Apple wins lawsuit against Samsung, as jury awards $1B for patent infringement

http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2012/08/...-samsung-case/

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A jury has ruled for Apple in its huge smartphone patent infringement case involving Samsung and ordered Samsung to pay $1.5 billion.The verdict was reached Friday.
In its lawsuit filed last year, Apple Inc. had demanded $2.5 billion while accusing Samsung of ripping off the design technology of iPhones and iPads.
During closing arguments at the trial, Samsung attorney Charles Verhoeven called that demand ridiculous and asked the jury to award Samsung $399 million after claiming Apple used Samsung Electronics Co. technology without proper compensation.
The two companies lead the $219 billion market for smartphones and computer tablets. They are enmeshed in similar lawsuits in the United Kingdom, Germany and Australia.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2012/08/...#ixzz24Vd1reUW

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And so the patent system continues, and Apple receives a tremendous settlement of over 1 billion dollars (unless appeals are still on the table).

This decision happened after another decision made in Samsung's hometown South Korea:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19364875

where both companies are being forced to hold certain products at bay until further legal proceedings ensue.

Meanwhile Google is calling for patent reform:

http://androidheadlines.com/2012/08/featured-google-wants-patent-reform-get-rid-of-abstract-concepts-and-patent-trolls.html

Patents, patents, PATENTS!

A drop in the ocean for Samsung's quarterly income, but still a nice win for Apple. Will be interested in how the appeals turn out.

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Originally Posted by Recursion

A drop in the ocean for Samsung's quarterly income, but still a nice win for Apple. Will be interested in how the appeals turn out.

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Agreed, as well as the ongoing affairs for the two in SKorea.

Not a bad settlement in the end, considering it's less than half of the original demand and no ban of sales. It would of been better if a British judge stepped in, told them both they were stupid and strutted out of the room like a Judge Judy.

The South Korean case is incredibly stupid. Banning both products is ridiculous, it's usually one or the other, or neither. So those who now want iPhones and Galaxy phones just have to wait for the two to fight each other out over patents which are more of a hindrance than anything. All this because organisations can't play fair :/

Sigh. Another day where a company can patent a shape and position of a button and it be considered fine.

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Originally Posted by Oleh

Sigh. Another day where a company can patent a shape and position of a button and it be considered fine.

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surely this will/should encourage more innovation, opposed to using designs that are extremely similar to competitors?

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Originally Posted by dirrty

surely this will/should encourage more innovation, opposed to using designs that are extremely similar to competitors?

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Depends on the design. Curves are what people expect these days - keyboards, laptops, cameras, speakers... Nearly everything in my room has curved corners. Curves are a basic design feature which shouldn't of been patented. Samsung use a different sort of curve (the SIII is one example) to avoid the patent, but why should it be about avoiding the patent? Remove the patent altogether. The Samsung phones are clearly different to the iPhone(s), the rest is all de minimus stuff no one should dare care about, particularly a court.

It's pretty disgusting how Apple are now seeking a sales ban in the US, aiming to announce this at the follow up hearing in September. Hopefully the appeal Samsung are putting in moves the case to a higher court - it was a daft idea to have a jury involved when most trials by jury do not solve the problem, but make it worse.

It is a stupid system but something that came up on twitter the past few days is that Microsoft is one of the only companies who is not trying to copy Apple. They say that because they are trying to think for themselves and actuality come up with their own innovation. Which I some what agree with - I may not agree with every decision they are currently making but it's better than say staling from other companies. Although the US patent system seems to be very flawed in many different ways. Who knows what will happen in terms of other companies.

I suppose it also helps that Microsoft and Apple have a number of agreements with each other and that's why you don't see them suing each other and other sorts in recent years.

will the not just appeal it lol?

i already knew were gonna win from the start.

The irony of a billion dollar lawsuit: it is all good advertising for Samsung

It is no surprise that the story of the day is Apple's sweeping victory in the US courts over Samsung. What is funny about it is posts such as that by Enrique Gutierrez on Google+. Enrique, it seems, has had an interesting day in Starbucks with his Samsung laptop.

Chat:

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"I'm sitting in a Starbucks doing random whatever over an iced americano. While I waiting for my drink, I watched a guy with his friend, pick up a newspaper; and start to remark on the Samsung Apple verdict.

Guy: "Wait, so what they're saying is, Samsung is the same as Apple?"
Friend: "I know, right? Makes me think twice about how much I paid for my Mac Book"
Guy: "Seriously"

Not 10 minutes later, a husband and wife, same newspaper:

Husband: "... Samsung's iPad is the same as Apple's iPad, and I paid how much for the Apple one? Honey, I told you they were a ripoff", after looking up the Samsung tablet on his iPhone.
Wife: "Oh wow," looking at the screen, "... that's a lot cheaper. Think we can return it?"

I put my Samsung QX410 on my table, and started to plug in, when he leans over to me, "Sorry, you don't mind if I ask, how much did you pay for your Samsung laptop?"

"Oh, no worries, it was $700." I replied.

I watched shock overcome his face, like actual shock. He looked at me, blankly, for an awkward amount of time, "Mind if I have a look?" he asked.

So, I obliged, and showed him a few things. He commented on Windows 7, so I opened up my virtual machine of OS/X... By the time the conversation was over, he was ready to kick Cupertino in the nuts, I think.

... Now, the punchline:

I'm writing this post after the FOURTH group of Starbucks patrons have made the connection that Samsung is now the same as Apple. They don't know the details, they don't really care, what they know is Apple is saying that Samsung is the same as Apple ... and with one simple Google Search, you get prices that are basically half for what seems to be the same products -- for nearly everything.

Two of these groups (including the husband/wife) asked me about my Samsung laptop, the second group noticed my Galaxy phone (also by Samsung)... Best billion dollar ad-campaign Samsung ever had."

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Sources: http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/25/32...dvertising-for

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

The irony of a billion dollar lawsuit: it is all good advertising for Samsung

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I love these sorts of stories. It's poetic justice - Company A takes Company B to court for "design theft" and wins the case. Consumers of Company A pick up on a minor detail that Company B must be the same as Company A for Company B to lose the case. Therefore, Company A is admitting that Company B is selling a product of the same quality for cheaper. Consumers couldn't care less about the patent system, as far as they see it the Samsung products are of equal quality but cheaper cost, and Apple are inadvertedly admitting that Samsung products are of equal quality for the case to have been won.

There are loads of these stories coming through. Some aren't even based on people owning Apple products, but people seeing Samsung trending in the news and looking up the products and deciding they look really good. Then there are the #boycottapple people on Twitter and Google+ who are fighting back at Apple. Afterall, Samsung are only taking Apple to court because it's a counter-suit.

It's a hollow victory.

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Originally Posted by GommeInc

Apple are inadvertedly admitting that Samsung products are of equal quality for the case to have been won.

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Although personally I do believe the Galaxy line is comparable in quality to the iPhone line, I'm not sure the stigma that comes out of Apple and Samsung's court battle actually makes Apple look bad. Keep in mind a lot of people will think Apple's products are still more solid, for instance even before Apple won this victory, your own judge insulted Samsung's product by saying it wasn't as cool as Apple's product, so clearly a lot of folks will still think Samsung to be inferior.

In terms of you saying it's a hollow victory, if/until an appeal succeeds, Apple is over 1 billion dollars richer (and they're already making a crapload of money to begin with), and in addition to that, withstanding the fact that Samsung wins the appeal, millions of consumers who don't follow the market and who didn't follow the court case are going to see Apple's victory and think bad of Samsung. It seems to me that Apple got a lot of what they wanted out of the court systems at the moment. If the dead man himself were still alive I think he would be pretty happy about his company's recent victory.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

Although personally I do believe the Galaxy line is comparable in quality to the iPhone line, I'm not sure the stigma that comes out of Apple and Samsung's court battle actually makes Apple look bad. Keep in mind a lot of people will think Apple's products are still more solid, for instance even before Apple won this victory, your own judge insulted Samsung's product by saying it wasn't as cool as Apple's product, so clearly a lot of folks will still think Samsung to be inferior.

In terms of you saying it's a hollow victory, if/until an appeal succeeds, Apple is over 1 billion dollars richer (and they're already making a crapload of money to begin with), and in addition to that, withstanding the fact that Samsung wins the appeal, millions of consumers who don't follow the market and who didn't follow the court case are going to see Apple's victory and think bad of Samsung. It seems to me that Apple got a lot of what they wanted out of the court systems at the moment. If the dead man himself were still alive I think he would be pretty happy about his company's recent victory.

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In doesn't make them look bad, obviously there will be a lot of praise - shares in Apple rose while Samsung lost a lot of value after the verdict (7%?). What's questionable is that one company that clearly makes popular products is being attacked because of a personal vendetta by another company, despite the fact the consumer is clearly happy to use these products for whatever reason they have. When you see the verdicts reached in other parts of the world - the UK, Germany etc. - it seems the US are just protecting Apple because it's American. Quite a few cases which involve American companies seem to see the domestic companies win and the foreign companies lose - General Motors v Spyker is one that comes to mind. It was obvious Samsung were going to lose partly because of this.

It seems unlikely the general public are going to care. Unless bans are involved the general public will buy whatever they want, they may see a Samsung phone and think "That was in the news recently" but not really know what for. It's similar to Nestlé, who were in trouble for not following the FairTrade movement, yet people still bought their chocolate. It's hard to say though as the UK do not appear to care so much about Samsung or Apple, since our court case the rivalry hasn't really been noticeable other than what's been coming from the US. The comments about the iPhone being "cooler" fell on deaf ears here, people still love Galaxys and iPhones so it all means very little :P British consumers are horrible to analyse.

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Originally Posted by GommeInc

In doesn't make them look bad, obviously there will be a lot of praise - shares in Apple rose while Samsung lost a lot of value after the verdict (7%?). What's questionable is that one company that clearly makes popular products is being attacked because of a personal vendetta by another company, despite the fact the consumer is clearly happy to use these products for whatever reason they have. When you see the verdicts reached in other parts of the world - the UK, Germany etc. - it seems the US are just protecting Apple because it's American. Quite a few cases which involve American companies seem to see the domestic companies win and the foreign companies lose - General Motors v Spyker is one that comes to mind. It was obvious Samsung were going to lose partly because of this.

It seems unlikely the general public are going to care. Unless bans are involved the general public will buy whatever they want, they may see a Samsung phone and think "That was in the news recently" but not really know what for. It's similar to Nestlé, who were in trouble for not following the FairTrade movement, yet people still bought their chocolate. It's hard to say though as the UK do not appear to care so much about Samsung or Apple, since our court case the rivalry hasn't really been noticeable other than what's been coming from the US. The comments about the iPhone being "cooler" fell on deaf ears here, people still love Galaxys and iPhones so it all means very little :P British consumers are horrible to analyse.

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Then if the general public don't care and the appeal fails, it would seem that Apple still became one billion dollars richer at no great expense :P

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

Then if the general public don't care and the appeal fails, it would seem that Apple still became one billion dollars richer at no great expense :P

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It might fuel the odd "#boycottapple" campaigns, but they're about as useful as fishing for salmon in the Sahara :P

It was bulleted with lack of knowledge and bias. The jury did not have sufficient knowledge on patents, so it's ridiculous how they can make a decision.

What's even more shocking is that one of the jurors actually held patents in Apple. Obviously people are now questioning the bias here: http://www.androidpit.com/what-juror...-used-by-apple.

The trial in S.K seems more representative of the actual truth. Also, it's a trial that will be detrimental to technology development. Expect to see companies develop products much slower over fear of other patent conflicts such as this one.

Interesting, yet a disappointing verdict.

Here's an interesting last thought from a lawyer, a Professor Michael Risch, who was following the dispute:
"How did the Galaxy Tab escape design patent infringement? This was the only device to be preliminarily enjoined (on appeal no less), and yet it was the one of the few devices to be spared the sledgehammer. And, by the way, it looks an awful lot like an iPad. Yet the Epic 4G, a phone I own (uh oh, Apple's coming after me)—which has a slide out keyboard, a curved top and bottom, 4 buttons on the bottom, the word Samsung printed across the top, buttons in different places (and I know this because I look in all the wrong places on my wife's iTouch), a differently shaped speaker, a differently placed camera, etc.—that device infringes the iPhone design patents...."

@Grig - It's worrying seeing the stories emerging from this. The S.Korea trial seemed quite fair and unbiased, considering Samsung is one of theirs. America seem to have a track record of supporting their own companies, which is adding more to the unfairness of this particular trial.

Isn't Samsung trying to get a ban removed on the Tab because it seemed to go unmentioned in this trial? That came up quickly on the news but there were no details. It's strange, the Tab was supposedly the main offender with the phones coming in second :P

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Originally Posted by dirrty

surely this will/should encourage more innovation, opposed to using designs that are extremely similar to competitors?

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Interestingly however apple has wanted to do the same it is doing to Samsung to Android - which looks different. The problem is that apple will find any small similarities with other companies products and claim they copied their design and try to sue. It's like the writer who's tried to sue people for similar ideas in films - he had a book with robots in so sued the terminator, he tried to sue one film because of a similar but often used concept to - you can't own ideas and you shouldn't be able to own standard designs.

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Originally Posted by xxMATTGxx

The irony of a billion dollar lawsuit: it is all good advertising for Samsung

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Interestingly this reminds me of an article I stumbled upon via a link in an email (think it was either Twitter or LinkedIn). Basically it stated apple didn't hire people with knowledge they only went for people who loved their products and mentions stuff like wanting to reach customers hearts and not their wallets - it's a total contradiction because Apple overprices all of their products and sadly the majority buy into it.

And I'm not an apple hater - I got criticised for entering a competition to win an iPad after I'd bashed Apple on their pricing - Their products are decent but overpriced - I'm not going to say no to a free one but right now I'm hardly rich and why should I waste a load of money on products of theirs when I can get the same for cheaper.

I remember having an argument with a friend of my brothers who used to work in a phone shop stating the iPhone 4S had better specs processor wise than the Galaxy S2 when the galaxy s2 has a slighter faster processor - 1.2 Vs 1.0 both dual core if I remember rightly. It's interesting to note that the S2 is older than the 4s by about 4 months and the s3 is now dual core.

I think Apple still bases its pricing on a few years ago when it was the main smartphone and there wasn't as much competition - it could afford to be expensive but now it needs to lower it's prices as the competition is offering identical if not often better technology for far less. However rather than do this apple seems to be just trying to sue the companies causing more issues. I hope a court puts a stop to them - apple accept that like Nokia you have fallen and aren't at the top of the game - notice how Nokia has had a restructure and is trying to big up the windows phones - rather than cause as big of a fuss they have just tried to get good better products out.

Best thing about this is they paid all that money (1 billion) in 5c coins LMAO.

http://en.paperblog.com/samsung-pays...-coins-294795/

^

Fake rumor.

Some believe Apple will now do a similar thing with HTC - Although I personally feel that if they do they will have a harder time in winning.

HTC are a much smaller company than Samsung, although I totally fail to see how their products are at all like Apple's...

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Originally Posted by Recursion

HTC are a much smaller company than Samsung, although I totally fail to see how their products are at all like Apple's...

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Indeed, we'll have to see if they do it or not. I doubt it because the chances of them winning is a lot less.

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Originally Posted by Grig

Best thing about this is they paid all that money (1 billion) in 5c coins LMAO.

http://en.paperblog.com/samsung-pays...-coins-294795/

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I saw this on Reddit whilst I was developing Reditr and my brother and I had a good laugh :)

What we weren't pleased about is the fact that Samsung is in a revenge mood. I don't like any of these patent disputes because they're just hurting the consumer in the end.

Samsung loses in the US - so then Apple files for an injunction to ban 8 Samsung phones

Samsung is mad at Apple - so Samsung wants lets everyone use LTE except for Apple

Great-- so if I want an awesome phone in the future I can't have a Galaxy or an iPhone.

Apple loses in Japan:

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Samsung may have lost its war with Apple in California, but it's winning small battles elsewhere. Following the company's recent victory in its home nation of South Korea, a Tokyo court has ruled in its favor in Japan. The Nikkei reports that Apple's case dealt with a patent covering the syncing of media files between devices, and eight Galaxy-series devices sold by NTT Docomo and KDDI were alleged to have infringed.

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http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/31/32...-case-in-japan

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

I saw this on Reddit whilst I was developing Reditr and my brother and I had a good laugh :)

What we weren't pleased about is the fact that Samsung is in a revenge mood. I don't like any of these patent disputes because they're just hurting the consumer in the end.

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You can't blame them when Apple won the court battle and then want to go on and ban the phones. There hasn't been an answer as to whether or not Judge Koh is going to double or treble the money Samsung owe to Apple, so it seems a step too far and goes beyond the original patent dispute - Apple seem to want to hinder consumer choice with a ban, rather than play fair and keep the dispute between Samsung and themselves.

And these cases are all pointless if they're not going to resolve the patent system :/

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Originally Posted by GommeInc

You can't blame them when Apple won the court battle and then want to go on and ban the phones. There hasn't been an answer as to whether or not Judge Koh is going to double or treble the money Samsung owe to Apple, so it seems a step too far and goes beyond the original patent dispute - Apple seem to want to hinder consumer choice with a ban, rather than play fair and keep the dispute between Samsung and themselves.

And these cases are all pointless if they're not going to resolve the patent system :/

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At present date both companies want want the courts to impose restrictions on each others products, Apple on grounds of an assortment of patent violations and Samsung on grounds of Apple allegedly violating LTE patents in the upcoming iPhone 5 (which you can read about in my previous post).

It's stupid, and both companies actions have and will persist in hurting consumers.

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Originally Posted by HotelUser

At present date both companies want want the courts to impose restrictions on each others products, Apple on grounds of an assortment of patent violations and Samsung on grounds of Apple allegedly violating LTE patents in the upcoming iPhone 5 (which you can read about in my previous post).

It's stupid, and both companies actions have and will persist in hurting consumers.

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Samsung seem to be in a mix of different reasons for being in court. The e-mails they've allegedly sent out across the company suggest they are only wanting to impose such bans because they are counter-suing Apple. The American case is one instance where they mention the reasons for their actions to go to court.

Apple on the other hand - well, it's part of their business plan to take people to court :P Jobs himself did say he wanted thermo-nuclear war with those who steal their work (Android mainly, but it seems to of set a precedent). Not that what he says makes any sense considering he also admits that great artists steal :P