Australian Prime Minister revives the Imperial Honours system (Knights & Dames)

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-2...r-dame/5344646

'Pre-eminent' Australians to be made knights or dames under a new award, PM Tony Abbott says

http://www1.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/T...kXom6D4BRl.jpg

Tony Abbott is a strong supporter of the Monarchy and British links, recently installing a picture of Queen Elizabeth II in the parliamentary offices.

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Prime Minister Tony Abbott has brought back the titles of knights and dames for "pre-eminent" Australians, nearly three decades after the honour was abolished by the Hawke Labor government.

The honour will be known as a knight or dame in the Order of Australia and will be the nation's highest award.

It will be automatically bestowed on the serving governor-general with up to four created per year by Her Majesty the Queen on the recommendation of the prime minister.

The first dame is the outgoing Governor-General Quentin Bryce and the first knight will be her successor, former Defence Force chief General Peter Cosgrove, who will take on the title of "sir" when he is sworn in on Friday.

"This new award will go to those who have accepted public office rather than sought it and who can never by virtue of that office ever entirely return to private life," Mr Abbott said.

The Prime Minister, a former leader of Australians for Constitutional Monarchy and an avowed monarchist, said he thought this was an important "gracenote in our national life".

He said he did not believe the current honours available to Australians were enough to acknowledge the achievements of some.

"That is for eminent achievement. This is for pre-eminent achievement," he said.

"The existing companions, officers and members of the Order of Australia continue as they should, but this will be a higher honour."

He said it was his intention that politicians would not receive the honour but he could not rule it out.

"It doesn't preclude anyone except people who have not given service of extraordinary and pre-eminent nature," he said.

"My anticipation is that the people who may receive this honour will be those who have accepted rather than sought public office.

"Politicians of course have sought public office. That's the nature of the business that I'm in."

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Excellent news, I heard rumours that he would but didn't think he'd do it.

The Monarchists are clever to build on the work of former Prime Minister John Howard who saved the Monarchy in Australia by reintroducing the honours system..... a system that New Zealand recently reintroduced and which Canada still issues. While support for the Monarchy is strong, it's worth reinforcing that - something the visit of Prince William and Princess Catherine + (Prince George?) should help cement this summer.

How nice it would be to have a real conservative in office and a patriot as a PM. It's symbolic, but important.

Thoughts?

Old news. Against monarchy

Not sure what I really think about this, the whole "achievement system" (not sure what else to call it) sounds horribly flawed and biased.

The restoration of this system in 2014 when in a Sydney Morning Herald poll a few weeks ago 87% of the population seek a departure from the monarchy is also arrogant & demeaning to all those apart from the elitists to whom these outdated awards are made. It is also a dilution of the integrity of the Order of Australia honours system.

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Originally Posted by -Moniquee.

The restoration of this system in 2014 when in a Sydney Morning Herald poll a few weeks ago 87% of the population seek a departure from the monarchy is also arrogant & demeaning to all those apart from the elitists to whom these outdated awards are made. It is also a dilution of the integrity of the Order of Australia honours system.

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Oh ha ha ha, quoting newspaper polls on the internet in (I presume) left wing rags isn't representative of the Australian public. If you want real opinion polling on the matter, then look at the scientific polls carried out by pollsters which finds a close race but one in which the Monarchy enjoys majority support in Australia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republi...Public_opinion After all, the Monarchists also won the 1999 referendum.

As for supposed elitism, erm what? It's just the same as the Australian system of honours but on a higher level. Ultimately an awards system by it's nature is elitist in that people are elevated above others: except that you could say that this reintroduction of the Honour's System by Abbott is less elitist than the existing system because of the fact that he has stated that unlike the Australian Companion system, only those who accept public office will be eligable for Knighthoods and Damehoods as opposed to those seeking office like politicians. That makes Knighthoods & Damehoods less elitist than the other existing ranks.

You are looking at the system through upside down glasses.

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

Oh ha ha ha, quoting newspaper polls on the internet in (I presume) left wing rags isn't representative of the Australian public. If you want real opinion polling on the matter, then look at the scientific polls carried out by pollsters which finds a close race but one in which the Monarchy enjoys majority support in Australia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republi...Public_opinion After all, the Monarchists also won the 1999 referendum.

As for supposed elitism, erm what? It's just the same as the Australian system of honours but on a higher level. Ultimately an awards system by it's nature is elitist in that people are elevated above others: except that you could say that this reintroduction of the Honour's System by Abbott is less elitist than the existing system because of the fact that he has stated that unlike the Australian Companion system, only those who accept public office will be eligable for Knighthoods and Damehoods as opposed to those seeking office like politicians. That makes Knighthoods & Damehoods less elitist than the other existing ranks.

You are looking at the system through upside down glasses.

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Um.. I live in Australia and it is a common fact that the monarchy system is not well liked. You are referring to a referendum which occurred 15 years ago and since then more changes have occurred.
Yes, I do happen to quote a newspaper poll because it is accurate because as I said previously majority of Australians want to move away from the monarchy. This is a common known fact and has been proven on multiple occasions - I happened to just quote this poll because it was the one that came to mind at first. Even other cabinet members are shocked about this decision as Abbott only consulted senior members of the party not the backbenchers.
In the 21st century we don't need outdated awards which separates the politicians who have accepted office away from the rest of society. The outgoing Governor General has been announced a Dame. Who cares? It is just another fancy name which means jack all. She was a Governor General, well done on her, she doesn't need to be a Dame to be remembered.
This is just a stupid decision. Tony Abbott should be busy facing the real issues rather than making idiotic decisions which would be overruled by the Labor party if they get office in the next election. Also, this serves no purpose to the everyday Australian and isn't going to benefit us in anyway whatsoever.
Previous Liberal PM, John Howard said this system came up whilst he was in office and he thought didn't think it was worthy to bring back. He has also stated that if he was invited to be a Knight he would most likely decline.
Tony Abbott needs to realise that it isn't the 1970s anymore. In 1986 the Dame and Knighthood system was scrapped because it served no good purpose at all. Why bring it back when it wasn't successful in the past?
@Daltron I actually would like to see your thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by -Moniquee.

Um.. I live in Australia and it is a common fact that the monarchy system is not well liked.

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Cite me some scientific polling on the subject then.

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Originally Posted by Moniquee.

You are referring to a referendum which occurred 15 years ago and since then more changes have occurred.

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Indeed, and if anything the Monarchy is much more popular than it was in the 1990's. It has long been said that in 1999 the Monarchists in Australia were literally an inch away from losing the battle, yet in the decade since - along with John Howard's Flag Day - support for the Monarchy has stabilised if not increased. The same applies to the colonial-era flag.

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Originally Posted by Moniquee.

Yes, I do happen to quote a newspaper poll because it is accurate because as I said previously majority of Australians want to move away from the monarchy. This is a common known fact and has been proven on multiple occasions - I happened to just quote this poll because it was the one that came to mind at first.

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That does not make it true. Internet polls attract supporters of a cause as do newspaper sites with a left or right bias. I could cite polls on local newspaper sites giving Ukip or Rand Paul 90% of the vote, but I don't because they aren't serious polls: I look at the scientific polling data and the trends given, and then come to a conclusion on the polling data. And as I have said, if you look at the scientific polling data on the Monarchy in Australia then you'll find a small majority support it's continued existence.

You may disagree, you are welcome to disagree - but that is what most Australians think.

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Originally Posted by Moniquee.

Even other cabinet members are shocked about this decision as Abbott only consulted senior members of the party not the backbenchers.

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You mean dripping wet losers like Turnball who should be in the Labor Party?

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Originally Posted by Moniquee.

In the 21st century we don't need outdated awards which separates the politicians who have accepted office away from the rest of society. The outgoing Governor General has been announced a Dame. Who cares? It is just another fancy name which means jack all. She was a Governor General, well done on her, she doesn't need to be a Dame to be remembered.

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I never understand why people like yourself tell me what century we're living in as though that has any relevence on the subject what so ever. It's 2014 and Australia issues Damehoods and Knighthoods like it has always done since the nation was established...... and your point is what exactly?

If you don't want a fancy name and you happened to be offered to be made a Dame then you'd be welcome to refuse it.

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Originally Posted by Moniquee.

This is just a stupid decision. Tony Abbott should be busy facing the real issues rather than making idiotic decisions which would be overruled by the Labor party if they get office in the next election. Also, this serves no purpose to the everyday Australian and isn't going to benefit us in anyway whatsoever.

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Well you could say that with anything couldn't you. You could say that the flag doesn't make a difference to your day to day life and therefore you should change it to a picture of egg, chips and sausage. You could say that Australia doesn't even need to exist as a federal state and should be split up into it's states as it wouldn't make a difference to your everyday life. You could say that as you aren't gay(?) it doesn't matter whether gay 'marriage' is introduced or not as it won't make a difference to your everyday life.

As for Labor overturning it - we shall see. With anyluck, the next Liberal/National Government would just bring them back again.

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Originally Posted by Moniquee.

Previous Liberal PM, John Howard said this system came up whilst he was in office and he thought didn't think it was worthy to bring back. He has also stated that if he was invited to be a Knight he would most likely decline.

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Probably because Howard is trying to toe the middle ground...... but as stated before, he is entitled to decline.

Although it won't be offered to him... as it's not for politicians.

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Originally Posted by Moniquee.

Tony Abbott needs to realise that it isn't the 1970s anymore. In 1986 the Dame and Knighthood system was scrapped because it served no good purpose at all. Why bring it back when it wasn't successful in the past?
@Daltron I actually would like to see your thoughts on this

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No, the Imperial Honours system was scrapped by the dogmatic Labor Party who said stuff exactly along the same lines as you are right now about 'oh its 1970 today not 1950' as though that constitutes an argument. That would be like smashing up a priceless Ming Vasé or the Oval Office desk as they're now 'outdated' and 'behind the times' - so what? Indeed, isn't that exactly what you and other Republicans in Australia want to do with your perfect constitutional system? Smash it up in the name of dogma?

The Honours System is a core part of the history of Australia..... and i'm glad to see your traditions preserved.

Not particularly fond of the honours system and it seems pointless to reintroduce it after it was removed not too long ago.

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Originally Posted by -:Undertaker:-

Cite me some scientific polling on the subject then.



Indeed, and if anything the Monarchy is much more popular than it was in the 1990's. It has long been said that in 1999 the Monarchists in Australia were literally an inch away from losing the battle, yet in the decade since - along with John Howard's Flag Day - support for the Monarchy has stabilised if not increased. The same applies to the colonial-era flag.



That does not make it true. Internet polls attract supporters of a cause as do newspaper sites with a left or right bias. I could cite polls on local newspaper sites giving Ukip or Rand Paul 90% of the vote, but I don't because they aren't serious polls: I look at the scientific polling data and the trends given, and then come to a conclusion on the polling data. And as I have said, if you look at the scientific polling data on the Monarchy in Australia then you'll find a small majority support it's continued existence.

You may disagree, you are welcome to disagree - but that is what most Australians think.



You mean dripping wet losers like Turnball who should be in the Labor Party?



I never understand why people like yourself tell me what century we're living in as though that has any relevence on the subject what so ever. It's 2014 and Australia issues Damehoods and Knighthoods like it has always done since the nation was established...... and your point is what exactly?

If you don't want a fancy name and you happened to be offered to be made a Dame then you'd be welcome to refuse it.



Well you could say that with anything couldn't you. You could say that the flag doesn't make a difference to your day to day life and therefore you should change it to a picture of egg, chips and sausage. You could say that Australia doesn't even need to exist as a federal state and should be split up into it's states as it wouldn't make a difference to your everyday life. You could say that as you aren't gay(?) it doesn't matter whether gay 'marriage' is introduced or not as it won't make a difference to your everyday life.

As for Labor overturning it - we shall see. With anyluck, the next Liberal/National Government would just bring them back again.



Probably because Howard is trying to toe the middle ground...... but as stated before, he is entitled to decline.

Although it won't be offered to him... as it's not for politicians.



No, the Imperial Honours system was scrapped by the dogmatic Labor Party who said stuff exactly along the same lines as you are right now about 'oh its 1970 today not 1950' as though that constitutes an argument. That would be like smashing up a priceless Ming Vasé or the Oval Office desk as they're now 'outdated' and 'behind the times' - so what? Indeed, isn't that exactly what you and other Republicans in Australia want to do with your perfect constitutional system? Smash it up in the name of dogma?

The Honours System is a core part of the history of Australia..... and i'm glad to see your traditions preserved.

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You my friend, asked for thoughts on the subject. I have stated my thoughts and I don't need you arguing against my opinion. This is the current affairs forum not the debate forum.
Your other points just seem pointless and I could provide a decent explanation on each but it's a waste of time when you just carry on with your one sided view.

he look cool i wonder if he snapchats david cameron

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Originally Posted by -Moniquee.

Um.. I live in Australia and it is a common fact that the monarchy system is not well liked. You are referring to a referendum which occurred 15 years ago and since then more changes have occurred.
Yes, I do happen to quote a newspaper poll because it is accurate because as I said previously majority of Australians want to move away from the monarchy. This is a common known fact and has been proven on multiple occasions - I happened to just quote this poll because it was the one that came to mind at first. Even other cabinet members are shocked about this decision as Abbott only consulted senior members of the party not the backbenchers.
In the 21st century we don't need outdated awards which separates the politicians who have accepted office away from the rest of society. The outgoing Governor General has been announced a Dame. Who cares? It is just another fancy name which means jack all. She was a Governor General, well done on her, she doesn't need to be a Dame to be remembered.
This is just a stupid decision. Tony Abbott should be busy facing the real issues rather than making idiotic decisions which would be overruled by the Labor party if they get office in the next election. Also, this serves no purpose to the everyday Australian and isn't going to benefit us in anyway whatsoever.
Previous Liberal PM, John Howard said this system came up whilst he was in office and he thought didn't think it was worthy to bring back. He has also stated that if he was invited to be a Knight he would most likely decline.
Tony Abbott needs to realise that it isn't the 1970s anymore. In 1986 the Dame and Knighthood system was scrapped because it served no good purpose at all. Why bring it back when it wasn't successful in the past?
@Daltron I actually would like to see your thoughts on this

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Yes it's common knowledge here in Australia that this was not well received and very few people actually wanted this change.

It's all well and good for someone in a country on the other side of the world try to tell us this is a good idea but in reality they don't really understand that Australian culture and society this day and age does not welcome old traditions like this.

It's pretty clear this government won't last full term and when Labor is back in these stupid changes will be reverted so it's just a matter of time. Abbott has all his priorities wrong and it's hilarious to me when I see people in his own party and ideology grouping disagree with many of the decisions he is making.

Monique I would just ignore Undertaker really, he is not going to look at this Australian issue from an Australian's perspective. Just let him run with his outdated view.

It's incredible that he asks for our thoughts but no no no, if you disagree the current affairs forum turns into the debate forum.

I'll probably get an essay back saying what a horrible person I am for personally attacking him and not agreeing and not providing bias statistics and blah blah blah. If I wanted a debate I will head over to the debate forum thanks. You asked for opinions OP and you got some

Peace out :hand:

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Originally Posted by Daltron

Yes it's common knowledge here in Australia that this was not well received and very few people actually wanted this change.

It's all well and good for someone in a country on the other side of the world try to tell us this is a good idea but in reality they don't really understand that Australian culture and society this day and age does not welcome old traditions like this.

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I don't believe I have said what the public think on this issue. I merely made a statement of fact on polling regarding the Monarchy, not the restoration of the Knighthoods and Damehoods. Do not misrepresent me & twist reality.

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Originally Posted by Daltron

It's pretty clear this government won't last full term and when Labor is back in these stupid changes will be reverted so it's just a matter of time. Abbott has all his priorities wrong and it's hilarious to me when I see people in his own party and ideology grouping disagree with many of the decisions he is making.

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You and other radicals on here really do misrepresent the Australian public, first we had the claim above that most of the country wanted rid of the Monarchy and now we have this claim that the Abbott Government (which has a majority last time I checked - something Labor couldn't manage hence why two PMs toppled within a couple of years) is about to fall apart and that somehow the glorious Labor Party with comrade Gillard at the helm is going to sweep to power. Have you even seen the opinion polls? The Liberals/Nationals are polling neck and neck with the Labor Party. The Abbott Government is likely to run to 2017 and serve the full term which gives me great pleasure. Abbott 2017 if he keeps it up. :D

I know you want your gay marriage legislation socialist paradise but half (if not more) of Australians know better than to believe in fairytales.

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Originally Posted by Daltron

Monique I would just ignore Undertaker really, he is not going to look at this Australian issue from an Australian's perspective. Just let him run with his outdated view.

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Again with the meaningless outdated jibe.

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Originally Posted by Daltron

It's incredible that he asks for our thoughts but no no no, if you disagree the current affairs forum turns into the debate forum.

I'll probably get an essay back saying what a horrible person I am for personally attacking him and not agreeing and not providing bias statistics and blah blah blah. If I wanted a debate I will head over to the debate forum thanks. You asked for opinions OP and you got some

Peace out :hand:

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Yeah, and you got my opinion in response. Checkmate!