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23-04-2013, 11:40 AM
Adam

Just close Habbox and all problems will disappear.
23-04-2013, 12:02 PM
Nick

Quote:

Originally Posted by pasta

but who will claim the award when he's missing!!

I will!!!
23-04-2013, 01:38 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inseriousity.

I've been on the fence the whole time. Personally, I think the merge could've worked. It was change and people are resistant to change but the whole transition was just done wrong, placing the department in a state of limbo and not able to rejuvinate itself. Both general management and department management are to blame for that. Applications should've been opened because it was only with new arrivals that the success of this department could be accurately measured. As newbies to the department, their opinion on the merge and what work they did would not have been about how it was different to what came before but based on the merge's own merits. They could've easily been asked to choose a department if the merge had been reversed.

The department management have had their fighting spirit eroded so I took the helm. I am not convinced by this idea that the writing styles are different. I've also worked in both departments before and found no transition difficult at all. If content is about throwing the kitchen sink in then imo that should change because the similarity between both is that they are to both instruct and entertain and that style is consistent in both news and content.

On the other hand, the lack of fighting spirit should be an indicator that it was never going to be championed from the rooftops so when asked, I told Matt we should unmerge.

Some of the notable differences include:

- Content is not personal to the readers, hence why we have to substitute words like your, you etc. for player, character and so on.
- News is more recent therefore we can use the present, past or future tense as we wish whereas we need to speak in the past tense for Content.
- We can't be repetitive in News, we can in Content.

Others can be found, although the two above should be easy to transition, some do find it difficult.
23-04-2013, 01:43 PM
Tom

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samanfa

Some of the notable differences include:

- Content is not personal to the readers, hence why we have to substitute words like your, you etc. for player, character and so on.
- News is more recent therefore we can use the present, past or future tense as we wish whereas we need to speak in the past tense for Content.
- We can't be repetitive in News, we can in Content.

Others can be found, although the two above should be easy to transition, some do find it difficult.

This is rubbish tbh. Don't you learn about tenses, when to use you, you're, your etc. in primary school at age 7/8? If they can't make a transition so simple I would question why they are in the department in the first place.
23-04-2013, 01:47 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skynus

This is rubbish tbh. Don't you learn about tenses, when to use you, you're, your etc. in primary school at age 7/8? If they can't make a transition so simple I would question why they are in the department in the first place.

It's not rubbish - I think I remember someone resigning because they couldn't write like news or like content, I didn't say I agreed with them as I know the transition and yeah I still make some of the mistakes I highlighted in my post, but it's not hard to change like you said. They are different writing styles though, mainly with those, but others, facts and opinions, history etc. I don't believe you were calling my post rubbish were you? As those differences are correct.
23-04-2013, 01:52 PM
Inseriousity.

If they are correct then they shouldn't be was my argument. Content shouldn't be cold, indifferent and seperate from the reader which seems to be the common theme here. It still needs to capture the reader's attention and it needs to keep them engaged. Everyone writes differently, that is to be expected. It is not beyond the realms of possibility that people can be nurtured and honed to adapt to a way that works for Habbox whether that's working for news, content or a merged department of the two.
23-04-2013, 02:02 PM
Adam

Can you not discuss this in your staff forums please? You're making Habbox Forum a horrible place to be.
23-04-2013, 02:03 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inseriousity.

If they are correct then they shouldn't be was my argument. Content shouldn't be cold, indifferent and seperate from the reader which seems to be the common theme here. It still needs to capture the reader's attention and it needs to keep them engaged. Everyone writes differently, that is to be expected. It is not beyond the realms of possibility that people can be nurtured and honed to adapt to a way that works for Habbox whether that's working for news, content or a merged department of the two.

It won't work though as surely a Wiki doesn't need to be involving the reader at every chance, it has the facts in, similar to news reports, but they are different. Also Content is about what happened and having the evidence to back that up, new can be rumours too, as well as guides and such - content can be guides too, but in a different sense and probably not on the Wiki.

Like I said though, I don't mind, I'm not allowed to show my true opinions publicly so I think hardly any of us will.
23-04-2013, 02:08 PM
Alkaz

This would have been a really good idea if it had been / is being implemented.
23-04-2013, 02:10 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alkaz

This would have been a really good idea if it had been / is being implemented.

Wanna bet :P? I honestly don't mind the merge now were in it, although there are differences. I just like writing though, for both sides.
23-04-2013, 02:57 PM
AlexJRiley

Quote:

Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

Fired and shoved onto the DNHL then thrown into jail with the key thrown away.

Please... dear god please!
23-04-2013, 04:08 PM
Chippiewill

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inseriousity.

If they are correct then they shouldn't be was my argument. Content shouldn't be cold, indifferent and seperate from the reader which seems to be the common theme here. It still needs to capture the reader's attention and it needs to keep them engaged.

Go read any page on Wikipedia, absolutely ZERO of them will refer to the reader at any time. It's how wiki content should be written and it's how I enforced it.

Frankly though it's not just writing styles, in the Content department I didn't care if people didn't do work on a week to week basis as long as they did their share in the long-run. This isn't viable with News, news is all about being on the ball, doing some investigative journalism and being regular and consistent. The processes in researching and creating content are entirely different.
23-04-2013, 04:38 PM
Inseriousity.

There are ways of engaging people without the use of the pronouns 'you' etc. Cold indifference makes Habbox look clinical and out-of-touch with the market we are attracting: younger teenagers. If we are being frank, perhaps it was the lack of attention to people not doing work that has allowed the department to implode from the inside. If you don't care, your staff won't care. Say, for the sake of debate, that this is true also, it still isn't really an argument against a merge as it could easily be accomodated within that framework.
23-04-2013, 05:14 PM
Zelda

Mike I think the point you are missing is that if people were interested in doing any content work they would have applied for content already, and a lot of news reporters will have no interest in content, often quote, "Finding the wiki pointless". Tbh it's the biggest flaw of the merge really.
23-04-2013, 05:26 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inkwell

Mike I think the point you are missing is that if people were interested in doing any content work they would have applied for content already, and a lot of news reporters will have no interest in content, often quote, "Finding the wiki pointless". Tbh it's the biggest flaw of the merge really.

It can't have actually merged though? You are still News Manager... - surely you should be Assistant Content Manager (News)? Like how AGM's are done.

Just call the staff; Content (News) and Content (whatever the other side is) - a partial merge is a good idea to me. Gives you guys the benefit of having both departments - news MUST do news stuff, and the wiki people MUST do wiki - but let them help in the other depts in they wish to? Can't see any problems with that at all?
23-04-2013, 05:30 PM
Grig

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

It can't have actually merged though? You are still News Manager... - surely you should be Assistant Content Manager (News)? Like how AGM's are done.

Just call the staff; Content (News) and Content (whatever the other side is) - a partial merge is a good idea to me. Gives you guys the benefit of having both departments - news MUST do news stuff, and the wiki people MUST do wiki - but let them help in the other depts in they wish to? Can't see any problems with that at all?

Why try to derail news, when the foundation wasn't broken, it just needed a few revamps here and there, but putting it as one department is certainly a step in the wrong direction.

So far I haven't seen positive reasons for a merge, but rather one or two saying good idea etc.
23-04-2013, 05:36 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

It can't have actually merged though? You are still News Manager... - surely you should be Assistant Content Manager (News)? Like how AGM's are done.

Just call the staff; Content (News) and Content (whatever the other side is) - a partial merge is a good idea to me. Gives you guys the benefit of having both departments - news MUST do news stuff, and the wiki people MUST do wiki - but let them help in the other depts in they wish to? Can't see any problems with that at all?

We spoke about that, but why have news, content and graphics sides to content, there would be no point to the merge then as it'd just be the same with 3 departments.
23-04-2013, 05:36 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grig

Why try to derail news, when the foundation wasn't broken, it just needed a few revamps here and there, but putting it as one department is certainly a step in the wrong direction.

So far I haven't seen positive reasons for a merge, but rather one or two saying good idea etc.

Were we waiting for V7 for these revamps? At least someone actually have the initiative to instigate change - whether you disagree with it or not.
23-04-2013, 05:38 PM
xxMATTGxx

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

Were we waiting for V7 for these revamps? At least someone actually have the initiative to instigate change - whether you disagree with it or not.

The only reason to ever wait for V7 if the actual changes require coding to be done. If it doesn't then there is no reason to wait.
23-04-2013, 05:39 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samanfa

We spoke about that, but why have news, content and graphics sides to content, there would be no point to the merge then as it'd just be the same with 3 departments.

Because;

News is content.
Graphics are content.
Wiki is content.

They belong with each other. Certainly wiki and graphics - I would have said it is beneficial. Surely it makes it easier to create really great content if they are all interconnected?

---------- Post added 23-04-2013 at 06:40 PM ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

The only reason to ever wait for V7 if the actual changes require coding to be done. If it doesn't then there is no reason to wait.

I know :L I was just expecting someone to eventually state that it was all coming in V7 lol
23-04-2013, 05:42 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

Because;

News is content.
Graphics are content.
Wiki is content.

They belong with each other. Certainly wiki and graphics - I would have said it is beneficial. Surely it makes it easier to create really great content if they are all interconnected?

---------- Post added 23-04-2013 at 06:40 PM ----------

I know :L I was just expecting someone to eventually state that it was all coming in V7 lol

If we're having 3 sides to content then there's no point in the merge, even the managers said that before it even went through, that's why they decided on two sides; if you're just going to have content (news) content whatever and content (graphics) then they can just stay separate and have managers that actually know what they're doing and staff who don't think they'd be forced to do other jobs than what they applied for.
23-04-2013, 05:48 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samanfa

If we're having 3 sides to content then there's no point in the merge, even the managers said that before it even went through, that's why they decided on two sides; if you're just going to have content (news) content whatever and content (graphics) then they can just stay separate and have managers that actually know what they're doing and staff who don't think they'd be forced to do other jobs than what they applied for.

I still think we are going too far with all this knowledge stuff. As a general rule, the people on Habbox are all amateurs - they have no professional background, or superior knowledge. Not saying we need professionals, but you guys are making it sound like managers are exclusive academics lol

I don't think they should be forced to do so - but I can see (certainly for wiki and graphics) the benefit of the two departments working together is obvious.
23-04-2013, 05:51 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

I still think we are going too far with all this knowledge stuff. As a general rule, the people on Habbox are all amateurs - they have no professional background, or superior knowledge. Not saying we need professionals, but you guys are making it sound like managers are exclusive academics lol

I don't think they should be forced to do so - but I can see (certainly for wiki and graphics) the benefit of the two departments working together is obvious.

How is it obvious? Working on the Wiki for near enough a year now I have never needed the graphics department? You're calling it Wiki yet it's content, we only need graphics for pages that we couldn't update for ages or the pages we had to rewrite for no reason.
23-04-2013, 05:55 PM
Chippiewill

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inseriousity.

There are ways of engaging people without the use of the pronouns 'you' etc. Cold indifference makes Habbox look clinical and out-of-touch with the market we are attracting: younger teenagers. If we are being frank, perhaps it was the lack of attention to people not doing work that has allowed the department to implode from the inside. If you don't care, your staff won't care. Say, for the sake of debate, that this is true also, it still isn't really an argument against a merge as it could easily be accomodated within that framework.

Even if you are correct it is frankly inconsequential. Most people who do content design don't want to do news, most people who do news don't want to do content. There is literally ZERO purpose in pissing everyone off because it *could* work.
23-04-2013, 06:19 PM
Adam

Please people won't somebody think of the children and take your bickering to your hidden forums it's all getting too emotional!
23-04-2013, 06:20 PM
Zelda

then how would people like laura and grig contribute to this????
23-04-2013, 06:26 PM
MKR&*42

It was a silly idea to merge all the depts. I vaguely understood why content + news, but not graphics.

As said before, content & news require different writing styles and completely different jobs - if someone had wanted to be a content designer and a news reporter, they would have applied for both.

Bad decisions one after another.
23-04-2013, 06:55 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samanfa

How is it obvious? Working on the Wiki for near enough a year now I have never needed the graphics department? You're calling it Wiki yet it's content, we only need graphics for pages that we couldn't update for ages or the pages we had to rewrite for no reason.

What exactly do the graphics department do then?
23-04-2013, 06:56 PM
Kardan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

What exactly do the graphics department do then?

I asked this and got told that basically they make the banner whenever Habbox does one of their big competitions, (Christmas/Summer Spectacular), so I asked 'Surely that means they have like, 3 jobs a year?' and got told 'Pretty much'. And considering no new content gets put on the site because of no V7, there's nothing to do on there either.
23-04-2013, 06:59 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kardan

I asked this and got told that basically they make the banner whenever Habbox does one of their big competitions, (Christmas/Summer Spectacular), so I asked 'Surely that means they have like, 3 jobs a year?' and got told 'Pretty much'. And considering no new content gets put on the site because of no V7, there's nothing to do on there either.

Basically the right to a user title then lol (surely the graphics dept should design these, but wasn't there a competition to design the last ones? :L)
23-04-2013, 07:04 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

What exactly do the graphics department do then?

They design user bars no one wants, @Chris; joking.

Anyway, they design whatever a department manager asks them to (if they can be bothered to), so say report images, or banners for events as @Kardan; said.
23-04-2013, 07:07 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samanfa

They design user bars no one wants, @Chris; joking.

Anyway, they design whatever a department manager asks them to (if they can be bothered to), so say report images, or banners for events as @Kardan; said.

WHat's wrong with the userbars? :L

When you say "if they can be bothered to", do you mean the designers be bothered to design it, or the department managers bothering to ask them?

If people want better userbars, maybe they could do that. Apologies though, I presumed they actually played a role in content (as one would expect given their role) - apparently not lol..
23-04-2013, 07:10 PM
David

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

What exactly do the graphics department do then?

all the bad sigs your seeing around, easter eggwhatever and the like

---------- Post added 23-04-2013 at 08:12 PM ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

If people want better userbars, maybe they could do that. Apologies though, I presumed they actually played a role in content (as one would expect given their role) - apparently not lol..

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=768420
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...hlight=userbar
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...hlight=userbar
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...hlight=userbar
23-04-2013, 07:19 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

WHat's wrong with the userbars? :L

When you say "if they can be bothered to", do you mean the designers be bothered to design it, or the department managers bothering to ask them?

If people want better userbars, maybe they could do that. Apologies though, I presumed they actually played a role in content (as one would expect given their role) - apparently not lol..

Basically, what @David; said about the userbars - probably both, think though near a holiday there will be so many graphics split between three of them as they don't even have a manager, kinda :P.
23-04-2013, 08:58 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

all the bad sigs your seeing around, easter eggwhatever and the like

---------- Post added 23-04-2013 at 08:12 PM ----------

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=768420
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...hlight=userbar
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...hlight=userbar
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...hlight=userbar

Well yeah, but I assumed the current ones were a result of popular opinion?
23-04-2013, 09:04 PM
sex

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam

Can you not discuss this in your staff forums please? You're making Habbox Forum a horrible place to be.

all your posts seem to do this lol

anyways, why bother keep open a failing department, it just adds more mess and unneeded work for management. news has been dying for years and people keep trying to saying its not (always news staff). they have had enough chances to revive it over the year bu the fact of the matter is no one read's your articles barely.....anyone who does is because they are trying to win vip for posting comments.
23-04-2013, 09:10 PM
David

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comity

all your posts seem to do this lol

anyways, why bother keep open a failing department, it just adds more mess and unneeded work for management. news has been dying for years and people keep trying to saying its not (always news staff). they have had enough chances to revive it over the year bu the fact of the matter is no one read's your articles barely.....anyone who does is because they are trying to win vip for posting comments.

wasnt there just a thread about the vip, and they scrapped it because only 1 person was commenting? something like that

---------- Post added 23-04-2013 at 10:11 PM ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

Well yeah, but I assumed the current ones were a result of popular opinion?

yeah, but you said they could do new userbars which they already did was my point. no one liked them
23-04-2013, 09:12 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comity

all your posts seem to do this lol

anyways, why bother keep open a failing department, it just adds more mess and unneeded work for management. news has been dying for years and people keep trying to saying its not (always news staff). they have had enough chances to revive it over the year bu the fact of the matter is no one read's your articles barely.....anyone who does is because they are trying to win vip for posting comments.

Sigh, news reporters say it isn't dying because they witness it, they know what goes on behind the scene, they have had surveys giving answers and frankly, before the merge news was doing better than it has done for months/years - people were starting to take an interest and they were more involved, yes they were involved with gaining VIP, but some have continued commenting without the hope for it (as it hasn't been done in a couple of months due to various factors).

Why keep open a failing department? It wasn't news that was failing it was content, there was only me at one point and just before the merge there was me and @pasta; it wasn't news in the slightest - @Inkwell; had a lot of ideas for news, and she followed through with a few of them, but now can't go through with the rest until she hears the final result of the merge. I would say go in news for a bit, well no, not now, but before the merge, and see where it's got to now - even you would see the decline in it over the month period that we've been merged; it's explainable why it has, due to news having the majority of staff pre-merge, but saying news is dying isn't true for some; we can't see the hits counter, but what's to say those who visit Habbox for rare values, the radio, jobs etc. don't read news while they're on the site? It's a default for the widgets so they can read it, thus getting hits up more.
@Catchy; even had an image showing him how many times his page had been viewed and I don't think it was a bad number in the slightest - really, news could do with bringing back what people want and incorporating the forum more, that's true, but when we do that we get told not to or people get annoyed - that's why I've been telling those reading the reports to comment on the news report and join in the discussion on Habbox Forum, it's also why I link to the article in threads and giving a bit of what to expect.

Sorry, if this sounds like a rant I don't mean it to be, but news wasn't the dying department before the merge, since Janice has become management she has literally turned it around and it was nice to see a fresh face with new ideas - the thing I don't agree on is saying news is dying when statistics such as comments on news reports and the members in the department says otherwise.
23-04-2013, 09:13 PM
AgnesIO

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

wasnt there just a thread about the vip, and they scrapped it because only 1 person was commenting? something like that

---------- Post added 23-04-2013 at 10:11 PM ----------

yeah, but you said they could do new userbars which they already did was my point. no one liked them

I was just trying to think of a reason why the graphics department has a point ;l
23-04-2013, 09:15 PM
Samantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marketing

I was just trying to think of a reason why the graphics department has a point ;l

The point I see is - management need graphics, but they can't make it public so they literally can't ask the members to make the graphics therefore they have the graphics team or they can ask someone to make it for them.

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