Morals and Values

[AgnesIO]

Morals and values are a huge part of any culture, however it is commonly argued that they are in decline.

Personally, I believe the majority of Western children are now given a 'too easy' childhood, where they are not taught about key family values, ideas and lessons. It is a topic that I am very interested in, and - in particular - comparing two countries together.

For me, being taught strong morals and values is hugely important, particularly when trying to create a strong society, alongside a community. Children are not generally expected to respect their teachers, or care for the world they live in. Young girls wear clothing that looks ridiculously revealing on a young adult, never mind a 12 year old girl. I also believe children should be expected to do more work (around the home, and at school).

Do you think morals and values are in decline? Does this matter? Do children grow up too easily now? Are morals and values from previous generations simply outdated?

I recognise that my views are evidently conservative and may not be the views of everyone (or even most on here...).

[jojohnny]

I see your point, but i see it in another perspective.
I think morals and values are not that important because sometimes i would prefer that people learn to think for their own, because there will always be some kind of rowdys and i'm tired of seeing people, that are kind to them just because of moral, because then the kind people are mostly the guys that finish last.
But i'm still on your side, because people first need to learn respect and value. They have to think of things like that before they act.

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[Cabl]

Morals and values are a huge part of any culture, however it is commonly argued that they are in decline.

Personally, I believe the majority of Western children are now given a 'too easy' childhood, where they are not taught about key family values, ideas and lessons. It is a topic that I am very interested in, and - in particular - comparing two countries together.

For me, being taught strong morals and values is hugely important, particularly when trying to create a strong society, alongside a community. Children are not generally expected to respect their teachers, or care for the world they live in. Young girls wear clothing that looks ridiculously revealing on a young adult, never mind a 12 year old girl. I also believe children should be expected to do more work (around the home, and at school).

Do you think morals and values are in decline? Does this matter? Do children grow up too easily now? Are morals and values from previous generations simply outdated?

I recognise that my views are evidently conservative and may not be the views of everyone (or even most on here...).

Moral makes values and values make moral. In my point of view. People have something called humanity. Yes kids grow up faster now. Learn faster about life. But people never stop learning even at elder ages. This generation I agree is having problems especially with Teen pregnancy and drug use. There freedom for expression. Please can talk and wear and be who ever there heart desires. As long as they have moral and respect and culture. And if a child is grown without moral or values. We shall see how they are. But a child is a reflection of their parents some of course. But that's just my point of you. Society can be horrible.

[-:Undertaker:-]

People are told nowadays to do whatever feels good not what is right.

That's why you have fatherless families where the father doesn't see himself as a man with responsibilities, that's why you have children running around in the streets causing trouble as the parents view it as not their problem and that's why you have so much generational unemployment because when you've been brought up with your mother with the state acting as the providing father bringing in the income: why work? It's the same with sex education which its proponents refuse to realise that since it was brought in STDs, abortion and pregnancy has rocketed: but the facts don't come into it and they won't admit they were wrong. The fact is that children under 16 or 18 rather shouldn't ever be having sex under any circumstances. Exercise self-control like a man, don't act like a chimp.

As Peter Hitchens has argued, we're living in the afterglow now of Christian morality. But the light is slowly dimming and see what happens next.

[Inseriousity.]

imo the loud minority shouts louder than the quiet majority who just keep their head down and get on with their day. In other words, morals are not declining, the vast majority of people are decent human beings who care and respect about others. It is just that we are now in a 24 hour news cycle where those who have none are given the spotlight to show us how dark humanity can be. I think the problem with conservative thought is that it believes everything they've heard when it's outside their own experience. Schools getting easier, for example. No, it's bloody well hard when you're in it then you move up and you wish you were back there because it was a piece of cake in comparison but that doesn't mean it's getting easier. Please stop with these generalisations when they are not representative. I think representative is the key word here.

[Kardan]

People are told nowadays to do whatever feels good not what is right.

That's why you have fatherless families where the father doesn't see himself as a man with responsibilities, that's why you have children running around in the streets causing trouble as the parents view it as not their problem and that's why you have so much generational unemployment because when you've been brought up with your mother with the state acting as the providing father bringing in the income: why work? It's the same with sex education which its proponents refuse to realise that since it was brought in STDs, abortion and pregnancy has rocketed: but the facts don't come into it and they won't admit they were wrong. The fact is that children under 16 or 18 rather shouldn't ever be having sex under any circumstances. Exercise self-control like a man, don't act like a chimp.

As Peter Hitchens has argued, we're living in the afterglow now of Christian morality. But the light is slowly dimming and see what happens next.

Teenage pregnancy in the UK is at it's lowest rates since records began in 1969. So are you arguing that there was more sex education in 1969 than in 2015?

In regards to the thread topic, I think the majority of kids are fine with their morals and values, it's just that all we end up hearing about are the minority that are not.

[FlyingJesus]

Morals should come from a place of logic and pragmatism, not arbitrary phrases pulled from nowhere and clung onto for the sake of something to cling on to

[GommeInc]

My only issue is that there seems to be a problem where teachers are expected to parent children. A few friends of mine in the teaching profession have told me a few horror stories where children just do not seem that well behaved, and because of this they tend to not want to stay for longer than a year or two at any given school - but that's a mix of terrible government policy, curriculum and red tape.

As for morals and values. Depends where they come from. Religious morals and values are meaningless in that they are out of date or followers have such extreme, self-righteous views that it becomes more about the views of the follower than the religion itself. Not forgetting religion is littered with inconsistencies.

[Hannah]

There are a lot of things you used to get away with in parenting that could now have you put into prison - some people could have done with a few clips around the ear. It's also not uncommon for a parent to lack control over their child, or little attempt to try. As well as people dragging their children up, rather than raising them. However, while this doesn't help where needed, some children would not turn out any different in the past. There is just more focus on it now - with lack of morality and poor upbringings to be blamed for crimes by young people.

I'm not hugely clued up on statistics and what not, but I feel it's safe to assume that there have always been people lacking morality - there's just a lot more media exposure which makes it look like there is a hell of a lot more.

For example, a 21 year old girl was stabbed and died from her injuries not far from where I work last week, a 22 year old was the one to commit the crime. Now, things like this have been happening for years, it's just now that there is extensive media coverage that it appears human morality is going down-hill at a more rapid pace than previous decades.

There does seem to be some form of crime wave going on at the moment though, I must admit. :rolleyes:

As for young girls dressing more inappropriately and growing up too fast - children see celebrities on TV flashing their flesh and admire the response they are getting for it. Therefore children see this as something which is appropriate, and while older generations may not, what is socially acceptable has changed, and this is just one of the issues that arise from it.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Teenage pregnancy in the UK is at it's lowest rates since records began in 1969. So are you arguing that there was more sex education in 1969 than in 2015?

In regards to the thread topic, I think the majority of kids are fine with their morals and values, it's just that all we end up hearing about are the minority that are not.

Only because of mass abortion of thousands of unborn babies every year.

Sex education has massively failed.

[FlyingJesus]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-23267842
Abortion rates amongst teens seems to be falling and falling and falling

From 2012 to 2013 abortion rates increased a MASSIVE 0.1% (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/319460/Abortion_Statistics__England_and_Wales_2013.pdf) and then dropped 0.4% (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/433437/2014_Commentary__5_.pdf) - and 37% of abortions in 2014 were to women who had already had one or more abortions, so there is no pandemic of abortions, just the same people making the same mistakes generally. A very small group of people are carrying on as they always did, but I see no evidence of national moral breakdown. There is almost no way of suggesting that sex ed has failed in any way unless you blinker yourself and pretend that pre-1990 there was no such thing as STDs.

[AgnesIO]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-23267842
Abortion rates amongst teens seems to be falling and falling and falling

From 2012 to 2013 abortion rates increased a MASSIVE 0.1% (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/319460/Abortion_Statistics__England_and_Wales_2013.pdf) and then dropped 0.4% (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/433437/2014_Commentary__5_.pdf) - and 37% of abortions in 2014 were to women who had already had one or more abortions, so there is no pandemic of abortions, just the same people making the same mistakes generally. A very small group of people are carrying on as they always did, but I see no evidence of national moral breakdown. There is almost no way of suggesting that sex ed has failed in any way unless you blinker yourself and pretend that pre-1990 there was no such thing as STDs.

We have one of the highest teenage pregnancy rates in Europe - and 1 in 5 pregnancies are aborted.

[Kardan]

Only because of mass abortion of thousands of unborn babies every year.

Sex education has massively failed.

Except that there's more abortions in every single age category in the UK than Under 18's, so it's not as if teenagers are leading the way in abortions.

Number of abortions per age group in England and Wales during 2014:

Under 18: 11,048
18-19: 16,407
20-24: 52,722
25-29: 44,157
30-34: 32,108
35+: 28,129

So teenage pregnancy is at it's lowest since the 60's and relatively the teenagers are the least likely to have an abortion.

[FlyingJesus]

We have one of the highest teenage pregnancy rates in Europe - and 1 in 5 pregnancies are aborted.

Fab that just means everyone else is doing even better. Where is the 1 in 5 stat from? All I can find on the matter are media reports based on broken sources, can't get at the raw data which is annoying. Regardless, it's still true that these are largely the same people repeating their mistakes as opposed to a widespread problem that requires action

[AgnesIO]

Fab that just means everyone else is doing even better. Where is the 1 in 5 stat from? All I can find on the matter are media reports based on broken sources, can't get at the raw data which is annoying. Regardless, it's still true that these are largely the same people repeating their mistakes as opposed to a widespread problem that requires action

The teenage pregnancy rate stat is from the World Bank; http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.ADO.TFRT?order=wbapi_data_value_2013+wbapi_data _value+wbapi_data_value-last&sort=desc

ONS said that there were 700,000 live births in 2013, whilst the UK Government has the number of abortions down at 185,000 for the same year. The total is therefore 885,000, meaning (185000/885000)*100 = 20.90% ie. 1 in 5.

My statement is based off of fact, yours is not. 37% of women apparently had had a previous abortion; meaning that 63% of abortions were not 'by the same people making the same mistakes'.

[FlyingJesus]

37% is a huge amount statistically, but good luck with trying to call hard statistics not fact. The fact is that abortion is on the decrease, especially in teens - even since 2013 where your argument is based. To quote the report, abortion is at "the lowest rate since 1997: 0.2% lower than in 2013, 6.4% lower than in 2004".

ps: I'm not disputing the 1 in 5 figure, I just wanted to know where it was from, but another fact is that your link doesn't even show what you're saying it shows. It's really quite important to know what's in your sources if you want to look informed. There is literally nothing at all on that page that mentions abortion.

[Metric1]

Basically my family has built a brand of quality - you pay for that quality but at the end of the day my pricing is fair, honest and clients will know their home will be renovated or built to the highest standard of quality.

[AgnesIO]

37% is a huge amount statistically, but good luck with trying to call hard statistics not fact. The fact is that abortion is on the decrease, especially in teens - even since 2013 where your argument is based. To quote the report, abortion is at "the lowest rate since 1997: 0.2% lower than in 2013, 6.4% lower than in 2004".

ps: I'm not disputing the 1 in 5 figure, I just wanted to know where it was from, but another fact is that your link doesn't even show what you're saying it shows. It's really quite important to know what's in your sources if you want to look informed. There is literally nothing at all on that page that mentions abortion.

Oh, you are right! Just like my post said; "The teenage pregnancy rate stat is from the World Bank".

The abortion stat is, as stated, from the ONS. You can find that very easily yourself. But yes, well done for showing that your ability to read my post matches that of a reader of ​the Sun.

[FlyingJesus]

My bad, I guess I just assumed that you were actually replying to the question I'd asked rather than posting something totally different about something that I never disputed, how silly of me. Have you been getting lessons from Dan? Going off on a tangent when you're shown to be wrong, top tactic

[AgnesIO]

My bad, I guess I just assumed that you were actually replying to the question I'd asked rather than posting something totally different about something that I never disputed, how silly of me. Have you been getting lessons from Dan? Going off on a tangent when you're shown to be wrong, top tactic

Are you completely dim, or do you just pretend to be?

I gave the source of the 1 in 5 stat in my post. I also gave further information.

[FlyingJesus]

Yes... after I asked for it. It's not something I've disputed (as I've had to say a few times now) and you're just getting angry over nothing. As for who's dim, you're the one claiming that things are getting worse when the stats and facts alllllllllllllllllllllllllllll show the exact opposite, and that's the only point that matters here

[Empired]

I think all of you need to take some time, step back and start valuing each other ok x Forgive and forget pals x

Also I think the mods need to value this thread a little bit more and moralderate it a bit better
haha get it

[AgnesIO]

Yes... after I asked for it. It's not something I've disputed (as I've had to say a few times now) and you're just getting angry over nothing. As for who's dim, you're the one claiming that things are getting worse when the stats and facts alllllllllllllllllllllllllllll show the exact opposite, and that's the only point that matters here

Unfortunately, replying to you doesn't make me 'angry' ;)

It would be worth noting not a single one of my posts refer to things getting worse. I simply stated we have one of the highest teenage pregnancy rates in Europe (fact) and that 1 in 5 pregnancies are aborted (fact). I do believe our morals are in decline, but that is an opinion.

Saying something is marginally decreasing is not good enough in my view, when we are drastically higher than other European countries.

I forgot that I had to reference my forum posts in Harvard style for everything I write. I'll try to remember next time!


I think all of you need to take some time, step back and start valuing each other ok x Forgive and forget pals x

Also I think the mods need to value this thread a little bit more and moralderate it a bit better
haha get it

There's nothing to moderate :P