Freedom of speech being denied, when it's the law?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nick-

Despite the fact that I study Psychology :rolleyes:
True clinical depression is exactly that, in some cases to the point of suicide. If you want I can delve into the causes of depression in humans, biologically it's essentially down to the suppression of the serotonin release system controlled by the hypothalamus, drugs are often used to bring the serotonin levels back to an acceptable level. Some patients choose ECT over drugs despite the negative image it's generated over the years from the media, usually this is used in cases that are an immediate danger to themselves or those around them as it provides relief from symptoms within an hour provided the immediate consequential after effects of disorientation, STM loss and mild confusion subside. Alternatively, in the more extreme and desperate cases of depression a pre frontal lobotomy is the only solution which involves the literal severing of links to or partial removal of parts of the pre frontal lobe. Lobotomies of any kind are permanent and only to be prescribed as a last resort solution as the consequences of failure are dire e.g. loss of other emotions, loss of certain motor controls or death. Lobotomy patients are also likely to never experience dreaming again as EEG scans have proven that this portion of the brain is highly active during REM sleep and NREM sleep to a lesser extent although the link between the pre frontal lobe and dreaming is yet unproven scientifically it has been reported that lobotomy patients experience a loss of dreams therefore it can be concluded that the pre frontal lobe plays a crucial role in the creation of dreams, although this role is currently undefined.
The socio biological explanations of depression are slightly long winded to be posted here although it's based on the idea that depression occurs as a result of a demotion in social status and I'm not the biggest fan of Freud's theories of psychological illnesses, I find them slightly tenuous and comparable to a loosely held together climbing frame that has a few screws missing plus I would need to explain the 3 areas of the psyche, they're development during the stages of psycho-sexual development and, to a certain extent, the Oedipus complex which is rather time consuming.
If you want to enlighten me on what depression is feel free to. While you're at it explain Sherman's EOBD hypothesis as well, whilst on the topic of depression we may as well attempt to explain the ultimate causation of BD rather than focusing on a proximate causation, perhaps you know something about the evolution of human intelligence too? Does the Machiavellian theory of human intelligence ring any bells? Perhaps you would like to share your opinions on the different theories of dreaming, personally I'm a firm believer in the activation-synthesis hypothesis, some of the more imaginative psychologists beg to differ and prefer to hold the more psychodynamic based theories (Jung's problem solving theory or Freud's 'psychic safety valve' theory) in higher regard although these are often criticised as entirely subjective and unfalsifiable which technically also makes them unscientific too. Then again there's always the reverse learning theory which is a relatively recent theory, although it's disproved to a certain extent due to the counterargument that anteater's don't actually dream therefore according to the reverse learning theory they should all be unable to function mentally simply because the brain can't hold enough information for long enough to ensure survival. Or you could inform me more about the socio biological theory behind PPD, another unique form of depression that often results in infanticide in the animal kingdom or maybe you've got some informed opinions on the whole brain size vs brain density in relation to intelligence debate that you'd like to share, if my opinion was asked for I would probably raise the argument that it isn't the size or surface area of the brain that defines intelligence (as proven by the case of the Blue Whale, if the largest brain = highest intelligence, why aren't blue whales at the top of the food chain?) but that intelligence is defined either by the number of neurons available within the cortex or by the number of layers in the cortex which has scientific support as primates have 6 cortical layers whereas cetaceans have only 5 and it's clear that primates are more intelligent than cetaceans, humans also have 6 which also provides an evolutionary link between us and the primates (although let's not bring that up near any creationists. ;))
If you want we can go back to the basic psychological theories ignoring the socio biological theory of human behaviour and focusing on the core 4 theories, assuming you know what these are...
How dare you say that I have not researched depression.

---

So you're essentially saying depressed people shouldn't go on the internet, that's quite a stupid statement if you ask me.
I was recently 'hit by a bought' of depression, but that didn't mean I couldn't get up in the morning, or go on the internet or whatever. In fact, I got alot of help from people that I had met on this forum, that I still talk to on MSN and stuff. They helped because they had an un-bias view of the situation, they didn't know me, they didn't know the other parties of people, so it was exactly what they thought. Whereas with my friends in real life, yes they helped me get over it, however because they were bias towards me, it didn't have the same effect.
If you get what I mean?
Basically what I'm saying is you shouldn't generalise people's levels of depression
And you shouldn't think you're an expert on the subject just becase you studied Pshychology, for all you know, so could've the other person in the argument thing you got going.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RUN

To quote MAD;

"Freedom of speech only exists in political forums".

---

By his definition :P In real life it's meant to exist, but then again it doesn't. Censorship is all around us.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lNaughtynemo

How dare you contradict someone who is actually right. I have been depressed, you might not believe that but i have. If i showed you a picture you'd know why. I wanted to kill myself, i was felt like life hated me and that i should just end it. I hated everything and was pretty NEGATIVE about EVERYTHING that was said to me. So you might have researched it BUT i have LIVED it!

So actually no, you are wrong and im afraid you cant wriggle yourself out of this one im afraid. <- Sounds negative right? Well its some harsh criticism. So once again, before you say they can't be negative because of an illness or something happening, maybe you should rethink that thought.

---

I've re thought it, as you so knowledgeably suggested I do and teenage depression differs from adult depression, teenage depression can be pinned down to hormones, as you've said in a later post, adult depression can't. Most, if not all of my friends have been through an extensive period of misery for whatever reason, some have threatened suicide but none have actually gone through with it, (usually those who are serious about committing suicide don't tell anyone about it, it just happens unexpectedly) looking back on it it was fairly obvious that it was almost entirely down to the wacky period of teenage hormone imbalances rather than depression, some can handle it better than others, some can't and resort to cutting themselves. Perhaps you should re think that last line of the second paragraph, I haven't just researched it, I've lived it too, I've experienced the utter despair, scepticism and misery that seems to spring from no where and get worse and worse no matter what people attempt to say or do. I've experienced that seemingly helpless and hopeless situation that you don't know how to get yourself out of.
Something that I thought was a bit unusual is the sentence about showing me a picture, I don't know of any of your other problems that you've said you have but that sounds like classic teenage insecurity which happens to everyone at some point no matter what they look like. It's almost expected for a teenager to feel like that at some point, some can hide it better than others and externally appear as though everything is fine, some can't and decide to slip subtle sentences into their speech in hopes that someone will pick up on it and offer sympathy, I'm not saying that this what you're doing here but it happens so often with teenagers during a depressive phase. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coldplay

Nick, Your being a bit pretentious there, Depression can be suffered in a matter of forums, for example my ex-girlfriend was depressed, it can randomly effect you, and cause mood swings and things like that, to say that to be depressed means you cant get out of bed is rubbish.

Everybody is depressed at some time in their life, being heartbroken is being depressed.

---

Niamh has pretty much answered this in a later post, teenage heartbreak seems like such an epic tale of woe when it happens because of the mood swings brough on by hormones, it wasn't the happiest time of my life when it happened to me too but it was no where near actual depression and it rarely is close to actual depression in most cases because teenagers who suffer a recent break up can still be bothered to go to school, learn, pay a minor amount of attention etc. I thought it was geniune depression at the time until I learnt the medical definition after which I realised I got off pretty easy compared to how some adults deal with depression. :P
You're right, it can randomly affect teenagers, it's rare for it to randomly affect adults though, normally it's brought about by a chain of stressful or traumatic events or one large traumatic event such as the death of a loved one. Not getting out of bed was an example of a symptom, not the only symptom although it is related to the main symptom which is apathy.
Everybody experiences down days/weeks, months is pushing it a bit but it can't be classed as depression. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lNaughtynemo

Ahh that reminds me coldplay, this forum is full of teenagers.

Did you know teenagers hormones go nuts? HMmm i thought you would. mood swings and one time happy, another time angry.

---

I can see how Coldplay may have thought that was an insulting comment but there's a valid point here, hormones are often the main cause of pretty much every obscure trait that a teenager could show, it's a bit of a generalisation but it's surprisingly accurate in most people.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coldplay

I dont know if that was inteneded to offend me or not, I presume not, just a bit badly phrased.

But yes, Hormones generally do cause mood swings and make people feel depressed, so Nick, just because somone says they're depressed doesn't mean 'Clinically Depressed' with suicidal tendancies. A lot of people mean it because they're going through a bad period of their life and are feeling down.

---

That's partially why I responded to Nialls comment which implied depression, it's a pet peeve of mine when people misuse terms, as a prospestive psychologist terminology is critical. I do it all the time when people talk to me, it irritates people when I correct them but it's worth the rolling eyes, tuts and moans I get because it would annoy me if I didn't do anything about it. :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by samsaBEAR

So you're essentially saying depressed people shouldn't go on the internet, that's quite a stupid statement if you ask me.
I was recently 'hit by a bought' of depression, but that didn't mean I couldn't get up in the morning, or go on the internet or whatever. In fact, I got alot of help from people that I had met on this forum, that I still talk to on MSN and stuff. They helped because they had an un-bias view of the situation, they didn't know me, they didn't know the other parties of people, so it was exactly what they thought. Whereas with my friends in real life, yes they helped me get over it, however because they were bias towards me, it didn't have the same effect.
If you get what I mean?
Basically what I'm saying is you shouldn't generalise people's levels of depression
And you shouldn't think you're an expert on the subject just becase you studied Pshychology, for all you know, so could've the other person in the argument thing you got going.

---

At no point did I say I was an expert on the subject but I would bet good money that I know more about it than most on this forum. ;)
Also, at no point did I say that depressed people shouldn't be on the internet, what I did say is that depressed people aren't likely to be on the internet because of their depression, there's a difference.
I got what you meant and an un bias opinion is essentially the role of a therapist, although you got it without having to pay £50 a session to a professional. :P

Anyway, pop psychology and teenage greivances aside, this is about freedom of speech although it appears to have turned into a ban appeal thread which, if it goes too far, will force me to lock this thread which is a shame because there's a fun debate somewhere in here underneath the off topic posts some of us have made, myself included. :(
As a reminder, those who ask 'what about my ban' or 'I made x post and got banned but someone else made y post but didn't get banned' won't get an answer in here because we don't discuss ban reasons. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nick-

At no point did I say I was an expert on the subject but I would bet good money that I know more about it than most on this forum. ;)
Also, at no point did I say that depressed people shouldn't be on the internet, what I did say is that depressed people aren't likely to be on the internet because of their depression, there's a difference.
I got what you meant and an un bias opinion is essentially the role of a therapist, although you got it without having to pay £50 a session to a professional. :P

---

Depressed people aren't likely to use the internet? That's like saying children who eat apples are less likely to go to the zoo this year. Makes no sense... You make it sound like when people become depressed they form the same personality of likes and dislikes and will immediately stop using the internet. That makes no sense :S Are you studying AS Psychology, which as far as I remember, gets over run by AS and A2 Philosophy which discredits most of it? Why are you even bringing up psychology? That's nearly as daft as bringing up A-level maths when people are talking about something slightly linked to maths. No one cares...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nick-

I've re thought it, as you so knowledgeably suggested I do and teenage depression differs from adult depression, teenage depression can be pinned down to hormones, as you've said in a later post, adult depression can't. Most, if not all of my friends have been through an extensive period of misery for whatever reason, some have threatened suicide but none have actually gone through with it, (usually those who are serious about committing suicide don't tell anyone about it, it just happens unexpectedly) looking back on it it was fairly obvious that it was almost entirely down to the wacky period of teenage hormone imbalances rather than depression, some can handle it better than others, some can't and resort to cutting themselves. Perhaps you should re think that last line of the second paragraph, I haven't just researched it, I've lived it too, I've experienced the utter despair, scepticism and misery that seems to spring from no where and get worse and worse no matter what people attempt to say or do. I've experienced that seemingly helpless and hopeless situation that you don't know how to get yourself out of.
Something that I thought was a bit unusual is the sentence about showing me a picture, I don't know of any of your other problems that you've said you have but that sounds like classic teenage insecurity which happens to everyone at some point no matter what they look like. It's almost expected for a teenager to feel like that at some point, some can hide it better than others and externally appear as though everything is fine, some can't and decide to slip subtle sentences into their speech in hopes that someone will pick up on it and offer sympathy, I'm not saying that this what you're doing here but it happens so often with teenagers during a depressive phase. ;)

---

Ok, this turned freakin personal now. You're saying, what i went through, for 3 years of my life and continuing, missing about 6months of year 7 and feeling suicidal 'classic teenage insecurity'!? OK, well i can't believe anything thats coming out of your mouth now, because thats a load of ****.

I have a few points to make:

1) You guys are mixing up the theoretical / technical from practice. THEORETICALLY, we can ban you for any reason, I can go onto your account, remove all of your rep points, change your signature to I HATE MY MOTHER and ban your account. In PRACTICE, I would get fired because we ethically don't accept that. However, the rule that allows us to do that is for legal reasons. And we would rectify the situation.

2) Entirely free speech would mean that there would be absolutely no rules. None at all. And even though you might say you love it, you KNOW that with absolutely 0 rules the forum would be a madhouse.

3) We will not comment on bans, and you obviously know that.

4) Yes, all non-management would be against the bans because they don't know the full ban reason. I can't say I've looked into the particular bans but I know from past experience a lot of the time the full reason for the ban never makes it onto the forum as when the reason goes down the grapevine things gradually get omitted, or weren't told in the first place.

5) Bringing in theoreticals such as using HabboxForum to escape the distopia (I may have gotten the word wrong) is unproductive. We can come up with theoreticals for .01% of the population (this is simply an example) till we're blue in the face, but it won't get us anywhere. There is a theoretical refutation for almost everything.

6) Discussion of depression will stop here as it has somehow (damned if I know) turned from a theoretical discussion to a personal discussion, therefore people are liable to get hurt. People continuing the depression discussion will be dealt with, and the thread may be closed.

I did AS Psychology- I got an E :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JackBuddy

I did AS Psychology- I got an E :D

---

Good post!

This has all been done before and has failed. I find this over the top and a little pathetic? As has been said before 'freedom of speech may be curtailed in private establishments'

There is NO 100% freedom of speech. There is freedom of speech to a high degree but even, say, teachers don't have freedom of speech - take homosexuality for example.

Clearly whatever you are saying that is being hidden/removed is pretty ****** and doesn't deserve to be read. I say that freedom of speech on habbox is fine. Stop drawing attention to yourself.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nvrspk4

I have a few points to make:

1) You guys are mixing up the theoretical / technical from practice. THEORETICALLY, we can ban you for any reason, I can go onto your account, remove all of your rep points, change your signature to I HATE MY MOTHER and ban your account. In PRACTICE, I would get fired because we ethically don't accept that. However, the rule that allows us to do that is for legal reasons. And we would rectify the situation.

2) Entirely free speech would mean that there would be absolutely no rules. None at all. And even though you might say you love it, you KNOW that with absolutely 0 rules the forum would be a madhouse.

3) We will not comment on bans, and you obviously know that.

4) Yes, all non-management would be against the bans because they don't know the full ban reason. I can't say I've looked into the particular bans but I know from past experience a lot of the time the full reason for the ban never makes it onto the forum as when the reason goes down the grapevine things gradually get omitted, or weren't told in the first place.

5) Bringing in theoreticals such as using HabboxForum to escape the distopia (I may have gotten the word wrong) is unproductive. We can come up with theoreticals for .01% of the population (this is simply an example) till we're blue in the face, but it won't get us anywhere. There is a theoretical refutation for almost everything.

6) Discussion of depression will stop here as it has somehow (damned if I know) turned from a theoretical discussion to a personal discussion, therefore people are liable to get hurt. People continuing the depression discussion will be dealt with, and the thread may be closed.

---

I laughed at the "people are liable to get hurt" part. Wait, you get paid for being here?!
Didn't know that =P