Shootings and explosion in Paris

[Yawn]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34814203

18 dead and still ongoing. rip

[j0rd]

At least 26 dead now, absolutely awful

665287433857187840

[!:random!:!]

omg, just seen this. So horrible to hear :(

[xxMATTGxx]

Wow, shocking news.

[Inseriousity.]

holy shit that video.
this is like the 3rd attack in paris this year isnt it? What's their security/intelligence services doing?

RIP to all the dead. :(

[DPS]

If they havent caught them expect more attacks untill they are killed. very shocking so sad for the people that have died

[Kasabian]

Hostages inside Bataclan concert hall, gunfire now heard inside. :(

[Joe]

That video was terrifying, it was so loud. I fucking hate this world agh.

[Yawn]

some reports saying 40 are dead and some saying as many as 60 :'(

a new shooting has just been reported as well :'(

[j0rd]

CNN now reporting 6 different shootings and 3 explosions

also seems to be another shooting in a shopping mall

[DPS]

hate to say it but... letting refugees in from syria no doubt in my mind that some ISIS have been pretending to be refugess just to get into countrys to cause havvoc like this. its sickening

[Yawn]

WTF is going on

100 people are being held hostage and even more shootings are taking place in the streets as we speak :'(

[David]

https://www.reddit.com/live/vwwmdb26t78v

- - - Updated - - -


CNN now reporting 6 different shootings and 3 explosions

also seems to be another shooting in a shopping mall

people are saying CNN is exaggerating so i'd ignore their reports

[lemons]

this is really scary :(

a guy on bbc news said there were reports someone was going round in a car shooting people

https://twitter.com/BBCkatyaadler << good twitter account of bbc reporter to keep updated

[Kasabian]

The whole thing is gut-wrenching. The pictures and videos coming out man :(

[DPS]

https://www.reddit.com/live/vwwmdb26t78v

- - - Updated - - -



people are saying CNN is exaggerating so i'd ignore their reports

bro CNN always report crap lol

- - - Updated - - -

"We have mobilized all possible forces to neutralize the terrorists" - Francois Hollande

François Hollande : currently, terrorist attacks are in progress, it is an horror

- - - Updated - - -

The borders will be closed, says Francois Hollande

[lemons]

french borders have been CLOSED

[DPS]

this is shocking, what kinda world do we live in now? i'm scared to bring children into this world because of things like this. It will only get worse it will never get better. I feel so sorry for all those that this has happen too...

[FlyingJesus]

39 dead and more than 50 injured supposedly at this moment in time, awful

Hashtag #PorteOuverte is being used by people inside Paris who are willing to bring in people who are out and about on the streets and/or far from home and not wanting to go through the city

[Yawn]

they are killing them 1 by 1 in the theatre ugh :'(

[Kasabian]

https://twitter.com/RamiAlLolah/status/665298459176607744

Can see the panic and the noise of shots being fired.

[DPS]

not many things upset me... but this is shocking if they are being killed 1 by 1 like someone said its vile.

[AgnesIO]

I'm due in Paris in a week. That'll be... interesting.

Borders closed for now as someone else said; scary stuff.

Why is France always targeted? Are their Intelligence Services really awful, or are they just the only real target?

[DPS]

starting to think france knew something was going to happen.. bbc just said yesterday there was a bomb scare in the germany football teams hotel i remember seeing it... and another bomb scare also but nothing was found. weird stuff.

[David]

#BREAKING (https://twitter.com/hashtag/BREAKING?src=hash) One of explosions near Paris stadium was suicide attack: several sources

https://twitter.com/AFP/status/665305750521167872

[AgnesIO]

If they got a bomb into the arts centre, why didn't they target the stadium? Surely the 'best' target from a terrorists point of view (thank God that they didn't, obviously).

[David]

If they got a bomb into the arts centre, why didn't they target the stadium? Surely the 'best' target from a terrorists point of view (thank God that they didn't, obviously).

tighter security?

[j0rd]

If they got a bomb into the arts centre, why didn't they target the stadium? Surely the 'best' target from a terrorists point of view (thank God that they didn't, obviously).

I'd imagine there would be much better general security in a stadium than an arts centre

[DPS]

"I'm still at the bataclan. 1th floor. Hurt Bad! They give the faster l assault. There are survivors inside. They are cutting down all the world. One by one. 1th floor soon!!!!" was put on facebook by someone inside the bataclan."

https://www.facebook.com/benjamin.cazenoves/posts/10153035449936652?pnref=story

[OldLoveSong]

60 confirmed dead rn

- - - Updated - - -


I'm due in Paris in a week. That'll be... interesting.

Borders closed for now as someone else said; scary stuff.

Why is France always targeted? Are their Intelligence Services really awful, or are they just the only real target?


my genuine guess is because they're very anti islamic

[David]

a minute ago (https://www.reddit.com/live/vwwmdb26t78v/updates/4c642614-8a5d-11e5-8fce-0e373b482bcf)2 suicide bombs and 1 bombing now confirmed by French police

/u/SpAn12 (https://www.reddit.com/user/SpAn12)

[AgnesIO]

my genuine guess is because they're very anti islamic

I'm guessing the same. I am also preparing my argument that anyone now seriously calling for anti-Islam laws (like banning the bur'qa) might like to rethink their ideas.

[Jake]

It's absolutely absurd!
How people could possibly think it's okay to resort to anything like this is beyond me.
Some sick people in this world.
Obama's speech was nice though basically saying America is on call for anything they need to help resolve the situation.

[DPS]

they are asking people to stop reporting via social media so the terrorists dont know whats going on.

[AgnesIO]

they are asking people to stop reporting via social media so the terrorists dont know whats going on.

If true, that will never work.

[Jake]

they are asking people to stop reporting via social media so the terrorists dont know whats going on.


There was 3.2 Million tweets at 10:30 which was not long after it was on the news.

It's social networks and people like to get 'likes' and 'retweets' won't ever stop unfortunately.

[lemons]

i remember the last time this happened the press were criticised a lot because they were letting out every bit of police info but this time round details seem v sketchy and uncertain

[AgnesIO]

French borders apparently not completely shut - mainly about stopping people getting out​ not in.

- - - Updated - - -

Reddit: We will no longer be reporting what's happening at the Bataclan. This is due to a gag request by French Police.

[Cerys]

Oh god this is awful :( you always think like oh stuff like this will never happen here, at home, but then this really brings reality back :(


RIP :( I hope it stops soon :( :(

[Zak]

This is such awful news :(

[AgnesIO]

Reddit: Bataclan siege reportedly over

[wixard]

i'm watching france24 and it actually boils my blood what they will do to these people who have just experienced something like this

they've just interviewed some woman who was in the bataclan and she was really calm but as she was telling them about her experience you can tell she's realising just how big a deal it actually was and what she has actually lived through/witnessed and then some guy asks her did she see the attackers and what did they look like

ie were they muslim looking lol

[DPS]

tbh i would say there is no question about it that it was some form of isis.

[Yawn]

sounds like absolute carnage in the theatre. explosives were detonated first

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTusxiqVEAA9t6-.jpg

the band that were playing there

[Jake]

Idk if you guys have seen the video.
But the france v germany international football game you could hear the explosion during the game.
Its horrific!

[Yawn]

60-100 in a confined space having explosives thrown at them

the death toll in there is going to massive :'(

[FlyingJesus]

There have been idiots outside Paris (in the UK and US mostly I think) using the PorteOuverte hashtag to say how good they think the idea is... which then of course renders it completely useless because actual Parisian tweets get swamped

Loads and loads of taxis doing free runs apparently, getting people away from the most dangerous areas. Cannot imagine what it must be like to be there right now

- - - Updated - - -

100 reported dead at the Bataclan now that the situation there is "calmed" :\

[Absently]

i really really hope this is all over for tonight :( this is just so awful i am completely heartbroken

[Yawn]

100 dead in the concert oh god :'(

[Cerys]

Latest update taken from the BBC is atleast 100 dead in side that concert hall

[Lex]

so utterly devastating to read and see all of this happening.

twice in two years for poor france, omfg. <//3

http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png

[Samantha]

My work colleague is in Paris at the moment, luckily he is safe, but it's so devastating seeing the videos and hearing the explosions and gun shots :(.

Sent from my C5303 using Tapatalk

[Kasabian]

Around 100 dead in the concert hall, but without sounding insensitive, thankfully it's only 100 considering there was rumoured to be 1500 people there.

[DPS]

so utterly devastating to read and see all of this happening.

twice in two years for poor france, omfg. <//3

http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png http://www.habboxforum.com/dbtech/vbshop/images/gifts/shop/france.png


also the jewish super market. and nearly on the train but the american marines stopped that.

[wixard]

Around 100 dead in the concert hall, but without sounding insensitive, thankfully it's only 100 considering there was rumoured to be 1500 people there.

they have to report low, death toll will rise double/triple

1.5k luckily is a hard crowd to take control of for 3 men so i'd say a good few of them got out unharmed

[Kasabian]

"Reuters is reporting that 40 others have died in other locations in and around Paris"

:(

[Cerys]

Does anyone know or have any opinion on why specially Paris has been targeted? I don't understand :(

This is so awful I can't imagine what it's like there, I hope they find all the awful individuals who did this

[FlyingJesus]

Does anyone know or have any opinion on why specially Paris has been targeted? I don't understand :(

Just because it's a big famous place with lots of people and therefore lots of panic can be (and obviously has been) caused worldwide.

Police reports from French radios saying AT LEAST 100 dead in the Bataclan and 41 confirmed dead on the streets so far, with 60 of the remaining injured needing immediate and critical care. The "Jungle" refugee camp at Calais is now apparently ablaze as part of an arson attack, whether by the same group or by anti-immigration activists I don't know, but there are counter-reports that it's a hoax using old footage. Strange to see so much uncertainty even in this age of instant mass reporting

- - - Updated - - -

Calais fire seemingly confirmed with new footage https://www.facebook.com/479803612168266/videos/vb.479803612168266/543274672487826/?type=2&theater

Also Belgium placing controls (not fully closing) on the borders with France

[Lewis]

Been watching Sky News, this is really awful :(. RIP to those who died

[-:Undertaker:-]

I've had a few drinks tonight but come home to this news...

The Religion of Peace aka Islam strikes once again. How any more attacks must be made before it comes apparent to the most brain dead of moronic self hating liberal hang-wringing lunatics that the more muslims you allow into western Christian countries, the more extremism and the more terrorist attacks you will have by sheer mathematics. The icing on the cake here will be if these murderers are newly arrived 'refugees' that Angela Merkel, the EU and Benedict Cumberbatch invited in. AND YET I HAD TO ARGUE WITH COMPLETE *REMOVED* ON HERE CALLING ME A RACIST THAT LETTING ALL THESE PEOPLE IN WAS STUPID. WHERE ARE THEY!!!?? *REMOVED* WHERE ARE YOU ALL?

The only good thing that can be salvaged from the awful news tonight is that Marine Le Pen is now closer to the French Presidency than ever before. Viva La France.

Edited by Expling (Forum Moderator): Please do not be rude to other forum members!

[FlyingJesus]

Oh joy, I wondered how long it would be before this would happen. Love and sympathy for the victims replaced by vitriol and hate. Individuals committed these acts because they were hateful and violent people, the types who will latch on to any excuse to cause harm. How about we focus not on blaming millions of innocent people for the acts of a handful, but on helping the survivors and the families of the dead to get through this tragedy

[passion]

I've had a few drinks tonight but come home to this news...

The Religion of Peace aka Islam strikes once again. How any more attacks must be made before it comes apparent to the most brain dead of moronic self hating liberal hang-wringing lunatics that the more muslims you allow into western Christian countries, the more extremism and the more terrorist attacks you will have by sheer mathematics. The icing on the cake here will be if these murderers are newly arrived 'refugees' that Angela Merkel, the EU and Benedict Cumberbatch invited in. AND YET I HAD TO ARGUE WITH COMPLETE *REMOVED* ON HERE CALLING ME A RACIST THAT LETTING ALL THESE PEOPLE IN WAS STUPID. WHERE ARE THEY!!!?? *REMOVED* WHERE ARE YOU ALL?

The only good thing that can be salvaged from the awful news tonight is that Marine Le Pen is now closer to the French Presidency than ever before. Viva La France.

must have been muslims who chose ur awful av too

Edited by Expling (Forum Moderator): Please keep on topic!

[Brad]

This shooting in Paris is blowing up my newsfeed on facebook... It's sad for those family and friends.

[OldLoveSong]

just horrifying this all is, and while this attack hasnt been claimed by any certain group yet (yet isis has applauded it), witnesses in the theatre said (joined in on CNN) that a few words were spoken by the shooters such as "allahu akbar" and "This is for syria"

just horrifying this all is, and while this attack hasnt been claimed by any certain group yet (yet isis has applauded it), witnesses in the theatre said (joined in on CNN) that a few words were spoken by the shooters such as "allahu akbar" and "This is for syria"

Edited by Expling (Forum Moderator): Posts merged!

[-:Undertaker:-]

Oh joy, I wondered how long it would be before this would happen. Love and sympathy for the victims replaced by vitriol and hate. Individuals committed these acts because they were hateful and violent people, the types who will latch on to any excuse to cause harm. How about we focus not on blaming millions of innocent people for the acts of a handful, but on helping the survivors and the families of the dead to get through this tragedy

Oh take a hike. I wondered how long before people like you started getting the excuses in for the religion of peace. What is it about you which can't understand that even if only 1% of muslims are extreme (it is actually higher) then 1 in every 100 is enough to bring western civilisation to a standstill when you are allowing in millions? Why must people like me who didn't want any of this in Europe be blown up or shot dead on our way to work because of your absolute stupidity?

Don't give me your love and hate sixth form speech either son to dodge the issue here, heard all that before and it doesn't wash.

[Inseriousity.]

We don't even know yet that they are immigrants. Reports say they were young so for all we know they could've been born in France and radicalised, which would require a totally different solution to border controls.

[AgnesIO]

I've had a few drinks tonight but come home to this news...

The Religion of Peace aka Islam strikes once again. How any more attacks must be made before it comes apparent to the most brain dead of moronic self hating liberal hang-wringing lunatics that the more muslims you allow into western Christian countries, the more extremism and the more terrorist attacks you will have by sheer mathematics. The icing on the cake here will be if these murderers are newly arrived 'refugees' that Angela Merkel, the EU and Benedict Cumberbatch invited in. AND YET I HAD TO ARGUE WITH COMPLETE IDIOTS ON HERE CALLING ME A RACIST THAT LETTING ALL THESE PEOPLE IN WAS STUPID. WHERE ARE THEY!!!?? MORONS! WHERE ARE YOU ALL?

The only good thing that can be salvaged from the awful news tonight is that Marine Le Pen is now closer to the French Presidency than ever before. Viva La France.

Has it not occurred to you that this is exactly what the majority of refugees have been trying to escape? Did that ever cross your mind?

I would also love to know what you count as 'extremist' if you think 15,000,000 Muslims are 'extremists', or did your calculator fail you?

[AgnesIO]

Breaking: Gatwick Airport North Terminal evacuated due to 'suspicious package'.

Hopefully just people being extra cautious.

[j0rd]

was inevitable but...
665481790736482304

665483767155449856

[Alkaz]

This is just awful. It's so scary that these attacks are becoming more and more frequent. You literally aren't safe anywhere, and now Gatwick airports north terminal was evacuated this morning after a man was apparently carrying round a gun in a bag. I mean, when will this madness stop?

[David]

"police have found a syrian passport on one of the bombers"

just said on sky. also a man arrested in germany that's linked to last night

[-:Undertaker:-]

I felt sick to my stomach this morning in work watching the footage from Paris.

I'd also like to thank the two people who +repped me who are also sick of the spineless apologists for these terrorists and their hateful ideology.


Has it not occurred to you that this is exactly what the majority of refugees have been trying to escape? Did that ever cross your mind?

I would also love to know what you count as 'extremist' if you think 15,000,000 Muslims are 'extremists', or did your calculator fail you?

It is no good talking about the 'majority' of muslims when even just 5% of them have a pathological hatred of the west. It took less than 20 to bring down the Twin Towers and 8 to kill 120 French & counting. The more that come the more this will happen & our society will be transformed.

If these people have come in with the 'refugee' waves then Angela Merkel (and the EU) has French blood on her hands and boy should she pay a heavy price.

[AgnesIO]

I felt sick to my stomach this morning in work watching the footage from Paris.

I'd also like to thank the two people who +repped me who are also sick of the spineless apologists for these terrorists and their hateful ideology.



It is no good talking about the 'majority' of muslims when even just 5% of them have a pathological hatred of the west. It took less than 20 to bring down the Twin Towers and 8 to kill 120 French & counting. The more that come the more this will happen & our society will be transformed.

If these people have come in with the 'refugee' waves then Angela Merkel (and the EU) has French blood on her hands and boy should she pay a heavy price.

Stop making up figures, it's making you look like an utter dunce.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Stop making up figures, it's making you look like an utter dunce.

I've actually given nicer figures than the actual figures. Here are the actual figures on extremism in Islam.


ICM Poll: 20% of British Muslims sympathize with 7/7 bombers
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1510866/Poll-reveals-40pc-of-Muslims-want-sharia-law-in-UK.html

NOP Research: 1 in 4 British Muslims say 7/7 bombings were justified
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/14/opinion/main1893879.shtml&date=2011-04-06
http://www.webcitation.org/5xkMGAEvY

People-Press: 31% of Turks support suicide attacks against Westerners in Iraq.
http://people-press.org/report/206/a-year-after-iraq-war

YNet: One third of Palestinians (32%) supported the slaughter of a Jewish family, including the children:
http://pajamasmedia.com/tatler/2011/04/06/32-of-palestinians-support-infanticide/
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4053251,00.html

World Public Opinion: 61% of Egyptians approve of attacks on Americans
32% of Indonesians approve of attacks on Americans
41% of Pakistanis approve of attacks on Americans
38% of Moroccans approve of attacks on Americans
83% of Palestinians approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (only 14% oppose)
62% of Jordanians approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (21% oppose)
42% of Turks approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (45% oppose)
A minority of Muslims disagreed entirely with terror attacks on Americans:
(Egypt 34%; Indonesia 45%; Pakistan 33%)
About half of those opposed to attacking Americans were sympathetic with al-Qaeda’s attitude toward the U.S.
http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb09/STARTII_Feb09_rpt.pdf

Pew Research (2010): 55% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hezbollah
30% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hezbollah
45% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hezbollah (26% negative)
43% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hezbollah (30% negative)
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

Pew Research (2010): 60% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hamas (34% negative).
49% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hamas (48% negative)
49% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hamas (25% negative)
39% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hamas (33% negative)
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

Pew Research (2010): 15% of Indonesians believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified.
34% of Nigerian Muslims believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified.
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

16% of young Muslims in Belgium state terrorism is "acceptable".
http://www.hln.be/hln/nl/1275/Islam/article/detail/1619036/2013/04/22/Zestien-procent-moslimjongens-vindt-terrorisme-aanvaardbaar.dhtml

Populus Poll (2006): 12% of young Muslims in Britain (and 12% overall) believe that suicide attacks against civilians in Britain can be justified. 1 in 4 support suicide attacks against British troops.
http://www.populuslimited.com/pdf/2006_02_07_times.pdf
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

Pew Research (2007): 26% of younger Muslims in America believe suicide bombings are justified.
35% of young Muslims in Britain believe suicide bombings are justified (24% overall).
42% of young Muslims in France believe suicide bombings are justified (35% overall).
22% of young Muslims in Germany believe suicide bombings are justified.(13% overall).
29% of young Muslims in Spain believe suicide bombings are justified.(25% overall).
http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

Pew Research (2011): 8% of Muslims in America believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified (81% never).
28% of Egyptian Muslims believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified (38% never).
http://www.people-press.org/2011/08/30/muslim-americans-no-signs-of-growth-in-alienation-or-support-for-extremism/

Pew Research (2007): Muslim-Americans who identify more strongly with their religion are three times more likely to feel that suicide bombings are justified
http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

ICM: 5% of Muslims in Britain tell pollsters they would not report a planned Islamic terror attack to authorities.
27% do not support the deportation of Islamic extremists preaching violence and hate.
http://www.scotsman.com/?id=1956912005
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist.html

Federation of Student Islamic Societies: About 1 in 5 Muslim students in Britain (18%) would not report a fellow Muslim planning a terror attack.
http://www.fosis.org.uk/sac/FullReport.pdf
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

ICM Poll: 25% of British Muslims disagree that a Muslim has an obligation to report terrorists to police.
http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/reviews/2004/Guardian%20Muslims%20Poll%20Nov%2004/Guardian%20Muslims%20Nov04.asp
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

Populus Poll (2006): 16% of British Muslims believe suicide attacks against Israelis are justified.
37% believe Jews in Britain are a "legitimate target".
http://www.populuslimited.com/pdf/2006_02_07_times.pdf
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

Pew Research (2013): At least 1 in 4 Muslims do not reject violence against civilians (study did not distinguish between those who believe it is partially justified and never justified).
http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Religious_Affiliation/Muslim/worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-full-report.pdf

Pew Research (2013): 15% of Muslims in Turkey support suicide bombings (also 11% in Kosovo, 26% in Malaysia and 26% in Bangladesh).
http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Religious_Affiliation/Muslim/worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-full-report.pdf

PCPO (2014): 89% of Palestinians support Hamas and other terrorists firing rockets at Israeli civilians.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/08/poll-89-of-palestinians-support-jihad-terror-attacks-on-israel (http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/08/poll-89-of-palestinians-support-jihad-terror-attacks-on-israelhttp://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/08/poll-89-of-palestinians-support-jihad-terror-attacks-on-israel)y

Pew Research (2013): Only 57% of Muslims worldwide disapprove of al-Qaeda. Only 51% disapprove of the Taliban. 13% support both groups and 1 in 4 refuse to say.
http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/09/10/muslim-publics-share-concerns-about-extremist-groups/ (http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/09/10/muslim-publics-share-concerns-about-extremist-groups/http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/09/10/muslim-publics-share-concerns-about-extremist-groups/)

BBC Radio (2015): 45% of British Muslims agree that clerics preaching violence against the West represent "mainstream Islam".
http://comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/ (http://comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/http://comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/)

Palestinian Center for Political Research (2015): 74% of Palestinians support Hamas terror attacks.
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/193395 (http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/193395http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/193395)

Pew Research (2014): 47% of Bangladeshi Muslims says suicide bombings and violence are justified to "defend Islam". 1 in 4 believed the same in Tanzania and Egypt. 1 in 5 Muslims in the 'moderate' countries of Turkey and Malaysia.
http://www.pewglobal.org/2014/07/01/concerns-about-islamic-extremism-on-the-rise-in-middle-east/ (http://www.pewglobal.org/2014/07/01/concerns-about-islamic-extremism-on-the-rise-in-middle-east/http://www.pewglobal.org/2014/07/01/concerns-about-islamic-extremism-on-the-rise-in-middle-east/)

The Polling Company CSP Poll (2015): 19% of Muslim-Americans say that violence is justified in order to make Sharia the law in the United States (66% disagree).
http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/150612-CSP-Polling-Company-Nationwide-Online-Survey-of-Muslims-Topline-Poll-Data.pdf (http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/150612-CSP-Polling-Company-Nationwide-Online-Survey-of-Muslims-Topline-Poll-Data.pdfhttp://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/150612-CSP-Polling-Company-Nationwide-Online-Survey-of-Muslims-Topline-Poll-Data.pdf)

The Polling Company CSP Poll (2015): 25% of Muslim-Americans say that violence against Americans in the United States is justified as part of the "global Jihad (64% disagree).
http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/150612-CSP-Polling-Company-Nationwide-Online-Survey-of-Muslims-Topline-Poll-Data.pdf (http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/150612-CSP-Polling-Company-Nationwide-Online-Survey-of-Muslims-Topline-Poll-Data.pdfhttp://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/150612-CSP-Polling-Company-Nationwide-Online-Survey-of-Muslims-Topline-Poll-Data.pdf)

See also: http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Muslim_Statistics_(Terrorism) (http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Muslim_Statistics_(Terrorism)/) for further statistics on Islamic terror.


You can apologise now.

[AgnesIO]

I've actually given nicer figures than the actual figures. Here are the actual figures on extremism in Islam.



You can apologise now.

I have no fucking intention of apologising. It's a lovely list. I decided to select one poll at RANDOM. Here's what Undertaker says;


BBC Radio (2015): 45% of British Muslims agree that clerics preaching violence against the West represent "mainstream Islam".
http://comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/ (http://comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/http://comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/)

Here's what the poll results actually said:



More than two in five (46%) feel that being a Muslim in Britain is difficult due to prejudice against Islam.
Almost all Muslims living in Britain feel a loyalty to the country (95%). Just 6% say they feel a disloyalty.
Nine in ten (93%) British Muslims believe that Muslims in Britain should always obey British laws.
One in four (27%) British Muslims say they have some sympathy for the motives behind the attacks on Charlie Hebdo in Paris.
However, two thirds (68%) say acts of violence against those who publish images of the Prophet can never be justified while a quarter (24%) disagree.
Muslim women are more likely than men to feel unsafe in Britain.
One in nine (11%) British Muslims feel sympathetic towards people who want to fight against western interests while 85% do not.
Half (49%) believe Muslim clerics preaching that violence against the west can be justified are out of touch with mainstream Muslim opinion, while 45% disagree.



So, let's look at that again. 95% of Muslims feel loyalty to Britain. 93% believe that they should always obey British laws. 68% say that violence against those who publish images about the prophet can ever be justified. 85% have no sympathy towards those wanting to fight against Western interests.

Of course, if you go and blow up another persons homeland, they will argue that returning some of that can be justified. 9/11 pretty much led to the war in Iraq - we all have the same mindset.

Now, I'm sorry but those figures simply do not indicate "pathological hatred". Disagreeing with us bombing one's homeland is not the same as pathological hatred. So no, I won't apologise. Not a chance in hell.

EDIT: Oh look, I just clicked another one of your links. Dan says: "20% of British Muslims sympathise with 7/7 bombers". Actual poll result: 20% sympathise with the FEELINGS of the bombers, 99% say the bombers were WRONG to carry out the attacks.

Sorry, I take back what I said. You don't look like an utter dunce. You are an *REMOVED*.

Edited by Expling (Forum Moderator): Please be nice to other forum members!

[-:Undertaker:-]

Those figures you quote from the poll are absolutely terrifying and much worse than any 5%. The fact that you think that 'only' one in four muslims having sympathy with the Charlie Hebdo attacks is good news just goes to show how you've dug yourself into a hole and don't want to help yourself out. Or you're just thick.

You tried getting me on the 5% example - which I foresaw hence why I made it a low 5% - but I know the real figures and the research. You lose chump.


Of course, if you go and blow up another persons homeland, they will argue that returning some of that can be justified.

More rationalising of terror attacks, earlier I recall you said something about France and the burka as though it somehow justifies murdering French people.

You disgust me.

[AgnesIO]

Those figures you quote from the poll are absolutely terrifying and much worse than any 5%. The fact that you think that 'only' one in four muslims having sympathy with the Charlie Hebdo attacks is good news just goes to show how you've dug yourself into a hole and don't want to help yourself out. Or you're just thick.

You tried getting me on the 5% example - which I foresaw hence why I made it a low 5% - but I know the real figures and the research. You lose chump.

There is a huge difference between having sympathy for the reason, and agreeing with the attacks. The crap you have just spouted in those polls are incredibly twisted, just like 99.9% of the other stuff you post.

(Yes, that's another made up percentage. I know you like those.)

[-:Undertaker:-]

There is a huge difference between having sympathy for the reason, and agreeing with the attacks. The crap you have just spouted in those polls are incredibly twisted, just like 99.9% of the other stuff you post.

(Yes, that's another made up percentage. I know you like those.)

I have no sympathy with people sympathising/justifying towards the murder of a magazine editor for the mere act of criticising and mocking a religion.

I'm appalled that you could even somehow sympathise with that position. As I said, disgusting.

[AgnesIO]

I have no sympathy with people sympathising towards the murder of a magazine editor for the mere act of criticising and mocking a religion.

I'm appalled that you could even somehow sympathise with that position. As I said, disgusting.

Nice of you to accept that your 5% figure ("pathological hatred") doesn't actually stand up to criticism.

Also, the polls do not say they sympathise with the murder of the editor. There's a difference between agreeing that the magazine was wrong and the murder of the writers. A very, very, very big difference.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Nice of you to accept that your 5% figure ("pathological hatred") doesn't actually stand up to criticism.

Also, the polls do not say they sympathise with the murder of the editor. There's a difference between agreeing that the magazine was wrong and the murder of the writers. A very, very, very big difference.

I'm sorry but I - since you won't - will be plain and clear that anyone who sympathises with the feelings or reasons of people who go out and murder the staff and editors of a magazine for the simple act of mocking and criticising a religion are vile human beings. I have nothing but hatred in my heart for terrorists who kill innocent people as should any decent and normal person in western civilised society. And I am sickened by you attempting to rationalise acts of terrorism against innocent French people.

What next from you I wonder? That you can 'see why' those killers went out and beheaded Lee Rigby?

[AgnesIO]

I'm sorry but i'll be plain and clear that anyone who sympathises with the feelings or reasons of people who go out and murder the staff and editors of a magazine for the simple act of mocking and criticising a religion are vile human beings. I have nothing but hatred in my heart for terrorists as should any decent and normal person.

And I am sickened by you attempting to rationalise acts of terrorism against innocent French people.

I'm not attempting to rationalise acts of terrorism. Don't you dare try and suggest that.

Would you be against any intervention in response to this? If not, how can you possibly sympathise with our governments killing innocent civilians (the 'price' of also getting to ISIS)? If you support any intervention whatsoever, you are being a hypocrite.

Saying "You should not publish derogatory images of the Prophet Mohammed" (which is what the Charlie Hebdo attackers said), is a perfectly reasonable thought. However, it is an entirely different thought to "yes, they deserved to be killed".​

[-:Undertaker:-]

@conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); I have and will suggest it.

I'll let all what you've said stand as I think anyone reading other than a select few can plainly see and make up their own minds, including this earlier comment...


I'm guessing the same. I am also preparing my argument that anyone now seriously calling for anti-Islam laws (like banning the bur'qa) might like to rethink their ideas.

aka "The French kinda brought it on themselves for daring asserting their secular republican values" I read that as. You're a vile apologist.

[AgnesIO]

What next from you I wonder? That you can 'see why' those killers went out and beheaded Lee Rigby?

Nobody is saying that. One could say; "I think it is entirely wrong that British soldiers are involved in the killing of Muslims in Africa and the Middle East". That is not the same as agreeing that a soldier deserves to be beheaded on our streets. They are two entirely different concepts.

I'm just glad that any rational person can see (based on your ridiculous poll claims) that you are an absolute nut case.

- - - Updated - - -


@conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); I have and will suggest it.

I'll let all what you've said stand as I think anyone reading other than a select few can plainly see and make up their own minds, including this earlier comment...



aka "The French kinda brought it on themselves for daring asserting their secular republican values" I read that as. You're a vile apologist.

That's not being an apologist. Paris has been targeted for a reason - it's entirely wrong - but that are seen as more anti-Islamic than other countries in Europe. It's absolutely disgusting that they've been targeted - but giving extremists an excuse to harm you is not going to help you.

It's lovely that you've read my post in an entirely different way to what I meant. At least I'm actually using your words as they are.

[-:Undertaker:-]

British troops are actively just killing innocent muslims in the Middle East and Africa are they? @conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885);

Are you really equating civilian casualties in a war with that of Islamic terrorists who open fire in a restaurant?

...as I said you've said enough to incriminate yourself. I'll leave it there and let anyone reading judge.


but giving extremists an excuse to harm you is not going to help you.

In other words, "don't stand up for your secular republican values France as you're kinda asking to be blown up. Just submit to radical Islam and abandon your values"

A modern day Quisling. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vidkun_Quisling)

[AgnesIO]

British troops are actively just killing innocent muslims in the Middle East and Africa are they? @conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885);

Are you really equating civilian casualties in a war with that of Islamic terrorists who open fire in a restaurant?



...as I said you've said enough to incriminate yourself. I'll leave it there and let anyone reading judge.

I seem to remember that you are the one that blames Blair and Bush for the problems in Africa and the Middle East... don't you say their wouldn't be these issues if it wasn't for our interventions 12 years ago? Oh, that's awkward.

---

Once again, I am not making excuses for Paris. I have never said that, I never will say that, and it is probably time you stop implying that I said that. That's called slander. It's a crime.

[-:Undertaker:-]

I seem to remember that you are the one that blames Blair and Bush for the problems in Africa and the Middle East... don't you say their wouldn't be these issues if it wasn't for our interventions 12 years ago? Oh, that's awkward.

I blame Bush and Blair for removing the strongmen in the Middle East who keep radical Islam in check.

I don't deny the existence of radical Islam or deny how widespread it is, like you. Wahabbism & other strains of Islam pre-date any western actions in the region.

[AgnesIO]

I blame Bush and Blair for removing the strongmen in the Middle East who keep radical Islam in check.

I don't deny the existence of radical Islam or deny how widespread it is, like you do.

Let's just spin this back to the start; "5% of Muslims have a pathological hatred towards the West".

Now, I don't deny radical Islam exists. I deny your bogus figures.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Let's just spin this back to the start; "5% of Muslims have a pathological hatred towards the West".

Now, I don't deny radical Islam exists. I deny your bogus figures.

My example figure was bogus yes, the figures from the research show the percentages to be higher than 5%. Fool.

[Thordenhime]

*REMOVED*

Edited by Samanfa (Forum Super Moderator): Please don't be rude to other members, thank you!

[Lewis]

I probably disagree with some of what Undertaker says, but he's the only one that's actually made some sense in in this thread. I'd rep him if I could but it seems I've already done so lately.

And for Conservative dismissing the polls and percentages Undertaker said, some statistics you've posted are even more shocking and worse than what what he's said, so you've done yourself no favour in my opinion. You said they had sympathy for the motives behind it and to me that is no better than having sympathy for those who actually carried the acts out.

I'm not much of a good debater, so don't expect much more from me lol

[Inseriousity.]

What conservative said makes perfect sense to me lmao. It's just dan twisting his words.

Charlie Hebdo posted cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad which is regarded as blasphemy in Islam so yes I am not surprised a high percentage of Muslims disagree with the magazine but that does not mean that a high percentage of Muslims agree that you have the right to shoot and bomb the magazine offices. It's not standing up or apologising for terrorism, it's standing up for the vast majority of law-abiding citizens who express their dislike for something in non-violent and constructive ways.

It goes without saying but seeing as Dan seems to think not saying it makes you point the finger of blame at France, I am perfectly content for anyone to publish cartoons/pictures of the Prophet Muhammad cos I'm not a Muslim and do not care.

[AgnesIO]

My example figure was bogus yes, the figures from the research show the percentages to be higher than 5%. Fool.

That's like saying 1% of British people like to drink urine, and then backing up your claim by using another statistic by saying 100% of British people urinate. They are two entirely different statistics...


I probably disagree with some of what Undertaker says, but he's the only one that's actually made some sense in in this thread. I'd rep him if I could but it seems I've already done so lately.

And for Conservative dismissing the polls and percentages Undertaker said, some statistics you've posted are even more shocking and worse than what what he's said, so you've done yourself no favour in my opinion. You said they had sympathy for the motives behind it and to me that is no better than having sympathy for those who actually carried the acts out.

I'm not much of a good debater, so don't expect much more from me lol

Wrong. There is nothing wrong with saying that Charlie Hebdo should not have published images mocking the Prophet Mohammed. BUT there is everything wrong with stating that they deserved to be killed as a result.

Inseriousity. has already said it on my behalf; read what I have actually read (not what Dan is implying I have said) and make a sensible (arguably non-UKIPesque) conclusion.

[-:Undertaker:-]

When you say there's nothing wrong with saying that Charlie Hebdo shouldn't have published those images mocking the Prophet what you really mean is that he shouldn't have published them not because it bothers you personally but because you both @conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); @Inseriousity. (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=26409); know what the reaction amongst many muslims is when their precious religion is subjected to criticism or mockery: they simply cannot take it and there's a radical section who will resort to violence to silence that criticism/mockery with backing or 'sympathy' from a substantial slice of the muslim population as the polling and research indicates. You both think or indicate that those cartoons shouldn't have been published because you are terrified of upsetting people who will turn violent against western society if they're upset. In short, you've already submitted and it makes you cowards in doing so.

In other words you both know there's serious problems in Islam (it's obvious) but you don't want to say it outright and don't want to upset the Religion of Peace.

[AgnesIO]

know what the reaction amongst many muslims is when their precious religion is subjected to criticism or mockery:

you are terrified of upsetting people who will turn violent against western society if they're upset.

you both know there's serious problems in Islam

*REMOVED*

Edited by Expling (Forum Moderator): Please respect other forum members!

[Inseriousity.]

No I don't think that at all. You're just assuming that. Yes I can bold words too. Magazine owners/newspapers have the freedom of speech/expression to post cartoon/pictures of the Prophet Muhammad, mock every other religion, mock politicians, mock celebrities etc and those that disagree have the freedom of speech/expression to disagree/protest/boycott/[insert other peaceful demonstration here]. The point was that the stats quoted show that the majority of Muslims disagree with the magazine for mocking their religion's Prophet (which both conservative and I are like WELL DUH) but the majority do not believe violence is an appropriate response.

If you're going to say what I think, please get it right.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Oh no you didn't say it @conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); but that's really what you meant. It is just as when you brought up France being 'anti-Islam' for daring to uphold secular republican values by banning the burqa what you really meant was that if only France pandered to Islam and stood down on it's own values then these bad things wouldn't happen.

You're an absolute quisling. Thankfully though there's many out there like myself who believe we should always defend our values even in the face of violence.


but the majority do not believe violence is an appropriate response.

Didn't claim they did.

Why is it when arguing with Islamic terror apologists all they can repeat over and over is "not all muslims are terrorists" as though somebody ever stated all muslims were terrorists? Answer: because they'd rather take a PC moral high horse than confront the reality which is that there's a substantial amount of support even in western islamic sections of the population who are hostile to western values such as free expression and who support violence.

As I said earlier, even if 5% of the hundreds of thousands of Syrians you are allowing in are radicals that is enough to bring our countries to their knees. It just happened.

[Kyle]

In a word: sympathising with those against blasphemy =/= agreeing that murder is the correct response.

This is painful. I hope it doesn't affect those seeking safety in Europe too much. :(

[-:Undertaker:-]

It's been confirmed at least one of those lovely 'refugees' that @conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); Angela Merkel and Benedict Cumberbatch wanted to let in is one of the suspects.

665564613250048000

665564692111314945

[AgnesIO]

Oh no you didn't say it @conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); but that's really what you meant. It is just as when you brought up France being 'anti-Islam' for daring to uphold secular republican values by banning the burqa what you really meant was that if only France pandered to Islam and stood down on it's own values then these bad things wouldn't happen.

As I said earlier, even if 5% of the hundreds of thousands of Syrians you are allowing in are radicals that is enough to bring our countries to their knees. It just happened.

Once again, 5% of Muslims (or refugees) are not radicals...

Ohh, of course, I get it. Because you know more about what I meant than I do. Right, move on.

Nobody is claiming that they won't have been one of the refugees, either. But that doesn't mean that every refugee is a fucking radical (or even 5%...)..

Why would I be scared of Islam? I'm flying to one of stricter Islamic countries in a little over a month. Hardly the sign of someone whom is scared.

[FlyingJesus]

Oh take a hike. I wondered how long before people like you started getting the excuses in for the religion of peace. What is it about you which can't understand that even if only 1% of muslims are extreme (it is actually higher) then 1 in every 100 is enough to bring western civilisation to a standstill when you are allowing in millions? Why must people like me who didn't want any of this in Europe be blown up or shot dead on our way to work because of your absolute stupidity?

Don't give me your love and hate sixth form speech either son to dodge the issue here, heard all that before and it doesn't wash.

I haven't made excuses for anyone, I just said that this isn't the place for hatred of those who haven't done any wrong. By your shit and senseless reasoning all blacks are criminals, all gays have AIDS, all whites are paedophiles, all Scousers eat rats, etc. The fact that you keep having to say IN OTHER WORDS!!!!!!!!! to try making a point shows that all you're doing is twisting quotes and ignoring what's really happening... as always.


You said they had sympathy for the motives behind it and to me that is no better than having sympathy for those who actually carried the acts out.

The "sympathy" statistic is misleading in that all it really means is they understand why cartoons of Mohammed angered some people. It doesn't mean they're going around thinking "aww those poor little terrorists I do feel sorry for them", just that they know why it happened

[-:Undertaker:-]

Once again, 5% of Muslims (or refugees) are not radicals...

Indeed, the figure is higher as I keep pointing out using scientific polling and research. Here's another.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_attitudes_towards_terrorism#Polls


In a 2007 Pew Research (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pew_Research) poll in response to a question on whether suicide bombing and other forms of violence against civilian targets to defend Islam could be justified, in Europe.

64% of Muslims in France believed it could never be justified, 19% believed it could be justified rarely, 10% sometimes, and 6% thought it could be justified often.

The same polling results in Islamic countries (where the 'refugees' are coming from) are much higher, for example...


45% of Muslims in Egypt (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egypt) believed it could never be justified, 25% believed it could be justified rarely, 20% sometimes, and 8% thought it could be justified often.

Those are terrifying figures and that research was undertaken back in 2007, before the events of the so-called Arab Spring.

I would suspect a sharp increase on 2007 given events in Turkey, Syria, Yemen, Bahrain, Jordan, Iraq and throughout the region.


Why would I be scared of Islam? I'm flying to one of stricter Islamic countries in a little over a month. Hardly the sign of someone whom is scared.

If you are going to one of the stricter Islamic countries then that should be a lesson as to why their leaders are so harsh. The likes of Assad, al-Sauds and the Egyptian military know better than anyone else what their own people are like and how to keep them in line: hence why nearly all Islamic countries are ruled with an iron fist.

[Empired]

It worries me that everyone is taking these statistics like they've come straight from the mouth of God. Statistics are great at showing answers to closed questions but are total rubbish in complicated, intricate situations like these. Of course plenty of people may be saying they feel some sympathy with attackers - you can't explain your entire mindset on a huge issue if the question you asked just said "do you sympathise with these men? A: yes / B: no".

It may be of some use if you try to apply your brain when looking at stats instead of just copying, pasting and saying I TOLD YOU SO.

For that specific example I would like to say that sympathising with the reasons for an action does not mean you agree with the action. I can sympathise with a woman cheating on her husband because he's stopped taking any interest in her but that does not make me a cheater, nor does it mean I condone adultery. In the same way, I can sympathise with the reasons a terrorist goes out and bombs a city without becoming a terrorist myself or thinking that terrorism is a good thing.

(Side note: isn't the bolding a little much? We're all capable of using our eyes and reading, thanks for the concern. Patronising the person you disagree with to make their posts look less valid is petty and unnecessary. Not to mention pointless.)

I'd have more to say on this but I don't really fancy sharing my opinion and being torn down by the use of BOLDING AND UNDERLINING (shock horror!), and I don't really think it would make a difference. But I did want to add what I said above.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Isn't it interesting the lengths people like @Empired (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=80588); will go to in order to avoid the grim reality even when multiple sources confirm these attitudes.

If you wanted a practical lesson rather than the academic evidence I have provided over and over in how muslim people view certain things in an extreme way, then you could always go to a muslim country and stand in the town square and either [a] engage in a gay kiss, [b] mock the Koran or [c] start handing out Jewish literature. And see what happens to you at the hands of the local population. Or you could just read accounts from gay and Jewish people in France, as I have, as to what life is becoming like for them as Islam strengthens in France.
(http://new.spectator.co.uk/2015/01/how-marine-le-pen-is-winning-frances-gay-vote/)
I suspect what happens if you did any of the above would broadly correlate with the research on the matter..... hence why you wouldn't dare try it.

[buttons]

as much as i find it annoying that dan and others jump to "immigration!! muslims!!" i'm finding it REALLY tiring how time and time again, an atrocity is carried out but the focus is on "protecting" innocent muslims. like hell yes, there's no need for islamaphobia but am i the only one who finds it so disrespectful that the focus turns away from the victims EVERY time and straight onto defending or condemning muslims/islam? if i lost a loved one to a terrorist attack and the first thing someone said to me was "don't blame all ____" or whatever, i would be so angry because the focus should be on the victims and sympathizing with the family, not innocent muslims (yeah i know they suffer consequences but clearly they're not the victims AT THAT POINT).

its like most people go to the extreme of condemning or defending when you can do both at the same time.

thats my view which im sure someone could somehow skew and make out that i'm a racist.

[Inseriousity.]

It would be nice. The problem is you'd have to ignore the "immigration!! muslims!!" for that to happen and it's very difficult to ignore it. I did actually do it for dan's first provocative post in this thread for that very reason and only jumped in cos dom's posts made him look like he was bashing his head against the keyboard. Felt bad for him lol. I'm rather tired of the immigration debate because of how extreme it is.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Yeah let's just ignore the immigration bit when we already know at least one of them has come in via invitation of the EU and Angela Merkel.

@Inseriousity. (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=26409); I was arguing with you all not to allow hundreds of thousands of them in and you all couldn't contain your glee a few weeks back, calling me a racist, a bigot and inhumane over and over again. Now that the consequences of your stupidity comes apparent - 127 French people laying cold and lifeless in the morgue because their government was powerless to control who comes into the country and who goes out - you just wish the topic would go away? No, never.

The Polish government agrees with me.

665597336681222144

[Inseriousity.]

I'm rather tired of the immigration debate because of how extreme it is.


@Inseriousity. (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=26409); I was arguing with you all not to allow hundreds of thousands of them in and you all couldn't contain your glee a few weeks back, calling me a racist, a bigot and inhumane over and over again. Now that the consequences of your stupidity comes apparent - 127 French people laying cold and lifeless in the morgue because their government was powerless to control who comes into the country and who goes out - you just wish the topic would go away? No, never.

I didn't post in that thread cos of the above. I never said I wish the topic would go away. That would be dumb, I know it's not but I can choose not to participate in a debate where everyone just repeats themselves over and over again.

[dbgtz]

Interesting to see people actually engage in some kind of dialogue as opposed to the standard "thoughts are with the family". Would have been nicer to see it a tad more civil, perhaps.

The impact this will have over the coming months, maybe years, will be interesting. It's surprising to see, at least as far as I've seen, that this hasn't really impacted on peoples opinions on the refugees so much (but that's a very small and selective group and there could well be a silent majority). I suspect, however, the governments of Europe will become less tolerable of the refugees which is no issue to me personally since I've always been in favour in (properly) assisting countries like Jordan instead, which we do and should hopefully continue to do. But, on the flip side, we will probably end up spending more on the military to fight ISIS which will just make things even worse.

Looking slightly closer to home, it will be interesting to see how the government spins this for internet surveillance and other similar authoritarian bills to "protect our safety".

[Joe]

http://habbox.com/v7/all-articles/real-life/current-affairs/peace-for-paris

Wrote this. RIP all those lost and condolences to those affected.

[FlyingJesus]

There was absolutely nothing saying "save the Muslims!!" or anything of that sort until Dan came in claiming that they should all be stopped at any cost etc., no-one's been bending over backwards taking focus away from the victims except for Dan. The entire thread was exclusively about the events as they were happening until his arrival

[-:Undertaker:-]

Why haven't any of you do-gooders who kept calling me racist/nasty/bigoted/inhumane a few weeks ago criticised and called the Polish government racist and nasty for doing what a government should and protecting her citizens? Why've you all got jack to say now when the results of your stupidity are clear to see?

Shouldn't Poland just do what you all demanded a few weeks back and let hundreds of thousands of them to keep streaming in?

665577453088284673

Apparently an Egyptian passport has now been found? Ohhh yeah, didn't I post a poll regarding Egyptian islamic extremism earlier and you ignored it?

[-:Undertaker:-]

665801368733544448

And another just now.

I think they've only just started.

But this has nothing to do with Islam or illegal immigrants though, oh no no. It could just as easily be Buddhists or Jews. Or native Germans and Italians. :rolleyes:

[AgnesIO]

665801368733544448

And another just now.

I think they've only just started.

But this has nothing to do with Islam or illegal immigrants though, oh no no. It could just as easily be Buddhists or Jews. Or native Germans and Italians. :rolleyes:

The first terrorist has been identified as.... wait for it.... a French citizen.

Also, yes, because Buddhists are such lovely people. Well, except for the persecution of the Rohingya people in Myanmar, oh and the violence against Hindus in Sri Lanka. But yes, they are definitely all peaceful people...

[Inseriousity.]

An Egyptian passport found at the scene of the Stade de France explosions and linked to the attackers belonged to an Egyptian victim, the country's ambassador to France has said.
Ihab Badawi said that the passport belongs to Waleed Abdel-Razzak, a football fan who was critically injured in the attack.
"No charges have been directed at Abdel-Razzak at all," Mr Badawi told Egypt's CBC news channel.

[FlyingJesus]

Why haven't any of you do-gooders who kept calling me racist/nasty/bigoted/inhumane a few weeks ago criticised and called the Polish government racist and nasty for doing what a government should and protecting her citizens?

Probably because this was a thread about France before you turned up

[David]

someone setting off firecrackers at the memorial

665953758921277440

665950534822699008

[Kasabian]

Can't believe its still continuing, alright its only firecrackers and probably someone having a "laugh", but its causing a state of panic.

[Alkaz]

It's disgusting that anyone would even think to do that. I've avoided social media over the lady couple of days because of some of the stupid comments people are posting. Just angers me!

[-:Undertaker:-]

The first terrorist has been identified as.... wait for it.... a French citizen.

And that just adds to my case, the more immigrants brought in from Islamic cultures the more and more we'll have these type of events.

I have also just read that the other attacker, a so-called Belgian with a very Belgian sounding name *rollseyes*, planned the attacks with the others from Belgium and then crossed into the French republic. Now if only the French state had border controls to protect her citizens.

665850272590204929

The new Polish Foreign Minister has already touched upon this angle....

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/11/14/newly-elected-polish-government-crazed-leftists-will-try-blame-paris-attacks-west/


The newly appointed Polish foreign minister has moved to forestall the inevitable hand-wringing over the Paris attacks, this morning claiming “crazed leftists” would blame the killings of over 120 civilians by Islamist terrorists on the West.

[Kasabian]

Why are you banging on about immigrants, deterring the thread even further?

[-:Undertaker:-]

Why are you banging on about immigrants, deterring the thread even further?

Because one attacker is an illegal immigrant from Syria and the other is an immigrant from Belgium.

Any other questions?

[David]

Any other questions?

What's your favorite wham song?
What's your mothers maiden name?
Are you or are you not a dick head?

Edited by Expling (Forum Moderator): Please keep on topic!

[AgnesIO]

And that just adds to my case, the more immigrants brought in from Islamic cultures the more and more we'll have these type of events.

I have also just read that the other attacker, a so-called Belgian with a very Belgian sounding name *rollseyes*, planned the attacks with the others from Belgium and then crossed into the French republic. Now if only the French state had border controls to protect her citizens.


That really doesn't add to your case.. your entire argument has been that the 'refugees' were the attackers, then you have been made to look like a fool, and come back "well that backs up my point"...

No, no it doesn't.

[Kasabian]

Because one attacker is an illegal immigrant from Syria and the other is an immigrant from Belgium.

Any other questions?

Whats the name of the street you grew up on?

Edited by Expling (Forum Moderator): Please keep on topic!

[-:Undertaker:-]

That really doesn't add to your case.. your entire argument has been that the 'refugees' were the attackers, then you have been made to look like a fool, and come back "well that backs up my point"...

No, no it doesn't.

Why've I been made to look like a fool? One attacker so far is confirmed to be from Syria and another was found with an Egyptian passport. It's already been alleged that the confirmed Syrian attacker came into Europe as a 'refugee' aka illegal immigrant (you know, the ones you wanted to let in and called me a racist etc when I said it was dangerous) with another one of the Paris attackers.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3318379/Hunt-Isis-killers-Syrian-passport-body-suicide-bomber-Stade-France.html

As for home-grown islamic terrorism, I have posted dozens of threads in the past warning of cultural ghettoisation via mass uncontrolled immigration.

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=831199

It's been confirmed that one of the attackers came from a Belgian suburb with a large muslim population where authorities have lost control (their words not mine).

[OldLoveSong]

i had no doubt in my mind that terrorists would come in along with the refugees, just as ISIS has said that they would get their way into our lands. Canada is accepting 20k refugees within the next year and im lit afraid. How is the screening process even done for things like this? (Better be freaking better and advanced than Greece who let the guy in..)

[Kasabian]

How do you find out whos a member of isis and whos just a common refugee though? How do you determine it?

[OldLoveSong]

How do you find out whos a member of isis and whos just a common refugee though? How do you determine it?

this is what i want to find out. Someone that comes over with NO papers or anything of that sort, how do you find out who they even are? Is it just left up to chance on whether u've let in a genuine refugee or a radicalist..?

[-:Undertaker:-]

How do you find out whos a member of isis and whos just a common refugee though? How do you determine it?

Until you can then you don't let them in then, simple.

Or else you might end up with 130+ Canadians laying in pools of their own blood by the time the year is out.

[FlyingJesus]

Why've I been made to look like a fool? One attacker so far is confirmed to be from Syria and another was found with an Egyptian passport.


An Egyptian passport found at the scene of the Stade de France explosions and linked to the attackers belonged to an Egyptian victim, the country's ambassador to France has said.
Ihab Badawi said that the passport belongs to Waleed Abdel-Razzak, a football fan who was critically injured in the attack.
"No charges have been directed at Abdel-Razzak at all," Mr Badawi told Egypt's CBC news channel.

If you're foreign and you're found at an attack site you must be a terrorist! Except no. Oops.


It's already been alleged that the confirmed Syrian attacker came into Europe as a 'refugee'

lol alleged. It's also been alleged that you don't have a fucking clue what you're on about but you don't seem to let that stop you

[-:Undertaker:-]

@FlyingJesus (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=24753); -repped me saying all that research on muslim extremism was just nonsense.

Well yet again I am proved right, here's what the French security services are dealing with when it comes to Islamic extremism.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/11996323/France-is-fighting-unwinnable-war-against-terror.html?utm_campaign=Echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook


France is fighting an unwinnable war against the rising threat of Islamic terrorism, leading French terror experts warned last night.

Disaffected Muslim populations at home, unpoliced European borders and battle-hardened fighters now flowing in from Syria and Iraq were creating a perfect storm of terror that is now in danger of defeating the French security services.

France is estimated to have 2,000 citizens involved in Syrian and Iraq jihadi networks and a further 3,800 individuals known to domestic intelligence services as “radicalised”, all watched over by just 3,200 intelligence officers.

The services are overwhelmed,” said Jean-Charles Brisard, head of the Paris-based Centre for the Analysis of Terrorism, “when you consider it takes 25 officers to provide round-the-clock surveillance on one individual, you can see the difficulty.”

Europe’s open border policy allowing weapons and terrorists to flow freely into France - with at least two of the Friday night attackers coming in from Belgium - means that there are now real fears that it is almost impossible for the intelligence services to keep track of the jihadi threat.

Wonder if *REMOVED* will reply? Can he reply? Or will he just reply with his usual off the cuff remarks of absolute written snot.

Edited by Expling (Forum Moderator): Please do not target other forum members!

[FlyingJesus]

I -repped you for your provably false claims... you even later admitted that you'd pulled the number out of thin air. Changing the subject doesn't make you right, I can't believe after all these years and literally hundreds of threads where you've done this you still don't understand how facts and debates work

[-:Undertaker:-]

I -repped you for your provably false claims... you even later admitted that you'd pulled the number out of thin air. Changing the subject doesn't make you right, I can't believe after all these years and literally hundreds of threads where you've done this you still don't understand how facts and debates work

*REMOVED*

Edited by Samanfa (Forum Moderator): Please do not be rude to other members, thanks!

[FlyingJesus]

Yes, if you looked at the wrong data and made up inferences that were never stated. Good of you to dodge being proved wrong (as usual) about the Egyptian chap who you were getting up in arms about

ps: I never said anything of the sort. You can stop making up stories and pretending that everyone who disagrees with you is the same person any time you like, it would be great

[OldLoveSong]

Seriously wondering whats going to happen next, are allied countries going to be sending out ground troops to Syria and stop the threat where its happening and originating from? (Although I don't believe it can fully be stopped anyways, way too many supporters and ISIS's troops all over the world in different states and countries waiting for their leaders orders on where and when to attack, blending in as regular civilian and hiding out).

Saw this comment on Facebook and want to know peoples thoughts on it?


"The reason that there are so many refugees,is because countries, including our own are not willing to go into Syria and eliminate the problem. Everyone seems to be afraid to step on each other's toes. Instead of taking refugees in, eliminate the reason they are refugees to begin with."

[AgnesIO]

Seriously wondering whats going to happen next, are allied countries going to be sending out ground troops to Syria and stop the threat where its happening and originating from? (Although I don't believe it can fully be stopped anyways, way too many supporters and ISIS's troops all over the world in different states and countries waiting for their leaders orders on where and when to attack, blending in as regular civilian and hiding out).

Saw this comment on Facebook and want to know peoples thoughts on it?

Sorry, but that's a really ignorant view of the problem. Ultimately, for this particular 'battle', ISIS are the winners. Before Dan tries to claim that I like ISIS or something, let me explain.... we have two options.

- Don't react any more than we already are. Problem is, ISIS will continue to grow, and use this as 'come and join us - we will soon be in power!!'
OR
- Go in and destroy parts of the Middle East. Problem is, ISIS will then use this as propaganda; "We call all of our brothers to join us. The West are killing our people."

Ultimately, we are damned if we do, damned if we don't.

Of course, I think we should step up our fight against them - but there will be consequences in doing so.

[buttons]

i don't think it's ignorant???
it's true that doing nothing and letting refugees into the west clearly isn't the solution because people are still going to be killed in the name of 'Islam'
but you're right, we don't have to go to the war-torn countries and intervene but surely we have a duty to protect our own country and people? and if that means extra security, being more "choosy" when allowing people in, then i don't see the problem.

[-:Undertaker:-]

@FlyingJesus (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=24753); don't believe I stated one was from Egypt. I'm simply reporting sources, hence the word alleged for one attacker.

I will guarantee right here right now however infront of you all that within the next 6 months there will be at least one other attempted terrorist attack from a 'refugee'.

@conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); No we shouldn't drop bombs in Raqqa on Islamic State because Islamic State in Iraq isn't the immediate threat to national security. The threat to national security are the people - Angela Merkel, the European Commission, the French government - along with cheerleaders like you who demanded that we allow hundreds of thousands of people from a highly radical war into Europe. That's the real threat to French national security along with open borders which allowed at least one attacker to cross numerous borders from Greece without any checks and another to cross the Belgian-French border without any checks. Oh and did I mention the Islamic ghettos across Europe where security services and authorities now admit they have 'lost control' in? Kind of like how in Rotherham they 'lost control' and thousands of English girls were passed around whilst the authorities sat by and did nothing for fear of being branded racist.... by people like you and Tom.

- - - Updated - - -


i don't think it's ignorant???
it's true that doing nothing and letting refugees into the west clearly isn't the solution because people are still going to be killed in the name of 'Islam'
but you're right, we don't have to go to the war-torn countries and intervene but surely we have a duty to protect our own country and people? and if that means extra security, being more "choosy" when allowing people in, then i don't see the problem.

jen that's just so racist how could you be so level headed

[AgnesIO]

i don't think it's ignorant???
it's true that doing nothing and letting refugees into the west clearly isn't the solution because people are still going to be killed in the name of 'Islam'
but you're right, we don't have to go to the war-torn countries and intervene but surely we have a duty to protect our own country and people? and if that means extra security, being more "choosy" when allowing people in, then i don't see the problem.

She didn't say stopping the flow of people, she said to send troops in - those are two very, very different things.

[FlyingJesus]

I literally quoted you saying "One attacker so far is confirmed to be from Syria and another was found with an Egyptian passport", you can't then backtrack and pretend that you've not said that an attacker was Egyptian. Aaaaaaaaaaaaand of course you then had to decide to make up what I feel about issues, lol shambles

[AgnesIO]

@conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); No we shouldn't drop bombs in Raqqa on Islamic State because Islamic State in Iraq isn't the immediate threat to national security. The threat to national security are the people - Angela Merkel, the European Commission, the French government - along with cheerleaders like you who demanded that we allow hundreds of thousands of people from a highly radical war into Europe. That's the real threat to French national security along with open borders which allowed at least one attacker to cross numerous borders from Greece without any checks and another to cross the Belgian-French border without any checks. Oh and did I mention the Islamic ghettos across Europe where security services and authorities now admit they have 'lost control' in? Kind of like how in Rotherham they 'lost control' and thousands of English girls were passed around whilst the authorities sat by and did nothing for fear of being branded racist.... by people like you and Tom.

You just posted a thread saying French intelligence services are 'watching' 5,000 people. How many of those have been watched for a lot longer than the refugee crisis? Or are you telling me they were not watching anyone before the crisis?

Girls get passed around all the time, every single fucking day, for fuck sake. If you are really so fucking small minded to think that getting rid of Islam is some how going to protect every girl in Britain, then YOU are the problem in this country. Sex trafficking, sexual exploitation, sex slavery - those are GIGANTIC issues and the whole Rotheram thing (which was terrible) is a tiny, tiny piece of the pie.

[-:Undertaker:-]

I literally quoted you saying "One attacker so far is confirmed to be from Syria and another was found with an Egyptian passport", you can't then backtrack and pretend that you've not said that an attacker was Egyptian. Aaaaaaaaaaaaand of course you then had to decide to make up what I feel about issues, lol shambles

An Egyptian passport was found and thought to belong to an attacker....

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/paris-terror-attacks-syrian-passport-found-on-body-of-suicide-bomber-at-stade-de-france-a6734491.html
http://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/passport-of-egyptian-man-belongs-to-victim-not-attacker-officials-say/


The Egyptian ambassador to France, Ihab Badawi, said that the Egyptian passport found after the Paris attacks belongs to a man called Waleed Abdel-Razzak.

Abdel-Razzak, according to Egyptian website Al Ahram, sustained severe injuries in the bombing.

Badawi said the media “incorrectly” described Abdel-Razzak as a suspect in the bombings that hit the French capital.

- - - Updated - - -


You just posted a thread saying French intelligence services are 'watching' 5,000 people. How many of those have been watched for a lot longer than the refugee crisis? Or are you telling me they were not watching anyone before the crisis?

Girls get passed around all the time, every single **** day, for **** sake. If you are really so **** small minded to think that getting rid of Islam is some how going to protect every girl in Britain, then YOU are the problem in this country. Sex trafficking, sexual exploitation, sex slavery - those are GIGANTIC issues and the whole Rotheram thing (which was terrible) is a tiny, tiny piece of the pie.

And do you think they'll have to watch a lot more as a result of opening the borders to hundreds of thousands of Syrian muslims? It isn't rocket science really is it.

[AgnesIO]

An Egyptian passport was found and thought to belong to an attacker....

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/paris-terror-attacks-syrian-passport-found-on-body-of-suicide-bomber-at-stade-de-france-a6734491.html
http://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/passport-of-egyptian-man-belongs-to-victim-not-attacker-officials-say/



- - - Updated - - -



And do you think they'll have to watch a lot more as a result of opening the borders to hundreds of thousands of Syrian muslims? It isn't rocket science really is it.

How many of those have been watched for a lot longer than the refugee crisis? Or are you telling me they were not watching anyone before the crisis?

[FlyingJesus]

An Egyptian passport was found and thought to belong to an attacker....

Yes I'm aware of that, but there was already a post debunking that thought long before you decided to continue claiming that one of the attackers was Egyptian to score points

[-:Undertaker:-]

How many of those have been watched for a lot longer than the refugee crisis? Or are you telling me they were not watching anyone before the crisis?

Most of them, and that was through more controlled islamic immigration (although still too high as I say every time).

Think of what the figure will spiral to if you get your way and hundreds of thousands keep pouring into Europe from a highly sectarian warzone.


Yes I'm aware of that, but there was already a post debunking that thought long before you decided to continue claiming that one of the attackers was Egyptian to score points

Yes you were aware of that weren't you. I'm so sorry I don't have instant updates from MI5 and have to go by media sources in a fast-paced debate like everyone else.

[AgnesIO]

Most of them, and that was through more controlled islamic immigration (although still too high as I say every time).

Think of what the figure will spiral to if you get your way and hundreds of thousands keep pouring into Europe from a highly sectarian warzone.


Well if there are hundreds of thousands, let's say 1,000,000.

Let's say 50% of those go to France. That's 500,000 people. Let's say 5% of those are radicalised. That's 25,000. Let's add that to the 5,000 you already have, we now had 30,000. We now have 0.6% of Muslims in France radicalised. Still not 5%, is it?

[FlyingJesus]

Yes you were aware of that weren't you. I'm so sorry I don't have instant updates from MI5 and have to go by media sources in a fast-paced debate like everyone else.

What the hell are you on about the post showing that the Egyptian passport DIDN'T belong to an attacker was at 11:25 this morning and your post still making the claim was at 19:29. Are you saying you need more than 6 hours to read a single post?

[-:Undertaker:-]

Well if there are hundreds of thousands, let's say 1,000,000.

Let's say 50% of those go to France. That's 500,000 people. Let's say 5% of those are radicalised. That's 25,000. Let's add that to the 5,000 you already have, we now had 30,000. We now have 0.6% of Muslims in France radicalised. Still not 5%, is it?

It's called an example figure, nowhere did I claim 5% was the actual figure. I later provided actual figures, which you did not like.

But let's get down to it: will you now admit you were wrong to call for Europe to open itself up to hundreds of thousands of Syrian muslim 'refugees'?

- - - Updated - - -


What the hell are you on about the post showing that the Egyptian passport DIDN'T belong to an attacker was at 11:25 this morning and your post still making the claim was at 19:29. Are you saying you need more than 6 hours to read a single post?

The other attacker is from Syria and we're still to find out about the other, so if I get one wrong via media reports that means my whole argument is wrong? No my son.

[AgnesIO]

It's called an example figure, nowhere did I claim 5% was the actual figure. I later provided actual figures, which you did not like.

But let's get down to it: will you now admit you were wrong to call for Europe to open itself up to hundreds of thousands of Syrian muslim 'refugees'?

I don't recall ever saying we should let every single person in. But no, I won't track back on my original comments; if anything, the attacks in Paris back up why so many of these 'economic migrants' are fleeing in the first place. I think I'd fucking flee if my city was like Paris on a daily basis, to be honest.

You didn't ever say "example", you said 5%. That's simply what you said. The real figures (as mentioned in another thread) are not "real", they are embarrassingly vague questions and an embarrassingly small sample (assuming that was the 1,000 sample one - might be wrong there though).

[FlyingJesus]

No it means the bit that I showed was wrong was wrong, simple as that you don't need to make up what I'm saying *+*+again*+*+

Although doesn't show great promise if you're not able to keep up to date on what's essentially a day-old update...

[-:Undertaker:-]

@conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); a 1,000 sample in scientific polling is standard. Nice try though.

And how amazing that you still think we should open the borders. An absolutely incredible statement to make after 130 French people lay dead in a pool of blood.

[AgnesIO]

@conservative (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); a 1,000 sample in scientific polling is standard. Nice try though.

And how amazing that you still think we should open the borders. An absolutely incredible statement to make after 130 French people lay dead in a pool of blood.

Nice of you to ignore the poor quality questions comment.

Also, did I say that? Please, do quote me.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Nice of you to ignore the poor quality questions comment.

The questions are clear cut unless you're looking for excuses just as you tried then by questioning the polling sample size (as all people who do not like polling results often do). It's just a shame you don't put this much questioning to yourself as to why allowing muslim people from a radicalised war into Christian countries is a good idea when we've just had one of them travel to Paris and help murder 130+ people in horrific fashion.


Also, did I say that? Please, do quote me.

So how many should be let in? Let's narrow it down for our audience and ask how many Syrians do you want Britain to take in?

I can give a clear answer: 0. Can you return the favour and do the same please?

[AgnesIO]

The questions are clear cut unless you're looking for excuses just as you tried then by questioning the polling sample size (as all people who do not like polling results often do). It's just a shame you don't put this much questioning to yourself as to why allowing muslim people from a radicalised war into Christian countries is a good idea when we've just had one of them travel to Paris and help murder 130+ people in horrific fashion.



So how many should be let in? Let's narrow it down for our audience and ask how many Syrians do you want Britain to take in?

I can give a clear answer: 0. Can you return the favour and do the same please?

The questions are not clear cut, as I have already proven. Please, continue to ignore my points.

Oh right, so if you were to go and blow up somewhere in Indonesia, they should ban all British people because one of us did something? #DansLogic. Oh, and Christian? Most people in this country are about as Christian as I am German.

I don't think it's entirely a numbers game; I know that's all you want to do, but there is more to it than pure maths.

[lawrawrrr]

All Paris threads have been closed for a cool-off period while moderators review all the posts up until this point as a lot of there are a lot of personal attacks going on. We remember those innocent victims of Paris - and elsewhere in the world - with peace and solidarity, not by arguing with each other and calling each other nasty names ~ lawrawrrr (General Manager)

[-:Undertaker:-]

https://twitter.com/SkyNewsBreak/status/666158288850014208


Sky News Update - BFM reports five people have been arrested and a rocket launcher has been seized in #Lyon during police raids after #ParisAttacks

Tip of the iceberg.

No other option but for the armed forces of the republic to raid and secure each and every Islamic ghetto in France. Now.

[abc]

I got bored after a few pages as it was Dan just repeating himself as always - another reason why I now avoid the Current Affairs forum.


Oh take a hike. I wondered how long before people like you started getting the excuses in for the religion of peace. What is it about you which can't understand that even if only 1% of muslims are extreme (it is actually higher) then 1 in every 100 is enough to bring western civilisation to a standstill when you are allowing in millions? Why must people like me who didn't want any of this in Europe be blown up or shot dead on our way to work because of your absolute stupidity?

Don't give me your love and hate sixth form speech either son to dodge the issue here, heard all that before and it doesn't wash.

The same western civilisation brought Iraq to a standstill and killed thousands of innocent people. But hey, why do you care right? Oh and we did it first. British Troops piss on Muslims, no one cares. British and American troops assassinate innocent people in Afghanistan like it is Call of Duty and no one gives a crap.
But the second a few Muslims kill white people, O.M.G ALL MUSLIMS ARE EVIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Grow up and stop with your rubbish generalisation.


I have no sympathy with people sympathising/justifying towards the murder of a magazine editor for the mere act of criticising and mocking a religion.

I'm appalled that you could even somehow sympathise with that position. As I said, disgusting.

Yet people show no sympathy for the Muslims we butchered in the wars we love to create for oil and other crap to show our "power" to the world.


British troops are actively just killing innocent muslims in the Middle East and Africa are they?

Are you really equating civilian casualties in a war with that of Islamic terrorists who open fire in a restaurant?

If you refer to the thousands of innocent people including children we murdered in Iraq as "civilian casualties of a war" then them killing French people in Paris or British people in London is the same for them as they are still in a war for us. So I guess the people who died in France are just "civilian casualties in a war". Sad thing is you forget that we are bigger terrorists than them, invading their country when they did nothing to us. For what? Oil disguised as WMD.


make out that i'm a racist.

you racist!!!!!

In all seriousness, look at it from the point of view of someone living in these middle eastern countries. HALF A MILLION Iraqis died as a result of the Iraq war. That is the number of people BRITISH AND AMERICANS HAVE MURDERED. But we are not labelled as terrorists. Now imagine, a lot of these half a million people lost their whole family, jobs and everything that belonged to them because we wanted their oil. They have nothing left in life. I have no doubt many of them will want revenge and I can easily see why they would turn to "radical" Islam and want to attack us.

I do not agree with what happened in Paris, I do not agree with what happened in Iraq etc, but we caused this situation. We added fuel to these organisations by attacking their country for our own benefit. So stop frigging blaming religion. Which "religion" caused us to destroy the lives of half a million people? Which "religion" caused crazy mental people in America to shoot innocent children at school? Which "religion" caused 1.2 million people in UK to be full time criminals. Which "religion" caused over 40,000 people to be on the child sex offenders register? Just because a few people shout religious words during murders, it does not automatically mean the whole religion agrees with them.

https://external.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/safe_image.php?d=AQANYHoUbuIiM6wl&w=487&h=487&url=https%3A%2F%2Fscontent.cdninstagram.com%2Fhpho tos-xpa1%2Ft51.2885-15%2Fe35%2F11377833_1303461996346187_2011461094_n. jpg

[-:Undertaker:-]

@snr (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=125189); is now engaging in self-blame as though those people in Paris restaurants brought being shot in the head on themselves. Or as if the actions of a few rogue British or American troops is somehow comparable to the actions of Islamic State or somehow justifies the murder of innocent people. It'd be the same as arguing that the IRA somehow had some justification because of the inevitable odd abuse by British commanders over the years. It's in very very poor taste.

Those in the Muslim world who follow strains such as Wahhabism would attack and kill anybody who differs from them whether we'd gone to Iraq or not.

Smell the coffee.


I do not agree with what happened in Paris, I do not agree with what happened in Iraq etc, but we caused this situation. We added fuel to these organisations by attacking their country for our own benefit. So stop frigging blaming religion.

Oh aye, yeah al-Qaeda, al-Nusra and Islamic State will just put down their weapons and become peaceful if we just withdraw from the Persian Gulf.

It's one excuse after the other for this religion isn't it. Next you'll be justifying their actions because we dare support via arms and trade the only democratic and humane state in the region which is Israel which nearly all the hateful Arab states have tried wiping out a number of times.

If you want to surrender to radical Islam then go over there yourself and do it. But don't commit suicide on behalf of all western christian civilisation.


Which "religion" caused 1.2 million people in UK to be full time criminals. Which "religion" caused over 40,000 people to be on the child sex offenders register?

Yes because criminals in the UK often shout "PRAISE BE TO JESUS" before raping or stealing people. Get back to the circus.

[FlyingJesus]

I can't see anything in his post that says any of the killings were justified

[-:Undertaker:-]

I can't see anything in his post that says any of the killings were justified

oh only the entire post where he insinuates that we brought it on ourselves via iraq completely ignoring the history of the likes of wahhabism that goes back well before 2003. because we all know wahhabists and salafists are reasonable people who would put down their weapons tomorrow if we just left them alone. :rolleyes:

[abc]

@snr (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=125189); is now engaging in self-blame as though those people in Paris restaurants brought being shot in the head on themselves. Or as if the actions of a few rogue British or American troops is somehow comparable to the actions of Islamic State or somehow justifies the murder of innocent people. It'd be the same as arguing that the IRA somehow had some justification because of the inevitable odd abuse by British commanders over the years. It's in very very poor taste.

Those in the Muslim world who follow strains such as Wahhabism would attack and kill anybody who differs from them whether we'd gone to Iraq or not.

Smell the coffee.



Oh aye, yeah al-Qaeda, al-Nusra and Islamic State will just put down their weapons and become peaceful if we just withdraw from the Persian Gulf.

It's one excuse after the other for this religion isn't it. Next you'll be justifying their actions because we dare support via arms and trade the only democratic and humane state in the region which is Israel which nearly all the hateful Arab states have tried wiping out a number of times.

If you want to surrender to radical Islam then go over there yourself and do it. But don't commit suicide on behalf of all western christian civilisation.



Yes because criminals in the UK often shout "PRAISE BE TO JESUS" before raping or stealing people. Get back to the circus.

You are a lunatic. I didn't realise it was only a "few rouge British an American troops" who murdered 500,000 Iraqis. And where on earth have I said any loss of life is justified? I said stop generalising.

No, you're right. British people do not shout anything before raping young girls or murdering people. That means these nasty traits are just in British peoples heads, that means all British people must be born with it. Omg all countries should ban us in case one of us rapes someone abroad. This is a ridiculous generalisation right? Good, I am glad you see it because this is the kind of ridiculous generalisations you are making.

- - - Updated - - -


oh only the entire post where he insinuates that we brought it on ourselves via iraq completely ignoring the history of the likes of wahhabism that goes back well before 2003. because we all know wahhabists and salafists are reasonable people who would put down their weapons tomorrow if we just left them alone. :rolleyes:

All Germans must be evil due to the Nazis.

[-:Undertaker:-]

he describes civilian casualties in a war as "murdered" lols and calls me the lunatic. i'm no fan of the iraq war by all means but come on, that's like describing the deaths of japanese or germans in world war ii by british and american bombers as murders when clearly it's regrettable civilian casualties.

and for the record, i was mainly against the iraq war because the removal of the ba'ath regime (awful though it was) is one hundred times less preferable to more militant strains of islam which have grown across the arab world in the last 50 years. in other words, saddam hussein was a monster who was able and who knew how to keep a population with many monsters under control hence why all stable arab states are the way they are.

truth is that islam has many problems and many awful strains which command considerable support amongst muslim populations across the world. the likes of wahhabism are hell bent on domination and global jihad against infideals as well as wanting to push Israel into the sea. it cannot be reasoned with or negotiated with & nor should we. that's why i always warn people criticising the House of Saud to be careful what they wish for, because their potential islamic replacements make them look timid.


All Germans must be evil due to the Nazis.

trying the same tactic that others have already tried in the thread as though i'm claiming all muslims are terrorists lol.

"considerable support" and similar words and phrases do not mean 'all'. to have a rational debate from this point on about radical islam you're gonna have to accept that or there's really no point continuing with it.

[abc]

he describes civilian casualties in a war as "murdered" lols and calls me the lunatic. i'm no fan of the iraq war by all means but come on, that's like describing the deaths of japanese or germans in world war ii by british and american bombers as murders when clearly it's regrettable civilian casualties.

truth is that islam has many problems and many awful strains which command considerable support amongst muslim populations across the world. the likes of wahhabism are hell bent on domination and global jihad against infideals as well as wanting to push Israel into the sea. it cannot be reasoned with or negotiated with & nor should we.

Oh yeah because killing a innocent human because we wanted to steal oil but disguised it as WMD is OK. KILLING A INNOCENT PERSON IS OK? ARE YOU A LUNATIC?! HALF A MILLION PEOPLE. DID YOU NOT SEE THE VIDEO WHERE OUR TROOPS WERE IN A HELICOPTER PICKING AND SHOOTING AT INNOCENT PEOPLE ON THE STREET FOR FUN? OH WAIT, THAT CAN'T BE MURDER, THEY ARE CASUALTIES OF A WAR. ARE YOU INSANE?!
IN THE SAME SENSE, THESE BLOOMING TERRORISTS CAN SAY "OH ITS OK THE PARIS PEOPLE DIED, COS THEY WERE NOT MURDERED, THEY ARE JUST CIVILIAN CASUALTY OF THE WAR".

You make my blood boil. I am done with this thread. Majority of the forum disagrees with your skewed messed up deluded view of this world. You think you know so much but you know so little. I wish you were born in Iraq or Syria or any of these countries. Then lets see what your opinion would be.

[FlyingJesus]

You badly interpreting what people mean doesn't change what they genuinely have or haven't said

[-:Undertaker:-]

Oh yeah because killing a innocent human because we wanted to steal oil but disguised it as WMD is OK. KILLING A INNOCENT PERSON IS OK? ARE YOU A LUNATIC?! HALF A MILLION PEOPLE. DID YOU NOT SEE THE VIDEO WHERE OUR TROOPS WERE IN A HELICOPTER PICKING AND SHOOTING AT INNOCENT PEOPLE ON THE STREET FOR FUN? OH WAIT, THAT CAN'T BE MURDER, THEY ARE CASUALTIES OF A WAR. ARE YOU INSANE?!
IN THE SAME SENSE, THESE BLOOMING TERRORISTS CAN SAY "OH ITS OK THE PARIS PEOPLE DIED, COS THEY WERE NOT MURDERED, THEY ARE JUST CIVILIAN CASUALTY OF THE WAR".

You make my blood boil. I am done with this thread. Majority of the forum disagrees with your skewed messed up deluded view of this world. You think you know so much but you know so little. I wish you were born in Iraq or Syria or any of these countries. Then lets see what your opinion would be.

looks like the ravings of someone from the green party when discussing geopolitics in the middle east. i'm just surprised you didn't manage to blame Israel too.

i don't know why you keep insisting to debate the iraq war with me in every thread on this when i agree that the iraq war was a geopolitical disaster. however that war is not the root cause of all the problems in the region and nor is it the region for radical strains of islam such as salafism and wahhabism that have plagued the region for over a century before tony blair was even baby sperm.

read your history, i suggest for wahhabism reading on how saudi arabia was formed and the balance of power in that kingdom. it's an eye-opener.

[abc]

looks like the ravings of someone from the green party when discussing geopolitics in the middle east. i'm just surprised you didn't manage to blame Israel too.

i don't know why you keep insisting to debate the iraq war with me in every thread on this when i agree that the iraq war was a geopolitical disaster. however that war is not the root cause of all the problems in the region and nor is it the region for radical strains of islam such as salafism and wahhabism that have plagued the region for over a century before tony blair was even baby sperm.

read your history, i suggest for wahhabism reading on how saudi arabia was formed and the balance of power in that kingdom. it's an eye-opener.

Because before the Iraq war, Al Qaeda did not exist in Iraq. ISIS has formed from the death of Bin Laden. ISIS are the ones going crazy. Oh look, there is the link to the Iraq war.

I do not agree with a lot of what is in the Quran or middle eastern way of life but you always generalise which is ignorant and shit. People like you are sick if you think our borders should determine which human life is worth more than the other. We do not choose where we are born.

Oh and why have you ignored my comment about us murdering people for fun? Oh wait, you do it every time someone proves you wrong.

[-:Undertaker:-]

@snr (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=125189); Islamic State and other groups are just a continuation of other groups like wahhabist islam which comes from the deserts of saudi arabia and that area. whilst it's true the problem got worse because of the removal of saddam hussein (something you'd see i was just saying above) it does not mean that radical islam is somehow a creationof british and american foreign policy. that's just an absurd position to take which you seem to believe.

as for generalising, you just did that by claiming i am saying all muslims are terrorists when all i've done is posted research into radical views in islam and stated it's a considerable number but not even a majority. but still enough to cause huge security problems as the french and belgian authorities have said so themselves.

and finally on borders, borders are there to protect people and a country is the product of the people who live there. it is up to the european peoples whether they want islam to become a stronger force in their societies or not. plainly speaking and from a selfish perspective here, i do not want islam to grow in influence in my society because as a gay person that isn't good news for me nor would it be good news for women, freedom of expression or criticism of religion as even mainstream islam does not view these things at all in a good way. are you honestly saying abolish all borders in the world? if so, i again go back to when you called me a lunatic and would ask you to go back and do a self-assessment on that buddy.


Oh and why have you ignored my comment about us murdering people for fun? Oh wait, you do it every time someone proves you wrong.

because you're referring to isolated ROGUE incidents in the British and American armed forces which are appalling but which are not official policy.

does that answer your comment or do i need to explain anything more about that. what. is. so. hard. to. understand. about. that.

[abc]

@snr (http://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=125189); Islamic State and other groups are just a continuation of other groups like wahhabist islam which comes from the deserts of saudi arabia and that area. whilst it's true the problem got worse because of the removal of saddam hussein (something you'd see i was just saying above) it does not mean that radical islam is somehow a creationof british and american foreign policy. that's just an absurd position to take which you seem to believe.

as for generalising, you just did that by claiming i am saying all muslims are terrorists when all i've done is posted research into radical views in islam and stated it's a considerable number but not even a majority. but still enough to cause huge security problems as the french and belgian authorities have said so themselves.

and finally on borders, borders are there to protect people and a country is the product of the people who live there. it is up to the european peoples whether they want islam to become a stronger force in their societies or not. plainly speaking and from a selfish perspective here, i do not want islam to grow in influence in my society because as a gay person that isn't good news for me nor would it be good news for women, freedom of expression or criticism of religion as even mainstream islam does not view these things at all in a good way. are you honestly saying abolish all borders in the world? if so, i again go back to when you called me a lunatic and would ask you to go back and do a self-assessment on that buddy.




My border comment was in relation to your hatred of refugees. If we had left Iraq etc alone, I believe there would be less deaths in the world. There would be less attacks. ISIS would not exist. But by meddling in their lives, killing them, attacking them, destroying their country, we fuelled it all.

In India, it was frowned upon for woman to wear revealing clothes. It was common practice to have arranged marriages. It was common practice that woman do whatever a man say. Now? It is rapidly moving towards how the western society is - girls out drinking in revealing clothes, people choosing who they want to marry, men and women having equal say. If someone had come along and bombed India to bits, killed half a million people, destroyed lives, I can assure you the situation in India would be a lot different.


because you're referring to isolated ROGUE incidents in the British and American armed forces which are appalling but which are not official policy.

does that answer your comment or do i need to explain anything more about that. what. is. so. hard. to. understand. about. that.

Haha thank you. Yet when a few rogue Muslims attack us, we should blame the views of all Muslims.
You are an absolute lunatic.

Say what you want, I will not be replying as it is a waste of my time.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Haha thank you. Yet when a few rogue Muslims attack us, we should blame the views of all Muslims.

this lie again.

where have i stated that all muslims are radical

[AgnesIO]

this lie again.

where have i stated that all muslims are radical

True, you only branded 75,000,000 radicals.

[-:Undertaker:-]

True, you only branded 75,000,000 radicals.

you mean the 5% example?