International Side of Habbox

[Matt]

Having a look back at Habbox's past and looking through the Wiki, I came across the (unfinished) page about former Habbox roles. I wasn't actually aware of the Assistant General Manager (International) role that was around, or the fact we had Habboxworld (before my time). According to the page, it says it was quite successful and was closed due to the costly running of the site.

Seeing as Habbox doesn't have any real infrastructure for the international side (because it's non-existent), would it not be worth having something in place to at least attempt at reviving it? Moving to OC, NA Managers and entirely new departments is a massive change where you'd need the staff in the first place to actually make the move (and therefore I'm not asking for that) but it would be cool to maybe try introduce something to tackle that side of Habbox? I feel like any new international members that join just leave due to Habbox dying once it gets to like 11pm.

Yes we get the occasional non-GMT manager passing through but they never last long due to timezones being blamed for poor communication and things being so hard in terms of monitoring staff (or at least that's the experiences I've had).

If you didn't want to have every department branching into OC, NA etc why not have an international side that comprises of all departments.

E.G.

AGM International
Intl Habboxlive DJ
Intl Events Organiser
Intl Help Desk Staff

Those are ofc just the community depts but they'd all report to the AGM and saves having separate managers? Or alternatively they could report to the standard managers but they'd fall under AGM international? There's a few ways you could have it, that's just one way I can think of. Not sure if you'd need to have non-community departments branching into international roles but it could happen too.

Thanks for reading.

[_spirit]

Thanks Matt for writing this post for me.

[GoldenMerc]

Yeh its not a bad idea, I think I was super mod on HabboxWorld & Help desk manager for CA.

In all honesty, it was totally dead, but it was a new forum, it'd be interesting to have it on here. I think its worth a try, if all fails, it fails so what

[Matt]

if all fails, it fails so what

I agree. No harm in trying imo.

I can't recall anything really being in place for the international side since I joined. But I was inactive from 09 - 11 I think.
@Nick (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=75119); would be good in the role

[Nick]

I agree. No harm in trying imo.

I can't recall anything really being in place for the international side since I joined. But I was inactive from 09 - 11 I think.
@Nick (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=75119); would be good in the role

what role is that

[Matt]

what role is that

Intl HabboxLive DJ :)

[Nick]

Intl HabboxLive DJ :)

only if i can play the amity affliction and architects

[Brad]

I think it's a good idea. Though I don't think we would need a whole entirely new forum, and what not but I think if we were to have our staff in all levels of management (AGM, Manager, seniors, regular) There will be enough staff that would help us take the step into getting an international side.

[Matt]

only if i can play the amity affliction and architects

but bro you gotta talk


I think it's a good idea. Though I don't think we would need a whole entirely new forum, and what not but I think if we were to have our staff in all levels of management (AGM, Manager, seniors, regular) There will be enough staff that would help us take the step into getting an international side.

I don't think we need a new forum. We struggle with forum activity as it is. I just feel like with the model I suggested below isn't really introducing any new roles (except one) and it would fall into place with the pre-existing structure Habbox has in terms of staff. If it did fail, you'd just get rid of "Intl" and go back to normal.

[Brad]

And lets be honest; Team Bravo (When i first joined habboxlive) was meant for International DJs. AESTand CA was most common in that department because the Head/Senior DJs would be around to help out.

[Cerys]

In the hxhd when I was there, and a few years ago too, we had the intl group managed by the intl senior which worked out quite well!
I mean sometimes there was only the senior and one other person in the group but still ;)

Not a clue if this still in place but it's a good example of where it has worked

Would be nice to see habbox more active during the night with new members

[Nick]

but bro you gotta talk

yer i will

is there even enough international staff to apply for these roles seeing as theres like 5 people in the OC area.

[lawrawrrr]

Okay so I'm at work so only giving a small reply right now

I do think that I would love to increase the international side, and we still have international seniors/heads (well, until they quit) in HxL and HxHD in particular. There are (well, historically there should be) specific teams for international people so they have a chat with other people in their time zone and are supposed to encourage each other when it's generally quieter for the rest of us!

We have recently (maybe a year ago) had a dedicated international manager but there wasn't a huge improvement even despite that.

One thing I will say is that I don't think bypassing managers and having one International AGM will be a good way to go. Managers have their own visions and way of running their departments and should be in charge of that, having someone making big decisions over their head will not go down well.

However, most of the cases will be silly things that need sorting - it's motivating staff, it's "help I have a problem with the panel", being online to supervise events or shows or something - all of these things are in the senior staff's role description.

After Hannah left HxHD I had a conversation with Jake about having a new senior, and whether they would be international or not. What id really like is a core of international people who are really into promotion and integration, active in some departments, which can only help to recruit MORE of those people!

I do firmly believe that international should be integrated and not separate though, to fit with Habbox's mission as a whole.


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[Brad]

http://www.habbox.com/staffupload/../assets/images//2016/06/10/60bf0c1a60d1b7f391192c8f51e78049.png

Now, the time stamp is in my time zone but that's the time in which I feel it always dies on the forum. We need to find those from the West coast of North America (in reality) to help drive that dead space...

[Matt]

yer i will

is there even enough international staff to apply for these roles seeing as theres like 5 people in the OC area.

Well there's a few but the hope would be that they grow as a result?


Thanks Matt for writing this post for me.

that's ok thanks for encouraging me to share my ideas :)

[lawrawrrr]

http://www.habbox.com/staffupload/../assets/images//2016/06/10/60bf0c1a60d1b7f391192c8f51e78049.png

Now, the time stamp is in my time zone but that's the time in which I feel it always dies on the forum. We need to find those from the West coast of North America (in reality) to help drive that dead space...

Even when we have had people from that time zone active (and we do have a handful from there even now), they don't seem to want to post on the forum or get that involved... which is a wider problem with the forum as a whole I believe. It's attracting people and giving them an incentive to post!

[Matt]

One thing I will say is that I don't think bypassing managers and having one International AGM will be a good way to go. Managers have their own visions and way of running their departments and should be in charge of that, having someone making big decisions over their head will not go down well.

However, most of the cases will be silly things that need sorting - it's motivating staff, it's "help I have a problem with the panel", being online to supervise events or shows or something - all of these things are in the senior staff's role description.

After Hannah left HxHD I had a conversation with Jake about having a new senior, and whether they would be international or not. What id really like is a core of international people who are really into promotion and integration, active in some departments, which can only help to recruit MORE of those people!

I do firmly believe that international should be integrated and not separate though, to fit with Habbox's mission as a whole.


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The only reason I suggested AGM International is because I feel like there needs to be someone in higher management with the power to make changes that's actually in the non-GMT timezone. I feel if there isn't, then we will be where we are now, with our current structure of international seniors and the odd international manager being in a minority where they hardly see management at all.

[lawrawrrr]

The only reason I suggested AGM International is because I feel like there needs to be someone in higher management with the power to make changes that's actually is in the non-GMT timezone. I feel if there isn't, then we will be where we are now, with our current structure of international seniors and the odd international manager being in a minority where they hardly see management at all.

I don't mean this to sound passive aggressive but what "changes" are you thinking? An intl AGM wouldn't be able to decide to change minimums or the way the raffle is run - for a few example - they would just have the responsibility for recruitment ideas and general supervision (which is definitely needed, but doesn't seem like an AGM role?)

[Brad]

Even when we have had people from that time zone active (and we do have a handful from there even now), they don't seem to want to post on the forum or get that involved... which is a wider problem with the forum as a whole I believe. It's attracting people and giving them an incentive to post!

oh I totally agree. It's determining what incentive is best. I know the forum runs on the BST time zone so for me a "new day" on the forum starts at 7pm, so i totally understand. I remember when we have a large quantity of staff from the international side and even then the forum was not thriving.. (back in summer 2014 was a good time to look at) maybe ciphering what was working well then, and what wasn't we can take steps to getting that time thriving again.

[Nick]

The only reason I suggested AGM International is because I feel like there needs to be someone in higher management with the power to make changes that's actually in the non-GMT timezone. I feel if there isn't, then we will be where we are now, with our current structure of international seniors and the odd international manager being in a minority where they hardly see management at all.

Wouldn't it be a problem with an international agm as well not seeing the other agms even though it would technically be kind of a separate part but ur on 1 forum making changes (if you were to do so) blah blah so you would wanna be working close to the other agms. like when me and phil were forum manager that was hard

edit from seeing lauras post:

might as well have an international forum admin aka chippiewill but active

[Matt]

I don't mean this to sound passive aggressive but what "changes" are you thinking? An intl AGM wouldn't be able to decide to change minimums or the way the raffle is run - for a few example - they would just have the responsibility for recruitment ideas and general supervision (which is definitely needed, but doesn't seem like an AGM role?)

Nah that's a legitimate question. When I say changes I guess I kind of mean representation within management? Having worked my way up in both Events and the Forum department, it's actually really hard to talk to managers who are in the GMT timezone. And if there's no senior from an international background, it's very ... lonely? I feel like if there's an AGM there who is able to maybe listen to ideas, relay them back to managers or even General Management, it's a step in the right direction and would maybe help staff retention?

AGMs get a say in a lot more than just minimums and the way the raffle is run. Having someone there who can talk from a different perspective of an international background would just help in my opinion.

[lawrawrrr]

oh I totally agree. It's determining what incentive is best. I know the forum runs on the BST time zone so for me a "new day" on the forum starts at 7pm, so i totally understand. I remember when we have a large quantity of staff from the international side and even then the forum was not thriving.. (back in summer 2014 was a good time to look at) maybe ciphering what was working well then, and what wasn't we can take steps to getting that time thriving again.

Well... I've been in management since then and even I can't answer that question. I wish I knew why people aren't posting as much, I wish I knew why our staff, in general, don't get as involved with forum, why we're attracting fewer people.

There are some theories and one of them is that we don't have enough events, comps or bigger HxL shows (although they're starting to kick off again!) to get the name out there and encourage people to sign up - and that is something that's improving already! I'm also working on staff incentives and involvement but every time I've tried it in the past, even offering hundreds of credits, new people just don't want to get involved and I have no use why!!

[lawrawrrr]

Wouldn't it be a problem with an international agm as well not seeing the other agms even though it would technically be kind of a separate part but ur on 1 forum making changes (if you were to do so) blah blah so you would wanna be working close to the other agms. like when me and phil were forum manager that was hard

edit from seeing lauras post:

might as well have an international forum admin aka chippiewill but active

What would the intl forum admin do? Will helped out doing a few cool effects and coding bits mainly, which isn't urgent?

[Matt]

Wouldn't it be a problem with an international agm as well not seeing the other agms even though it would technically be kind of a separate part but ur on 1 forum making changes (if you were to do so) blah blah so you would wanna be working close to the other agms. like when me and phil were forum manager that was hard

Yeah there is that. AGMs would have to make it work though, just like you and Phil made it work. I feel like an International AGM would just have to take one for the team if it meant they could represent the non-GMT side and be there to help the international side as a whole.

And International forum admin would also work quite well and would be there to help with minor issues and maybe panel issues depending on their permissions.

[Nick]

What would the intl forum admin do? Will helped out doing a few cool effects and coding bits mainly, which isn't urgent?

the same as intl agm but not make changes i guess

[Brad]

Yeah there is that. AGMs would have to make it work though, just like you and Phil made it work. I feel like an International AGM would just have to take one for the team if it meant they could represent the non-GMT side and be there to help the international side as a whole.

And International forum admin would also work quite well and would be there to help with minor issues and maybe panel issues depending on their permissions.

Agreed.
I think these two positions are key for a non-GMT time.
One would be more community based, giving us a leader to help promote events, djing, etc. in the non-gmt timezone
The other would be more content based, giving us help behind the scenes with the panel, habbox.com and also encouraging forum activity.

[lawrawrrr]

Nah that's a legitimate question. When I say changes I guess I kind of mean representation within management? Having worked my way up in both Events and the Forum department, it's actually really hard to talk to managers who are in the GMT timezone. And if there's no senior from an international background, it's very ... lonely? I feel like if there's an AGM there who is able to maybe listen to ideas, relay them back to managers or even General Management, it's a step in the right direction and would maybe help staff retention?

AGMs get a say in a lot more than just minimums and the way the raffle is run. Having someone there who can talk from a different perspective of an international background would just help in my opinion.

I know what you mean and I see that it is lonelier for you guys as there are less people. I would like seniors HxL, HxHD and events that are international, but it does seem a little bit pointless when there are so few international staff and every time we've had one, they haven't really done a lot of recruitment at all (which is a major part of any seniors role, but particularly international).

I'm really against having an international AGM as it is - I think it has the potential to go against managers or the AGMs of those actual departments. I do think that having more say from the international side would be good though - weirdly I have been thinking lately about the international side and I was considering setting up a 'steering group' of active international staff and members to come up with ideas and maybe even set some of them in motion?

I guess that would kind of be like a feedback thread but with more responsibility and with people who are actually around during those times to give a real picture and see what actually works! And it would be a good way of letting you guys know each other.

[David]

weirdly I have been thinking lately about the international side and I was considering setting up a

[12:39:14 PM] David: laura will go IVE BEEN THINKING ABOUT THIS AND MEANING TO DO IT

but yes i agree it's lacking if compared to other fansites you should return mdport and get all ur coffee club buddies to join

[lawrawrrr]

Agreed.
I think these two positions are key for a non-GMT time.
One would be more community based, giving us a leader to help promote events, djing, etc. in the non-gmt timezone
The other would be more content based, giving us help behind the scenes with the panel, habbox.com and also encouraging forum activity.

But they're senior role requirements IMO! The only thing extra would be admin on certain panels and things, which rarely go wrong any more - things like the server going down only a few people are trusted with etc etc. I guess I'm sceptical because every time we've appointed someone to particularly promote intl it's not been done :/

[lawrawrrr]

[12:39:14 PM] David: laura will go IVE BEEN THINKING ABOUT THIS AND MEANING TO DO IT

So? Am I not supposed to say I've thought about it? I'd hate that you guys think I'm totally oblivious to problems like this....

[Matt]

I know what you mean and I see that it is lonelier for you guys as there are less people. I would like seniors HxL, HxHD and events that are international, but it does seem a little bit pointless when there are so few international staff and every time we've had one, they haven't really done a lot of recruitment at all (which is a major part of any seniors role, but particularly international).

I'm really against having an international AGM as it is - I think it has the potential to go against managers or the AGMs of those actual departments. I do think that having more say from the international side would be good though - weirdly I have been thinking lately about the international side and I was considering setting up a 'steering group' of active international staff and members to come up with ideas and maybe even set some of them in motion?

I guess that would kind of be like a feedback thread but with more responsibility and with people who are actually around during those times to give a real picture and see what actually works! And it would be a good way of letting you guys know each other.

I can see the International AGM clashing with managers/other AGMS over the jurisdiction of each department and I guess if it were to happen you'd need to set rules regarding how much the AGM International can do. Of course they wouldn't have set departments and would maybe not have as much say as original AGMs who have their set departments to oversee.

I think with saying Seniors are failing to advertise/recruit isn't really fair though. Yeah it's in their role description but if there's no events to advertise/recruit in anyway, then there goes a major on-client opportunity to advertise/recruit. I can't really talk for HxL because I don't pay attention to it but even HxHD sits empty pretty much all the time so they can't really go advertise/recruit there. On the forum there's only so much they can do and you can't really expect them to go around on Habbo shouting out Habbox and advertising/recruiting. I feel like and AGM would help steer that (without introducing international managers for each department).

Sorry if that makes no sense lol, I'm slowly getting tired (bed time)

[David]

So? Am I not supposed to say I've thought about it? I'd hate that you guys think I'm totally oblivious to problems like this....

relax it's just a prank an observation that you always say it

bit like when inseriousity used to always say "we're working on something you'll see it soon"

[lawrawrrr]

I can see the International AGM clashing with managers/other AGMS over the jurisdiction of each department and I guess if it were to happen you'd need to set rules regarding how much the AGM International can do. Of course they wouldn't have set departments and would maybe not have as much say as original AGMs who have their set departments to oversee.

I think with saying Seniors are failing to advertise/recruit isn't really fair though. Yeah it's in their role description but if there's no events to advertise/recruit in anyway, then there goes a major on-client opportunity to advertise/recruit. I can't really talk for HxL because I don't pay attention to it but even HxHD sits empty pretty much all the time so they can't really go advertise/recruit there. On the forum there's only so much they can do and you can't really expect them to go around on Habbo shouting out Habbox and advertising/recruiting. I feel like and AGM would help steer that (without introducing international managers for each department).

Sorry if that makes no sense lol, I'm slowly getting tired (bed time)

I understand what you mean but I think saying to someone ok you're in charge of international but not actually any departments I think they would be completely lost - having a few things in place, working from seniors would be a better way I think


relax it's just a prank an observation that you always say it

bit like when inseriousity used to always say "we're working on something you'll see it soon"

Yeah I do say it a lot I know :p it's mainly cos i overthink everything and therefore come up with ideas and solutions... which get pushed to ages in the future cos other things get in the way. Really going to push myself this weekend to get things out though :)!

[GoldenMerc]

I don't think there is any need for intl admin, but events, dj's, AGM, ye i do think so bring joshuar; back

[Matt]

I understand what you mean but I think saying to someone ok you're in charge of international but not actually any departments I think they would be completely lost - having a few things in place, working from seniors would be a better way I think

Isn't that what we have now :( I feel like leaving it to seniors puts way too much dependence on them, and lets face it seniors don't have that much power at all and should be led by someone in a more managerial role imo. And I mean if you had the Intl DJ, Intl Events etc, that would give them something to look after? And maybe have subforums for international staff where managers AND the AGM chat about issues or ideas they might have. So there's things in place for them to talk and get a response from both their manager and their international AGM. Yes normal AGMs could reply but the Intl AGM would be able to ensure implementation of recruiting or advertising is actively being done (whilst GMT managers and general management are asleep?).

That subforum idea was a spur of the moment thing and I cbf deleting it.

[lawrawrrr]

Seniors actually have a lot more power and responsibility than the majority of seniors in the last few years have realised... the manager is there to guide ofc but recruitment is soooo crucial to any senior role (and arguably, to any staff member because they should want their department to do well, right?)

I just think that with the AGM roles being quite structured now (as they haven't really been in the past, with specific responsibilities and departments) an Intl AGM would create confusion... or not really have much power in itself


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[Brad]

Isn't that what we have now :( I feel like leaving it to seniors puts way too much dependence on them, and lets face it seniors don't have that much power at all and should be led by someone in a more managerial role imo. And I mean if you had the Intl DJ, Intl Events etc, that would give them something to look after? And maybe have subforums for international staff where managers AND the AGM chat about issues or ideas they might have. So there's things in place for them to talk and get a response from both their manager and their international AGM. Yes normal AGMs could reply but the Intl AGM would be able to ensure implementation of recruiting or advertising is actively being done (whilst GMT managers and general management are asleep?).

That subforum idea was a spur of the moment thing and I cbf deleting it.

I agree to the extent of them having something to do with them being able to look after Intl. Events, HxL, and would be support for those in senior/head roles as well. And with them having a limit on what they could do technically wouldn't make them AGMs anymore, but more of like... [Insert word that I am drawing a blank on].
I'm going to bring a real scenario in it; Let's pretend Habbox is a Country. In those countries we have different states/provinces/sections of land in which is ran by Mayors/leaders/higher role. Above those people is a board of trustees in which make ultimate decisions in which what goes on as a whole for the country.
This Intl. Representative we are talking about will be that individual that takes are of the middle ground in which is not an AGM role, nor a Senior/head/manager role. Even though they may not have a specified area, they still are there to be the mediator between the "board of trustees" (Which is the AGM for Habbox) and the mayors/leaders (Which are the Seniors/Heads/Managers)


I'm sorry if that's confusing but that's the only way I could explain it. LOL.

[despect]

It would be lovely to see the international side of things pick up. Now ive got a new intl seniors and heads there will be more giveaways and events being done so we can hopefully spark more interest during intl timezones :)

[FlyingJesus]

is a massive change where you'd need the staff in the first place to actually make the move

Answered your own query with this line frankly; we don't have the international presence currently to require specific international managers, let alone general managers. A manager who is doing their job will be available at certain times through the day that overlap with the waking hours of international staff anyway, so realistically there shouldn't be more than a few hours between asking questions and getting a response - I can't see anything more urgent than that coming up in a normal role and it's still a quicker turnaround than you'd get in most office jobs trying to reach a manager :P


I understand what you mean but I think saying to someone ok you're in charge of international but not actually any departments I think they would be completely lost - having a few things in place, working from seniors would be a better way I think

Speaking as someone who was once given a management role without the actual access rights to do most of the jobs involved with it, I agree completely that calling something management that isn't anything of the sort does no-one any favours. General queries and support can come from seniors or even other base level staff who know their stuff and managers obviously take on that plus being the trusted link to Upstairs, but creating jobs that have fancy names but don't actually do anything basically just turns to nepotism and confusion

[Matt]

Seniors actually have a lot more power and responsibility than the majority of seniors in the last few years have realised... the manager is there to guide ofc but recruitment is soooo crucial to any senior role (and arguably, to any staff member because they should want their department to do well, right?)

I just think that with the AGM roles being quite structured now (as they haven't really been in the past, with specific responsibilities and departments) an Intl AGM would create confusion... or not really have much power in itself


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I agree but I also don't :P I feel like although they wouldn't have clear-cut responsibilities over departments, they would be overseeing everyone with a "Intl" role. And frequently interacting with all International staff and speaking with the rest of the AGM team as well as the management team. With everyone working towards the same goal I could see it working.

The reason I think an AGM International would work is because they have the power to host, dj and have access to everything. They'd lead the whole international side of it.

- - - Updated - - -

I feel like people are referring back to what we currently have now and are saying it's good enough, which is proven not to work. Managers having to overlap their time with non-gmt isn't the right way to go. They should be able to function somewhat on their own.

:( :( :(

I don't want to sound rude, but like I feel this 'debate' is the non-gmt people arguing for the same thing and the (majority of) gmt people saying that change is not needed and we should just 'try' and use what we've got - expecting it to work out by making seniors do more to recruit. I personally don't think that's good enough if proper change is to happen. But hey that's my opinion.

Going to bed/

[Cerys]

I actually proper agree with an intl agm, but I don't see it being the traditional agm role you all know and understand

The way I'd see it is they'd be staff in all depts essentially so they'd have more responsibilities than the current agms in terms of hosting events, djing, perhaps a bit of forum moderation etc. Generally just doing everything to keep habbox afloat during UK night time. Personally I think it'd be a great idea, the only downfall I can see is finding someone who actually wants to host, dj, do some time in hxhd etc etc cos it'd be a huge responsibility

[Brad]

I actually proper agree with an intl agm, but I don't see it being the traditional agm role you all know and understand

The way I'd see it is they'd be staff in all depts essentially so they'd have more responsibilities than the current agms in terms of hosting events, djing, perhaps a bit of forum moderation etc. Generally just doing everything to keep habbox afloat during UK night time. Personally I think it'd be a great idea, the only downfall I can see is finding someone who actually wants to host, dj, do some time in hxhd etc etc cos it'd be a huge responsibility

I think though even though it may look like a more responsibility, it might balance out with not having the same amount of work as other agms

[FlyingJesus]

That's not an AGM role though that's just being in lots of departments

[Cerys]

Yeah it's not the *traditional* agm role, as I said :)

Just my thoughts

[scottish]

cba reading 5 pages, but hxw wasn't hugely successful and was mostly inactive from what I remember.

[Inseriousity.]

When I was AGM, Jade wanted to have an international assistant manager as well as herself/assistant manager (I'll admit this is a very specific debate that wasn't that important so I may not be remembering the specific details 100% right. It may have been international manager) using a lot of the same arguments that you did whereas I responded differently.

For me, it is not about the job titles. It's about having the right staff in place and empowering them to think beyond the confines of their job rank. I think the issue for a lot of people is that apparently you need to have a manager title before you can actually do anything which just isn't true. She wanted to promote Grig who was doing really well already as a Head DJ bringing in new international DJs. In the end, I was over-ruled and Grig became a manager. He did really well continuing to build a really strong international side.

Grig eventually left as Grig has a habit of doing and the next international manager was not as pro-active and it crumbled back to normal. The job title isn't enough, you need the really good staff who are going to run it and tbh the really good staff would already be doing it because they don't need a title to do so.

Despite my doubts, I also don't see much harm in trying it out.

[Matt]

When I was AGM, Jade wanted to have an international assistant manager as well as herself/assistant manager (I'll admit this is a very specific debate that wasn't that important so I may not be remembering the specific details 100% right. It may have been international manager) using a lot of the same arguments that you did whereas I responded differently.

For me, it is not about the job titles. It's about having the right staff in place and empowering them to think beyond the confines of their job rank. I think the issue for a lot of people is that apparently you need to have a manager title before you can actually do anything which just isn't true. She wanted to promote Grig who was doing really well already as a Head DJ bringing in new international DJs. In the end, I was over-ruled and Grig became a manager. He did really well continuing to build a really strong international side.

Grig eventually left as Grig has a habit of doing and the next international manager was not as pro-active and it crumbled back to normal. The job title isn't enough, you need the really good staff who are going to run it and tbh the really good staff would already be doing it because they don't need a title to do so.

Despite my doubts, I also don't see much harm in trying it out.

Ah I forogt about Grig being the International HxL Manager, he did do well. I feel like in that situation, if you had an AGM to steer any international manager in the right direction and offer support it would be really helpful and maybe prevent roles like that from becoming redundant.


cba reading 5 pages, but hxw wasn't hugely successful and was mostly inactive from what I remember.

The wiki says it was 'relatively successful'. But yeah I'm not saying we should create an entirely new site or forum, i'd be very against that idea. I do kind of wish I was around to see it though.


Touching on the point made by FlyingJesus; I do agree in the sense that it might not be an Assistant General Manager role as their responsibilities could be very basic compared to the normal AGMs but in that case why not create an 'International' based role or manager or admin that had the power to change panels, do things on the forum and just be online for when most other admins or members of management were asleep. So we aren't calling them a member of senior management but they do have the power to change things such as panels or anything that needed immediate attention.


To me, there's a few different solutions that could be implemented that have be mentioned in this thread. Now I guess it's just up to Management to see if they want to implement any of them.

[FlyingJesus]

What do you mean by chang[ing] panels? The only urgent/live changes that ever need to be made would be DJing and events booking, both of which I'm pretty sure can be done anyone in the department. That just leaves the forum as a possibility, so really all that's potentially missing is an int mod, a role for which anyone around the globe can already apply

[lawrawrrr]

Flairrr is an intl mod!

I honestly don't see the need for these extra permissions, the only forum or panel admin we use are updating league tables (which aren't urgent) and occasionally adding or editing events when the senior or manager aren't available. I can count the number of times I've had to modify an event in the last 6 months on one hand though...

As for forum, we decided to hire an intl mod specifically TO cater to non eu posting. Any extra forum permissions than that (aka forum management, reps, perms, shop) is Sam's job, not particularly urgent?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Matt]

I can count the number of times I've had to modify an event in the last 6 months on one hand though...

Because there's really only 2 a day so I wouldn't really expect anyone to be modifying that many events at the moment if I'm 100% honest.

I fee like your post takes us straight back to square one and that you've missed my point entirely :(

So you're just going to stick with seniors then? From what I can see (even though people are saying they agree with some sort of International AGM or International Admin) you've said no to it all because it's not necessary. The point of them having the extra permissions is so that they can lead the international side. Very few international people can sort forum permissions and assuming only SEO's can add events then very few people can approve events, things like that where it's nice to know something can get done without waiting for England to wake up.

[FlyingJesus]

Anyone in the events team can add events as I said in my last post, what you're suggesting is something that is entirely surplus to requirement. You're basically asking to be given a role (because let's face it this is about you) that's nothing more than an extra features manager

[lawrawrrr]

Because there's really only 2 a day so I wouldn't really expect anyone to be modifying that many events at the moment if I'm 100% honest.

I fee like your post takes us straight back to square one and that you've missed my point entirely :(

So you're just going to stick with seniors then? From what I can see (even though people are saying they agree with some sort of International AGM or International Admin) you've said no to it all because it's not necessary. The point of them having the extra permissions is so that they can lead the international side. Very few international people can sort forum permissions and assuming only SEO's can add events then very few people can approve events, things like that where it's nice to know something can get done without waiting for England to wake up.

All events staff can add events?! It would be ridiculous to not have events staff book their own events, we'd have less than we currently do!!!!!!!

Forum permissions we don't need extra people for, they all get done within 24 hours and if they need to be done quicker then the manager usually messages myself, Lauren or Kelly. They're quicker now than they were a few years ago TBH...

I just don't see why all these extra permissions are so crucial to the role in your eyes? Even as (A)GMs we don't do a lot on forum/panel management because there isn't a lot TO do and what is there is certainly not critically urgent. There are realistically only 5 or 6 hours of the day where you can't contact any current management - I'm up at 7am every day and I know Lauren/Kelly stay up later than I do!

In answer to you though, I'm definitely not hiring an international AGM, no. Maybe some sort of development leader for now, but not someone who will have access to EVERYTHING we do because it's not at all necessary.

[Matt]

All events staff can add events?! It would be ridiculous to not have events staff book their own events, we'd have less than we currently do!!!!!!!

Forum permissions we don't need extra people for, they all get done within 24 hours and if they need to be done quicker then the manager usually messages myself, Lauren or Kelly. They're quicker now than they were a few years ago TBH...

I just don't see why all these extra permissions are so crucial to the role in your eyes? Even as (A)GMs we don't do a lot on forum/panel management because there isn't a lot TO do and what is there is certainly not critically urgent. There are realistically only 5 or 6 hours of the day where you can't contact any current management - I'm up at 7am every day and I know Lauren/Kelly stay up later than I do!

In answer to you though, I'm definitely not hiring an international AGM, no. Maybe some sort of development leader for now, but not someone who will have access to EVERYTHING we do because it's not at all necessary.

Because if you have someone from an international background that can do all that then it's appealing when an international person does decide to join. Having predominantly UK based management and staff doesn't appeal to the international side hence why there isn't really one at Habbox.

Yeah we don't have the staff now and therefore you see no point in having the role, but someone like an International AGM would focus on recruiting and build up from there - that's when the role would become effective.

I'll be honest and say I didn't really expect you guys to see the point in what I was saying and totally prepared myself for having the idea totally knocked down, as you don't really see what it's like for an international Habbox user.

[lawrawrrr]

Because if you have someone from an international background that can do all that then it's appealing when an international person does decide to join. Having predominantly UK based management and staff doesn't appeal to the international side hence why there isn't really one at Habbox.

Yeah we don't have the staff now and therefore you see no point in having the role, but someone like an International AGM would focus on recruiting and build up from there - that's when the role would become effective.

I'll be honest and say I didn't really expect you guys to see the point in what I was saying and totally prepared myself for having the idea totally knocked down, as you don't really see what it's like for an international Habbox user.

I actually do really see that the international times aren't great and we have had past staff tell us it's because of the lack of interaction in those times. I don't think that's down to upper management though, I think that's because there aren't enough other intl staff or members to talk to - in staff chats, on client, on forum... End of the day most of us here have probably stayed because of our friends, not because of upper management?

From the supervision perspective, that's why I'd like intl seniors (well all seniors actually) to step up a bit and make the extra effort. I'm launching my lil staff recruitment thingy today which hopefully will make everything a lot easier and incentivise the current staff - then I will revisit this concept in a couple weeks?

[Matt]

Anyone in the events team can add events as I said in my last post, what you're suggesting is something that is entirely surplus to requirement. You're basically asking to be given a role (because let's face it this is about you) that's nothing more than an extra features manager

Yeah this is about me because I'm from the international side of Habbox, can you blame me. I've not once said I'd take on the role and to be quite frank, I'd not want to take on the role. I'm suggesting it as feedback because the international side at Habbox is non-existent and it's clear that me suggesting ideas is better than doing nothing. How can you then say I'm asking for the role when I've not once indicated I want the role. All you're doing if defending events and licking Laura's ass, which shows you've missed the point of what I'm trying to ask for entirely.


I actually do really see that the international times aren't great and we have had past staff tell us it's because of the lack of interaction in those times. I don't think that's down to upper management though, I think that's because there aren't enough other intl staff or members to talk to - in staff chats, on client, on forum... End of the day most of us here have probably stayed because of our friends, not because of upper management?

From the supervision perspective, that's why I'd like intl seniors (well all seniors actually) to step up a bit and make the extra effort. I'm launching my lil staff recruitment thingy today which hopefully will make everything a lot easier and incentivise the current staff - then I will revisit this concept in a couple weeks?

I disagree and believe it's up to upper management to make a change. And ok do what you want :)

[Alysha]

The problem I have with all of your feedback threads is how angsty you get.

The AGM role is useless unless we get members in beforehand, having one person in that role won't bring in the masses, a base clientele has to be established first. When you were manager of events and forum (and whatever else you've been), did the international side increase at all? I haven't read through the whole thread to be honest, so I could have missed some vital points to this.
I don't agree with a senior management role dedicated entirely to it, but something lesser might be good, something that increases the activity and keeps people around that don't necessarily want to be staff.

[Matt]

The problem I have with all of your feedback threads is how angsty you get.

The AGM role is useless unless we get members in beforehand, having one person in that role won't bring in the masses, a base clientele has to be established first. When you were manager of events and forum (and whatever else you've been), did the international side increase at all? I haven't read through the whole thread to be honest, so I could have missed some vital points to this.
I don't agree with a senior management role dedicated entirely to it, but something lesser might be good, something that increases the activity and keeps people around that don't necessarily want to be staff.

The reason I do it is because no one listens otherwise. I honestly get annoyed at the fact nothing changes because people say no and don't like change. The reason my last few posts have been stroppy is because a number of people agreed with me but it's still not going to happen. Likewise with my other thread about AGMs hosting, people start saying no change is needed and that everything is fine the way it is (+ provide excuses) - and we get no where.

What I'm trying to say is, if we had an admin in place to help establish that international clientele it would work much better than leaving it up to Seniors and still having management who are predominantly UK based. Why do you think other fansites have OC, NA etc. Because it works and they are all able to target each international area (all having at least someone from that specific timezone in a position of power that can help lead).

[FlyingJesus]

It's not about licking anyone's anything, it's about correcting you when you're being clearly wrong about stuff. You repped me about making assumptions when this whole idea is based on the assumption that for some reason community staff aren't allowed to book their own slots for anything and require constant managerial input, so let's not pretend you have any idea how things work. AGAIN having a random international admin would add nothing at all because there is no job to do there, no matter how many other people who don't know how things work say that it would be nice to invent extra roles. What you're really asking for is a figurehead, because that's all an international AGM would be

[Empired]

I do think from what you've said, Matt, that an international AGM really would just be a figurehead. Obviously you wouldn't know how the new events (and whatever else) panel works because you've not been in the department since the beginning of v7 but honestly as a new trialist EO I can tell you Jake has been away since I started my trial and I've needed no input from him whatsoever from perms to booking events for myself.

Also, I do know how you feel when you're saying you feel like you're being ignored because habbox doesn't like change and so just keeps slamming new ideas (cough like system and hxhd to lounge) but in this instance Laura has clearly and rationally explained why an international AGM wouldn't be necessary. And to me those are legit reasons, and some of the reasons you've argued back at her (like normal staff not being able to access the panel) are actually entirely incorrect which has been pointed out before but to me it looks like you ignored them explaining the panel (or didn't really notice I guess...)

Ugh I hate typing on my phone so I've forgotten what my original point is so I'll stop there

[GoldenMerc]

I think if there was someone who was proactively pushing Habbox in a management position who was CA, AU, or what ever then sure, it'd make it a simple decision to push them to AGM Intl (which I do agree in some parts should happen - but only for the right person) Then they have their own team etc... But for now, we have about 3 intl members, until that lifts, there isnt any need.

[Brad]

I agree with both sides here. I agree that when numbers start increasing that role will become needed but until then there's no need of an actual agm role.
The thought of an individual to take such role as to be the representative to be there to help drive that side can be valuable as GoldenMerc and many others have stated it has be be chosen properly.

I always feel whenever a feedback thread is made and there's a disagreement between two sides, everyone starts attacking eachother. A feedback thread is meant for suggestions, ideas, thoughts and in the end, whether or not it gets implemented is not up to anyone else but the AGMs and the GM. let them take what they have seen works and doesn't work. They ultimately have the final decision no matter how many posts we can write "defending" our ideas.

I personally love the idea of an individual as a power head encouraging all departments, and to lead the International side of Habbox to a place where it could potentially have life.
Sometimes all you have to do is give it a chance, if it doesn't work then it didn't work. If it does- perfect!

[Samantha]

It's all fine and good complaining about Habbox's international side when you are no longer part of the staff team, but it seems you're only an 'international Habbox member' when it's suits because you did nothing to improve the international side when you were Forum Manager.

When you were Forum Manager, there were no Happy Hours to boost posting, there weren't any for European members let alone Australian/New Zealand members, and you made probably around 10 (being very generous here) threads that weren't related to anything your job consisted of anyway; not only that, but little to none of them were made in international times, I believe the earliest was around 6:45am - when some European members are already up at that time! Admittedly your posts were suited to international times, but the bulk were posted on a Monday to reach your 15 posts then you'd hardly make any for the rest of the week.

This may sound harsh, but I don't see how someone can bring it up now, then say it shouldn't be down to just senior staff members, when, you were a manager and you still didn't do anything to cater for them; we don't know what it's like being an international forum member, but you do and had the chance to influence the international side so much, why didn't you? Yeah it's a bit late in the day to say this as you resigned months ago, but it was a problem then and is still a problem now!

Now I have nothing against you personally, and I would have said the same to anyone who mentioned it if I could (e.g. if they were a manager before etc.) so don't take this too personally!

As for the new roles - you don't 'need' any new roles, you could literally add the word 'international' to Hannah's usertitle for 'International Help Desk Staff' or to Flairr's for 'International Forum Moderator', but a word/name/role will not do anything so no I don't think any extra roles are needed, just more ideas that may be suited to them more and I agree with GoldenMerc; if someone shows that drive to make the international side thrive then they could potentially be rewarded/promoted for it!

[scottish]

It's all fine and good complaining about Habbox's international side when you are no longer part of the staff team, but it seems you're only an 'international Habbox member' when it's suits because you did nothing to improve the international side when you were Forum Manager.

When you were Forum Manager, there were no Happy Hours to boost posting, there weren't any for European members let alone Australian/New Zealand members, and you made probably around 10 (being very generous here) threads that weren't related to anything your job consisted of anyway; not only that, but little to none of them were made in international times, I believe the earliest was around 6:45am - when some European members are already up at that time! Admittedly your posts were suited to international times, but the bulk were posted on a Monday to reach your 15 posts then you'd hardly make any for the rest of the week.

This may sound harsh, but I don't see how someone can bring it up now, then say it shouldn't be down to just senior staff members, when, you were a manager and you still didn't do anything to cater for them; we don't know what it's like being an international forum member, but you do and had the chance to influence the international side so much, why didn't you? Yeah it's a bit late in the day to say this as you resigned months ago, but it was a problem then and is still a problem now!

Now I have nothing against you personally, and I would have said the same to anyone who mentioned it if I could (e.g. if they were a manager before etc.) so don't take this too personally!

As for the new roles - you don't 'need' any new roles, you could literally add the word 'international' to Hannah's usertitle for 'International Help Desk Staff' or to Flairr's for 'International Forum Moderator', but a word/name/role will not do anything so no I don't think any extra roles are needed, just more ideas that may be suited to them more and I agree with GoldenMerc; if someone shows that drive to make the international side thrive then they could potentially be rewarded/promoted for it!

oh shit son. I agree completely

[Martin]

Personally I don't think having an international AGM would work. There are plenty of ways the international side of things can be boosted without someone having those kind of permissions/authority. We have had plenty of international managers in the past and it hasn't really helped things that much, at the end of the day it's enthusiastic staff members who are keen to advertise and improve that side of things that we need. Sure, seniors are helpful too and will be great to monitor and supervise these staff during overnight periods, but at the end of the day it's down to the staff. When there are occasionally late night events they seem to be really popular, so there is definitely a market there, just need to ensure it's advertised really well.

Events organisers are able to add their own events now etc, so already it's much easier for things to run overnight than it used to be. You need a decent set of international events hosts/habboxlive DJ's and helpdesk staff and instantly things can improve. These staff members can easily be managed by current management too, there will be overlaps where both will be online, and there's plenty of ways to communicate.

I think having a separate side for the international stuff would cause even more segregation and cause communication to lapse even further, when really it's just a bit of teamwork and enthusiasm that's needed, and for the managers to put measures into place to actively encourage the international side of things to flourish, through the help of their international staff.

Back in 2011 we had quite a few international DJ's and events hosts and they were really good at keeping things alive at night, (the helpdesk would often be populated overnight too) yet we didn't need any additional agm roles or anything for this. Although I'll admit back then we also had GMT managers who were addicts and would stay online until 3/4am anyway as I did when I was agm. Insomnia rules!

[Matt]

It's all fine and good complaining about Habbox's international side when you are no longer part of the staff team, but it seems you're only an 'international Habbox member' when it's suits because you did nothing to improve the international side when you were Forum Manager.

When you were Forum Manager, there were no Happy Hours to boost posting, there weren't any for European members let alone Australian/New Zealand members, and you made probably around 10 (being very generous here) threads that weren't related to anything your job consisted of anyway; not only that, but little to none of them were made in international times, I believe the earliest was around 6:45am - when some European members are already up at that time! Admittedly your posts were suited to international times, but the bulk were posted on a Monday to reach your 15 posts then you'd hardly make any for the rest of the week.

This may sound harsh, but I don't see how someone can bring it up now, then say it shouldn't be down to just senior staff members, when, you were a manager and you still didn't do anything to cater for them; we don't know what it's like being an international forum member, but you do and had the chance to influence the international side so much, why didn't you? Yeah it's a bit late in the day to say this as you resigned months ago, but it was a problem then and is still a problem now!

Now I have nothing against you personally, and I would have said the same to anyone who mentioned it if I could (e.g. if they were a manager before etc.) so don't take this too personally!

As for the new roles - you don't 'need' any new roles, you could literally add the word 'international' to Hannah's usertitle for 'International Help Desk Staff' or to Flairr's for 'International Forum Moderator', but a word/name/role will not do anything so no I don't think any extra roles are needed, just more ideas that may be suited to them more and I agree with @GoldenMerc (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=26925); if someone shows that drive to make the international side thrive then they could potentially be rewarded/promoted for it!

I'll mention a few things you've pointed out.

This whole time i've been arguing for someone to be in higher management from an International background because I think there needs to be someone in place for this whole international thing to work. It's all good and fine for a manager to start fighting for an international side to Habbox but as we know managers don't seem to last as long nowadays and it's so so hard for an international manager (especially if they're one of the only international managers at Habbox) to, on their own, increase the International fanbase when it's only them fighting for it. Yeah it's easy for you to say that nothing was done in terms of the international side to the forum when I was manager because I feel (and always have done) that Habbox doesn't have the structure in place to even appeal to an international audience. It doesn't just lie within one department, hence why I've been trying to say that Habbox needs someone in a position of power to help lead it. Call them a figurehead or whatever, but I literally saw no point in me alone, fighting for a bigger international audience as it was only me fighting for it. I lasted 6 months in the role because I started Uni again and left, then a UK-based forum manager was put in the role. Even if I had have done anything to aid in making the international side bigger, I was replaced with a UK-based staff member that wouldn't be online at the same times as me - leaving like one other international manager at the time to maybe carry it on. It isn't just a matter of me recruiting, then leaving, and it all being fine - it needs to be consistent and continuous in order for it to work.

I feel it's like, just because i've made a thread addressing the issue it's my fault for not doing enough in my managerial role. "You're a manager, so here have the responsibility of generating an international clientele for Habbox all on your own and from scratch". I really don't feel that's even fair and I'd be exactly the same if I was in a Senior role being told I need to do more to recruit and create something with the pre-exisiting structure Habbox has (which caters more for a UK timezone). I'll admit, I don't have the time or even the dedication to do that as it takes a hell of a lot of work - something which I just can't dedicate to Habbox because of my other commitments. If I had been in an AGM role and you were telling me I did nothing for the International timezone then fair enough, but as I've said before, I believe it needs someone in the General Management role to dedicate the time to help structure it. As a manager I agree that I did have the capacity to increase the international clientele greatly, but I simply couldn't dedicate that much effort to doing so. If it was as clear-cut as "you're international so go and recruit or increase activity - oh look more international people" then yeah that's awesome, but it's not like that.

Also quickly, the reason I didn't do the Happy Hours is because they're a redundant idea, give people tokens for posting when they hardly ever use tokens anyway. The times I was online meant hardly anyone was online meaning hardly anyone would 'reap the rewards' for posting. There's people with 30k+ tokens, having happy hours to increase their tokens is/was a silly idea when there's nothing actually worthwhile to spend them on. I'd already asked around and seen what people's attitudes were. The only times people used their tokens was when an icon was released that was actually popular. Hardly anyone was buying icons, you got people like Dan buying bulk and he was literally it. I wasn't totally oblivious to the things happening

I also didn't realise you paid so much attention to my posts Sam. I'll just say, the amount of times I got top poster and was actively posting a lot more than 15 posts was a sign I was trying. You make it out like I was doing the bare minimum when actually I would disagree. I could even say the same for you at this current moment in time but hey that's my opinion from what I've seen so far.

I feel like, although you told me you aren't attacking me personally, it definitely felt like that. So i've put across my thoughts (call them excuses if you want) on the issue and why I did (or did not) do what I did when I was manager.

[Samantha]

I'll mention a few things you've pointed out.

This whole time i've been arguing for someone to be in higher management from an International background because I think there needs to be someone in place for this whole international thing to work. It's all good and fine for a manager to start fighting for an international side to Habbox but as we know managers don't seem to last as long nowadays and it's so so hard for an international manager (especially if they're one of the only international managers at Habbox) to, on their own, increase the International fanbase when it's only them fighting for it. Yeah it's easy for you to say that nothing was done in terms of the international side to the forum when I was manager because I feel (and always have done) that Habbox doesn't have the structure in place to even appeal to an international audience. It doesn't just lie within one department, hence why I've been trying to say that Habbox needs someone in a position of power to help lead it. Call them a figurehead or whatever, but I literally saw no point in me alone, fighting for a bigger international audience as it was only me fighting for it. I lasted 6 months in the role because I started Uni again and left, then a UK-based forum manager was put in the role. Even if I had have done anything to aid in making the international side bigger, I was replaced with a UK-based staff member that wouldn't be online at the same times as me - leaving like one other international manager at the time to maybe carry it on. It isn't just a matter of me recruiting, then leaving, and it all being fine - it needs to be consistent and continuous in order for it to work.

I feel it's like, just because i've made a thread addressing the issue it's my fault for not doing enough in my managerial role. "You're a manager, so here have the responsibility of generating an international clientele for Habbox all on your own and from scratch". I really don't feel that's even fair and I'd be exactly the same if I was in a Senior role being told I need to do more to recruit and create something with the pre-exisiting structure Habbox has (which caters more for a UK timezone). I'll admit, I don't have the time or even the dedication to do that as it takes a hell of a lot of work - something which I just can't dedicate to Habbox because of my other commitments. If I had been in an AGM role and you were telling me I did nothing for the International timezone then fair enough, but as I've said before, I believe it needs someone in the General Management role to dedicate the time to help structure it. As a manager I agree that I did have the capacity to increase the international clientele greatly, but I simply couldn't dedicate that much effort to doing so. If it was as clear-cut as "you're international so go and recruit or increase activity - oh look more international people" then yeah that's awesome, but it's not like that.

Also quickly, the reason I didn't do the Happy Hours is because they're a redundant idea, give people tokens for posting when they hardly ever use tokens anyway. The times I was online meant hardly anyone was online meaning hardly anyone would 'reap the rewards' for posting. There's people with 30k+ tokens, having happy hours to increase their tokens is/was a silly idea when there's nothing actually worthwhile to spend them on. I'd already asked around and seen what people's attitudes were. The only times people used their tokens was when an icon was released that was actually popular. Hardly anyone was buying icons, you got people like Dan buying bulk and he was literally it. I wasn't totally oblivious to the things happening

I also didn't realise you paid so much attention to my posts Sam. I'll just say, the amount of times I got top poster and was actively posting a lot more than 15 posts was a sign I was trying. You make it out like I was doing the bare minimum when actually I would disagree. I could even say the same for you at this current moment in time but hey that's my opinion from what I've seen so far.

I feel like, although you told me you aren't attacking me personally, it definitely felt like that. So i've put across my thoughts (call them excuses if you want) on the issue and why I did (or did not) do what I did when I was manager.

Was it brought up to General Management then so they could see you were voicing your concerns and actually wanted something done about it? This is a genuine question as I'm not sure as I wasn't in a manager's position at the time. I know you address why it wouldn't be kept on further down, but instead of doing nothing for the international side you could have attempted something, nothing will happen if nothing is tried and tested to see if it works.

The role of having someone higher up doesn't really need to happen, likewise with everything at Habbox it can obtained by people having the drive and passion to work their way up, and, if they're international then it's definitely a bonus and it won't go unnoticed.

Also, I'm not saying it's your fault for the state Habbox's international side is in at the moment, I'm saying it might not be as bad, or it might be somewhat known if you had done more as an international manager (this is talking about all those who were in international and did nothing for that side). However, reiterating my point about something could easily be tried - Sophie as an example tried an international Saturday Night Quiz, it failed, but at least it showed she was trying to do something! It doesn't take so much effort, just to help that little bit.

Happy Hours are not a redundant idea, well they aren't to me - you never did one and automatically assumed they're pointless so didn't bother? It's fine saying you asked people, but you didn't put any into action so you wouldn't have fully known if anything would have improved or not. Happy Hours aren't exactly a time to 'reap the rewards' to me, they're a time to give that little boost in posting numbers, and sometimes they help, sometimes they don't. The one I did last night didn't get many posts, and I don't think any threads were created, but the one before that was very popular and the amount of posts we have this week alone, for one reason, is down to the Happy Hours as they are being rewarded for posting! The thing is with Tokens, you need to make sure you make things worthwhile in the shop, there are 3 amazing icons currently (Cool Toast, Flirty Fox and Crying Bear), and they've been selling fairly well. Also, if you don't for example, lower prices and actually manage the Token shop, like a shop then what's the point in having it at all? I do understand some things might not be worthwhile getting, and I will probably think of more things to add to it so thank you for giving me your opinion on that!

I looked at your posts/threads last night, I haven't paid too much attention to yours before, apart from some of them that interested me back then. I won't deny the fact you were high on the posting statistics in the week, but you did post most of yours on the Monday then sort of just posted a little during the week. However, you need to remember back then the amount of posts people were getting were also less posts during the week!

I knew you would say I wasn't doing much though, I was waiting for it! However, we've gone from having a dead forum to something that's actually getting more and more popular in terms of posting - within the start of me being Forum Manager we've gained over 300 posts in a week (which doesn't seem like a lot), but I would rather start off slow and work up! I'm unsure if you've seen the two competitions the forum currently has running (one partnering with another department), or the one that took place last month too. I can assure you I am not doing the 'bare minimum' and if I was I would be contacted by laura, who, knows full well what's happening in the department and (is happy with my progress) something is returning with a new lease of life. However, I've had to put that on hold as I'm away from tomorrow and want to make sure it runs smoothly and is better. If you believe I'm doing nothing though, that's fine and you're entitled to your opinion and an observation.

[Matt]

Was it brought up to General Management then so they could see you were voicing your concerns and actually wanted something done about it? This is a genuine question as I'm not sure as I wasn't in a manager's position at the time. I know you address why it wouldn't be kept on further down, but instead of doing nothing for the international side you could have attempted something, nothing will happen if nothing is tried and tested to see if it works.

The role of having someone higher up doesn't really need to happen, likewise with everything at Habbox it can obtained by people having the drive and passion to work their way up, and, if they're international then it's definitely a bonus and it won't go unnoticed.

Also, I'm not saying it's your fault for the state Habbox's international side is in at the moment, I'm saying it might not be as bad, or it might be somewhat known if you had done more as an international manager (this is talking about all those who were in international and did nothing for that side). However, reiterating my point about something could easily be tried - Sophie as an example tried an international Saturday Night Quiz, it failed, but at least it showed she was trying to do something! It doesn't take so much effort, just to help that little bit.

Happy Hours are not a redundant idea, well they aren't to me - you never did one and automatically assumed they're pointless so didn't bother? It's fine saying you asked people, but you didn't put any into action so you wouldn't have fully known if anything would have improved or not. Happy Hours aren't exactly a time to 'reap the rewards' to me, they're a time to give that little boost in posting numbers, and sometimes they help, sometimes they don't. The one I did last night didn't get many posts, and I don't think any threads were created, but the one before that was very popular and the amount of posts we have this week alone, for one reason, is down to the Happy Hours as they are being rewarded for posting! The thing is with Tokens, you need to make sure you make things worthwhile in the shop, there are 3 amazing icons currently (Cool Toast, Flirty Fox and Crying Bear), and they've been selling fairly well. Also, if you don't for example, lower prices and actually manage the Token shop, like a shop then what's the point in having it at all? I do understand some things might not be worthwhile getting, and I will probably think of more things to add to it so thank you for giving me your opinion on that!

I looked at your posts/threads last night, I haven't paid too much attention to yours before, apart from some of them that interested me back then. I won't deny the fact you were high on the posting statistics in the week, but you did post most of yours on the Monday then sort of just posted a little during the week. However, you need to remember back then the amount of posts people were getting were also less posts during the week!

I knew you would say I wasn't doing much though, I was waiting for it! However, we've gone from having a dead forum to something that's actually getting more and more popular in terms of posting - within the start of me being Forum Manager we've gained over 300 posts in a week (which doesn't seem like a lot), but I would rather start off slow and work up! I'm unsure if you've seen the two competitions the forum currently has running (one partnering with another department), or the one that took place last month too. I can assure you I am not doing the 'bare minimum' and if I was I would be contacted by laura, who, knows full well what's happening in the department and (is happy with my progress) something is returning with a new lease of life. However, I've had to put that on hold as I'm away from tomorrow and want to make sure it runs smoothly and is better. If you believe I'm doing nothing though, that's fine and you're entitled to your opinion and an observation.

Going back to when I was in the Events department and I was the non-GMT Senior, I tried so hard to get the international side of Habbox to work. I've been in the shoes of a senior that's tried to recruit and advertise on behalf of the whole of Habbox and it was literally the most draining thing. There was the Manager at the time who was so focused on trying to revive Events and make it a success that it meant I was literally manning the international side of it on my own. Not one AGM or the GM at the time stepped in to check, they just saw that events were being hosted and that was the main thing. If there was an international AGM or someone who was there when I was hosting events at 2-3-4am to support me and throw in ideas, then maybe when I came round to Forum Manager I wouldn't be so deflated. I tried when I was Events Senior, I was literally the face of the international side at Habbox (along with the team of EOs such as Brad and Sarah who ran the international side) yet no one offered support because there was no one there to offer it. Yeah I probably could've asked but it's the job of General Management to be helping out and actually offering to help. Then what happened was once I got Events Manager my timezone was blamed for miscommunication and decisions being made without my knowledge and that's why I lasted just over a month as the Events Manager and quit. That is why I didn't dedicate my time as FM to the international side of things because I had done in the past and the hard work was chucked in my face.

Also, you keep referring to my posts all being done by Monday and then nothing happened. I'm not sure where you keep getting Monday from because I literally posted throughout the week and mainly on weekends (when I was actually at home and didn't have work or Uni to go to). So to say I posted them all on Monday to ensure I got over 15 is just rubbish. I never actually cared about the 15 post minimum as it just happened and was more directed at moderator activity rather than myself as manager.

I'm kinda done with this thread now. It's clear it won't be happening so unless you want to reply Sam then you can close this :)

[GoldenMerc]

Its really not complex.

If Habbox had more than 10 intl members
If Habbox had someone who could fit the role

MAYBE

but it doesn't so unless you can whip up 30-40 active intl its absolutely pointless

[FlyingJesus]

Habbox doesn't have the structure in place to even appeal to an international audience

We have 24/7 slots available for all community staff, what "structure" are you expecting that can magically make everyone in Australia want to be staff?


"You're a manager, so here have the responsibility of generating an international clientele for Habbox all on your own and from scratch". I really don't feel that's even fair

You're right that isn't fair, which is why this whole thing isn't a viable idea.

[Matt]

We have 24/7 slots available for all community staff, what "structure" are you expecting that can magically make everyone in Australia want to be staff?

A structure that actually appeals to international staff? Management/Staff in place to provide support when those international staff are actually online, someone in higher management that isn't UK-based, all the things i've been repeating throughout this thread that we already know you disagree with.


You're right that isn't fair, which is why this whole thing isn't a viable idea.

So come up with a viable idea that will actually work instead of shooting me down as soon as I try and suggest one myself. Oh and seniors doing all the work doesn't count as a viable idea.

[GoldenMerc]

But your acting like being Habbox staff is just the UK? And directed at just the UK which it isn't. Considering HotelUser & ---MAD--- and prob many more got to Agm without having to separate the roles ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Matt]

But your acting like being Habbox staff is just the UK? And directed at just the UK which it isn't. Considering HotelUser & ---MAD--- and prob many more got to Agm without having to separate the roles ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well I'm suggesting that we have a more permanent international member of senior management and not just luck of the draw on who gets promoted to AGM when someone leaves and the off-chance they are from a timezone other than the UK.

Staff is open to everyone yes, but currently it's only really worthwhile if you're from a UK timezone.

[GoldenMerc]

Well I'm suggesting that we have a more permanent international member of senior management and not just luck of the draw on who gets promoted to AGM when someone leaves and the off-chance they are from a timezone other than the UK.

Staff is open to everyone yes, but currently it's only really worthwhile if you're from a UK timezone.

Thats not true, at all.

I think you made this thread so laura would say, OH YOUR NOT FROM THE UK? SURE YOU CAN BE AGM.

But its silly idea, unless you go recruit some more intl members at least.

[lawrawrrr]

There are thousands of Habbos who aren't in the UK, and hosting an event at 4am would still attract people... from a different timezone! Having an intl AGM doesn't magically mean hundreds of non EU people will sign up, having the intl events, radio shows, will because frankly, THAT'S what attracts people.

- - - Updated - - -


If it was as clear-cut as "you're international so go and recruit or increase activity - oh look more international people" then yeah that's awesome, but it's not like that.


also.... wouldn't this LITERALLY be the intl agm job??

[Matt]

Thats not true, at all.

I think you made this thread so laura would say, OH YOUR NOT FROM THE UK? SURE YOU CAN BE AGM.

But its silly idea, unless you go recruit some more intl members at least.

If you'd have read my reply to FlyingJesus, you'd have seen I told him I don't want the role nor would I accept the role if I was offered it.

You're more likely to get International people to join if there's more things in place for them, and catering for international staff is what I'm saying needs changing as a starting point.

Why is this so hard to understand, like I honestly don't get it. Having an International AGM, Admin or senior management role would be a starting point to recruiting people from an international clientele as we would then have someone in place to support and listen to them whilst everyone else is not online.

[lawrawrrr]

If you'd have read my reply to FlyingJesus, you'd have seen I told him I don't want the role nor would I accept the role if I was offered it.

You're more likely to get International people to join if there's more things in place for them, and catering for international staff is what I'm saying needs changing as a starting point.

Why is this so hard to understand, like I honestly don't get it. Having an International AGM, Admin or senior management role would be a starting point to recruiting people from an international clientele as we would then have someone in place to support and listen to them whilst everyone else is not online.

What I can't understand is that you say we need more things in place (events and shows and threads... which are STAFF jobs, not AGM jobs) and SUPPORT (which is a Senior's job, if not a manager). Having someone who's job is solely recruiting isn't an AGM job in my eyes.

[GoldenMerc]

If you'd have read my reply to FlyingJesus, you'd have seen I told him I don't want the role nor would I accept the role if I was offered it.

You're more likely to get International people to join if there's more things in place for them, and catering for international staff is what I'm saying needs changing as a starting point.

Why is this so hard to understand, like I honestly don't get it. Having an International AGM, Admin or senior management role would be a starting point to recruiting people from an international clientele as we would then have someone in place to support and listen to them whilst everyone else is not online.

Hard to understand? You've been begging for 8 pages for this role to exist, yet you show no enthusiasm to having it. You have pretty much said LAURA MAKE ME THIS ROLE BECAUSE







nothing...
You are acting like all the user titles say Events Staff (UK ONLY TIMEZONES), which is far from true considering most people host later because of school, college or work, so if anything most people generally dont run by UK times.

Well this is poor never the less, but it shows that the ONLY event today is actually at 10pm...
http://tashload.com/Uploader/uploads//2aHxfSe.png

Why don't you stop begging and pretending like you are this idealistic member and actually proactively show you can do this role by recruiting members & staff, then maybe people would be like ok cool maybe he was right.

Rather than demanding like a crying baby.

[Matt]

Having an intl AGM doesn't magically mean hundreds of non EU people will sign up, having the intl events, radio shows, will because frankly, THAT'S what attracts people.

Yeah but our issue is that we don't have international staff to even host the intl events and radio shows. Therefore we are attracting no one. A Senior Management role dedicated to the international side of things means someone is there to support international staff.

- - - Updated - - -


Hard to understand? You've been begging for 8 pages for this role to exist, yet you show no enthusiasm to having it. You have pretty much said LAURA MAKE ME THIS ROLE BECAUSE







nothing...
You are acting like all the user titles say Events Staff (UK ONLY TIMEZONES), which is far from true considering most people host later because of school, college or work, so if anything most people generally dont run by UK times.

Well this is poor never the less, but it shows that the ONLY event today is actually at 10pm...
http://tashload.com/Uploader/uploads//2aHxfSe.png

Why don't you stop begging and pretending like you are this idealistic member and actually proactively show you can do this role by recruiting members & staff, then maybe people would be like ok cool maybe he was right.

Rather than demanding like a crying baby.

You've legit not read half my responses in this thread as i've already answered this. Suck up the fact it's a long thread and go read my other replies.


What I can't understand is that you say we need more things in place (events and shows and threads... which are STAFF jobs, not AGM jobs) and SUPPORT (which is a Senior's job, if not a manager). Having someone who's job is solely recruiting isn't an AGM job in my eyes.

Yeah but that's not happening Laura. You even admitted that yesterday. Their role wouldn't be solely recruiting I explained that like 50 times :(

[lawrawrrr]

Yeah but our issue is that we don't have international staff to even host the intl events and radio shows. Therefore we are attracting no one. A Senior Management role dedicated to the international side of things means someone is there to support international staff.

"Dedicated to the international side of things"... doing what exactly? What I don't understand is you've said multiple times in this thread the proposed Intl AGM would "have admin", "have access to panels", "recruit" which are all massively sweeping statements with no actual reasoning behind, and it does sound like a power trip role rather than an actual substantive one. We've had those before and they have not ended well!!

Once again though, supporting international staff, supervising and feedback and sorting small problems that may arise (events being cancelled, edited, threads being moderated, people behind behind the hxhd desk and answering questions correctly) are all part of the SENIORS job.

We absolutely need more international staff. I do not disagree on that. Maybe some kind of temporary leader for that recruitment would be a good idea - and I have already said something to the girls about it (which I said before, I think you must have missed it as you seem to think I'm just shouting you down and totes anti-change), but an entire Intl AGM role and all the access and power that comes with it? No...

[Matt]

Yeah ok I'm done with this. Laura I'm more than happy to clarify what I mean on Skype :)