iPad '4G' claims face scrutiny from UK regulator

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The Advertising Standards Authority has widened its inquiry into the advertising of the Apple iPad.

The BBC understands the regulator is not satisfied that Apple has complied with an agreement to amend claims about the latest iPad's 4G capabilities.

The UK does not yet have widespread 4G coverage, and the iPad will be incompatible with it when it does.

The regulator said it had received dozens of complaints in relation to the issue. Apple has declined to comment.

The regulator had resolved some of the complaints after discussions with Apple about changes to its advertising, but said it is now looking into further concerns raised by consumers.

A letter to one complainant seen by the BBC says that Apple "have advised us that no further reference to the 4G capabilities of the iPad will be made on their UK website".

The letter goes on to say that this will resolve the complaint, and the Advertising Standards Authority (ASA) will consequently be closing the file.

The ASA told the BBC that when it approached Apple the company said it had removed references to 4G from the webpage subject to the complaint, and had edited a video that contained references to 4G.

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Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-17899912

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I am not really surprised at this to be honest considering the UK doesn't even have 4G coverage.

If the problem is that they're angry in Apple advertising the device as 4G ready then that's the stupidest thing I have ever heard in my entire life.

Next they'll be showing people using google maps on the iphone 4s to find businesses when it can only be done in the US... wait they already did that.

Apple has become a hotbed of false advertising recently. Probably because most of their good new features are focussed on the US.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

If the problem is that they're angry in Apple advertising the device as 4G ready then that's the stupidest thing I have ever heard in my entire life.

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The device wouldn't actually be 4G in the United Kingdom even if we did have 4G networks.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

If the problem is that they're angry in Apple advertising the device is 4G ready then that's the stupidest thing I have ever heard in my entire life.

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The UK have somewhat sane advertising laws, hence they never aired the "I'm a Mac" ads here. Good job they're making them change it, how can something be 4G capable when the spec isn't even finalised in the UK?

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

If the problem is that they're angry in Apple advertising the device as 4G ready then that's the stupidest thing I have ever heard in my entire life.

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They're not saying 4G ready, they're plastering 4G, LTE and "full speed ahead" all over their website and stating in very teeny places that it only works in the US or canada (note they also say in other places "across the world", two countries on the same continent, hemisphere and general geographic area are hardly "across the world"). Technically they're right, but what they're very clearly implying is not and this advertising clearly is designed with deceit in mind. The advertising is hardly in "good faith" and unlike across the pond we have an advertising standards agency which does its job.

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Originally Posted by Recursion

The UK have somewhat sane advertising laws, hence they never aired the "I'm a Mac" ads here. Good job they're making them change it, how can something be 4G capable when the spec isn't even finalised in the UK?

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It is incredibly stupid how in North America corporations advertise 4G when it's not LTE, however even though I hate it I wouldn't ban them from advertising their product in that way. They should be entitled to create stupid ads if they wish, and I suppose there is a conflict of interest here because I'm used to advertisement regulations over here, and you're used to advertisement regulations over there :P

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I wouldn't ban them from advertising their product in that way.

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Let's also allow them to advertise their products as curing cancer, because who cares as long as the consumer doesn't know any better.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

It is incredibly stupid how in North America corporations advertise 4G when it's not LTE, however even though I hate it I wouldn't ban them from advertising their product in that way. They should be entitled to create stupid ads if they wish, and I suppose there is a conflict of interest here because I'm used to advertisement regulations over here, and you're used to advertisement regulations over there :P

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If Apple sold the iPad as 4G capable now, that's exactly what the consumers would expect to be able to use, but as it happens a) no networks have rolled any any kind of 4G technology yet and b) the 4G technology they roll out later this year or early next may not even be compatible with the hardware the iPad uses.

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Originally Posted by Recursion

If Apple sold the iPad as 4G capable now, that's exactly what the consumers would expect to be able to use, but as it happens a) no networks have rolled any any kind of 4G technology yet and b) the 4G technology they roll out later this year or early next may not even be compatible with the hardware the iPad uses.

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I would validate their advertising campaign on two key points:

1. They're clearly marketing based on the 4G definition as defined within the United States and Canada, so they're not just making up baseless claims about their product.

2. Just because a service doesn't exist in an area doesn't mean you should be banned from marketing it in that area (usually). LTE devices were marketed to me where I am in Canada before we had the infrastructure.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I would validate their advertising campaign on two key points:

1. They're clearly marketing based on the 4G definition as defined within the United States and Canada, so they're not just making up baseless claims about their product.

2. Just because a service doesn't exist in an area doesn't mean you should be banned from marketing it in that area (usually). LTE devices were marketed to me where I am in Canada before we had the infrastructure.

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I guess this is why we have a better advertising agency. Because it clearly states on the Apple UK site that the iPad you are going to buy has 4G which it doesn't for anyone who uses it in the United Kingdom or Europe.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

They're clearly marketing based on the 4G definition as defined within the United States and Canada, so they're not just making up baseless claims about their product.

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I'm going to use the mars definition, because they invented it therefore we should use it even though in any other place it means something different and consumers will believe it's something different to what we actually have but it's ok since the official authority, but not here, says it's ok.

The whole point of following laws is to follow the ones where you are, not where you've come from.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

Just because a service doesn't exist in an area doesn't mean you should be banned from marketing it in that area (usually). LTE devices were marketed to me where I am in Canada before we had the infrastructure.

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Then canada has a ****** ASA, doesn't mean it's ok to do. It would be ok if this was an innocent mistake but Apple is clearly acting out of bad faith and is intentionally trying to deceive consumers.

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

I guess this is why we have a better advertising agency. Because it clearly states on the Apple UK site that the iPad you are going to buy has 4G which it doesn't for anyone who uses it in the United Kingdom or Europe.

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Change "better" to "different" and what you said becomes more accurate.

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Originally Posted by Chippiewill

I'm going to use the mars definition, because they invented it therefore we should use it even though in any other place it means something different and consumers will believe it's something different to what we actually have but it's ok since the official authority, but not here, says it's ok.

The whole point of following laws is to follow the ones where you are, not where you've come from.

Then canada has a ****** ASA, doesn't mean it's ok to do. It would be ok if this was an innocent mistake but Apple is clearly acting out of bad faith and is intentionally trying to deceive consumers.

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You cannot call Canada's ASA ****** because you know nothing about it, if you did you would have called it by its name, ASC.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I would validate their advertising campaign on two key points:

1. They're clearly marketing based on the 4G definition as defined within the United States and Canada, so they're not just making up baseless claims about their product.

2. Just because a service doesn't exist in an area doesn't mean you should be banned from marketing it in that area (usually). LTE devices were marketed to me where I am in Canada before we had the infrastructure.

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The 4G definition in the US may be very different to that in the UK, funnily enough the UK isn't the USA. In regards to "doesn't exist in an area" you can't use that for an ENTIRE COUNTRY.

UK advertising laws are there to protect the consumer, Apple shouldn't be allowed to advertise something as 4G capable when there is NO 4G capability in the UK, and even if there were to be in the next few months it may not necessarily work. 4G doesn't yet exist in the UK, there is nothing to define the iPad as 4G capable in our country.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

Change "better" to "different" and what you said becomes more accurate.



You cannot call Canada's ASA ****** because you know nothing about it, if you did you would have called it by its name, ASC.

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Better because they are protecting the consumers.

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

Better because they are protecting the consumers.

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Patriotism is a terrible thing to bring up in the Technology Forums; what were you thinking?

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Originally Posted by Recursion

The 4G definition in the US may be very different to that in the UK, funnily enough the UK isn't the USA. In regards to "doesn't exist in an area" you can't use that for an ENTIRE COUNTRY.

UK advertising laws are there to protect the consumer, Apple shouldn't be allowed to advertise something as 4G capable when there is NO 4G capability in the UK, and even if there were to be in the next few months it may not necessarily work. 4G doesn't yet exist in the UK, there is nothing to define the iPad as 4G capable in our country.

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Which brings me back to the following:

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

there is a conflict of interest here because I'm used to advertisement regulations over here, and you're used to advertisement regulations over there :P

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I see and understand your views and I also see and understand mine.

I just don't understand how they could get away with it in any country, say the US didn't yet have any sort of 4G, it's pretty simple deception.

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Originally Posted by Recursion

I just don't understand how they could get away with it in any country, say the US didn't yet have any sort of 4G, it's pretty simple deception.

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Because they're not disseminating completely inaccurate information about their product, I suppose you have to live here to understand the norm for what we see as socially acceptable advertisement and I suppose I would have to live over there to understand what you see as the mismarketing injustice that's going on.

Why would you try to sell a product that mentions it has 4G capabilities in a country with NO 4G networks. It does not make sense. There is no actual point in doing it apart from misleading people into buying it.

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

Why would you try to sell a product that mentions it has 4G capabilities in a country with NO 4G networks. It does not make sense. There is no actual point in doing it apart from misleading people into buying it.

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I would hope the ASC here is more concerned with regulating advertisements about things such as drugs or loans as opposed to telling companies not to advertise non product selling point features which will likely be introduced to the market shortly anyway, because of the off chance that someone is stupid enough to spend a thousand dollars on the product not knowing what it does and who is incapable of going back to the store to return it in the event that s/he is dissatisfied once coming to the (should be immediate) realization that the thousand dollars they spent on the product included spending money on a feature they cannot use. In my opinion and presumably the opinion of Ad Standards Canada, there is a difference between protecting consumers and spoon feeding them all the "right" answers.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I would hope the ASC here is more concerned with regulating advertisements about things such as drugs or loans as opposed to telling companies not to advertise non product selling point features which will likely be introduced to the market shortly anyway, because of the off chance that someone is stupid enough to spend a thousand dollars on the product not knowing what it does and who is incapable of going back to the store to return it in the event that s/he is dissatisfied once coming to the (should be immediate) realization that the thousand dollars they spent on the product included spending money on a feature they cannot use. In my opinion and presumably the opinion of Ad Standards Canada, there is a difference between protecting consumers and spoon feeding them all the "right" answers.

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http://www.mattgarner.net/facepalm.jpg

Brb going to advertise a product in the UK and tell everyone that it can do 4G but you would have to travel to the USA or Canada to actually use that feature. Because that makes a lot of sense! The UK advertising agency is actually doing something good and stopping this sort of crap. Oh and it's also taking place in Australia to!

The iPad cannot do 4G in the UK and shouldn't be advertised that it can in the UK.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I would hope the ASC here is more concerned with regulating advertisements about things such as drugs or loans as opposed to telling companies not to advertise non product selling point features which will likely be introduced to the market shortly anyway, because of the off chance that someone is stupid enough to spend a thousand dollars on the product not knowing what it does and who is incapable of going back to the store to return it in the event that s/he is dissatisfied once coming to the (should be immediate) realization that the thousand dollars they spent on the product included spending money on a feature they cannot use. In my opinion and presumably the opinion of Ad Standards Canada, there is a difference between protecting consumers and spoon feeding them all the "right" answers.

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You can't expect everyone to be clued up in terms of technology.

Partly off topic, but I'm pretty sure I've never seen a drugs advert on TV :P

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

Brb going to advertise a product in the UK and tell everyone that it can do 4G but you would have to travel to the USA or Canada to actually use that feature. Because that makes a lot of sense! The UK advertising agency is actually doing something good and stopping this sort of crap. Oh and it's also taking place in Australia to!

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It's pretty bad if somebody buys a product thinking they can use a feature which doesn't even exist in the country they live, and that picture you posted is absolutely adorable!

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Originally Posted by Recursion

You can't expect everyone to be clued up in terms of technology.

Partly off topic, but I'm pretty sure I've never seen a drugs advert on TV :P

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Really? not even over the counters?

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

It's pretty bad if somebody buys a product thinking they can use a feature which doesn't even exist in the country they live, and that picture you posted is absolutely adorable!



Really? not even over the counters?

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And you expect every single person of the population to know about technology? Don't advertise features that aren't available in the country you are selling it in.

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

And you expect every single person of the population to know about technology? Don't advertise features that aren't available in the country you are selling it in.

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I'm really struggling to see how that would fly over here, a lot of people would blame the consumer for spending so much money and not understanding what on-- I would be inclined to agree.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I'm really struggling to see how that would fly over here, a lot of people would blame the consumer for spending so much money and not understanding what on-- I would be inclined to agree.

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We would blame the company who advertised it because they are advertising features that aren't actually available. Maybe that's just typical USA/Canada! :P

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I'm really struggling to see how that would fly over here, a lot of people would blame the consumer for spending so much money and not understanding what on-- I would be inclined to agree.

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Our economy is based on the assumption that the consumer can trust the retailer, clash of cultures really but it does mean that we need our ASA to prevent companies from abusing that trust in bad faith which is clearly what Apple was attempting to do.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I'm really struggling to see how that would fly over here, a lot of people would blame the consumer for spending so much money and not understanding what on-- I would be inclined to agree.

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You can rationalise it all you want but Apple where advertising a feature of their product in a country that can't use that feature. To deny this as misleading is just wrong and it's the whole reason the UK has an advertising agency against stuff like this, to protect consumers.

I also find that Apple has a lot of mindless followers who will buy the next product even if they don't need the new features on it - just because its a new product. Remember not everyone knows the latest technical stuff. I know a lot of older people with iPads and iPhones who know how to use them basically but probably wouldn't know what 3g is never mind 4g. They may think 4g is better and so buy it not realising its not supported in the UK. You could say it's their fault for not knowing but I would say Apple was also at fault for misleading them in the first place.

Just an update on this matter.

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Apple changes iPad branding to Wi-Fi + Cellular

Soon after the new third generation iPad was launched, residents of other countries complained that Apple's claims of the iPad having "4G" wireless support were incorrect. North American buyers can connect to 4G LTE networks on Verizon or AT&T, but other countries cannot because their wireless network's frequencies are different.

In Australia, Apple has already offered to give iPad owners there a refund if they felt mislead by the 4G claims. Now it looks like Apple is making even more changes, perhaps as a way to avoid any legal actions against the company. As first spotted by 9to5Mac.com, the Apple online store has now changed how the iPad with both Wi-Fi and wireless data network support is branded.

Instead of the previous "Wi-Fi + 4G", the new iPad models that connect to mobile phone wireless networks have been rebranded as having "Wi-Fi + Cellular" support. The older iPad 2 still has the "Wi-Fi + 3G" branding.

This change is apparently being made worldwide, including in the US. In addition, the Australian Apple store has an additional message:

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This product supports very fast cellular networks. It is not compatible with current Australian 4G LTE networks and WiMAX networks. For service from a wireless carrier, sign up for a simple, month-by-month plan on your iPad and cancel anytime without penalty.

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In addition to the online store, Apple retail stores have now changed their signage to reflect the new Wi-Fi + Cellular branding.

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http://www.neowin.net/news/apple-cha...i-fi--cellular

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Originally Posted by Chippiewill

Our economy is based on the assumption that the consumer can trust the retailer, clash of cultures really but it does mean that we need our ASA to prevent companies from abusing that trust in bad faith which is clearly what Apple was attempting to do.

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There is no basis to suggest Apple's alleged illegal advertising move is in bad faith, they simply copied their American advertising which happened to be illegal in the UK, lazy but not enough evidence to prove bad faith based on that at all.

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

We would blame the company who advertised it because they are advertising features that aren't actually available. Maybe that's just typical USA/Canada! :P

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Or to me, typical UK!

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

Just an update on this matter.



http://www.neowin.net/news/apple-cha...i-fi--cellular

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And thus all assertions that Apple marketed in bad faith are renounced.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

There is no basis to suggest Apple's alleged illegal advertising move is in bad faith, they simply copied their American advertising which happened to be illegal in the UK, lazy but not enough evidence to prove bad faith based on that at all.



Or to me, typical UK!



And thus all assertions that Apple marketed in bad faith are renounced.

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We still have the better advertising standards, ok thanks.

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

We still have the better advertising standards, ok thanks.

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Your opinion is noted but I'm sticking with my maple syrup.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

Your opinion is noted but I'm sticking with my maple syrup.

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Even though the iPad was marketed as 4G in the UK, but currently wont work (due to no 4G infrastructure) and will in fact, never work (even when we do get 4G infrastructure)?

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Originally Posted by Recursion

Even though the iPad was marketed as 4G in the UK, but currently wont work (due to no 4G infrastructure) and will in fact, never work (even when we do get 4G infrastructure)?

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Well Apple fixed that and it looks like it was more of just an advertising hiccup as opposed to in bad faith but generally speaking I don't really have a problem with advertising in Canada, and I'm a real big fan of the fundamental freedoms of media as depicted in section two of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.