Reputation vs Like/Thanks system?

This has been brought up a few times for example (*) there was a poll 2 years ago where the favourable outcome was the rep system as it is, however I think quite a few people have changed opinions since then, so why not give it another go?

Last year a poll was done regarding if reputation has value to you (*) and the result was 45.83% No and 54.17% Yes (11-13), so it seems more and more than reputation is having less meaning to people.

The last poll on this done in 2013 has 56.25% of members voting to keep the rep system, 39.07% of members voting for a like system, 3.13% of members voting to get rid of both and 1.56% voting other.

Judging by the last thread I'll sum up the valid points in pros and cons

Pro:
- Reputation is an out dated system
- Reputation is heavily seen as a negative system
- Reputation adds more work for forum staff due to reports
- Reputation is abused (friends repping each other, pointless reps, rude reps, revenge reps, etc)
- Like system publicly shows who agrees/liked your posts
- Like system shows a 'total' (rather than power)
- Like system has a flat out power (1) making it equal for all (i.e. someone joining tomorrow can like a post, as well as someone from 10 years ago, and there isn't 80 points different within their 'like')
- Like system is more widely used, so newer members will understand it where as some may not understand the reputation system (*)


Con:
- Can't give out 'likes' for competition rewards
- People with high power
- Like system is more 'up to date'
- Reputation allows you to add a comment


I'll add the same options we have 2 years ago.


What do you think? Can you add to the Pros and Cons?

Feel free to discuss your vote.

i would rather have nothing. i feel like people should have equal status on here, rather than maybe some new people assuming those with high reputations have more power and more right to an opinion. all it does is shows reputation given throughout the years, not how the person is seen today which should be more important?

and, i think kyle said this before maybe someone else, but i'd rather see people post "i agree with this __" rather than hide behind the reputation system? it does create a negative atmosphere when people are repped for bad posts and promotes bullying.

Keep it as it is since there's no reason to change it.

"Get rid of both systems"

Surely you mean, get rid of rep + don't implement like. We don't have both systems atm :P

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Originally Posted by buttons

i would rather have nothing. i feel like people should have equal status on here, rather than maybe some new people assuming those with high reputations have more power and more right to an opinion. all it does is shows reputation given throughout the years, not how the person is seen today which should be more important?

and, i think kyle said this before maybe someone else, but i'd rather see people post "i agree with this __" rather than hide behind the reputation system? it does create a negative atmosphere when people are repped for bad posts and promotes bullying.

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The like system would essentially do that, as it wouldn't cause someone to have say 100 'like' power, they would simply have 1, whether they had 0 likes or 100,000 likes they'll always have the exact same 'power'.

I agree I'd rather see people post, but again with the like system it would be something that's publicly displayed under each post (or somewhere near it) saying "x, x, x liked this post". so it would prevent the bullying that we have with the current system (unless they want to be publicly seen as endorsing those comments)

"get rid of vm's because you can bully people over them"

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Originally Posted by Intersocial

"Get rid of both systems"

Surely you mean, get rid of rep + don't implement like. We don't have both systems atm :P

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Yeah blame MCR, I copied his poll from years ago :P

STUPID AD THING KEEPS COMING UP SO I CANT REPLY GRR

im not against a like system, i just don't like the rep system anymore. i would rather have nothing but would prefer a like system over rep.

Like systems promote bandwagoning and less contribution. If a persons name is within a thread under somebody's post to indicate that they like it they are less likely in my experience to actually contribute to discussion. It's about as useful as saying "this" or [2] or retweeting.

There are problems with the rep system of course but those regarding negativity were addressed before and the decision was taken to not do anything about them. What we have at the moment is a like system with no name display that encourages people to post if they want to be seen as contributors.


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I much prefer reputation but I can see the multiple downfalls, as with a like system.

If you're going to change rep, I'd say just remove it altogether and people may actually contribute more.

I've wanted a like system for yonks so I'm glad you made this thread. The rep system is nothing but a pain in the backside for Forum Management and it's actually become a lot worse than it used to be. The -rep reports are constant and instead of people just accepting Forum Managements decision they decide to try and argue it out so they can have it removed.

If we were to bring in a like system to the forum then we could suspend the rep feature so that rep could no longer be issued. This would allow those who have become attached to their rep power to keep it displayed permanently.

But I don't think the system will change anyway. People are too stuck in their ways to accept such a change.

Ideally I would like the current system (anonymous addition to counter on a post) that counts each person equally as a unit of 1 and the rep amount displayed would have no actual power.


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Originally Posted by Wispur

I've wanted a like system for yonks so I'm glad you made this thread. The rep system is nothing but a pain in the backside for Forum Management and it's actually become a lot worse than it used to be. The -rep reports are constant and instead of people just accepting Forum Managements decision they decide to try and argue it out so they can have it removed.

If we were to bring in a like system to the forum then we could suspend the rep feature so that rep could no longer be issued. This would allow those who have become attached to their rep power to keep it displayed permanently.

But I don't think the system will change anyway. People are too stuck in their ways to accept such a change.

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Or you could, yknow, stop allowing people to report rep.


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like system, rep seems really outdated.

Can someone explain how rep is outdated, I don't really get it

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Originally Posted by scottish

Yeah blame MCR, I copied his poll from years ago :P

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Interestingly, I voted exactly the same this time as I did last time (reduce rep powers) - who'd have thought? :L

Is it possible to find out exactly how many +Rep's a person has got? Could they then be directly converted to likes (if a user makes a request) - ie. 1 +Rep =/= 1 like (no matter how many points).

I would be happy with likes, just - personally - I don't think you should completely eradicate peoples 'credit' for potentially the past 11 years worth of posts (god, that is scary).

I do think a like system would be used more - not sure why, I guess just due to experience on other forums.

EDIT: You can tell I read the poll options properly xox :P

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Originally Posted by Wispur

I've wanted a like system for yonks so I'm glad you made this thread. The rep system is nothing but a pain in the backside for Forum Management and it's actually become a lot worse than it used to be. The -rep reports are constant and instead of people just accepting Forum Managements decision they decide to try and argue it out so they can have it removed.

If we were to bring in a like system to the forum then we could suspend the rep feature so that rep could no longer be issued. This would allow those who have become attached to their rep power to keep it displayed permanently.

But I don't think the system will change anyway. People are too stuck in their ways to accept such a change.

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If it's come to such a point it's causing such an issue then perhaps it's time to force a change.

For example with rep inflation it was an issue multiple times and they were then forced with the rep scaling, I believe a poll was done and something like 80% were against it, but within a few weeks all was forgotten.

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Originally Posted by Kyle

Ideally I would like the current system (anonymous addition to counter on a post) that counts each person equally as a unit of 1 and the rep amount displayed would have no actual power.


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So, you'd display the amount of times you'd been repped instead of the power? (as you wouldn't show points, as that's dependent on rep power)

So for example if you +rep me 80 times and -rep me 5, 75 would be shown?

Lol just skimmed through that thread and Scott made a post that said habbox will be dead long before anyone reaches 100 rep power. I think that's telling of how highly repped users are able to keep an exponentially increase their monopoly and new users are left in the cold when it comes to having any visible sway on opinion through their meagre rep powers.


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Originally Posted by MyChemicalRomance

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Interestingly, I voted exactly the same this time as I did last time (reduce rep powers) - who'd have thought? :L

Is it possible to find out exactly how many +Rep's a person has got? Could they then be directly converted to likes (if a user makes a request) - ie. 1 +Rep =/= 1 like (no matter how many points).

I would be happy with likes, just - personally - I don't think you should completely eradicate peoples 'credit' for potentially the past 11 years worth of posts (god, that is scary).

I do think a like system would be used more - not sure why, I guess just due to experience on other forums.

EDIT: You can tell I read the poll options properly xox :P

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Exactly, if General Management didn't reset the scores on the arcade for exactly the same reason then why is it suddenly ok to do the same for the rep system?

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Originally Posted by Kyle

Or you could, yknow, stop allowing people to report rep.


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I'm sure forum management would love to do that, but you haven't considered the effect that doing that would actually have. It would just allow people to abuse the system willy-nilly which would make the system even worse than it already is.

And @scottish; I can't really force the change. If I did then I imagine people would be all over me like a pack of wolves.

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Originally Posted by scottish

If it's come to such a point it's causing such an issue then perhaps it's time to force a change.

For example with rep inflation it was an issue multiple times and they were then forced with the rep scaling, I believe a poll was done and something like 80% were against it, but within a few weeks all was forgotten.

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So, you'd display the amount of times you'd been repped instead of the power? (as you wouldn't show points, as that's dependent on rep power)

So for example if you +rep me 80 times and -rep me 5, 75 would be shown?

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Exactly that. Though I think id rather it show +80-5 than +75


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kyle

Lol just skimmed through that thread and Scott made a post that said habbox will be dead long before anyone reaches 100 rep power. I think that's telling of how highly repped users are able to keep an exponentially increase their monopoly and new users are left in the cold when it comes to having any visible sway on opinion through their meagre rep powers.


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Yeah I believe it was posted in that thread that its much harder for higher rep users to get the rep (as they're giving out more than receiving) but evidently not if they're jumping up that fast lol.

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Originally Posted by Wispur

I'm sure forum management would love to do that, but you haven't considered the effect that doing that would actually have. It would just allow people to abuse the system willy-nilly which would make the system even worse than it already is.

And @scottish; I can't really force the change. If I did then I imagine people would be all over me like a pack of wolves.

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Stopping the report of -reps would result in the reputation system having even more of a negative impact and more pointless, revenge, rude, etc reps given/received.

You forced piss rep, this is a lot better :P

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Originally Posted by scottish

Yeah I believe it was posted in that thread that its much harder for higher rep users to get the rep (as they're giving out more than receiving) but evidently not if they're jumping up that fast lol.

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Stopping the report of -reps would result in the reputation system having even more of a negative impact and more pointless, revenge, rude, etc reps given/received.

You forced piss rep, this is a lot better :P

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New users rep is jumping up just as quick. @bikini; joined a year ago and already has 12 Rep Power.

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Originally Posted by Kyle

Lol just skimmed through that thread and Scott made a post that said habbox will be dead long before anyone reaches 100 rep power. I think that's telling of how highly repped users are able to keep an exponentially increase their monopoly and new users are left in the cold when it comes to having any visible sway on opinion through their meagre rep powers.


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That is indeed very telling lol

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Originally Posted by The Don

Exactly, if General Management didn't reset the scores on the arcade for exactly the same reason then why is it suddenly ok to do the same for the rep system?

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I agree. I do think the current system is flawed (FlyingJesus +Reps me 4 times = 1 rep power. New user reps me 400 times = 1 rep power. Is a new users opinion REALLY that void? I am therefore in favour of a one like = one rep power switch, which I can't see anyone complaining with, given how the current system is (in fairness) very artificial in terms of measuring anything... at all.

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Originally Posted by The Don

New users rep is jumping up just as quick. @bikini; joined a year ago and already has 12 Rep Power.

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Probably largely down to the Christmas rep thread :P

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Originally Posted by The Don

New users rep is jumping up just as quick. @bikini; joined a year ago and already has 12 Rep Power.

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12 rep power is like over 2k rep points below me, it's just not as large a number as it might have been years ago


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Originally Posted by MyChemicalRomance

Probably largely down to the Christmas rep thread :P

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Which would also increase @FlyingJesus;' score, so new users are gaining just as much as older users.

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Originally Posted by The Don

Which would also increase @FlyingJesus;' score, so new users are gaining just as much as older users.

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In that one thread yes, in general no.


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Originally Posted by Kyle

In that one thread yes, in general no.


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His comment was about that one thread?

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Originally Posted by The Don

Which would also increase @FlyingJesus;' score, so new users are gaining just as much as older users.

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the point was, they said they gained a lot less (the highest rep people) due to everyone else having sometimes significantly lower power. which obviously isn't the case if they're gaining more power than a new active user.

if we did stick with rep, is there a way to alter it so it's not as simple as

400 = 1
800 = 2
1200 = 3 etc

so maybe

400 = 1
1000 = 2
1800 = 3

etc

obviously not those exact figures but you get the point.

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Originally Posted by MyChemicalRomance

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Interestingly, I voted exactly the same this time as I did last time (reduce rep powers) - who'd have thought? :L

Is it possible to find out exactly how many +Rep's a person has got? Could they then be directly converted to likes (if a user makes a request) - ie. 1 +Rep =/= 1 like (no matter how many points).

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this was my reasoning last time the poll came up, that it doesn't matter how much reputation points or power i have, that's not indicative of the amount of times i've actually been repped and i don't find it fair that my agreement with someone is going to give them a lot of rep compared to someone with a lower rep.
i did count up mine before and i can't remember how much it came to... 124 pages to go through...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by scottish

Stopping the report of -reps would result in the reputation system having even more of a negative impact and more pointless, revenge, rude, etc reps given/received.

You forced piss rep, this is a lot better :P

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Yeah exactly, so disallowing reports would be a really bad idea.

"Piss rep" is a bit different though. That was just a small addition to the system which didn't really change the way it works. A like system is a large change thats going to effect users.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by scottish

the point was, they said they gained a lot less (the highest rep people) due to everyone else having sometimes significantly lower power. which obviously isn't the case if they're gaining more power than a new active user.

if we did stick with rep, is there a way to alter it so it's not as simple as

400 = 1
800 = 2
1200 = 3 etc

so maybe

400 = 1
1000 = 2
1800 = 3

etc

obviously not those exact figures but you get the point.

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What would that achieve other than making it just as hard to gain rep

Abolish te power element I say!


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by scottish

the point was, they said they gained a lot less (the highest rep people) due to everyone else having sometimes significantly lower power. which obviously isn't the case if they're gaining more power than a new active user.

if we did stick with rep, is there a way to alter it so it's not as simple as

400 = 1
800 = 2
1200 = 3 etc

so maybe

400 = 1
1000 = 2
1800 = 3

etc

obviously not those exact figures but you get the point.

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I'm getting confused. Bikini (new user) has received 1/4 of my rep power in just one year. Is there any proof that older users gain more power than new active users?

But yeah, I'm not opposed to making all reps issued equal.

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Originally Posted by Kyle

What would that achieve other than making it just as hard to gain rep

Abolish te power element I say!


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That works too, but idk how practical that is. As far as I'm aware from the rep system there isn't an option to just show amount of reps etc, it's based on power always from what I remember.

It would make it harder and harder as you go up in power, so you're not getting the same amount of rep points between rep power as someone who's been here for 2 days.

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Originally Posted by buttons

this was my reasoning last time the poll came up, that it doesn't matter how much reputation points or power i have, that's not indicative of the amount of times i've actually been repped and i don't find it fair that my agreement with someone is going to give them a lot of rep compared to someone with a lower rep.
i did count up mine before and i can't remember how much it came to... 124 pages to go through...

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Agreed - I would be happy for a swap as long as old users posts are not ignored for their value to the forum (similarly against resetting post count etc).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kyle

What would that achieve other than making it just as hard to gain rep

Abolish te power element I say!


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Abolishing the power element does effectively make it a like system where peoples current number of +Reps are converted.

Can we not export amount of times repped to a new system :(


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kyle

Can we not export amount of times repped to a new system :(


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not sure.

but as MCR said, showing only the amount of times you've been repped is essentially the like system. the only different is it's practical in the like system and not in standard vbulletins reputation system (from what I'm aware)

so we are in agreement that the fairest system is users aren't penalized for their previous contributions but we still remain on an equal level by not allowing one person's like/rep to be more powerful than anothers?

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Originally Posted by The Don

I'm getting confused. Bikini (new user) has received 1/4 of my rep power in just one year. Is there any proof that older users gain more power than new active users?

But yeah, I'm not opposed to making all reps issued equal.

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yes, there is proof if you ask the people with access to go through and make a comparison of every users reps over the past year, other than that no :P

The argument that was made in the other thread was something along the lines of;

New users gain more rep points because older members have high rep. It's hard to gain rep power at higher powers because you get repped lower than you give out.

Where as some of the highest members have gone up what 15-20 rep power in the year or something? (idk exactly, I don't record this data and keep a date of it) so it's obviously not accurate. Maybe it's a tiny bit different or more equal, but they're obviously not at a huge disadvantage.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kyle

Can we not export amount of times repped to a new system :(


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That is the fourth system in the poll :)