BNP membership list forced closure

[HotelUser]

Dan: Last time I checked Mr. Griffin is still in denial of the holocaust, he's xenophobic and homophobic. There's also Nick Eriksen, once a senior BNP official who said, "rape is sex - and women enjoy sex," and, "some women are like gongs — they need to be struck regularly". So--and I actually say this quite objectively: If you or anyone else suggests for a second, that the BNP are not racist, or sexist, this person making this statement has a horrible political mindset, and would do much less damage not even voting, much less trying to justify a corrupt point to begin with.

Catzsy: I'm really sorry Cat, I can see why you think Dan's remarks in this thread are sexist (Dan in all honesty you could have worded your point a lot better, maybe elaborated more, as opposed to just basically saying, "woman aren't interested in politics and generally aren't as good because yelling men debate better"). But in all honesty I'm not sure I understand how you can act upon Dan being sexist (when he isn't even intending to), when you yourself are a Habbox Forum Moderator who actively reads the various other sexist posts around the forum (primarily in spam) without speaking up, when those posters are one-hundred percent knowingly saying sexist remarks and jokes. I'm not looking from an argument from either of you here--I honestly think taking up sexism in this thread which doesn't matter, as opposed to addressing it at other parts of Habbox, is useless.

[-:Undertaker:-]

No that's not to bad at all tbf if it is a first time try. I am quite surprised. I have answered this question more than once. If you were worthy of becoming a labour candidate then there should be nothing stopping you but no prospective MP has the right as far as I know to pick and choose their seat. This would apply as much to a woman as to a man. Most decent employment requires you to eb 'mobile' these days and move if they want you to. We are really going around in circles here as I have already stated that in principle I agree with all women short lists until there is a fairer representation of numbers in parliament. There is nothing that a man can do that a woman cannot do as an MP - there is no difference in brain power. You have only taken about 3 examples and Diane Abbott is most definitely not namby pamby - she is a left wing feminist that I don't admire. This is a list of all the woman that have held positions of power since 1997 and I don't think that you can generalise and say their 'feminine' sides let them down and politics isn't a women's thing.

I haven't said for once that women who are feminine do not succeed, however it does pander them hence why their are more men. Infact women on that list such as Claire Short I admire greatly although she also has a more masculine side, as does the dreaded Harriett Harman. So I shall make it very clear; I have not for once said that women are less clever, less capable - I have just given you reasons why their are more men in politics than women with the two simple reasons being; vocal performances and interest.

I did take three examples, and have you not noticed how it is the most vocally capable leaders who are remembered. John Major - most children will not even of heard of him while Margaret Thatcher on the other hand they have. The same for Queen Elizabeth I compared with say for instance King Richard III. The most vocal are often the most capable, the same goes for Farage over Pearson and Blair over Brown - Farage and Blair have the ability to let their speech flow, the other two struggle especially Brown. Womans voices are naturally lower and less rough, thus will struggle to get the message across in a rowdy and noisy Houses of Parliament.

As for me not standing; yes you are barring me, because of the gender I was born from standing in an internal election because of a factor I could not and cannot control. If I or the BNP for a better example proposed banning all black people from the UK on the factor of 'we want to keep Britain white' how would you react? - I dont think you would be too pleased nor would the majority of people and I am not all that pleased with you basically telling me as a male that I should not be able to stand in certain consituencys because of my gender.

If a male MP proposed banning all women standing in a seat there would be instant uproar.

Dan: Last time I checked Mr. Griffin is still in denial of the holocaust, he's xenophobic and homophobic. There's also Nick Eriksen, once a senior BNP official who said, "rape is sex - and women enjoy sex," and, "some women are like gongs — they need to be struck regularly". So--and I actually say this quite objectively: If you or anyone else suggests for a second, that the BNP are not racist, or sexist, this person making this statement has a horrible political mindset, and would do much less damage not even voting, much less trying to justify a corrupt point to begin with.

Catzsy: I'm really sorry Cat, I can see why you think Dan's remarks in this thread are sexist (Dan in all honesty you could have worded your point a lot better, maybe elaborated more, as opposed to just basically saying, "woman aren't interested in politics and generally aren't as good because yelling men debate better"). But in all honesty I'm not sure I understand how you can act upon Dan being sexist (when he isn't even intending to), when you yourself are a Habbox Forum Moderator who actively reads the various other sexist posts around the forum (primarily in spam) without speaking up, when those posters are one-hundred percent knowingly saying sexist remarks and jokes. I'm not looking from an argument from either of you here--I honestly think taking up sexism in this thread which doesn't matter, as opposed to addressing it at other parts of Habbox, is useless.

I am not denying the BNP are racist, sexist or homophobic and I would challenge you to find me an example doing so. I am pointing out that while Rosie and others such as yourself are very keen to label the BNP racist and so forth, how can you do so when your own parties (the Lib/Lab/Con three) do exactely the same, just they dont discriminate against the black man/asian man, they discriminate against the white man and males. Do not try and melt me in with the BNP because I have been arguing page after page that you are all as bad as eachother.

The BNP, Labour and the Conservatives all judge on race. What makes the Labour Party and Conservative Party so much more morally superior?

[Catzsy]

I haven't said for once that women who are feminine do not succeed, however it does pander them hence why their are more men. Infact women on that list such as Claire Short I admire greatly although she also has a more masculine side, as does the dreaded Harriett Harman. So I shall make it very clear; I have not for once said that women are less clever, less capable - I have just given you reasons why their are more men in politics than women with the two simple reasons being; vocal performances and interest.

I did take three examples, and have you not noticed how it is the most vocally capable leaders who are remembered. John Major - most children will not even of heard of him while Margaret Thatcher on the other hand they have. The same for Queen Elizabeth I compared with say for instance King Richard III. The most vocal are often the most capable, the same goes for Farage over Pearson and Blair over Brown - Farage and Blair have the ability to let their speech flow, the other two struggle especially Brown. Womans voices are naturally lower and less rough, thus will struggle to get the message across in a rowdy and noisy Houses of Parliament.

As for me not standing; yes you are barring me, because of the gender I was born from standing in an internal election because of a factor I could not and cannot control. If I or the BNP for a better example proposed banning all black people from the UK on the factor of 'we want to keep Britain white' how would you react? - I dont think you would be too pleased nor would the majority of people and I am not all that pleased with you basically telling me as a male that I should not be able to stand in certain consituencys because of my gender.
If a male MP proposed banning all women standing in a seat there would be instant uproar.



I am not denying the BNP are racist, sexist or homophobic and I would challenge you to find me an example doing so. I am pointing out that while Rosie and others such as yourself are very keen to label the BNP racist and so forth, how can you do so when your own parties (the Lib/Lab/Con three) do exactely the same, just they dont discriminate against the black man/asian man, they discriminate against the white man and males. Do not try and melt me in with the BNP because I have been arguing page after page that you are all as bad as eachother.

The BNP, Labour and the Conservatives all judge on race. What makes the Labour Party and Conservative Party so much morally superior?

I certainly do not label you as having anything to do with the BNP or supporting them I haven't said that anywhere. Women are not a race, they are a gender. End of.
If you can't see that the BNP are no different to the main political parties then you can't see it. Nominations for parliamentary selection do not work that way. Nobody in this world can expect to have their local constiuency handed to them on a plate. In any event there have only been about 50 shortlists altogether in the 1997 and 2005 elections which is nothing compared with the amount of constuencies there are so I really don't know what you are moaning about. If there there were not enough men to fairly represent society in parliament then I wouldn't complain about all men shortlists. Having said that most of them are

I have just given you reasons why their are more men in politics than women with the two simple reasons being; vocal performances and interest.

This is complete nonsense not backed up by anything - it is just a stereotypical view no different to all teenagers who wear hoodies must be muggers. Now lets agree to disagree as Jrh2002 has suggested. Thanks =]

[-:Undertaker:-]

I certainly do not label you as having anything to do with the BNP or supporting them I haven't said that anywhere. Women are not a race, they are a gender. End of. If you can't see that the BNP are no different to the main political parties then you can't see it. Nominations for parliamentary selection do not work that way. Nobody in this world can expect to have their local constiuency handed to them on a plate. In any event there have only been about 50 shortlists altogether in the 1997 and 2005 elections which is nothing compared with the amount of constuencies there are so I really don't know what you are moaning about. If there there were not enough men to fairly represent society in parliament then I wouldn't complain about all men shortlists. Having said that most of them are This is complete nonsense not backed up by anything - it is just a stereotypical view no different to all teenagers who wear hoodies must be muggers. Now lets agree to disagree as Jrh2002 has suggested. Thanks =]

Why do you not get the simple fact that if you ban me from standing as my local Labour candidate because of the colour of my skin or because of the fact I am a man and not a woman then that is discriminating me because of my gender/race and thus is racist and sexist. The British National Party judge people on race - are they racist? - if so by saying they are then you are also having to admit that the Labour Party and Conservative Party are by the very least sexist.

You cannot have one rule for yourselves and another for the BNP.

[Catzsy]

Why do you not get the simple fact that if you ban me from standing as my local Labour candidate because of the colour of my skin or because of the fact I am a man and not a woman then that is discriminating me because of my gender/race and thus is racist and sexist. The British National Party judge people on race - are they racist? - if so by saying they are then you are also having to admit that the Labour Party and Conservative Party are by the very least sexist.

You cannot have one rule for yourselves and another for the BNP.

Again for about the fourth time - I have said nowhere that there should be black shortlists Why can't you take a hint? i.e.

Now lets agree to disagree as Jrh2002 has suggested. Thanks =]

You can believe what you want of me, of the main political parties, that you are correct all the time but I haven't got to agree with you so please leave it that. Thanks =]

[-:Undertaker:-]

Again for about the fourth time - I have said nowhere that there should be black shortlists Why can't you take a hint? i.e.
You can believe what you want of me, of the main political parties, that you are correct all the time but I haven't got to agree with you so please leave it that. Thanks =]

You have said very clearly that you believe in shortlists restricting people to create a more 'diverse and fair parliament' so surely that includes having ethnic candidate shortlists only. So I shall ask again; you tell me why as a man I should be barred from standing as my local Labour candidate because of the gender I was born? - explain that to me. Also tell me why you think it is racist for the British National Party to ban black people from becoming members of the party yet it is fine for the main parties (Labour, Conservatives and Liberal Democrats) to ban white people/males from candidate shortlists?

I'm not saying i'm correct, i'm simply asking you to tell me why the Labour Party is any different to the BNP in these matters and so far you have failed time and time again to reply to that simple question.

[Catzsy]

You have said very clearly that you believe in shortlists restricting people to create a more 'diverse and fair parliament' so surely that includes having ethnic candidate shortlists only. So I shall ask again; you tell me why as a man I should be barred from standing as my local Labour candidate because of the gender I was born? - explain that to me. Also tell me why you think it is racist for the British National Party to ban black people from becoming members of the party yet it is fine for the main parties (Labour, Conservatives and Liberal Democrats) to ban white people/males from candidate shortlists?


I'm not saying i'm correct, i'm simply asking you to tell me why the Labour Party is any different to the BNP in these matters and so far you have failed time and time again to reply to that simple question.

Okay I have asked you twice to agree to disagree in the last two posts. You persist in asking me questions that I have already answered. Please check the thread. You may not like the answers but I have answered this question about 3/4 times. To sum up you think I am sexist, racist (along with the main political parties) and a markist who doesn't live in the real world - you are entitled to your opinion which I respect. I think that you have made some sexist comments in the thread and that your views are very old fashioned and I am entitled to my opinion. I would be greatful if therefore you would agree to disagree as this is now started to feel like harrassment. Thanks =]

[-:Undertaker:-]

Okay I have asked you twice to agree to disagree in the last two posts. You persist in asking me questions that I have already answered. Please check the thread. You may not like the answers but I have answered this question about 3/4 times. To sum up you think I am sexist, racist (along with the main political parties) and a markist who doesn't live in the real world - you are entitled to your opinion which I respect. I think that you have made some sexist comments in the thread and that your views are very old fashioned and I am entitled to my opinion. I would be greatful if therefore you would agree to disagree as this is now started to feel like harrassment. Thanks =]

And I have asked you time and time again to tell me why as a male I should not be allowed to stand as my local Labour candidate. I have still not had an answer to why, because of my gender which I did not choose, that I should not be allowed to stand. Call the BNP racist, sexist and all the other words under the sun you like but the fact is that both your own party and the BNP discriminate on race and sex, so for a Labour supporter or a Conservative suporter at that to call the BNP racist or sexist for that matter is at the very least a little hypocritical. Next time before you attend an anti-BNP rally, call the BNP racist or even call me a sexist on this forum, just please look at yourself and your party before you make any comments.

If I called for black people to be banned from the buses, i'm sure you wouldnt just tell me that i'm 'entitled to my opinion'.

[Catzsy]

And I have asked you time and time again to tell me why as a male I should not be allowed to stand as my local Labour candidate. I have still not had an answer to why, because of my gender which I did not choose, that I should not be allowed to stand. Call the BNP racist, sexist and all the other words under the sun you like but the fact is that both your own party and the BNP discriminate on race and sex, so for a Labour supporter or a Conservative suporter at that to call the BNP racist or sexist for that matter is at the very least a little hypocritical. Next time before you attend an anti-BNP rally, call the BNP racist or even call me a sexist on this forum, just please look at yourself and your party before you make any comments.

If I called for black people to be banned from the buses, i'm sure you wouldnt just tell me that i'm 'entitled to my opinion'.

These are answers that I have given to your question about standing at an election and there are more that I cba to look for:
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...10#post6360610

You cannot see the point between being free to join a party and having a shortlist. There is a great deal of difference. It is nothing to do with discrimination against white people as historically parliament has been made up of almost all white males which is not representative of our society. Shortlists are more commonly for females anyway so why you keep just mentioning 'black' people I don't know as it is more common for women to be on the shortlist. As I said before there is no bar to membership of the parties/associations which is the actual issue here

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...41#post6364941

You need to put things into perspective a bit here. All women short lists, not that there are many, are legal and therefore not racist as that is illegal. Men, women of all age, creeds races who want to stand for parliament can put themselves forward . There is no bar. If you were applying for a job nobody can guarantee it for your local area - it is no different in politics. If anybody is that keen they will go for a constituency that is free.

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...58#post6366358

There is nothing stopping anybody as I have said before in this thread putting themselves forward for election in any consituency they choose and if there is another person selected they can stand as an independent if they are so parochial that it has to be their home town.

The sexual discrimination act was passed by MPs who were in the majority white males - just the category that you complain being discriminated against so at least they can see a point to it even if you can't. For hundreds of years the males of the country took up all positions of any power and that act was passed to redress the balance. It is now the 21st century where women have an equal place in society and deserve some sort of equal representation in our parliament which has been denied to them for centuries. It was voted in by a majority of men until 2030. In the normal workplace I would agree with you it should be the best man or woman for the post.

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthrea...15#post6366415

I say again there are not 'black' shortlists. You seem to think it is fair that because of history when women were denied entry to the House of Commons because of discrimination of previous generations then they should not be given the chance to 'catch up' a bit? If a male is denied selection from your local constituency because of an all women shortlist then he is not much of a man to 'throw his toys out of the pram' and shout 'discrimination' and quite frankly I am sure that any man wishing to stand for election would understand the reason for it and not have such superficial, narrow minded views. There are plenty of constituencys in the UK to stand for election and there is always the opportunity if they feel they are the 'best man for the job' to enter as an independent.

If you asked for black people to be banned on the buses - yes I would say you are entitled to your opinion but I would not agree with. If I want to attend a anti BNP Rally that is up to me but that does not make me a sexist racist marxist as you seem to think. It is not my fault you don't like my answers NOW - WILL YOU PLEASE LEAVE ME ALONE.