Sulake Cracks Down on Black Market Trading

[HOSKO02]

Here's some files that have been making the rounds on the emails, I've redacted any identifiable information to try keep it within forum guidelines:

Page 1:

http://tashload.com/Uploader/uploads//LLOJjyL.png

Page 2:

http://tashload.com/Uploader/uploads//VcJh8Df.png

Exhibit A:

http://tashload.com/Uploader/uploads//1aEoP3p.png



Interesting to see the approach Sulake takes to this kind of trading outside of Habbo officially, thoughts?

Props to TashLoad (http://tashload.com/)for image hosting (owned by a forum member).

[GrandpaJoe63]

If people bought the creds from Habbo, they should be able to spend it in whatever way they want or trade them for whatever, be it real money. Checked the site shown here, Habbo's still there.

[Aiden]

is that PA or something? I think that's what it's called
or is it the forum one?
idek lol

but yeah I see where they're coming from but like grandpajoe said, they was brought by someone in the first place

[rnix]

is that PA or something? I think that's what it's called
or is it the forum one?
idek lol

but yeah I see where they're coming from but like grandpajoe said, they was brought by someone in the first place

*REMOVED*

I really don't see the big deal. Sulake is just p'eed off cause they arnt getting credits bought directly from them. But black market trades will always be around no matter how hard they try to stop it.

Edited by Nick (Forum Super Moderator): Please don't name black market sites.

[Michael]

I hope the same effect is still going into closing down retros, if they got those players back they'd have more players to buy credits legitimately.

[Kardan]

The big deal is, why would people buy credits from Habbo when they can get it cheaper else where?

[FlyingJesus]

Legally all credits and items bought are actually still the property of Sulake so this kind of trading isn't just akin to cheating on a game by buying tools and extras, it's a criminal offence

[Tyrell]

Maybe Habbo should offer more incentive to buy credits directly. When was the last time they had a double-credit weekend or whatever it was? Pretty sure I spent loads then...

[Shorty]

DMCA's are only effective when the hosting company and/or the website owner actually takes action/notice towards them. As for this DMCA, it is quite surprising that they've taken this approach to 3rd parties selling coins, but at least they're finally doing something about it.

[GoldenMerc]

Good luck :P

[Daltron]

It's a good move in the right direction to directly remove the sales form the most popular websites giving users no other options but to buy via Habbo. And lol at people saying this isn't a big deal

[lucaskf390]

Their game, their rules, If they created something they have to right to manage how things move, I don't think Habbo Black Market will end, they ll just take off sellers/buyers from their comfortable positions. Interesting.

[Kyle]

this is a site specifically designed for blackmarket trading across multiple gaming platforms. do sulake really think that a dmca is going to prevent them from doing the illegal business they have been conducting for so many years now??? noobs

[Brad]

this is a site specifically designed for blackmarket trading across multiple gaming platforms. do sulake really think that a dmca is going to prevent them from doing the illegal business they have been conducting for so many years now??? noobs

I kind of agree. Let's be honest.. If they are just implementing this now, how much farther are those who are using the blackmarket to sell coins? Let's be real. Sulake has to pull up it's socks to catch up to those who are doing it still.

Even if they do, someone- somewhere will find out a way to bypass it. haha!

[Zak]

The big deal is, why would people buy credits from Habbo when they can get it cheaper else where?

Until bans start for the buyers I'm going to agree.

[Daltron]

Could Sulake take a more proactive approach by listing cheap credits themselves on PA and then banning all who attempt to buy and refunding whatever money they get in the process?

- - - Updated - - -

Or buying credits themselves and banning all accounts in which credits are passed through?

[GrandpaJoe63]

Could Sulake take a more proactive approach by listing cheap credits themselves on PA and then banning all who attempt to buy and refunding whatever money they get in the process?

- - - Updated - - -

Or buying credits themselves and banning all accounts in which credits are passed through?

I'm going to guess and say that Sulake would have to accept the terms of use of PA, I'm not sure what's in there but I'd assume there'd be something there that would be against Sulake if they decide to take that path.

[MKR&*42]

I'm going to guess and say that Sulake would have to accept the terms of use of PA, I'm not sure what's in there but I'd assume there'd be something there that would be against Sulake if they decide to take that path.

I'm actually sure I asked @GommeInc (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=2339); about something very similar to this - along the lines of "If Sulake agree to the terms of use on a retro site, in which the terms of use state "you must not be a member of the Sulake Oy corporation", can Sulake themselves be held accountable for anything?". I'm sure he said Sulake wouldn't get in trouble, but yeah.
--
Unless you meant something else, oops? :P

[Kardan]

Could Sulake take a more proactive approach by listing cheap credits themselves on PA and then banning all who attempt to buy and refunding whatever money they get in the process?

- - - Updated - - -

Or buying credits themselves and banning all accounts in which credits are passed through?

If Sulake sell credits for cheap, the black market will simply sell them for cheaper.

[Bitty]

Sulake people don't make sense, when you buy something you OWN it so IDFK how it's under "copyright"
It's not like black market are making gbs then selling them..
They do have the right to close down retros but closing black markets is just sulake wanting ripoff people

[Daltron]

If Sulake sell credits for cheap, the black market will simply sell them for cheaper.

I meant as a remedy to quickly catch out main offenders buying and selling credits and continuously ban/remove their accounts and supply.

[Bitty]

Ok let's put it this way, if you buy a new phone lets say an iphone
Does Apple send you a letter telling you that you can't sell it to your friend?!
When you buy gbs you own them!

[MKR&*42]

No you do not. Sulake's terms of service specifically state:


Accordingly, you have no other interest, including no property, proprietary, intellectual property, ownership, or monetary interest, in your Virtual Currency and Virtual Goods, which remain our Content and property. We reserve the absolute right, at any time and in our sole discretion, to manage, regulate, control, modify or eliminate Virtual Currency and/or Virtual Goods.


And


Sulake has the absolute right to manage, regulate, control, modify, and/or eliminate Virtual Currency and/or Virtual Goods as it sees fit in its sole discretion

[Kardan]

Ok let's put it this way, if you buy a new phone lets say an iphone
Does Apple send you a letter telling you that you can't sell it to your friend?!
When you buy gbs you own them!

Your iphone isn't a virtual good.

[Bitty]

So basically your giving away your money to sulake to do what ever they want when you buy a "virtual good"
That's dumb..

[sex]

So basically your giving away your money to sulake to do what ever they want when you buy a "virtual good"
That's dumb..

IF ITS DUMB DONT DO IT..

[jorsian]

It will happen no matter what. The emails are probably an intimidation tactic that won't be followed through with. Even if the sites are closed people will get craftier and find alternative ways to sell under the table.

[GommeInc]

I'm actually sure I asked @GommeInc (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=2339); about something very similar to this - along the lines of "If Sulake agree to the terms of use on a retro site, in which the terms of use state "you must not be a member of the Sulake Oy corporation", can Sulake themselves be held accountable for anything?". I'm sure he said Sulake wouldn't get in trouble, but yeah.
--
Unless you meant something else, oops? :P
I don't remember that discussion :P

Technically Sulake can't get in trouble as they own that property anyway. Retros are essentially property of Sulake, so them signing up to a retro means absolutely nothing seeing as retros violate so many laws anyway - one area of which is intellectual property law. If they puts terms and conditions on their site saying "you must not be a Sulake member", then who is going to bring Sulake to court for violating something that is illegal in the first place? For using their own property which has been stolen? No one.

The court may make the odd comment that if Sulake can't control their own property or if their customers find their practices absurd then it is Sulake's fault for being a poorly managed and maintained organisation, possibly citing how it's a hive for paedophiles, but they will leave Sulake to go about their business unless they actually start to violate laws (e.g. paedophilia or not acting to protecting the rights of children).

Anyway:

If Sulake really want to remove the black market, they should just incorporate it into their services. Asking people to pay money for something worthless is stupid. It's like having a currency to buy currency. It never made sense when they started attacking rare dealers by making a separate service. If anything they shot themselves in the foot. I'm still waiting for Sulake to just give up - they're only going to become worse.

[HOSKO02]

It will happen no matter what. The emails are probably an intimidation tactic that won't be followed through with. Even if the sites are closed people will get craftier and find alternative ways to sell under the table.

You're right, I'm gonna be careful here as I'm still not sure what is/isn't forum rules regarding this.

A site that rhymed with HobbaTarget was popular in the past as I'm sure many members here know, it's since re-branded itself to something rhyming with MutualBabes - and it's expanding into other online virtual markets like the website at the receiving end end of this letter is known for. This only shows the scope for these markets is growing, not declining, Sulake will forever be fighting an uphill battle against this.

I say the only way to get around it is to make credits cheaper officially, at least it will rake some of that market back.

[KJK]

I will quit habbo if I can no longer buy coins from here.

[GoldenMerc]

You're right, I'm gonna be careful here as I'm still not sure what is/isn't forum rules regarding this.

A site that rhymed with HobbaTarget was popular in the past as I'm sure many members here know, it's since re-branded itself to something rhyming with MutualBabes - and it's expanding into other online virtual markets like the website at the receiving end end of this letter is known for. This only shows the scope for these markets is growing, not declining, Sulake will forever be fighting an uphill battle against this.

I say the only way to get around it is to make credits cheaper officially, at least it will rake some of that market back.

Think I know which site your on about, like the rhymes was sat there thinking hmm...

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

[RyRy]

Only way I can see Sulake effectively catching many people is secretly recording browsing data, which only alerts Sulake to an issue when it goes to a blackmarket trading site. That kind of list could be updated daily, and they know about the main offenders so they could be caught pretty quickly.

The problem is the user would have to be on the site whilst the client is open for that to happen... Which I think is most of the time for most people. It's what Valve did with Steam I believe, and they got some flak for it but told them that the data wasn't being used in a malicious way. Of course the way Sulake gets round this issue is if you're opening the client, you're allowing them to view your history as well. They'd have to make that clear in a T&C change, but that would catch a good majority out in my belief.

And the other way they could do it, is giving the users the ability to do this on Habbo legally but with a taxation fee. That's similar to what EA do when you buy a player with coins you earn in-game, but you can't pay for said coins without using the black market.