Business/Foreign Workers

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AgnesIO

Waiting for someone to say "yes, but your culture is more aligned to ours, so you are fine", and then they will claim they are not simply being xenophobic :rolleyes: :P

---

and to add to that, the Ireland Act (1949) states irish people in the uk are not considered 'foreign'

so when the question was raised to the home office it should have been 100% clear that irish people are to be exempt from it, the fact they dismissed the question with a no comment just shows that they either have no idea what they're talking about or they're happy to include irish citizens on the ridiculous list

shaming people who want to contribute to your own society isn't the smartest way to go about things, and foreigners are not the reason for all of the uks problems but OH WELL

I disagree with it. It's just another unnecessary bureaucratic obstacle where people are labelled and categorised by things that have no bearing on how they do their job (gender, race, age, ethnicity etc etc).

However, there is an issue with immigration that annoys me. People say things like "oh these foreign workers help prop up our NHS" which is true and my thanks/gratitude to each and every one of them. My issue is that pro-immigration arguments always tend to rely on degenerating and undermining British people. You can even see that in here. "They're too lazy", "they're too stupid", "immigrants do the jobs that British people don't want to do" and I think that's a slap in the face because I do think that British people would do these jobs. I was unemployed for 2 years (I live in an area of high unemployment) and it was hell on Earth. I am not saying any immigrants took my job but it did annoy me when these arguments are made cos I am working my butt off trying to find a job and people are making these inaccurate generalizations.

I will take nursing as an example. There's a huge demand for entries to nursing degrees but there isn't enough supply so it means we have to look to other countries to prop it up. Why aren't we training more nurses? Why aren't we building the skills, talent, workforce so that we don't have to rely on immigration? According to the article in the link, this is due to funding but I do think the long term benefits of having more people in work and filling the demand means it is worth the investment.

Immigration should be used as a last resort to fill the skills gaps in the system rather than as an excuse not to bother. "We don't need to spend money/resources on this because we can just use highly skilled/trained people from other countries" as that is bound to breed resentment and is unsustainable long term.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AgnesIO

How many student doctors do you know of that can't find a job?

They're not being employed because they're cheaper; they're being employed because we don't have enough. Why don't we have enough? Because our education system does not produce students with good enough qualifications or work ethic. Why is this? Because kids have it far too easy in school.

It isn't anything to do with foreigners.

---

You can argue that case for the few skilled immigrants that come but you cannot argue it for the vast majority of immigrants coming who are filling unskilled jobs which less academic Britons are being pushed out of.

If British people aren't willing to work for a measly wage then an employer in a natural market would be forced to up his wages in order to find staff to do the work. Since 2004 however, he's has an endless supply of cheap labour from Eastern Europe with which to keep his wages the same which Britons who have to cope with living costs cannot keep up with.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Empired

Actually at my fathers care home we've been told by the staff (who are all foreign; there is not a single person on my dad's floor whose native language is English) that they are chosen over residents of the UK because UK residents demand higher pay. But that's only one example that's personal to me, I couldn't produce any stats or make any generalisations about the country but I still think that's pretty shocking.

---

Indeed. Cheap labour from the continent has been amazing for corporations the last ten years as it has helped push down Britons wages, especially in unskilled jobs. Well thankfully that is now coming to an end.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wixard

it's easy for you all to say you think the outrage is ridiculous when it's not your name on the list

my name will be one of the names demanding to be listed

---

It won't be a list. It is simple statistics.

To my mind this isn't about skilled work anyway. If HSBC in London is employing 30% French bankers then that's not really an issue. The issue has been and always has been low-skilled immigration into this country in deprived towns. If a fish finger packing factory, being one of the only employers in an area with 50% unemployment is found to be employing 90% Polish workforce then that is morally wrong and unacceptable - do you not agree?

The affect it has on social cohesion, confidence and the social fabric is disasterous. It's got to stop.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wixard

and I don't particularly think it's fair that an english person with the same qualifications gets automatically chosen over myself.

---

At the end of the day our duty is to the people who are British subjects and living here. Your country left the Union way back in 1922. If you as a foreigner are not needed to fill a job, then I am sorry but that's not our responsibility.

I welcome people if we need them, but certainly not at the expense of my own people: British subjects. My family who moved to Australia did not go demanding changes to the immigration system: they had to abide by it and did so.

If you want all the privileges of British nationality then apply to become a British subject. If not, then *shrugs*

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wixard

like what agnes io said, what if my personality is more fit for the job? but i'm not british, so i automatically get placed behind them? and lets just say that's not even the case, that's still how i've been made feel and at the moment i feel extremely unwelcome

---

This isn't about feelings, this is about reality. A few years ago my aunt's Spanish nanny stated to her how she was shocked that employers here wouldn't put British people first. She remarked how back in Spain employers there will always put their own first because ultimately the future of your own country is your own people.

If you're feeling "unwelcome" that's just because you had must've no idea what the majority of normal British people felt as for the last decade the liberal media and politicians have slurred them for voicing any concerns on migration.

The 23rd June changed all that forever. It's only all come as a shock to people who weren't paying attention tbh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wixard

just to add, i don't think the whole 'list being made public' is a bad idea with regard to finding employers who are exploiting the system, it's how it's suddenly been put to the public and DEMANDED

---

But a large majority of the public back this. Look at the polling I posted.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wixard

and how the entire attitude surrounding it is BRITISH PEOPLE FIRST
i have two degrees and studied for one of them in your country, i think i have just as much a right to work there don't you

---

The attitude now is British people first because for far too long our own people have been put second.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

You can argue that case for the few skilled immigrants that come but you cannot argue it for the vast majority of immigrants coming who are filling unskilled jobs which less academic Britons are being pushed out of.

If British people aren't willing to work for a measly wage then an employer in a natural market would be forced to up his wages in order to find staff to do the work. Since 2004 however, he's has an endless supply of cheap labour from Eastern Europe with which to keep his wages the same which Britons who have to cope with living costs cannot keep up with.



Indeed. Cheap labour from the continent has been amazing for corporations the last ten years as it has helped push down Britons wages, especially in unskilled jobs. Well thankfully that is now coming to an end.



It won't be a list. It is simple statistics.

To my mind this isn't about skilled work anyway. If HSBC in London is employing 30% French bankers then that's not really an issue. The issue has been and always has been low-skilled immigration into this country in deprived towns. If a fish finger packing factory, being one of the only employers in an area with 50% unemployment is found to be employing 90% Polish workforce then that is morally wrong and unacceptable - do you not agree?

The affect it has on social cohesion, confidence and the social fabric is disasterous. It's got to stop.



At the end of the day our duty is to the people who are British subjects and living here. Your country left the Union way back in 1922. If you as a foreigner are not needed to fill a job, then I am sorry but that's not our responsibility.

I welcome people if we need them, but certainly not at the expense of my own people: British subjects. My family who moved to Australia did not go demanding changes to the immigration system: they had to abide by it and did so.

If you want all the privileges of British nationality then apply to become a British subject. If not, then *shrugs*



This isn't about feelings, this is about reality. A few years ago my aunt's Spanish nanny stated to her how she was shocked that employers here wouldn't put British people first. She remarked how back in Spain employers there will always put their own first because ultimately the future of your own country is your own people.

If you're feeling "unwelcome" that's just because you had must've no idea what the majority of normal British people felt as for the last decade the liberal media and politicians have slurred them for voicing any concerns on migration.

The 23rd June changed all that forever. It's only all come as a shock to people who weren't paying attention tbh.



But a large majority of the public back this. Look at the polling I posted.



The attitude now is British people first because for far too long our own people have been put second.

---

So you are a fan of the minimum wage. Hardly a right wing 'kipper.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AgnesIO

So you are a fan of the minimum wage. Hardly a right wing 'kipper.

---

Where did I say I was a fan of the minimum wage?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wixard

it's easy for you all to say you think the outrage is ridiculous when it's not your name on the list

my name will be one of the names demanding to be listed, and I don't particularly think it's fair that an english person with the same qualifications gets automatically chosen over myself.

like what agnes io said, what if my personality is more fit for the job? but i'm not british, so i automatically get placed behind them? and lets just say that's not even the case, that's still how i've been made feel and at the moment i feel extremely unwelcome

- - - Updated - - -

just to add, i don't think the whole 'list being made public' is a bad idea with regard to finding employers who are exploiting the system, it's how it's suddenly been put to the public and DEMANDED

and how the entire attitude surrounding it is BRITISH PEOPLE FIRST
i have two degrees and studied for one of them in your country, i think i have just as much a right to work there don't you

---

It's not a list with names though, it's a "we employ 24 workers from overseas" that's all. It's just the same as being "listed" by the government for being a woman at work (which they have to collect as well) I honestly don't see the problem with it? It's not like they're trying to get rid of everyone who hasn't lived here for years, probably just to shame some larger corporations who employ 70% foreign staff rather than British people when they're a British company.

Are you here on a worker visa now?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

Where did I say I was a fan of the minimum wage?

---

Well, on the basis you despise immigration on the basis it artificially lowers wages, surely you must therefore be in favour of an ever increasing minimum wage - as it means that no amount of immigration can continually lower wages.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lawrawrrr

It's not a list with names though, it's a "we employ 24 workers from overseas" that's all. It's just the same as being "listed" by the government for being a woman at work (which they have to collect as well) I honestly don't see the problem with it? It's not like they're trying to get rid of everyone who hasn't lived here for years, probably just to shame some larger corporations who employ 70% foreign staff rather than British people when they're a British company.

Are you here on a worker visa now?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

---

oh my god what? NO

this just shows how uninformed you all are!

i'm a european citizen and i'm also irish, no worker visa is NEEDED

even if we take being european out of the equation, ireland and the UK have an agreement where both can work and move freely between the countries since the 1920s, however with the UK leaving europe we're in the process of trying to reestablish it and we're not too sure what will happen since Ireland will still be in the EU therefore there are border issues.

Fallon has announced this isn't happening.

A win for the majority.

Jimmy Fallon?

But yeah I thought you were in favour of the free market Dan rather than imposing specific levels of wages on businesses and letting government dictate how private companies can work