War in Afghanistan - can it be won?

[-:Undertaker:-]

The conflict in Afghanistan and now Northern Pakistan started in 2001 as a reply to the attacks of 9/11 on the United States. NATO currently has around 65,000 troops in Afghanistan and the terrorists are largely unknown, but is estimated to be well under 500,000. The question is, even with a troop surge, can this war be won?

I personally think not, as the British Empire failed, and later on the Soviet Union also failed with over 100,000 troops in Afghanistan. I think Afghanisatan is basically ungovernable and our efforts should be focused on Pakistan which has faced a lot of trouble since Pervez Musharraf was outsted from office, and now terrorists control large chunks of the nuclear armed nation.

Do you think Afghanistan is winnable?

Moved by Jamesy (Forum Moderators): From "Current Affairs"

[Ardemax]

not as of yet.

i agree with what you're saying, i said it before also, soviets went there like 10 years earlier, failed, lost thousands of troops, but suddenly some big heads think we can win.

if we use the american drone things, then we have a good chance.

[Jamesy]

it's a bit of a catch 22. Leave Afghanistan and they surge into nuclear armed pakistan, or you end up fighting to the bitter end over many years with increasing lack of public support.

[-:Undertaker:-]

The only way you could beat them would be to fight exactly as they do, which will never happen and I very much doubt could happen. It does appear to be the new Vietnam.

[Ardemax]

The only way you could beat them would be to fight exactly as they do, which will never happen and I very much doubt could happen. It does appear to be the new Vietnam.

pick up a tea towel. put it on head. make a bomb in a coke can. shout something. throw it. go hide in a cave. thrive.


doesnt sound that hard tbh..

[Nixt]

if we use the american drone things, then we have a good chance.

I assume you mean UAVs? The British Army have those too and I don't see how they give us such an amazing chance of winning this war. Yes, they give us an advantage but they are merely a small part of the wide variety of kit the coalition have access too .

It does appear to be the new Vietnam.

I can see how you would make this association however I do think it is just a little exaggeration. Just as one example, the casualties in Afghanistan (for the whole coalition, private contractors and the Afghan security force) currently stands at 6,782. The death toll in Vietnam exceeded one million. Additionally the tactics employed by soldiers in the Vietnam war is massively different to how they behave in the Afghan war. The one similarity is the tactics employed by the Vietcong and the Taliban however.

pick up a tea towel. put it on head. make a bomb in a coke can. shout something. throw it. go hide in a cave. thrive.

What an incredibly stereotypical and misguided view of Al Qaeda / the Taliban... There is a lot more to their organisation than that.

As for the war in Afghanistan, it is certainly a conflict we can win providing our troops are provided with the appropriate equipment and kit as well as having the amount of troops they need.

[Special]

I personally think not, it would have been won by now. But a teacher at school told me if we backed out, the far east (china etc) may attack us.

But no, i dont think it can be won

[-:Undertaker:-]

I can see how you would make this association however I do think it is just a little exaggeration. Just as one example, the casualties in Afghanistan (for the whole coalition, private contractors and the Afghan security force) currently stands at 6,782. The death toll in Vietnam exceeded one million. Additionally the tactics employed by soldiers in the Vietnam war is massively different to how they behave in the Afghan war. The one similarity is the tactics employed by the Vietcong and the Taliban however.

I have said before in other debates, something does not have to be black and white to be compared to something else (EU & USSR) because hardly anything is ever the same. If Afghanistan troop numbers gradually increase as they did in Vietnam, then we do face a Vietnam-style war which in the end, we will lose. On the point of China in the post above, China has nothing to do with Afghanistan, while I think China is the biggest threat to the world by saying China would attack us if we withdrew from Afghanistan is jusr scare-mongering.

[Jordy]

I personally think not, it would have been won by now. But a teacher at school told me if we backed out, the far east (china etc) may attack us.

But no, i dont think it can be won

What lol? Never heard that before

As for the war in Afghanistan, it is certainly a conflict we can win providing our troops are provided with the appropriate equipment and kit as well as having the amount of troops they need.

Although there is the obvious need for better equipment, that will not win us the war. The Americans have decent equipment and all it means is less deaths (Obviously it's a price worth paying to have the equipment, my point is though it won't win us the war).

What is needed is a greater effort from NATO as a whole, the Americans, British, Canadians, Dutch, Danish and Australians seem to be doing it all. Germany are just pissing around in far safer areas such as Kabul, it's a complete waste. Another example is how last week it came out that the Italians had been paying the Taliban not to attack them. With some troop surges and decent help from the likes of France, Germany, Spain and Italy I believe that could make quite a difference. And most importantly, collaboration with Pakistan. NATO and Pakistan both have similar motives and hate the Taliban, if the Pakistani Government would willingly let NATO Forces into Northern Pakistan it would certainly help the war. Whatever it takes, bribing the pakistani's with money, oil or military equipment, it'd be worth it.

[-:Undertaker:-]

What lol? Never heard that before

Although there is the obvious need for better equipment, that will not win us the war. The Americans have decent equipment and all it means is less deaths (Obviously it's a price worth paying to have the equipment, my point is though it won't win us the war).

What is needed is a greater effort from NATO as a whole, the Americans, British, Canadians, Dutch, Danish and Australians seem to be doing it all. Germany are just pissing around in far safer areas such as Kabul, it's a complete waste. Another example is how last week it came out that the Italians had been paying the Taliban not to attack them. With some troop surges and decent help from the likes of France, Germany, Spain and Italy I believe that could make quite a difference. And most importantly, collaboration with Pakistan. NATO and Pakistan both have similar motives and hate the Taliban, if the Pakistani Government would willingly let NATO Forces into Northern Pakistan it would certainly help the war. Whatever it takes, bribing the pakistani's with money, oil or military equipment, it'd be worth it.

The problem being the United States doesn't have any money, we don't either (well we do but we'd rather waste it on foreign aid, EU, China, India and all the rest of it).