Republic of Ireland prepares to vote in abortion referendum

[-:Undertaker:-]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirty-sixth_Amendment_of_the_Constitution_Bill_2018_(Ire land)#Opinion_polling

Republic of Ireland prepares to vote in abortion legalisation referendum

Polls have been narrowing in the Catholic country towards No but Yes maintains a lead


https://cdn.static-economist.com/sites/default/files/images/print-edition/20180324_EUP003_0.jpg


The Thirty-sixth Amendment of the Constitution Bill 2018 (bill no. 29 of 2018) is a proposed amendment to the constitution of Ireland which would permit the Oireachtas (parliament) to legislate for abortion in instances where it is currently prohibited. The proposal is often described as Repeal of the Eighth Amendment, referring to the 1983 constitutional amendment which guarantees foetal right to life, making abortion illegal unless the pregnancy is life-threatening. The 2018 bill would replace Article 40.3.3° of the Constitution, which was added in 1983 and amended in 1992.

The bill was introduced to the Oireachtas on 9 March 2018 by the Fine Gael minority coalition government, and completed its passage through both houses on 27 March 2018. It will be put to a referendum on 25 May 2018.

I struggled to find an article explaining the basics of the vote that wasn't biased towards the Yes side but couldn't find one so had to settle for this Wikipedia passage instead. Like I put under the headline, polls had narrowed in recent weeks but Yes still commands a lead. The big unknown of course is Don't Know and turnout(?).

Hopefully No wins!

[Hannah]

One question I always have with anti-abortion - who's going to take care of the child and offer it a fulfilling life if a child rape victim gets pregnant? Who's going to look after a child that isn't wanted? Who is going to look after the child who's parents are not of sound mind?

Who is going to ensure that the said children are not so messed up after fuzzy upbringings, that they don't turn into criminals and follow the right path?

[-:Undertaker:-]

One question I always have with anti-abortion - who's going to take care of the child and offer it a fulfilling life if a child rape victim gets pregnant? Who's going to look after a child that isn't wanted? Who is going to look after the child who's parents are not of sound mind?

Who is going to ensure that the said children are not so messed up after fuzzy upbringings, that they don't turn into criminals and follow the right path?

For those of us who oppose abortion, nothing is worse than the termination of an innocent baby in the womb. Rape is horrible yes, as is child neglect - but these in my eyes do not justify the taking of a life. To me, it is like saying we should euthanise old people in homes who don't have any family because they'd simply be a burden on the state and nobody wants them anyway. That's not the way to treat life in our country. I used to be pro-abortion, before I read what it actually involves. Horrifying.

On the internet just then I saw a great quote, "Pregnancy is temporary, Death is permanent."

[FlyingJesus]

Elderly person: has already done their time and put in the service to the country in whatever way they've been able to, irreplaceable

Unwanted foetus: burden on the mother's body, burden on both parent's psyche if forced to term, burden on finances, more likely to be abused or abandoned, can be remade if/when parents are ready

[-:Undertaker:-]

Costs the state money? Kill it!

[FlyingJesus]

That wasn't on my list

[Hannah]

For those of us who oppose abortion, nothing is worse than the termination of an innocent baby in the womb. Rape is horrible yes, as is child neglect - but these in my eyes do not justify the taking of a life. To me, it is like saying we should euthanise old people in homes who don't have any family because they'd simply be a burden on the state and nobody wants them anyway. That's not the way to treat life in our country. I used to be pro-abortion, before I read what it actually involves. Horrifying.

On the internet just then I saw a great quote, "Pregnancy is temporary, Death is permanent."

I'm unsure as to why you've brought the elderly into this. As FlyingJesus said, they have lived, they have worked, they have served the country. Someone who has done all of this, is in no way equivalent to an unborn fetus.

Although, seeing as we are moving away from the point - in many places euthanasia is illegal, yet there are many people who have endless pain and suffering and would like help to be killed peacefully because they cannot do it themselves. Is that equivalent to abortion being illegal?

Back on topic, pregnancy may be temporary, but that child's suffering will be until the end of their life.

What if the child becomes so damaged, that they start harming or even killing people because of how damaged they are?

I would prefer to sacrifice one and save many, or simply to not bring someone into a life of suffering - when even their parents cannot love them - and it is illegal to be euthanized.

[lawrawrrr]

I fully support the campaign to repeal and seriously hope Ireland votes for that. To preface this post.

However, I do understand why people are anti-abortion.

What is completely baffling to me is when there is ZERO chance of the foetus surviving outside of the womb... you still want it kept alive? For what, an hour's life? Full of suffering??

What else is baffling is men saying how horrible the procedure is. Well, thank god YOU don't have to go through with it. Should we also stop other procedures that are painful or disgusting?

Final baffling thing is WHY IS A FOETUS' LIFE WORTH MORE THAN A MOTHER'S? You can't have cancer treatment if you're pregnant. Oops, mum's dead!! But at least this baby can grow up motherless cos that's definitely better right? If a mother can't physically care for a baby... they still have to carry to term and have a baby they can't look after? Even if they're considering adoption the PERMANENT changes a baby makes, they have to lie with those mental and physical scars forever? Or rely on the state to pay for it? Where's all that money suppose to come from??

I had a look through the LoveBoth and SaveThe8th hashtag earlier and it honestly made me sick. The way some people are talking about abortions like this vote is to make them MANDATORY no??? Some people will still object personally, that's fine. But why should those people stop other people from doing what they want with their own bodies??

[-:Undertaker:-]

Not sure why rape, incest and disabilities are always brought into it when they constitute a small percentage of abortions. Well actually no I tell a lie, I know exactly why they're always brought into it - to deflect from the fact that the industrial scale of abortions this country has are performed as a means of contraception.

If a baby is only going to survive for an hour or so when born, ie with no brain then I can understand in an abortion taking place. Similarly if a mother is seriously ill and needs to abort or else she has a strong possibility of dying. But that's pretty much the only scenarios I can see it being justified.

[FlyingJesus]

I know exactly why they're always brought into it - to deflect from the fact that the industrial scale of abortions this country has are performed as a means of contraception.

Or y'know, to highlight a very good reason that you can't just outlaw things you don't like with blanket bans and hand wringing

[-:Undertaker:-]

Or y'know, to highlight a very good reason that you can't just outlaw things you don't like with blanket bans and hand wringing

Actually, you can - and we do.

I'd say there's nothing much more important for the law to do than to protect innocent life.

[FlyingJesus]

Forcing someone to have their rapist's child isn't protection

[-:Undertaker:-]

Forcing someone to have their rapist's child isn't protection

And blending that baby up in the womb is?

[FlyingJesus]

In early stages it's no more a baby than the egg or sperm separately were. We don't call women murderers every time they have a period or think of men as mass murdering demons whenever they bash one out

[-:Undertaker:-]

"No more a baby than sperm + eggs" but looks like a baby has legs, tiny hands, a head.......

[FlyingJesus]

Is that what you think happens straight away lol

[Sloths]

I am fully against abortion being a crime, it’s still a crime here in NZ unless you get two doctors to believe you’re mentally/physically unable to carry the baby to term so basically it’s a crime for all but the seriously ill.

Its unfair if youre doing everything to protect yourself from getting pregnant (birth control plus condoms etc etc) but still that little 0.001% or whatever it is happens and you fall pregnant you have to go through with it even if you’re not financially able and have been doing everything right to prevent it. There’s always adoptions but that doesn’t mean everyone can manage to get the baby through to full term in terms of money housing and doctors appointments etc. and don’t get me started on rape.

I understand making it a crime because of those few that won’t do any protection against pregnancy then expect an abortion to clean everything up when they do fall pregnant. But it’s unfair for the rest of us who are trying to do everything possible and when some bad luck happens don’t have a choice.

[TinyFroggy]

To be honest, I'm favoring the pro-abortion.

I think it's up to the woman to have this kind of decision. I believe life started the moment you are born into this world and not before. So, we're not killing a person and that should be off the table.

These women are the one who are supposed to bring up these children and I can't see any benefit from someone delivering a baby that they don't want to keep (whether because of rape victims, mentally unwell, financially unprepared and for whatever personal reason they have). Yes, we may provide another alternative such as baby bank or adoption center but does the government really have the capacity to take care of them in the best manner? The system of adoption center and foster care are so broken and defected, we can't even trust them anymore.

If we make abortion crimes, by hook or by crook, most of these women will abort them eventually. Inhumanely. Their life will be at stake for septic abortion and what not. Not only they have to endure the excruciating pain all alone, they might also die. Which would be much less likely to happen if abortion is legalized and hospital will be the best setting for them to go through this hard moment in a more controlled environment.

Well yeah, that's in my most honest humble opinion.