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 08:43 PM

Okay lets just assume when I say hitting I mean spanking because we don't really say spanking over here :P Yeah but whether you hurt the child or not, you're still teaching the child that it's okay to hit others when they have done wrong. Even if you're not hurting the child, if a child decides to copy your actions on another child, that child can be hurt. Children don't realise their own strength.
yes that's a chance that could happen . but you aren't hurting the child with a spank. ( which is less than a hit) you spank them on the bum.

But you do realise that 'just spanking' could escalate to hitting and beating and serious abuse later on?
but if your spanking your child and its turning to you beating the kid later on them you aren't a fit parent

karter

31-12-2013, 08:50 PM

yes that's a chance that could happen . but you aren't hurting the child with a spank. ( which is less than a hit) you spank them on the bum.

but if your spanking your child and its turning to you beating the kid later on them you aren't a fit parent

Yeah that's the point isn't it. Some people are not fit parents so encouraging things like spanking could trigger abuse

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 08:54 PM

Yeah that's the point isn't it. Some people are not fit parents so encouraging things like spanking could trigger abuse

i'm not encouraging it . ofc im not going to go out in a rage and abuse my child
i'm going to spank my child on the bum and say " you don't do that " like my mom did to me when i was a kid and it worked
and if people abusing their kid then that kid needs to be removed

Thomas.

31-12-2013, 09:09 PM

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 09:11 PM

This is alot better than smacking children.

but they wouldn't learn..

Lewis

31-12-2013, 10:28 PM

but they wouldn't learn..

I don't think one person has said as soon as the child says sorry they'll give it back. This is a rough idea how it'd work for a 7 year old+ for me:

The kid misbehaves. Depending on how serious, it may just be a verbal warning to begin with.
Next I take their thing away for a few days. After the few days are up, they don't get it back until I hear a sincere apology.
If it's committed again, the time it's taken away doubles or more. So, say 6 days. Then after it's up, they don't get it back until I hear a sincere apology.
The first time you might take one thing. The next time two things. The next take four things off them. And just let it build up until they have NOTHING and are forced
to wait the time and apologize.

Also, the same rules above apply with grounding them. (keeping them inside away from friends and so forth.)

Eventually that time will get up to over a month. They'll stop.

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 10:33 PM

I don't think one person has said as soon as the child says sorry they'll give it back. This is a rough idea how it'd work for a 7 year old+ for me:

The kid misbehaves. Depending on how serious, it may just be a verbal warning to begin with.
Next I take their thing away for a few days. After the few days are up, they don't get it back until I hear a sincere apology.
If it's committed again, the time it's taken away doubles or more. So, say 6 days. Then after it's up, they don't get it back until I hear a sincere apology.
The first time you might take one thing. The next time two things. The next take four things off them. And just let it build up until they have NOTHING and are forced
to wait the time and apologize.

Also, the same rules above apply with grounding them. (keeping them inside away from friends and so forth.)

Eventually that time will get up to over a month. They'll stop.

grounding. where they sit in their room. for about an hour where all the toys mostly are? . sorry i just think grounding are stupid . they never worked on me when i was little. but yes once you take everything from them. what do you expect your kid to do

Lewis

31-12-2013, 10:38 PM

grounding. where they sit in their room. for about an hour where all the toys mostly are? . sorry i just think grounding are stupid . they never worked on me when i was little. but yes once you take everything from them. what do you expect your kid to do

Clearly you have not read all my posts properly. What do I expect the kid to do? Apologize eventually - and be sincere about it, which they will!

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 10:40 PM

Clearly you have not read my post, re-read it and then come up with a better reply. :P

your grounding rule is just same thing as taking the toys away but adding on that they cant go out side . so you think the child will just sit in its room all day ?

Lewis

31-12-2013, 10:46 PM

your grounding rule is just same thing as taking the toys away but adding on that they cant go out side . so you think the child will just sit in its room all day ?

Yes. Not everything will be taken away, but the more they do, the more is taken away and the longer it is for. Eventually they'll get bored, come to understanding the wrong they did and realize the adult is in charge. They will apologize and mean the apology, no matter how long it takes.

And they don't have to stay in their room, as long as they aren't doing anything to entertain themselves within the house... With limits. Wouldn't matter if the child was playing with a deck of cards on their own.

If they try to get out of the house, I'd personally go after them. If they refuse to come back, it's just the longer the punishment will last --- and eventually, if extremely necessary, you can get the police to have a word with them and sort them out.

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 10:49 PM

Yes. Not everything will be taken away, but the more they do, the more is taken away and the longer it is for. Eventually they'll get bored, come to understanding the wrong they did and realize the adult is in charge. They will apologize and mean the apology, no matter how long it takes.

And they don't have to stay in their room, as long as they aren't doing anything to entertain themselves within the house... With limits. Wouldn't matter if the child was playing with a deck of cards on their own.

If they try to get out of the house, I'd personally go after them. If they refuse to come back, it's just the longer the punishment will last --- and eventually, if extremely necessary, you can get the police to have a word with them and sort them out.

tbh i am injoying this debate . i love debating and this really fun

OT.
Not everything will be taken away, but the more they do, the more is taken away and the longer it is for. Eventually they'll get bored,
That could take days. there would have to be a better solution than that . because i do now that parents buy their kid every single toy

- - - Updated - - -

know**

Lewis

31-12-2013, 10:52 PM

tbh i am injoying this debate . i love debating and this really fun

OT.
That could take days. there would have to be a better solution than that . because i do now that parents buy their kid every single toy

- - - Updated - - -

know**

Then make a few changes? Take away more toys than 1 doubling every time. Start of with 5. Whatever is best? :P

Also, let's remember this way is applying for the older kids mainly.

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 11:01 PM

Then make a few changes? Take away more toys than 1 doubling every time. Start of with 5. Whatever is best? :P

Also, let's remember this way is applying for the older kids mainly.

ok so how about the younger ones.
even by doubling it . you're going to have a mountain of toys. a solution for yours would to have a different room just for toys. and have a lock on the door

Lewis

31-12-2013, 11:12 PM

ok so how about the younger ones.
even by doubling it . you're going to have a mountain of toys. a solution for yours would to have a different room just for toys. and have a lock on the door

Clearly you need to read back to my previous posts about the younger ones, there stuff getting taken away and them being grounded isn't part of it. And a lock is not required anyway. It's called good parenting and patience -- just tell them you have to stay in the NAUGHTY spot and put them back. But do not repeat this, only say it once.

Every time they get up, the time resets on the naughty spot.

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 11:24 PM

Clearly you need to read back to my previous posts about the younger ones, there stuff getting taken away and them being grounded isn't part of it. And a lock is not required anyway. It's called good parenting and patience -- just tell them you have to stay in the NAUGHTY spot and put them back. But do not repeat this, only say it once.

Every time they get up, the time resets on the naughty spot.

You said taking stuff would be manly for the older kids. no parent will be willing to take toys day after day. i believe they would have better things to do

lucaskf390

31-12-2013, 11:28 PM

Education is necessary, no matter the ways, start slow and if the metod doesnt work use the force, some people are easy to educate other are harder to educate. I don't think someone can judge the education if they dont live with the family.

Lewis

31-12-2013, 11:39 PM

You said taking stuff would be manly for the older kids. no parent will be willing to take toys day after day. i believe they would have better things to do

I never knew older kids still played with dolls? Older kids are likely to have tvs, phones, game consoles, ipads, the likes of that. We're not in the 19th century!

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 11:42 PM

I never knew older kids still played with dolls? Older kids are likely to have tvs, phones, game consoles, ipads, the likes of that. We're not in the 19th century!

ya and what happen whens you take something from them. they end up throwing a fit and try to run away

Lewis

31-12-2013, 11:45 PM

ya and what happen whens you take something from them. they end up throwing a fit and try to run away

I'm not going to continue to repeat what I've said. Everything I've said in my previous posts cover it :P

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 11:46 PM

I'm not going to continue to repeat what I've said. Everything I've said in my previous posts cover it :P

all i'm saying is that taking stuff won't really help the problem

Lewis

31-12-2013, 11:51 PM

all i'm saying is that taking stuff won't really help the problem

And all I'm saying is, I've answered all your questions so read back. And it does work. BUT... It won't work if parents don't stick with it. But discipline is different for younger people as mentioned in several of my posts from before. But no matter how old the child is, violence is never the answer.

!x!dude!x!2

31-12-2013, 11:54 PM

And all I'm saying is, I've answered all your questions so read back. And it does work. BUT... It won't work if parents don't stick with it. But discipline is different for younger people as mentioned in several of my posts from before. But no matter how old the child is, violence is never the answer.

taken stuff you be easier with the bigger kids because if you hit the teens well they will fight back.
but like i've stated a million times . giving a little tap on the bum and saying don't do that and make them say they are sorry if not a bad thing. no where is it abuse. and it doesn' harm the child at all

Lewis

01-01-2014, 12:02 AM

taken stuff you be easier with the bigger kids because if you hit the teens well they will fight back.
but like i've stated a million times . giving a little tap on the bum and saying don't do that and make them say they are sorry if not a bad thing. no where is it abuse. and it doesn' harm the child at all

My opinion sticks. There's no need for it when it's quite easily done without using your hands (hard to begin with, of course... But it gets easy)

GommeInc

01-01-2014, 01:38 AM

I think it depends on the child and what you define as smacking. A hard tap so the child acknowledges you is useful for some children, or a light smack. Sometimes verbal discipline doesn't work while with others it does.

Also legislation wouldn't work. We have laws to protect adults, which is one argument, yet adults are still disciplined (for want of a better word) with smacks. The courts more often than not wouldn't care unless there is proven distress, and often the court will redefine what unlawful personal violence is and measure up whether or not the adult (or child) is actually distraught from it.

Also smacking is very different to the laws which cover adults (referring to the argument that we protect adults, why not children?). Mainly because smacking isn't really that much of a problem unless it becomes violent. There is a fine line between a smack and a forceful, physical abusive action, but it's definable.

If the time out chair didn't work it was used wrong
Agreed. You should hit the child with it :P

Lewis

01-01-2014, 02:47 AM

I think it depends on the child and what you define as smacking. A hard tap so the child acknowledges you is useful for some children, or a light smack. Sometimes verbal discipline doesn't work while with others it does.

Also legislation wouldn't work. We have laws to protect adults, which is one argument, yet adults are still disciplined (for want of a better word) with smacks. The courts more often than not wouldn't care unless there is proven distress, and often the court will redefine what unlawful personal violence is and measure up whether or not the adult (or child) is actually distraught from it.

Also smacking is very different to the laws which cover adults (referring to the argument that we protect adults, why not children?). Mainly because smacking isn't really that much of a problem unless it becomes violent. There is a fine line between a smack and a forceful, physical abusive action, but it's definable.

Agreed. You should hit the child with it :P

oh god, that made me laugh xD.

But seriously, hitting is just pointless and it doesn't always work. If anything, it makes your child scared of you and for some it does have long-lasting effects on them. Things can be solved without violence, as long as you're willing to have the patience.

Phil

01-01-2014, 02:02 PM

yes that's a chance that could happen . but you aren't hurting the child with a spank. ( which is less than a hit) you spank them on the bum.

but if your spanking your child and its turning to you beating the kid later on them you aren't a fit parent

If there's a chance that your child can learn bad things from it, why would you take that chance?

!x!dude!x!2

01-01-2014, 02:55 PM

If there's a chance that your child can learn bad things from it, why would you take that chance?

well . its a tap on the bum nothing harmful

Phil

01-01-2014, 02:59 PM

well . its a tap on the bum nothing harmful

iteydrtjikodrhgdfd

Are you reading my posts?!

You tap kid 1
Kid 1 thinks it's okay so hits another kid 2
Kids don't understand their own strength
Kid 2 gets hurt

despect

01-01-2014, 03:32 PM

I think personally i don't agree with parents smacking their children simply because most parents use it as a punishment if the child does something wrong however, its been proven that there are other methods to discipline children.

Kardan

01-01-2014, 04:18 PM

well . its a tap on the bum nothing harmful

Do you have any relevant experience in looking after children at all?

!x!dude!x!2

01-01-2014, 07:26 PM

iteydrtjikodrhgdfd

Are you reading my posts?!

You tap kid 1
Kid 1 thinks it's okay so hits another kid 2
Kids don't understand their own strength
Kid 2 gets hurt

Do you have any relevant experience in looking after children at all?

do you both even know what a tap is....
because everyone i know was tapped as kid when we were little

and ya i use to watch my baby cousin

Kardan

01-01-2014, 07:40 PM

do you both even know what a tap is....
because everyone i know was tapped as kid when we were little

and ya i use to watch my baby cousin

I would say a tap is simply making the lightest of contact with your hand with someone, so I wouldn't say people were 'tapped' as kids.

And I was just wondering because you're arguing with Dilusionate; and I'm sure (if I remember correctly) he is either studying or working in the field of childcare - so he certainly knows what he's on about.

!x!dude!x!2

01-01-2014, 07:42 PM

I would say a tap is simply making the lightest of contact with your hand with someone, so I wouldn't say people were 'tapped' as kids.

And I was just wondering because you're arguing with Dilusionate; and I'm sure (if I remember correctly) he is either studying or working in the field of childcare - so he certainly knows what he's on about.

but everyone is raised different. maybe where he is they do something different. and maybe in america they do something different there aswell. but i know in Canada we tapped the kid slightly on the bum

Phil

01-01-2014, 08:41 PM

do you both even know what a tap is....
because everyone i know was tapped as kid when we were little

and ya i use to watch my baby cousin

Yes but omg kids don't see it as a tap.

I swear if I say this once more Ill have to hellban myself to stop all the spamming. You tap child. Child taps other child. Because kids don't understand tap, they will hit.

but everyone is raised different. maybe where he is they do something different. and maybe in america they do something different there aswell. but i know in Canada we tapped the kid slightly on the bum

Where you live shouldn't determine how a child was raised

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!x!dude!x!2

01-01-2014, 08:43 PM

Yes but omg kids don't see it as a tap.

I swear if I say this once more Ill have to hellban myself to stop all the spamming. You tap child. Child taps other child. Because kids don't understand tap, they will hit.

Where you live shouldn't determine how a child was raised

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actually you wouldn't believe it but in every country people raise their kids differently

Phil

01-01-2014, 08:57 PM

actually you wouldn't believe it but in every country people raise their kids differently

Why wouldn't I believe it? Lol
Just because they are raised differently in every country doesn't mean they need to be

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!x!dude!x!2

01-01-2014, 08:58 PM

Why wouldn't I believe it? Lol
Just because they are raised differently in every country doesn't mean they need to be

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but everyone is different. i've talked to a lot of people last and they did say they would tap their kid if they something wrong . but most of all you people on the other side of the world say you wouldnt

Phil

01-01-2014, 09:04 PM

but everyone is different. i've talked to a lot of people last and they did say they would tap their kid if they something wrong . but most of all you people on the other side of the world say you wouldnt

I know but I'm arguing that its unnecessary

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GommeInc

02-01-2014, 12:06 AM

Yes but omg kids don't see it as a tap.
I don't remember full on punching someone when I was child because I was tapped :/ What do you call a reasonably hard but not painful tap with just the fingers and no thumb (like a smack but more a fud)? Are we not raising parents who are just going to be afraid to touch their children? There's quite a few debates on this recently that it seems the new generations of children are being brought into a bubble wrapped lifestyle where's they're so mentally insecure and unstable, regardless of whether or not they were "abused" as children. Also isn't it strange to believe children turn to violence because of their parents? What if a child just punches someone because they're a brat?

I'm fascinated and you study it so it's all the more useful to ask these questions.

Phil

02-01-2014, 12:23 AM

I don't remember full on punching someone when I was child because I was tapped :/ What do you call a reasonably hard but not painful tap with just the fingers and no thumb (like a smack but more a fud)? Are we not raising parents who are just going to be afraid to touch their children? There's quite a few debates on this recently that it seems the new generations of children are being brought into a bubble wrapped lifestyle where's they're so mentally insecure and unstable, regardless of whether or not they were "abused" as children. Also isn't it strange to believe children turn to violence because of their parents? What if a child just punches someone because they're a brat?

I'm fascinated and you study it so it's all the more useful to ask these questions.

Yeah but what parent taps their child, I tap someone if I want their attention in the club. I wouldn't call the four finger thing a tap but I wouldn't call it a slap either. This bit:

Are we not raising parents who are just going to be afraid to touch their children?

How? I don't really understand what you're getting at or asking here apologies :P

I disagree with new generations of children being bubblewrapped, I actually think they are far less bubblewrapped than recent generations (maybe it's just in my area). I think children are growing up far faster. You'd see 7 year olds walking on the street like they run the place! You also see a lot of young kids getting things like iPads for Christmas and birthday so this is exposing them to so much more than recent generations at a younger age.

Can you understand how if a child gets smacked that they may think it's okay to smack others? Well, and I've seen it happen, when a child hits another child and then the parent punishes them for doing it by smacking them, you can see how this could confuse the child.

What if a child just punches someone because they're a brat?

what about it? :P

GommeInc

02-01-2014, 12:41 AM

Yeah but what parent taps their child, I tap someone if I want their attention in the club. I wouldn't call the four finger thing a tap but I wouldn't call it a slap either.
How else will you get their attention? Shouting at them seems scarier and surely scaring a child is generally considered a bad thing, because they will fear people? The alternatives to smacking seem to not be wanted either, from my understanding.

How? I don't really understand what you're getting at or asking here apologies :P
For instance, if a fight occurs - how do you remove the child? Man handling them is obviously a no-no, as you may injure the child in the process.

I disagree with new generations of children being bubblewrapped, I actually think they are far less bubblewrapped than recent generations (maybe it's just in my area). I think children are growing up far faster. You'd see 7 year olds walking on the street like they run the place! You also see a lot of young kids getting things like iPads for Christmas and birthday so this is exposing them to so much more than recent generations at a younger age.
That doesn't mean they're not bubble wrapped - that just means they're free to do what they want while wearing bubble wrap, if that makes sense? :P Like wrapping up a bird in bubble wrap and letting it fly free - it won't feel bumps and it is made to not feel the toils of every day life as an adult. Disappointment and even fear is a part of growing up, after all.

Can you understand how if a child gets smacked that they may think it's okay to smack others? Well, and I've seen it happen, when a child hits another child and then the parent punishes them for doing it by smacking them, you can see how this could confuse the child.
Isn't this just bad upbringing? If a child hits another child it isn't the only reason that they were smacked - they could just be brats like I said :P I'd say a tap of acknowledgement (not a smack) like you would an adult should go hand in hand with being sat down and taught right from wrong, by going down to their level and explaining why they're being an arse. A naughty chair is a silly idea as children do not reflect on what they do, they just get bored (from my experience at least). They need to be explained thing, which is probably where certain expressions such as "what, do you need to be explained everything like a child" come from :P

Eric

02-01-2014, 07:18 AM

Everyone's experience is different. I was canned at home for misbehaviour and by my teachers at school for the most trivial reasons and i turned out to be fine, but really it's different for everyone else. Still, i wouldn't encourage spanking, surely there are other forms of discipline that could be used instead. Well, it could be used as a last resort but still it could trigger abuse when it is no longer a punishment and transcends into some sort of rage. Same goes to the other forms of discipline, like time-out could be used abusively as well?? Spanking doesn't always guarantee the children won't have any behaviour problems in the future. Anyway, it's still considered an abuse and shouldn't be done by an angry and unfit parent

Zak

03-01-2014, 08:57 AM

I'll be smacking my kids regardless. I smack the dogs when they're naughty.. I hit the cows with a stick when they don't move.. I got smacked as a kid.. Almost everyone I know was and they all turned out fine. Even the dogs are well disciplined.. the cows probably don't even feel it.

A bit of discipline does a kid good. Again, leaving a mark (bruise) is too far but everyone has their own opinion on it. We are far too lenient as a country..

Wengles

03-01-2014, 12:47 PM

I was pretty cut and dry on this until I heard the argument 'well you wouldn't be allowed to physically assault an adult so why should you be able to do it to a child?' fair. I don't have an answer to that or at least the only logical standpoint I can take is 'well you shouldn't.'

Phil

03-01-2014, 04:49 PM

How else will you get their attention? Shouting at them seems scarier and surely scaring a child is generally considered a bad thing, because they will fear people? The alternatives to smacking seem to not be wanted either, from my understanding.

Saying their name? :P

For instance, if a fight occurs - how do you remove the child? Man handling them is obviously a no-no, as you may injure the child in the process.

A child would normally stop fighting when they realise they have been caught by an adult and they know they have done wrong and then you just remove them from the situation, ask both kids what's going on and deal with it appropriately. Maybe in a rare case you may have to physically remove a child from a situation but most Childcare Practitioners would also be qualified in Manual Handling so they know how to do this in a safe manner.

In the past three years working in childcare, I've never had to physically remove a child from a situation

That doesn't mean they're not bubble wrapped - that just means they're free to do what they want while wearing bubble wrap, if that makes sense? :P Like wrapping up a bird in bubble wrap and letting it fly free - it won't feel bumps and it is made to not feel the toils of every day life as an adult. Disappointment and even fear is a part of growing up, after all.

Okay yeah fair point and now that I've read what you've said I agree with you that children are bubble wrapped and this actually really annoys me :P

Isn't this just bad upbringing? If a child hits another child it isn't the only reason that they were smacked - they could just be brats like I said :P I'd say a tap of acknowledgement (not a smack) like you would an adult should go hand in hand with being sat down and taught right from wrong, by going down to their level and explaining why they're being an arse. A naughty chair is a silly idea as children do not reflect on what they do, they just get bored (from my experience at least). They need to be explained thing, which is probably where certain expressions such as "what, do you need to be explained everything like a child" come from :P

Oh yeah exactly, I'm not saying that if a child hits another child it means they are being hit at home. Sure if that were the case every single child would be in care :P Some are just brats, I've come across enough of them to know that lol. The naughty chair isn't a silly idea and they are reflecting on what they have done because when you put them on and take them off you should be explaining why they are there and how what they have done is wrong, you really have to outline why they're being punished.

Sorry for the slow reply, I've been away :P

Charz777

04-01-2014, 01:54 PM

I think there is a clear difference between kids today and kids of my generation; (say 20-25 year olds).

Parents these days are afraid to punish their kids and look at the results. Sorry to generalise here, but I see way more bratty kids these days than I did 5, 10 years ago. People will disagree I'm sure when I say that discipline is about showing respect to your parents and elders. But I was smacked if I ever stepped out of line and I respect my parents and I respected teachers at school, I respect my fellows at university and people I was at work with. I've never committed a crime, I've never smoked or taken drugs. I've never even had enough alcohol in my system to be considered tipsy. I'd like to think that this is because I was brought up properly.

Don't get me wrong, I don't condone violence in any way. Another thing I've never done is been in a physical fight. But there is a big difference between tapping a child and full on abuse. I don't think I'd be able to smack my own children, I just don't have it in me, but I don't think there is anything wrong with parents using a gentle tap.

Oh, and I saw some woman talking complete rubbish on This Morning the other day about how tests show that children who were smacked have a lower IQ. I was smacked and I'm doing a Maths degree, so I wouldn't exactly call myself stupid, alright I know many people more intelligent than me, but I wouldn't say I have a low IQ.

Cassiieee

14-01-2014, 12:58 AM

I would never smack my child if I had one. I would find some other way to descipline them. Like take their favourite toy away, or no sweets, ect. Never find smacking your child is the only option.

Liva

15-01-2014, 01:01 AM

Some kids need to understand consequence. Yelling or talking to them isn't a big enough statement, and I guess pain is enforced to stop them from doing it again? It shouldn't be dealt to older kids though, that's when I think it becomes abuse because they should know better by that point.

Phil

15-01-2014, 09:17 PM

!x!dude!x!2

15-01-2014, 09:22 PM

Liva

15-01-2014, 10:36 PM

so you would abuse your child ???
No idea where this came from, and I don't think I would actually do the whole smacking thing when I do have children. I said I only think it would really count as abuse when the child is older, and it should stop before then.

Hold on what?! Pain?! Why would you want to hurt the child?!
That's essentially what smacking is, no? [strike (someone or something), typically with the palm of the hand and as a punishment.]
It leaves a (slightly painful) tingle on the skin which, I guess, makes them think twice before doing it again. My parents did it with me and I don't resent them or blame the way I am personally on it, if anything it made me definitely learn not to do it again! :P
(Just as long as it doesn't last longer than a minute or two, pain wise, or any bruises/long-term effect.)

MKR&*42

15-01-2014, 10:42 PM

I am 100% against it lmao. How on Earth are we meant to teach children violence is not the answer (minus self defence, but that's a different matter) if we allow them to be smacked themselves? There are many different ways and as an odd example using the show Supernanny or w.e with Jo Frost, she didn't used to smack kids to teach them a lesson - at most she would pick them up and carry them which is not smacking.

It's never ever ever ever the answer and I know a **** tonne of people (myself included) who have suffered horrifically emotionally because of the amount of times our parents have smacked us (and done A LOT worse...) as a child when they simply didn't need to.

Phil

15-01-2014, 11:31 PM

No idea where this came from, and I don't think I would actually do the whole smacking thing when I do have children. I said I only think it would really count as abuse when the child is older, and it should stop before then.

That's essentially what smacking is, no? [strike (someone or something), typically with the palm of the hand and as a punishment.]
It leaves a (slightly painful) tingle on the skin which, I guess, makes them think twice before doing it again. My parents did it with me and I don't resent them or blame the way I am personally on it, if anything it made me definitely learn not to do it again! :P
(Just as long as it doesn't last longer than a minute or two, pain wise, or any bruises/long-term effect.)

No, you don't hit a child to hurt them, that's abuse and it's quite frankly terrifying. If you're going to discipline a child in that sense (which for the record I disagree with), you don't hit to hurt them, just to show authority.

I am 100% against it lmao. How on Earth are we meant to teach children violence is not the answer (minus self defence, but that's a different matter) if we allow them to be smacked themselves? There are many different ways and as an odd example using the show Supernanny or w.e with Jo Frost, she didn't used to smack kids to teach them a lesson - at most she would pick them up and carry them which is not smacking.

Thank you so much for saying this I swear Nick could not understand this no matter how many times I said it and probably thought I was insane!

karter

22-02-2014, 03:37 AM

https://24.media.tumblr.com/3d189366a4109cb002c2a7d4d0724405/tumblr_n1c8bfAuD11qc8jh0o6_250.gifhttps://31.media.tumblr.com/08acbdeb4806086de27e3842699db690/tumblr_n1c8bfAuD11qc8jh0o10_250.gif
https://24.media.tumblr.com/0603b6f670cf9f3cc0779e8c80f836ba/tumblr_n1c8bfAuD11qc8jh0o7_250.gifhttps://24.media.tumblr.com/f11a35b7bfb12446bbc308505ecf453b/tumblr_n1c8bfAuD11qc8jh0o8_250.gif

StevenWinehouse

09-03-2014, 05:15 AM

I'm going to be one of those "I was spanked as a child & look how I turned out" kind of people.

I was a very unruly child when I was growing up. I would not listen to my parents, at all. When I got in trouble they tried grounding me, they tried taking my toys, and they even tried the time out chair. None of that worked, I laughed at most of it, and most definitely I stole all my toys back from my parents. The last thing they could result to was physically punishing me, as in spanking. Yea, sometimes it hurt, but I knew that I deserved it and knew exactly why I was receiving it. What else were my parents suppose to do? Talk to me? I'd laugh in there face or just walk off. My parents always used physical discipline as a last resort though, not as a first one.

There is also a line between abuse & physical discipline. I was also abused as a child, so I do know the difference(My father verbally, mentally, and physically abused me). A spanking should never ever leave a bruise, if you make it leave one then that is clearly abuse and you're just being a **** to your child and aren't fit to raise one.

I don't see where y'all are getting at that spanking your children causes them to be violent? I've lived in two different environments, one where spanking was the norm and one where spanking was taboo.
The environment where spanking was the norm, every kid seemed well behaved, there didn't seem to be any fights between any of the kids.
Now to the environment where spanking was taboo, that environment surprisingly had the most violent kids that I've ever seen. Kids were joining gangs, when fights broke out they would smash other kids' heads into lockers. I even remember one instance at my middle school there was a fight where someone got stabbed in the back of the neck with a pen.
However, even though spanking is used in the well behaved environment, and not int he other, doesn't mean that it's the reason why the two environments are the way they are. Sure it plays a part, but it's also the way the culture is in the environments and the household, which also plays a huge factor.

I'm sure there are better ways to discipline children, but sometimes parents have to result to punishing their children like that. Trust me they don't find joy in it (unless they're abusive ***** like my father)

Also, each child reacts to things differently and different things work on one child that wouldn't work on another. One child might respond well to a time out and thats all you would need to do. While another child doesn't respond well to a time out, and you'd have to try different methods.

As stated above, I was spanked as a child. However, being spanked as a child hasn't made me anxious or afraid of other people. It also didn't make me afraid of my parents.