Can a relationship work without trust?

[Triz]

http://thethreetomatoes.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/trust-2.png
Can relationships work when the trust is gone?




My brother recently got cheated on and after months and months of him trying to make it work in an attempt to not throw away the 5 years they've had together, he's finally had to call it a day. She hasn't done anything since the initial 'event', however he was never really able to move forward with it always lingering in the back of his mind.

Do you think the length of relationship has an affect on whether or not you can earn someones trust back? For example; had they been together for 30 years, would he have been able to put it in the past and not worry 24/7 about what she's doing and who she's with?



What are your views
If someone has cheated on their partner, can they truly ever be forgiven and move past it?



THIS DEBATE ENDS ON THE 7th MARCH

For more information on the debate guidelines and how to win prizes see the guidelines thread here (https://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=848168)

[Triz]

This debate is now open!

[scottish]

No.

/Thread

[Triz]

No.

/Thread

Would you not argue that if a person has kids together... perhaps young ones, then its worth fighting to stay together? Or perhaps if they've been together 30 odd years and made one silly mistake, is it worth throwing that all away and not even trying?

I'm not saying it's right or condoning it, but when I was cheated on, I tried to give it a chance, rather have giving up on the spot because of what she had done, and we were only together about 4 and a half years, I like to think that if we had been together a lot longer or perhaps had kids together then I would have tried even harder and perhaps for longer...

Though this thread isn't just about cheating, but rather trust in general. Perhaps your partner no longer trusts you because you once stole from them, is that something you can redeem yourself for?

[lawrawrrr]

It depends what kind of trust IMO. If you don't trust someone to not cheat on you or something like that, then no.

If you don't trust yourself, don't trust they will clean properly or whatever, these are minor things that coooould be worked on.

I actually would go far as to say that don't think implicit 100% trust in ANYONE is a healthy thing to aim for actually!

[FlyingJesus]

I think you're asking two very different questions here.

Can you have a relationship without trust? No. Trust to some degree is the basis of any relationship even casual friends or colleagues, so having no trust in someone at all means you can't have a working relationship. Forgiveness for cheating however can happen; it's a very specific trust that's been broken and while it's obviously not nice it doesn't negate everything else about the relationship and it can be built back up depending on the situations and people involved.

[Triz]

But at the same time you can have forgiveness for cheating but never fully regain their trust... I think for something such as cheating, then it almost outweighs everything else. How can you possibly go on with them with the thought always lingering in the back of your mind.. the what ifs.

I don't think trust to that degree can ever be built back up... It can be ignored but never come back.. there will always be doubt, and doubting someone not to cheat on you again isn't exactly a trusting relationship

[Samantha]

I think it depends why you don't trust them, and what they have done for you to question in to begin with. I also think that it depends on your age moreso than the time you've been together. Every relationship that ends is a learning curve and when you start a new relationship you tend to realise what was wrong in your previous ones.

For example, one of my exes never physically cheated on me, but he did message people (anonymously) asking inappropriate questions and tried to chat up at least two people that were close to me. I didn't end it, I was young and it was my first proper relationship. I don't think I trusted him, but he didn't give me reason to trust him either. Now though, if I was in a relationship where that happened again, I wouldn't hesitate to end it even though it would end up with me being single.

Another example is my relationship now. We've been together 4 years next week, and I can honestly say we trust each other 99.99% and I believe it makes our relationship so much better and means neither of us have to worry. My boyfriend originally started liking me in 2012 when we met - the trust is there because I knew he liked me but I wouldn't cheat on my (ex) boyfriend with him (nor did he want me to), but if I had done then I don't think our relationship would have lasted and I don't believe he would have trusted me (therefore it wouldn't have worked). Now, I'm not saying this is the same for every relationship, it's primarily up to the person and what their views on it are. Personally, I don't think a relationship is healthy if you don't trust your partner, it creates a lot of uneeded worry and stress when a relationship should be a loving thing.

In regards to other things, I believe if someone says they will do something and then they don't - you might get annoyed and not trust them to do it if you ask again, but a good relationship requires good communication, so you should be able to ask them why they haven't done it etc. If I was cheated on, maybe I would try and make it work, but in reality I know full well I wouldn't be able to trust them again. Also, if they cheated on you, there's nothing to say they won't do it again and you'll question why they did it and why you weren't good enough for them.

Overall, it's up to the person and their personal view on it, but for me I don't believe a relationship will work without any trust.

[scottish]

Would you not argue that if a person has kids together... perhaps young ones, then its worth fighting to stay together? Or perhaps if they've been together 30 odd years and made one silly mistake, is it worth throwing that all away and not even trying?

I'm not saying it's right or condoning it, but when I was cheated on, I tried to give it a chance, rather have giving up on the spot because of what she had done, and we were only together about 4 and a half years, I like to think that if we had been together a lot longer or perhaps had kids together then I would have tried even harder and perhaps for longer...

Though this thread isn't just about cheating, but rather trust in general. Perhaps your partner no longer trusts you because you once stole from them, is that something you can redeem yourself for?

I don't think trust can be repaired no matter how long you've been together, if they can do something once they can do it again and that will always be in the back of your mind no matter what. So the next time they're in the same situation (say they cheated on you on a night out) it'll be in the back of your mind and every other situation after that, you will never fully trust them again.

I think without trust the relationship would eventually fall apart, no matter how much you fight to stay together or believe you're 'over it' or whatever.

[Triz]

I never understand the people that cheat. Even if it's them cheating on the current partner for you, you're just setting yourself up for failure, because if they're capable of doing that to someone else, then they're capable of doing it to you as well.

Once a cheat always a cheat in my eyes.

Though I do think you owe it to yourself to at least try and not throw away X years relationship in the blink of an eye, even if you're 99% sure it's not going to work, I say at least try until you realise that it's 100% not going to work, then you can say you did you're best and didn't discard the relationship like you met yesterday.

[scottish]

I never understand the people that cheat. Even if it's them cheating on the current partner for you, you're just setting yourself up for failure, because if they're capable of doing that to someone else, then they're capable of doing it to you as well.

Once a cheat always a cheat in my eyes.

Though I do think you owe it to yourself to at least try and not throw away X years relationship in the blink of an eye, even if you're 99% sure it's not going to work, I say at least try until you realise that it's 100% not going to work, then you can say you did you're best and didn't discard the relationship like you met yesterday.

You're just wasting both of your time though, as it will eventually fall apart and you're just delaying that, when you could be looking elsewhere as could they.

[Samantha]

I never understand the people that cheat. Even if it's them cheating on the current partner for you, you're just setting yourself up for failure, because if they're capable of doing that to someone else, then they're capable of doing it to you as well.

Once a cheat always a cheat in my eyes.

Though I do think you owe it to yourself to at least try and not throw away X years relationship in the blink of an eye, even if you're 99% sure it's not going to work, I say at least try until you realise that it's 100% not going to work, then you can say you did you're best and didn't discard the relationship like you met yesterday.

I agree with your first bit! I don't understand why people cheat - if you're even considering it then be the bigger person and break up with your current partner as no one deserves it and your partner deserves respect. Also, if you cheat on someone you're going to be the one who is painted out to be the bad person (and rightly so), not your partner.

I know someone who cheated with someone on a night out, the girl was warned about it and told that he had a girlfriend. The original couple broke up because of it and the girl he cheated on her with ended up with him. Ironically (allegedly) they are no longer together because the girl cheated on him - I don't condone it at all, but that karma. I also don't understand how relationships can work if that level of trust was already broken. I know someone who got married (female), but went out of their way to cheat on them beforehand (multiple times including the hen party) and then they cheated again after they got married. Safe to say the guy finally got rid of her and is probably doing so much better now. Not sure how he allowed it for so long, but like I said it's up to them and their personal views.

[Triz]

You're just wasting both of your time though, as it will eventually fall apart and you're just delaying that, when you could be looking elsewhere as could they.

Probably yeah, but I just remember how I felt when my ex cheated on me, I had all my friends telling me that it wouldn't work because the trust is gone, but I needed to get to that clarification on my own.. I learn by my own mistakes, I'm not sure should I get cheated on again, I'll need to go through that again, or if I'll just break it off right away, but here's hoping that I won't have to ever find out lol


I agree with your first bit! I don't understand why people cheat - if you're even considering it then be the bigger person and break up with your current partner as no one deserves it and your partner deserves respect. Also, if you cheat on someone you're going to be the one who is painted out to be the bad person (and rightly so), not your partner.

I know someone who cheated with someone on a night out, the girl was warned about it and told that he had a girlfriend. The original couple broke up because of it and the girl he cheated on her with ended up with him. Ironically (allegedly) they are no longer together because the girl cheated on him - I don't condone it at all, but that karma. I also don't understand how relationships can work if that level of trust was already broken. I know someone who got married (female), but went out of their way to cheat on them beforehand (multiple times including the hen party) and then they cheated again after they got married. Safe to say the guy finally got rid of her and is probably doing so much better now. Not sure how he allowed it for so long, but like I said it's up to them and their personal views.

Yeah. Starting a relationship with the foundations of cheating is just a recipe for disaster. To be honest I should have seen the red flags with my ex as she cheated on her last bf with someone else who I knew, before eventually falling for me, so I kinda saw it first hand that she was capable of doing that, but I guess you always think they'll never do that to me..

Lesson learned though I guess.

[Samantha]

Probably yeah, but I just remember how I felt when my ex cheated on me, I had all my friends telling me that it wouldn't work because the trust is gone, but I needed to get to that clarification on my own.. I learn by my own mistakes, I'm not sure should I get cheated on again, I'll need to go through that again, or if I'll just break it off right away, but here's hoping that I won't have to ever find out lol



Yeah. Starting a relationship with the foundations of cheating is just a recipe for disaster. To be honest I should have seen the red flags with my ex as she cheated on her last bf with someone else who I knew, before eventually falling for me, so I kinda saw it first hand that she was capable of doing that, but I guess you always think they'll never do that to me..

Lesson learned though I guess.

With the first bit about getting clarification on your own, I understand what you mean. When I was with my ex, people felt they couldn't talk to me and tell me he was chatting to them because I probably wouldn't have believed them. I needed to find out on my own and go through that experience - we were together for a year and half and he broke up with me over text, that's when I found out about him messaging others. If I had have found out before he broke up with me, I probably wouldn't have ended it even though the trust wasn't there anyway.

For the second bit, luckily I've never been with someone who was a cheat, and hopefully I never will. However, I see relationships that start on that basis and you could say leopards don't change their spots or maybe that someone they're with now is special. I know someone who was willing to cheat on their girlfriend with me, but I wouldn't trust them if they did that and I definitely wouldn't look for a relationship with them.

I know someone who has multiple personality disorder, he used to lie to everyone and you always had to take what he said with a pinch of salt. He is with someone and I don't understand how they can trust him as a person, I know it might not be his fault 100%, but I don't think I could cope not knowing what he was and wasn't lying about.

[Empired]

Lads surely anyone is capable of cheating what with y'know free will and everything. Anyone who's everyone is capable of cheating. I don't agree with this whole "once a cheater always a cheater" stuff; that just seems like such a narrow minded, black and white perspective that shoves a whole tonne of people under one label. I've never been cheated on or cheated but I assume infidelity must actually be a massive grey area and you'd be foolish to ignore that.

I think a relationship can work without trust, but only short term and as long as you're both still actively working on rebuilding that trust. Obviously as other people have said there are lines that, once crossed, you're probably not gonna be able to come back from. But if you both think your relationship is still worth working to save, there will be a period where trust isn't there but I think it's possible to rebuild it.

It really depends on what kinda people you both are, though.

[buttons]

Lads surely anyone is capable of cheating what with y'know free will and everything. Anyone who's everyone is capable of cheating. I don't agree with this whole "once a cheater always a cheater" stuff; that just seems like such a narrow minded, black and white perspective that shoves a whole tonne of people under one label. I've never been cheated on or cheated but I assume infidelity must actually be a massive grey area and you'd be foolish to ignore that.
^ I'm not gonna disagree that people shouldn't cheat and that it's shitty of them to do so but it definitely doesn't mean once a cheater always a cheater. People do learn from their mistakes or can learn that either the person they were in a relationship was wrong for them and/or that they need to work on something deep inside that causes them to cheat. We aren't slaves to our emotions and therapy/theory can help us understand the patterns we get into and the reasons for our behaviours. Personally I'd be distraught if someone cheated on me and wouldn't go back to them, not because I couldn't trust them not to do it again (because I know people can change) but because I'd want to respect myself more than that and allow them to deal with the consequences of their actions. Sometimes that's what people need to be able to change. However, I would understand why they would do it and that it's something to do with them and not me, that it's something they can work on. Whether or not the other partner chooses to stay and support them is entirely up to them.

I've cheated before but I don't consider myself a cheater. It was one relationship where I was unhappy/insecure/immature/too broken to get out. In the same vein, I used to do gymnastics a long time ago but that doesn't mean I'm a gymnast anymore. My ex never once made me feel guilty for cheating in a previous relationship - he knew my reasons for it and how far I had come since it. He never ever spoke about it or used it against me. And no, I never cheated on him and I knew if I ever had the thoughts to, then it was something I needed to explore about myself and my relationship instead of staying in a relationship I'm unhappy in and hurting another person. So, isn't that trust? He trusted that I wouldn't hurt him even though I was capable of doing it.

Also let me make the point that whilst cheating is horrible for the other partner, it isn't actually the worst thing that could happen. Kissing someone that makes you feel safe and happy versus the cheated on person being neglectful or abusive and makes it difficult for the cheatee to get out of the relationship? It's definitely not as black and white as its made out to be.

As for the question - of course a relationship can "work" without trust - people stay together all their lives even though they don't trust each other and even though they really detest each other! What you need to define is what trust is and what you think makes a relationship "work". Sometimes distrust is unconscious. An anxious person can unconsciously distrust their partner and believe they're cheating on them without any evidence of it, an avoidant person can distrust their partner and believe they're trying to control them or take away their freedoms. So sometimes people are in love but don't trust each other, they make it "work" in a way that they keep trying without actually getting to the root of the problem. So, what is a working relationship? Is it solely based on trust? It's an important part of it but it isn't the whole story.

[FlyingJesus]

Feel like there's been a lot of "I wouldn't be comfortable with X if Y happened, therefore it's impossible for anyone" going on in this thread. A debate shouldn't have your personal experiences as absolutes - if even one person says that they've worked things out with a cheating partner then clearly saying that it's irreparable is just incorrect.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Wouldn't have any idea, never been in one.

Love blinds people though.

[Triz]

Wouldn't have any idea, never been in one.

Love blinds people though.


Doesn't have to be a romantic relationship, what about a a business relationship, or even a friend...

[-:Undertaker:-]

Doesn't have to be a romantic relationship, what about a a business relationship, or even a friend...

Friendship then, I would say loyalty is the most important trait.

[_spirit]

I feel once you have lost someone's trust or they have lost yours you can build it back up but it does take time. I even know people who have been cheated on but worked it out with their partner, So I feel its down to the two partners themselves as an individual whether or not to work through there issues and see if they can rebuild the relationship back up. Also I do agree with Laura like who can say that they trust someone 100% its like rolling a dice like 1 in 6 chance. You can trust someone but I would never trust 100% as people change and so do situations your put into.

[Jarkie]

I feel once you have lost someone's trust or they have lost yours you can build it back up but it does take time. I even know people who have been cheated on but worked it out with their partner, So I feel its down to the two partners themselves as an individual whether or not to work through there issues and see if they can rebuild the relationship back up. Also I do agree with Laura like who can say that they trust someone 100% its like rolling a dice like 1 in 6 chance. You can trust someone but I would never trust 100% as people change and so do situations your put into.

I disagree - I personally feel like I could never trust someone ever again if I got cheated on. I have been cheated and lied too before by an ex partner and my so called "best mate" so this is probably why I will have a bias view towards your first paragraph. With trust, you cannot have a relationship with trust it is one of the fundamentals biases of a relationship with things such as communication and loyalty. It is evident, if you have had bad experiences in this relatable topic you're going to have a negative view towards.

Remember everyone - you have till 7th of March to reply and engage! Triz (Sectional) and I have some fabulous prizes to give out - get replying (especially if you haven't replied yet) for a chance - and don't be scared to reply either :)

[Jarkie]

@Sectional (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=79795); @scottish (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=53890); @lawrawrrr (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=61966); @FlyingJesus (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=24753); @Samantha (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=68263); @Empired (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=80588); @buttons (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=42203); -:Undertaker:-; cameron446:;

You have all posted some fantastic responses to this debate - Just tagging for a reminder to see if you wish to provide any further replies to this debate - you have till the 7th of March to get them replies in :)

Additionally, if you are reading this and haven't said your piece yet - then get posting, you could be in a chance to win some prizes :)

[Triz]

I feel once you have lost someone's trust or they have lost yours you can build it back up but it does take time. I even know people who have been cheated on but worked it out with their partner, So I feel its down to the two partners themselves as an individual whether or not to work through there issues and see if they can rebuild the relationship back up. Also I do agree with Laura like who can say that they trust someone 100% its like rolling a dice like 1 in 6 chance. You can trust someone but I would never trust 100% as people change and so do situations your put into.

Like Jamie, I also disagree, but that may be because I too have been cheated on, I tried to make it work for about 4 or 5 months after the incident, but ultimately the constant worrying that she'd do it again and always wanting to know where she is and who she was with is not something I could put myself through... And after 4 or 5 months of that it certainly puts a toll on your mental state as well as your relationship, I realised that it just wasn't going to work, and I don't believe you can fully regain trust when it was lost in a way such as cheating.. there will always be a sliver of doubt in the back of your mind and it'll eat away at you until you reach breaking point.