English-only votes for English-only laws

[-:Undertaker:-]

http://order-order.com/2014/09/19/denham-sticks-boot-into-miliband-over-devolution-fudge/


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/55/Union_Flag_and_St_Georges_Cross.jpg



Miliband mentioned the word “change” over a dozen times in his referendum result response this morning, but said nothing about English votes for English laws. Writing on his personal blog today, Labour MP John Denham has some strong words for the Labour leader:


“English Labour needs its own voice in this process, unrestrained by Labour from other parts of the union. I’d argue that devolution with England has been held back by a UK Labour Party not convinced that England needs change as much as Wales and Scotland. Now we need a voice of our own… As the powers of the Scottish Parliament increase, the role of Scottish MPs in determining English laws will inevitably diminish. If the aim is to ensure that laws affecting England alone have the consent of elected English representatives, there are many ways of doing so.”

Delicious irony if Gordon Brown’s last ditch attempt to save the union means Labour MPs in Scottish constituencies will no longer be able to vote on English laws…

So the choices essentially are....

- Restrict the voting of Scottish MPs on English-only legislation in Westminister (so English-only sessions).
- A English parliament (little demand for more politicians).
- Regional assemblies (although rejected by voters in the north-east by a huge majority 10 years ago).

I back the first option. I neither want England carved up into small Euro-regions or a mickey mouse English parliament.

What do you think? And if option 1 goes ahead, should Labour MPs from Scotland be barred from English-only laws?

[scottish]

I want further devolution for all.

So every country having their own parliament with more powers and more responsibilities.

Federal UK!

[-:Undertaker:-]

I want further devolution for all.

So every country having their own parliament with more powers and more responsibilities.

Federal UK!

I have no desire as an Englishman for a mickey mouse English parliament.

Simply removing Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish MPs from England-only votes seems to me to be the classic British solution to a constitutional problem. We've never ever done huge conventions and all that malarky, just patched up whatever the problem is. :P

Apparently Tory MPs are now threatening to veto more devolution for Scotland unless Scottish MPs are barred from England votes. Good.

[scottish]

Of course that will happen, if we get further devolution why should Scotland MPs have any say in English Parliament if English have no say about Scotland.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Of course that will happen, if we get further devolution why should Scotland MPs have any say in English Parliament if English have no say about Scotland.

It hasn't happened so far.

The problem is, it causes a constitutional crisis in that you can have a government elected in Westminister that can't get through most of it's domestic policies. Imagine a Labour Ministry with a majority in the HoC of 20 seats, 50 of which are Scottish seats.

[scottish]

It hasn't happened so far.

The problem is, it causes a constitutional crisis in that you can have a government elected in Westminister that can't get through most of it's domestic policies. Imagine a Labour Ministry with a majority in the HoC of 20 seats, 50 of which are Scottish seats.

Neither has further devolution though.

True but there's no other alternative really, Scotland voted no on the promise of further devolution, and **** would hit the fan if it was just 'you're not getting it'

[-:Undertaker:-]

Neither has further devolution though.

For the last ten years, England hasn't been able to vote on Scottish, Welsh or Northern Irish matters in the likes of education but all of those have been able to vote in the House of Commons on England-only issues. The current settlement has been unfair on England for a long time.


True but there's no other alternative really, Scotland voted no on the promise of further devolution, and **** would hit the fan if it was just 'you're not getting it'

Well to be fair, those promises made by the three main Westminister parties have no worth: Scotland voted on the question of independence yes/no, not devomax. So far, nobody has given consent to these supposed changes to the British constitution so it was wrong of Gordon Brown to promise them and it appears as though backbench Tories will block unless the English issue is settled, including the scrapping of the Barnett Formula (subsidies) to Scotland.

Farage seems to agree with you anyway on federalism.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHzAHFmmfog

[Kardan]

I agree with English-only votes for English laws, as long as the same is applied for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

[GommeInc]

I want further devolution for all.

So every country having their own parliament with more powers and more responsibilities.

Federal UK!
I quite like this idea. Have one central Government for matters concerning the whole of the UK, then union member governments for matters concerning the individual countries (Regional Parliaments etc).

So for the UK matters concerning military and international affairs. For regional areas education, NHS and local Government affairs. The best people to Govern local matters are politicians who are actually from the area using funds that are extracted from that area, not a small crowd of misinformed politicians miles away who are out of touch with really serious matters, which is why Scotland had the vote. It's what England and Scotland have wanted for ages, as Westminster seems to only serve itself and those in power, or at least that's how many voters see it.

[-:Undertaker:-]

I quite like this idea. Have one central Government for matters concerning the whole of the UK, then union member governments for matters concerning the individual countries (Regional Parliaments etc).

So for the UK matters concerning military and international affairs. For regional areas education, NHS and local Government affairs. The best people to Govern local matters are politicians who are actually from the area using funds that are extracted from that area, not a small crowd of misinformed politicians miles away who are out of touch with really serious matters, which is why Scotland had the vote. It's what England and Scotland have wanted for ages, as Westminster seems to only serve itself and those in power, or at least that's how many voters see it.

I often find that the performance of regional or local politicians puts national politicians to shame. And that's saying something.

[GommeInc]

I often find that the performance of regional or local politicians puts national politicians to shame. And that's saying something.
I do too. They seem more approachable and talk as if they know what is at fault and have a genuine interest in the people that voted them in. What's interesting is that from what was reported by people in Scotland, Salmond was very approachable while other party leaders - Cameron, Miliband and Clegg - were cold and uninterested in speaking to people.

[-:Undertaker:-]

I do too. They seem more approachable and talk as if they know what is at fault and have a genuine interest in the people that voted them in. What's interesting is that from what was reported by people in Scotland, Salmond was very approachable while other party leaders - Cameron, Miliband and Clegg - were cold and uninterested in speaking to people.

Oh no, see I meant the other way around. That as poor as national figures are, regional/local are even worse for wasteful spending etc. :P

[GommeInc]

Oh no, see I meant the other way around. That as poor as national figures are, regional/local are even worse for wasteful spending etc. :P
Oh yeah, they're terrible at spending. It's why you have a central government to kick them in the right direction. Essex is notorious for spending.