Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 - Crashed in East Ukraine

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Originally Posted by FlyingJesus

So don't blame Russia for something that's their fault because someone else had done it elsewhere in a completely unrelated incident what kind of logic is this

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Dan logic

The train carrying 280 of the bodies is now on the move. Destination currently unknown. The black boxes from the aircrsft is also being handed over to the Malaysian authorities

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Originally Posted by FlyingJesus

So don't blame Russia for something that's their fault because someone else had done it elsewhere in a completely unrelated incident what kind of logic is this

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Nobody knows who it was.

The blame is being placed on Russian separtarist forces - not Russia itself. Whilst those forces may be indirectly under Russian control and supplied by Russia (all of which is understandable and nothing out of the ordinary) it's also likely that this was simply a rogue commander or soldier who fired.

The motivation for Russia to fire down a passenger jet? None.

The motivation for western powers to blame Russia for this? Many.

I watched just before on Sky News for example a reporter say that President Putin is now viewed as the international bogeyman. Sorry, but by whom? By EU member states such as the UK, France and Germany who are idiotically attempting to wrestle the Ukraine out of Russian influence and the Russian power sphere? By the United States which is determined to keep Russia at bay and which has stupidy and recklessly encroached into former Soviet territory since the fall of the Berlin Wall?

No-one thinks Russia shot it down, the issue with them is that they supplied untrained rebels with weaponry they weren't able to properly use and then refused to take responsibility. There's no motivation for ANYONE to shoot down a passenger plane, it's pretty much confirmed by early/intercepted messages and satellites that it was a mistaken attack meant to be aimed at a military aid craft. As usual you've come into a thread with a specific subject and tried to talk about Islamic radicals

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Originally Posted by FlyingJesus

No-one thinks Russia shot it down, the issue with them is that they supplied untrained rebels with weaponry they weren't able to properly use and then refused to take responsibility. There's no motivation for ANYONE to shoot down a passenger plane, it's pretty much confirmed by early/intercepted messages and satellites that it was a mistaken attack meant to be aimed at a military aid craft.

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So it was a mistake made by the separatists.

Now what has that got to do with President Putin exactly? By the coverage you'd think Russian Federation forces had shot it down on purpose.

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Originally Posted by FlyingJesus

As usual you've come into a thread with a specific subject and tried to talk about Islamic radicals

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I haven't mentioned Islamic rebels.

Dan I really do think you're being contrary for the sake of it.

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

So it was a mistake made by the separatists.

Now what has that got to do with President Putin exactly? By the coverage you'd think Russian Federation forces had shot it down on purpose.

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Are you somehow unaware that Putin's supplying these people? If I break into someone's house with a chap who hates the resident and give my accomplice a gun, I can't then say "well it happened in your house so it's your fault" to the resident who gets shot

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

I haven't mentioned Islamic rebels.

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

Paul’s response: “That may well be true, but guess what? ISIS has a lot of American weapons. We send weapons into Syria to help the rebels and if al Qaeda ends up getting it, it doesn’t mean our American government and Obama deliberately wanted ISIS to get American weapons.”

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Haven't you

I really haven't seen any evidence of missile shooting the plane down? Not doubting it but is this a conclusion based on witnesses or what

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Originally Posted by karter

I really haven't seen any evidence of missile shooting the plane down? Not doubting it but is this a conclusion based on witnesses or what

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How do you think it's crashed the way it did then? :P

An important point:

Perhaps crucially, no presentation of evidence in either the US or Russia disputes that #MH17 was shot down.

— Jon Ostrower (@jonostrower) July 21, 2014

Not sure if posted before but this is what one of the victis posted on facebook

Which means; If it should disappear, this is what it look likes.

http://www.kualalumpurpost.net/wp-co...07/Cor-Pan.png

I m glad the bodies will be transported to the netherlands