British Government refuses France's request to take in 1,500 'child' refugees

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Originally Posted by dbgtz

I don't know? All I was trying to point out is that there is this thing called diplomacy as you like to bang on about when it comes to being a "free" country where you make your own trade deals and such. Pissing off your neighbours too frequently will definitely not help when it comes to negotiation.

Thankfully I'm not in a position to make or affect these negotiations, but even better, neither are you. Unfortunately what we do have is men like Boris Johnson which is an absolute joke.

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exactly, you don't know so it was just a chance to have a stab at me who at least does know what he want & can say it.

and what are you linking trade deals with this for? it's a very strange EU mindset that trade has anything to do with border controls or above all asylum policy. The Dominion of Canada just signed a trade deal with the EU and guess what? the French don't have any say on Canadian refugee, asylum or immigration policy as Canada is not in the EU. it's the same with us. stop conflating trade + borders.

if the French started linking what form of government they thought we should have (a republic rather than monarchy) tommorow with their trade policy with us then we'd rightly ask 'what?' and tell them to get lost. same here with refugees.

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

exactly, you don't know so it was just a chance to have a stab at me who at least does know what he want & can say it.

and what are you linking trade deals with this for? it's a very strange EU mindset that trade has anything to do with border controls or above all asylum policy. The Dominion of Canada just signed a trade deal with the EU and guess what? the French don't have any say on Canadian refugee, asylum or immigration policy as Canada is not in the EU. it's the same with us. stop conflating trade + borders.

if the French started linking what form of government they thought we should have (a republic rather than monarchy) tommorow with their trade policy with us then we'd rightly ask 'what?' and tell them to get lost. same here with refugees.

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But you say that not actually knowing the consequence of what you say. Everyone likes to pretend they're an expert but you do not know how this will affect any kind of deal in future. I'm not suggesting to bow down to their request, all I am saying is don't be surprised when they do something which will negatively impact us. Yes, it is likely this one event will not have huge impact, but who knows what else we've done to piss off the French (and other) governments. You can't just keep giving other countries the middle finger but expect them to give you a great trade deal.

Also, don't compare our form of government to accepting some immigrants, that's very different and you know it is. However, I would bet if enough countries took action against us because of our form of government, then I see it being changed fairly quickly.

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Originally Posted by dbgtz

But you say that not actually knowing the consequence of what you say. Everyone likes to pretend they're an expert but you do not know how this will affect any kind of deal in future. I'm not suggesting to bow down to their request, all I am saying is don't be surprised when they do something which will negatively impact us. Yes, it is likely this one event will not have huge impact, but who knows what else we've done to piss off the French (and other) governments. You can't just keep giving other countries the middle finger but expect them to give you a great trade deal.

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To say we are pissing them off implies that we're acting in an irrational manner or being unreasonable. It is not unreasonable to say that the asylum policy of Her Majesty's Government has jack all to do with the President of the French Republic.

If anyone should be pissed off it is us for them daring to demand we tailor our refugee policy to their demands when the situation at Calais is solely their responsibility and that of the European Union for failing to control their borders.

If they then wish to use trade as a weapon then let them, who cares? Diplomacy is about calling bluff and not bowing down.

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

To say we are pissing them off implies that we're acting in an irrational manner or being unreasonable. It is not unreasonable to say that the asylum policy of Her Majesty's Government has jack all to do with the President of the French Republic.

If anyone should be pissed off it is us for them daring to demand we tailor our refugee policy to their demands when the situation at Calais is solely their responsibility and that of the European Union for failing to control their borders.

If they then wish to use trade as a weapon then let them, who cares? Diplomacy is about calling bluff and not bowing down.

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So as you have pissed me off, does that make you irrational or unreasonable? So no, pissing off does not imply someone acting irrationally unless you care to admit you are irrational. In such a globalised and connected world, the unfortunate truth is most of our decisions and laws will have impact on other countries in some shape or form and vice versa.

That is also not diplomacy in the slightest.