Apple vs Google - Getting Personal.

[AgnesIO]

iMac ...

[marriott0.01]

I would totally disagree with synergy. This is synergy for you. I have a Live account, I can access MSN on my Windows Mobile Phone (And various more), Xbox 360 and Windows PC. I can share Windows Media Centre between multiple PCs, Xbox 360s and Zune HDs. Microsoft integrate their Zune services, Hotmail services, Xbox 360 Gamertags, Microsoft Office Online, Skydrive etc all with one Live account which works with so many services and devices. That's what I call synergy.

With an iPad, it can't even share internet from a MacBook or a iPhone, their products fail to interact with each other.

Windows is cheaper yes, but I think millions of people around the world would thank you for that, it has transformed businesses and allowed the internet to expand a lot more. If we were left with solely Macs, lots of people around the world would be without access to computers. Microsoft of course do charge a high premium to manufacturers, hence why the company has become so successful, in terms of both revenue and number of people using the OS, however this is not passed onto the consumer. And I don't think the manufacturers suffer either, Michael Dell is one of the richest men in the world. Windows brought an affordable OS to the masses, provided the manufacturers with a fantastic OS to put on their systems and make them a fortune, and also made Microsoft a fortune. It's win win all round.

Referring to stealing, Microsoft may well be in the wrong for that, Apple are no better for stealing the whole GUI, the foundation of home computing.

I also don't think it's a case of people not knowing what Yahoo and Microsoft have to offer, the vast majority of Google users have used them both in the past. Most people really do think Google's products are far better and I'm sure if Google began stopping it's services being accessed on an iPhone, a surprising number of people would pack in their iPhones.

Apple are preventing technology progressing, they have patented the most basic of things such as multi-touch (This is also the fault of the patent office), without using such simple things, competition cannot progress.

I didn't mean Synergy between services, because Apple also does all this via MobileMe, I mean the Hardware and the software were built for each other. And remember this isn't about Microsoft and Apple, as the companies are getting on well. They collaborate a lot in recent years and Microsoft pays Apple for its IP and Apple pay Microsoft for its IP. And I have nothing against Microsoft I am a fan of the Xbox, Windows Phone 7 Series and the new ZuneHD.

You can quite easily sync bookmarks and things like that with the iPad or iPhone.

Windows is cheaper. But if they're going to make it cheaper they need to fix the problems with it. Which there are plenty. I do like Windows 7 and it is the best version of Windows available, but it's not as good as OSX. Windows isn't the biggest because they are the cheapest, nor are they the biggest because they are the best. They are the biggest because they are the most readily available. Worldwide it is far easier to pick up a PC than it is a Mac. But Apple are now making it easier to pick up Mac's hence why the Mac is growing in market share constantly. You say Michael Dell is one of the Richest men in the world, and so would Steve Jobs be, if it wasn't for himself accepting a salary of $1, simply because he loves Apple and creating great new products, unlike people like Michael Dell who have Salaries well over $1million. In the USA, where companies make some of the most money out of computer sales, Apple is the number 1 computer manufacturer in the US, simply because Apple have concentrated on making Mac's easily available in the US. Also Apple has invested in showing people how the Mac works and why it is better than the PC. Which people in the US now realise, hence why the Mac is the most popular computer in the US.

Apple did steal, and so did Microsoft, but Apple stole with the permission from the CEO of Xerox Star. Microsoft stole without any permission, and lied their way into the development of the Macintosh.

Well I use Google Mail, yes, and I have used Yahoo Mail. But I only use Google Mail, not because it's better because some of the new features in Yahoo Mail put it far above the rest, but because services prefer to integrate with Google mail. And people generally don't use Bing simply because it's new and people know Google. I use Google Search again, because i've used it quite a lot and it's more of a habit to use, but I do like Bing.

People won't recognise the difference if Google stopped producing for Apple, as Apple would just implement Bing, which does the same job to be honest, and the company that would really be hit is Google, considering the iPhone is the most popular way people gain access to the internet, Google's share in the Mobile Search would drop dramatically, meaning a drop in advertising revenue.

Apple are preventing people from stealing from them, not technology progressing. Apple spent billions upon billions coming up with multitouch, now say you spent that much, would you like to see people just using you hard work for free and gaining profit from it? Apple needs to get a return on the innovation they create. And the patent office is essentially trying to help companies do this, get a return on the amount they've invested in the industry. Competition will progress more if people think of a way of creating their own technologies that can better Apple's multitouch, like Nokia is trying to develop multitouch for resistive touchscreens, which would bring innovation into the technology space. And they only did this because they didn't want to pay for Apple's Multitouch license agreement.

iMac ...

Okay I agree their were issues with the 27inch, but Apple are sorting them.

[Recursion]

Technology gets nowhere without companies stealing each other's ideas. Fact.

[marriott0.01]

Technology does not move anywhere without ideas being stolen left right and center. Fact.

It does because people have to create their own stuff to move... Or they would just be moving backwards or be sued and lose money?

[Jordy]

I didn't mean Synergy between services, because Apple also does all this via MobileMe, I mean the Hardware and the software were built for each other. And remember this isn't about Microsoft and Apple, as the companies are getting on well. They collaborate a lot in recent years and Microsoft pays Apple for its IP and Apple pay Microsoft for its IP. And I have nothing against Microsoft I am a fan of the Xbox, Windows Phone 7 Series and the new ZuneHD.

You can quite easily sync bookmarks and things like that with the iPad or iPhone.

Windows is cheaper. But if they're going to make it cheaper they need to fix the problems with it. Which there are plenty. I do like Windows 7 and it is the best version of Windows available, but it's not as good as OSX. Windows isn't the biggest because they are the cheapest, nor are they the biggest because they are the best. They are the biggest because they are the most readily available. Worldwide it is far easier to pick up a PC than it is a Mac. But Apple are now making it easier to pick up Mac's hence why the Mac is growing in market share constantly. You say Michael Dell is one of the Richest men in the world, and so would Steve Jobs be, if it wasn't for himself accepting a salary of $1, simply because he loves Apple and creating great new products, unlike people like Michael Dell who have Salaries well over $1million. In the USA, where companies make some of the most money out of computer sales, Apple is the number 1 computer manufacturer in the US, simply because Apple have concentrated on making Mac's easily available in the US. Also Apple has invested in showing people how the Mac works and why it is better than the PC. Which people in the US now realise, hence why the Mac is the most popular computer in the US.

Apple did steal, and so did Microsoft, but Apple stole with the permission from the CEO of Xerox Star. Microsoft stole without any permission, and lied their way into the development of the Macintosh.

Well I use Google Mail, yes, and I have used Yahoo Mail. But I only use Google Mail, not because it's better because some of the new features in Yahoo Mail put it far above the rest, but because services prefer to integrate with Google mail. And people generally don't use Bing simply because it's new and people know Google. I use Google Search again, because i've used it quite a lot and it's more of a habit to use, but I do like Bing.

People won't recognise the difference if Google stopped producing for Apple, as Apple would just implement Bing, which does the same job to be honest, and the company that would really be hit is Google, considering the iPhone is the most popular way people gain access to the internet, Google's share in the Mobile Search would drop dramatically, meaning a drop in advertising revenue.

Apple are preventing people from stealing from them, not technology progressing. Apple spent billions upon billions coming up with multitouch, now say you spent that much, would you like to see people just using you hard work for free and gaining profit from it? Apple needs to get a return on the innovation they create. And the patent office is essentially trying to help companies do this, get a return on the amount they've invested in the industry. Competition will progress more if people think of a way of creating their own technologies that can better Apple's multitouch, like Nokia is trying to develop multitouch for resistive touchscreens, which would bring innovation into the technology space. And they only did this because they didn't want to pay for Apple's Multitouch license agreement.



Okay I agree their were issues with the 27inch, but Apple are sorting them.

I really don't think synchronizing bookmarks matches the synergy of Microsoft or Google. And when it comes to MobileMe, Google offers an identical service for free (rather than £50 a year). Not many know of it but it's there: http://www.google.com/mobile/sync/

However Microsoft's success is not due to it's availability (although it no doubt contributes), it is because of it's value for money. The reason Mac has a small marketshare compared to Microsoft is certainly not because people cannot find Macs in shops. Apple could put their Macs for sale in India and China, the reason they don't is because very few can afford them and they're not practical for business, unlike Windows which is much cheaper and therefore does very well. The likes of Dell and Microsoft, despite their directors and executives making enormous amounts, their companies are still massively successfully, they're not reliant on them pouring money back in. Bill Gates takes lots of money out of Microsoft, yet they're still a success and the real winner from his billions are Charities and the third world.

I do not think multi-touch should be patented never the less, which I blame both Apple and the US patent office for. It's like inventing the screen or the keyboard and claiming no one else can use it. It's something which was bound to happen eventually and is going to be needed by all in the future. They prevent application from really progressing because of how restrictive the App Store is with all it's rules. It doesn't allow apps to complete with it's own services, this means there's no competition to be more innovative, therefore the Apple apps suffer.

[Titch]

Yeah. Someone rated one of the best CEOs in the world is a ruddy fool.

I deem this poll biased because there's a lot of "Microsoft fanboys" here

And there is 2 HUGE MEGA MEGA MEGA, would marry apple fan here. (i wonder who they are???) Everyone likes there own things, you cant say a poll is biased becuase people are giving there opiniond, THATS THE WHOLE POINT IN A POLL.

[marriott0.01]

I really don't think synchronizing bookmarks matches the synergy of Microsoft or Google. And when it comes to MobileMe, Google offers an identical service for free (rather than £50 a year). Not many know of it but it's there: http://www.google.com/mobile/sync/

However Microsoft's success is not due to it's availability (although it no doubt contributes), it is because of it's value for money. The reason Mac has a small marketshare compared to Microsoft is certainly not because people cannot find Macs in shops. Apple could put their Macs for sale in India and China, the reason they don't is because very few can afford them and they're not practical for business, unlike Windows which is much cheaper and therefore does very well. The likes of Dell and Microsoft, despite their directors and executives making enormous amounts, their companies are still massively successfully, they're not reliant on them pouring money back in. Bill Gates takes lots of money out of Microsoft, yet they're still a success and the real winner from his billions are Charities and the third world.

I do not think multi-touch should be patented never the less, which I blame both Apple and the US patent office for. It's like inventing the screen or the keyboard and claiming no one else can use it. It's something which was bound to happen eventually and is going to be needed by all in the future. They prevent application from really progressing because of how restrictive the App Store is with all it's rules. It doesn't allow apps to complete with it's own services, this means there's no competition to be more innovative, therefore the Apple apps suffer.

Apple's MobileMe does cost, but I've used it, and it's a pretty amazing thing. I've heard of Google Mobile Sync, used to use it on my N97 now decided to switch to Ovi Sync because it's more integrated into Nokia phones. I know it may not be as 'synergising' but it doesn't need to be. It isn't like Microsoft offering services, they offer software and hardware, they are very different to the things Microsoft do.

It's not value for money, it's simply price, because the value for money is very low, as it's not very good value for the thing you get out of it. And it's actually more expensive to upgrade from Vista > 7 than it is from Leopard > Snow Leopard. So Apple are not making something that is cheap to start off with, but they're giving you something that'll be reasonably priced to start off with but then it'll be pretty much free to run for life. As you won't need to install expensive software or constantly trying to upgrade the computer or do any other modifications as Apple Computer will always work. And you do find Apple Computers in shops worldwide, they are sold to people such as business owners in India and China they are extremely successful, I don't know the stats, but like America, China is a country who uses a lot of Apple products, likewise with Japan. This means that Apple are growing their presence around the world, and it is beginning to hit the UK, more and more people are getting access to Apple Stores where they can buy an Apple Computer after test driving one, and Apple are gaining market share in the UK at a rapid rate. Likewise in Australia which again is a very Apple country like the US. Apple are trying to conquer places step by step, they are trying to make sure everything works around the consumers and the people in them countries will enjoy Apple products. And Apple very much like to shape their products around the consumer whereas Microsoft has created an operating system that tries to fit as many people from all backgrounds into it. Many company owners, and even Bill Gates himself, use Mac's because they are a more executive and easier to use computer, which most company owner's prefer as they need the job done.

General things are patented all the time, wireless technology such as Wifi in phones and even the 3G connection chips are patented by Nokia as they worked tirelessly on creating that technology, and who knew it was going to be as big as they are? No one. Apple or the Patent office couldn't predict how big they were going to be. Obviously Apple would have hoped it was going to be big because of the amount of effort they put into creating it, but obviously they aren't going to stop patenting something because it is theirs, like if you created a piece of technology at your home, someone saw that technology, saw how it worked and everything and simply just went out and sold it, and made much more profit than you, you'll be annoyed.

Apple restricts its apps yes, but they have reasons, they have very tight rules to keep ALL iPhone and iPod Touch users. Women complained about apps that objectified women, so they had to remove them... They create apps for their iPhone, which they don't want people competing with, such as Safari, it's because they don't need to compete with it... Safari simply just works. I do like the look of Opera, however, and I do think Apple will allow it to slip through as they allowed apps such as Spotify, which rivals the iPhone App Store, through, but Apple's iPhone is INCREDIBLY easy to develop for, and they want good quality apps that better the experience for the end user, not crap that you get in the app store offerings from people like Nokia or even some of the Android Apps...

And there is 2 HUGE MEGA MEGA MEGA, would marry apple fan here. (i wonder who they are???) Everyone likes there own things, you cant say a poll is biased becuase people are giving there opiniond, THATS THE WHOLE POINT IN A POLL.

Titch I'm not a mega Apple fan, I like Apple Products but I like Microsoft products too. I even like Google Products, but I think Apple are right in this case...

[GommeInc]

I'm with Google. Jobs is best described as an idiot with an over-inflated ego. His latest spat with everyone just proves this, especially with his incredibly hilarious iPad release speech - it was so full of fail the idiot should of been shot come sunset to save the world from his idiocy.

Apple haven't brought much actually. They didn't bring the computer to the world. They didn't bring the first MP3 player into the world. They didn't bring the first touch phone into the world. They didn't invent multi-touch (they got it off a partnership). The company should of been let to rot when Microsoft bailed them out - out of all of Microsoft's short-comings, saving Apple was their worst idea. Also, the common business phrase "Someone else would of done it anyway" comes to mind. Computers with colour would of turned up either way. Touchscreens have existed for years, it was a matter of time before a company got there. So all this "Apple brought out the first..." is aload of hoo-haa.

[AgnesIO]

Snow Leopard is just a bloody service pack though.. You had to pay to get a service pack.

Windows 7 and vista are not the same. Leopard and Snow Leopard are.

So in actual fact Apple were being ludicrous.

[marriott0.01]

I'm with Google. Jobs is best described as an idiot with an over-inflated ego. His latest spat with everyone just proves this, especially with his incredibly hilarious iPad release speech - it was so full of fail the idiot should of been shot come sunset to save the world from his idiocy.

Apple haven't brought much actually. They didn't bring the computer to the world. They didn't bring the first MP3 player into the world. They didn't bring the first touch phone into the world. They didn't invent multi-touch (they got it off a partnership). The company should of been let to rot when Microsoft bailed them out - out of all of Microsoft's short-comings, saving Apple was their worst idea. Also, the common business phrase "Someone else would of done it anyway" comes to mind. Computers with colour would of turned up either way. Touchscreens have existed for years, it was a matter of time before a company got there. So all this "Apple brought out the first..." is aload of hoo-haa.

I never actually said they brought out the first touchscreen phone nor the first MP3 player, but they brought out by far the most innovative and by far the best offerings of both.

Also Multitouch was there's with a partnership, partnership always suggest they also had something to do with it, pretty much the same as the awesome Project Natal is their's through a purchase of a smaller company...

Also regarding the iPad, it has it's pro's, why did Apple need to change something that was already popular?

Snow Leopard is just a bloody service pack though.. You had to pay to get a service pack.

Windows 7 and vista are not the same. Leopard and Snow Leopard are.

So in actual fact Apple were being ludicrous.

Snow Leopard improved on so many things that it couldn't even be classed as a service pack. They've reworked a lot of things in Snow Leopard and some of the UI has changed, so it is a completely new OS.

Windows 7 is what Vista should of been, and it is very similar to Vista, the UI and some code was changed, although I have nothing against 7. I've said repeatedly i have issues with no companies, they're all good in their own sense... I'm just saying doesn't Apple have a right to protect its IP, why the attacks on Apple lols?