UK slips down Index of Economic Freedom rankings

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Originally Posted by alexxxxx

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ncome_equality

if you take another measure here, you will see that HK and SG are much further down the list in income equality, ie it shows that certain sectors (like banking and finance in these areas) means that there is an elite in both city states in comparison. Do you think economic growth and prosperity should be shared among only a few people. We don't have 'socialist-style' economies. Don't be stupid. ID cards have been scrapped due to public pressure like how a democracy works, much of the CCTV is owned privately and if im not mistaken there are measures coming in to prevent councils from doing that.

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I'm not talking about income equality, the richer and more prosperous a nation is then the higher the gap will become. I am talking about their future and the way they are going about it is the correct way to go, them both being city-states has nothing to do with it and only strengths my argument that if they can do it - why can't we? because we have a mass of regulation hurting growth, high taxes to pay for bloated public spending.

The ID cards, the threat has not gone at all despite what Blue Labour and the Liberal Democrats tell you, afterall it was Michael Howard who published the green paper on suggesting ID cards in the first place a few years ago.

If you want democracy then bring in the Swiss-style referendum styled system.

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Originally Posted by alexxxxx

Well sustained economic growth in all eurozone countries (and high growth in certain countries like Luxembourg) is your answer! Im unsure how you can blame the Euro for the current crisis.

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Sustained growth is good enough is it during a worldwide boom? thats the best we can aim for? it is pitiful. We fact get excited over growth rates of 0.4% or 1.2% is pathetic and the idea that we should pat ourselves on the back for it is ridiculous whilst on the other side of the world you have Chinese people working hard, creating things living in a country which is far from perfect but is at growth rates such as 8% whilst buying all of our business up securing a future monopoly for China.

So no, the Euro hasn't brought about economic success - its failing, the European Central Bank the other day had to buy its own debt just to keep the house of cards up. A complete failure thanks to incompetant governments spending too much and a foolish-politically motivated idea in the first place.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuaDezWIFak

Growth and stability? no, the opposite has happened.

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Originally Posted by alexxxxx

Hong Kong does not grow as fast as China or less developed regions, granted, it grows faster than the UK but its ties with those countries (and location) allows for its relatively high growth with them.

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Nonsense, we can easily match this growth - although you are correct in saying that trade with those countries does help, as a recent economical report stated - that the UK needs to turn to the East rather than do what is currently does (and is forced to do) which is trade mainly with the EU.

If I find the report tonight/tommorow I will link you to it.

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

I'm not talking about income equality, the richer and more prosperous a nation is then the higher the gap will become. I am talking about their future and the way they are going about it is the correct way to go, them both being city-states has nothing to do with it and only strengths my argument that if they can do it - why can't we? because we have a mass of regulation hurting growth, high taxes to pay for bloated public spending.

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Nope that is not true. Simply not true. Sweden, Norway, Iceland, The Netherlands, Austria etc have higher GDP per capita AND lower GINI coefficients. And yes it does have everything to do with, city states are obviously more dense and therefore public services are easier and cheaper to administer, let alone the fact they do not have the responsibility of looking after vast public spaces.

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Sustained growth is good enough is it during a worldwide boom? thats the best we can aim for? it is pitiful. We fact get excited over growth rates of 0.4% or 1.2% is pathetic and the idea that we should pat ourselves on the back for it is ridiculous whilst on the other side of the world you have Chinese people working hard, creating things living in a country which is far from perfect but is at growth rates such as 8% whilst buying all of our business up securing a future monopoly for China.

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Hahaha, that's where you are wrong - it isn't a worldwide boom, if you look at the USA, Canada, the rest of the EU (apart from maybe the east), AUS/NZ, South Korea, Japan you'll see a similar pattern. Slow growth.

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So no, the Euro hasn't brought about economic success - its failing, the European Central Bank the other day had to buy its own debt just to keep the house of cards up. A complete failure thanks to incompetant governments spending too much and a foolish-politically motivated idea in the first place.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuaDezWIFak

Growth and stability? no, the opposite has happened.

Nonsense, we can easily match this growth - although you are correct in saying that trade with those countries does help, as a recent economical report stated - that the UK needs to turn to the East rather than do what is currently does (and is forced to do) which is trade mainly with the EU.

If I find the report tonight/tommorow I will link you to it.

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Trade what? We can't compete on much manufacturing, but if you look at exports per capita here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...rts_per_capita which of course includes services and goods you'll see that our export rate is much higher than the Chinese but is far lower than many of the richer countries of the European Union. The idea that we are somehow held back by the EU is nonsense. It's problems at the national level!

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Originally Posted by alexxxxx

Nope that is not true. Simply not true. Sweden, Norway, Iceland, The Netherlands, Austria etc have higher GDP per capita AND lower GINI coefficients. And yes it does have everything to do with, city states are obviously more dense and therefore public services are easier and cheaper to administer, let alone the fact they do not have the responsibility of looking after vast public spaces.

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I'm talking here about economic leaders such as Hong Kong, Singapore, Australia and New Zealand - not Austria, Sweden and so on. As for city states, that is utter nonsense i'm afraid - London is dense, but Switzerland not as dense yet Switzerland is outperforming London and the UK. The bigger the country the more natural resources and a bigger population we have, we can could match these nations/cities in growth - but in one sense you are right, Hong Kong and co. do not have bloated public sectors and thus do not need to spend money on that.

The vast majority of UK tax is spent on welfare payments, not looking after vast public spaces - most public spaces in recent years have simply been sold off in order to fund the bloated public sector and much land is privately owned and maintained. So that is complete nonsense.

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Originally Posted by alexxxxx

Hahaha, that's where you are wrong - it isn't a worldwide boom, if you look at the USA, Canada, the rest of the EU (apart from maybe the east), AUS/NZ, South Korea, Japan you'll see a similar pattern. Slow growth.

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Look at a map of growth rates and you will see the money is shifting eastwards, the western world is bankrupt. There is a worldwide boom (or could be) if government over here got its face out of the people and allowed them to get on with it, provided they cut the public sector right back along with a mass dumping of regulations that are holding us back.

You have a choice, compete with China and co. or don't - its very simple and I know which i'd pick.

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Originally Posted by alexxxxx

Trade what? We can't compete on much manufacturing, but if you look at exports per capita here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...rts_per_capita which of course includes services and goods you'll see that our export rate is much higher than the Chinese but is far lower than many of the richer countries of the European Union. The idea that we are somehow held back by the EU is nonsense. It's problems at the national level!

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We can't compete on manufacturing because we have a mass of regulations and taxation which would make it impossible for anyone to be based here successfully and new EU regulations are making it harder for even service based sectors to be located here, hence why they are all fleeing to Switzerland. Japan competes perfectly well with pretty high wages and has a technological base, we need to follow that - if we don't then we'll simply become what China and co. where to us not so long ago, client states.

Its at national level yes, but not helped at EU level with its ridiculous regulations which cost jobs and money. No national government could energise/reform this economy without leaving the European Union. They are already preparing to harmonise taxes, thus losing yet again another competitive advantage - business will simply move to locations such as Switzerland which are free from such rubbish.

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

I'm talking here about economic leaders such as Hong Kong, Singapore, Australia and New Zealand - not Austria, Sweden and so on. As for city states, that is utter nonsense i'm afraid - London is dense, but Switzerland not as dense yet Switzerland is outperforming London and the UK. The bigger the country the more natural resources and a bigger population we have, we can could match these nations/cities in growth - but in one sense you are right, Hong Kong and co. do not have bloated public sectors and thus do not need to spend money on that.

The vast majority of UK tax is spent on welfare payments, not looking after vast public spaces - most public spaces in recent years have simply been sold off in order to fund the bloated public sector and much land is privately owned and maintained. So that is complete nonsense.

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You call Australia and NZ 'economic leaders.' NZ is in a recession, australia has weak growth.. Why can't I choose to compare other european nations? Because they don't fit in with your warped view of the world. Britain has a problem in that it hasn't a diverse economy. Welfare payments incl health? Face it, it is easier and more efficient for public services to be handed out in cities. Plus large government departments aren't required due to the size of the countries. Smaller Sizes = More Efficient, if you knew anything about economics you'd know that there is an optimum size for any organisation and it's clear that for government departments it's smaller.

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Look at a map of growth rates and you will see the money is shifting eastwards, the western world is bankrupt. There is a worldwide boom (or could be) if government over here got its face out of the people and allowed them to get on with it, provided they cut the public sector right back along with a mass dumping of regulations that are holding us back.

You have a choice, compete with China and co. or don't - its very simple and I know which i'd pick.

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That's because the east has capacity to grow! Low wage rates, low land prices, cheaper natural resources. The 'Western World Is Bankrupt' is a load of rubbish.

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We can't compete on manufacturing because we have a mass of regulations and taxation which would make it impossible for anyone to be based here successfully and new EU regulations are making it harder for even service based sectors to be located here, hence why they are all fleeing to Switzerland. Japan competes perfectly well with pretty high wages and has a technological base, we need to follow that - if we don't then we'll simply become what China and co. where to us not so long ago, client states.

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Does Japan really have good growth? not sure it really does. Japan has had massive economic problems in the last few years. Germany competes pretty well under the 'crippling' EU regulations.

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Its at national level yes, but not helped at EU level with its ridiculous regulations which cost jobs and money. No national government could energise/reform this economy without leaving the European Union. They are already preparing to harmonise taxes, thus losing yet again another competitive advantage - business will simply move to locations such as Switzerland which are free from such rubbish.

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So why is it all the EU's fault when you fail to consider the other nations in the EU (or the vast amount of EU legislation that swiss companies have to accept)? It's national level, failure and poorly managed investments by the government (in my opinion). I'm unsure how the government think that by cutting university funding will somehow improve UK performance in the future.