Tuition Fees: Poorest students will get up to two years FREE tuition!

[Conservative,]

Answer my questions Robbie. I don't need a lesson in Maths.

I don't know if I'm totally honest. They may owe money in taxes, and I'd be surprised if the Government didn't tighten on tax avoidance & being tougher on benefit frauds & people claiming job-seekers allowance when they could've had jobs and not taken them. But it's the choice that's been taken, and in reality, people aren't complaining about that. They're complaining about people having to pay more. But they would know this is not the case if they did the maths

[AgnesIO]

Oh how kind of the government.

Giving the poorest students free tuition. THOSE OF US WITH MORE MONEY THAN OTHERS ARE NOT MULTI BILLIONAIRES. We STILL have to pay for the fees, we STILL get loans out to pay for it. The government is covering up a major issue with this. Hardly anyone will get this tuition - and guess what? If you don't count as one of the 'poorest' students, you will be paying for the 'poor' students to go to university.

If they are going to put fees up, why not charge EVERYONE the same - instead of making some people pay for some others to go to university.

[Catzsy]

I don't know if I'm totally honest. They may owe money in taxes, and I'd be surprised if the Government didn't tighten on tax avoidance & being tougher on benefit frauds & people claiming job-seekers allowance when they could've had jobs and not taken them. But it's the choice that's been taken, and in reality, people aren't complaining about that. They're complaining about people having to pay more. But they would know this is not the case if they did the maths

The amount owed by benefit fraud is 1b. The amount owed by tax avoiding companies is 70b.
It does not take a rocket scientist to work out which they don't want to tackle and there is nothing so far to suggest they are even going to try considering they are closing some of the fraud offices down in the Inland Revenue. I don't complain about paying £3,600 odd for tuition fees which will work out to about 11/12k debt. Thing is you seem to think students would be better off under the new system. How is owing 40/50k better than owing about 15k? It still has to be paid probably for the rest of their working lives whereas presently it could be paid off in 10 years. Also it accrues interest so obviously that will be a lot more on a larger sum. When somebody goes for a mortgage the bank/building society have to take into account how much debt a person has so this policy has a double edged sword to it.

[FlyingJesus]

They won't be helping. Students will be coming out of University with a life time of debt because of the new system. Just because you have the degree doesn't mean you'll get a well paid job. The new system is designed to put off poorer students and replace them with future David Cameron's. The Government are trying to implement the class system again whereby the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The term "look after your own" is put into play by the poor excuse of a Government.

You call it a lifetime of debt yet I quite clearly explained that if someone was sufficiently moved to do so they could even pay it all back in 3 years without having to live in any kind of squalor once they're earning over the threshold for repayments to start. Most would choose to pay it back over a longer period as it would be even easier of course, but again they would be earning a lot more so it isn't an issue. A degree doesn't mean a well paid job, you're right, but until you have a well paid job you're not paying back the loan at all - the only people who will be put off are people who cannot do the maths and work out that frankly there's a pretty decent likelihood of never having to pay the loan back at all

And he's only in the coalition because he lied to the people. These are the people who got him in and now he's turned on them. The people are turning on him and he knows he's put himself in his own political coffin. The man is nothing more than a liar.

I agree with your synopsis of Clegg's rise to power, but that has nothing to do with what the government has said as was suggested

All the evidence you need is sitting in Parliament. They lied to us, what's stopping them lying again? We have to fight back, they're nothing more than liars who we simply can't trust again. How can we believe them that they'll need special permission to charge 9K when they've already lied to us in a big way?

That's not evidence, that supposition and distrust - however valid your reasons for such feelings may be, it does not amount to evidence and you absolutely cannot claim that the entire policy is somehow radically different to the paper on which it was signed. There is a huge difference between a man not being able to keep his promises because he doesn't fight hard enough for them and an entire government ignoring law and policy

Were you there or watching the BBC which is funded by Government?

Neither, I heard it from the student unions and the peaceful protesters who believe you to be an embarrassment

You go one way expecting to be let out, they then tell you to go back to where you came from. This was where it was kicking off initially. So they expect you to go back there and get hit by the police. People didn't want to do that so stayed, they then charged. A flare was thrown at the police to stop them beating a woman who fell on the floor and evidently injured so couldn't go back. They're utter filth. Check the news today and you'll see one stand out story without even looking into much detail.

As I said, yes it would be annoying to be in such a situation but it's down to you complying or not complying with police orders. You can't expect to have a protest and just get your way with every movement you make

We didn't break the line

The students simply didn't want to follow the intended route

Is that a fact?

Your type will be the ones who will only moan when it affects them.

It does affect me - I'm now planning to actually go to uni at some point because of how cheap/free I can make it in the long run

[Conservative,]

The amount owed by benefit fraud is 1b. The amount owed by tax avoiding companies is 70b.
It does not take a rocket scientist to work out which they don't want to tackle and there is nothing so far to suggest they are even going to try considering they are closing some of the fraud offices down in the Inland Revenue. I don't complain about paying £3,600 odd for tuition fees which will work out to about 11/12k debt. Thing is you seem to think students would be better off under the new system. How is owing 40/50k better than owing about 15k? It still has to be paid probably for the rest of their working lives whereas presently it could be paid off in 10 years. Also it accrues interest so obviously that will be a lot more on a larger sum. When somebody goes for a mortgage the bank/building society have to take into account how much debt a person has so this policy has a double edged sword to it.

I've said before.

It only gets interest if you're owning over a certain amount (something like 30k+) and I also have said it may be more debt, but you're also getting MORE money back. As I have showed you - it gives you £3k MORE than the current system in which to pay off the debts. It may be more debt, but it's also more money back to you. £15k isn't a lot to live on when you're paying debts, food, mortgage ect. £21k, despite only being £6k more...is a lot more comfortable.

I am not saying the government shouldn't chase up on the tax avoidance but that's for a different discussion in which we would agree they need to do that.

And you keep saying £15k debt as opposed to £40-50k debt yet you are not giving any sort of reason as to why a complete and absolute maximum - reserved only for the best Uni's who are willing to give huge grants - of £27k is jumping to £50k? And £11-12k only going to £15k.

The maximum debt I expect to be in when I hopefully get into & leave Cambridge (all assuming I do) is £30k. Then i can go into the working world and get a job. If it pays less than £21k, the debt is basically non-existent. If I get a job that pays more, I then by that time have enough money to know I can pay that off reasonably in 10 years - £3k per year leaving me with £18k (or more) to spend on living & luxuries. If I'm earning 30k+ (or whatever it is) and it's earning interest (at the current rate of 1.2%) I'd be able to pay it off in 6-7 years - £5k per year leaving me 25k to spend on living/luxuries.

If I went now my family would have to fork out £15k+ AND money for living. WITH interest if we couldn't pay it upfront. So really...I think students win.

[Catzsy]

I've said before.

It only gets interest if you're owning over a certain amount (something like 30k+) and I also have said it may be more debt, but you're also getting MORE money back. As I have showed you - it gives you £3k MORE than the current system in which to pay off the debts. It may be more debt, but it's also more money back to you. £15k isn't a lot to live on when you're paying debts, food, mortgage ect. £21k, despite only being £6k more...is a lot more comfortable.

I am not saying the government shouldn't chase up on the tax avoidance but that's for a different discussion in which we would agree they need to do that.

And you keep saying £15k debt as opposed to £40-50k debt yet you are not giving any sort of reason as to why a complete and absolute maximum - reserved only for the best Uni's who are willing to give huge grants - of £27k is jumping to £50k? And £11-12k only going to £15k.

The maximum debt I expect to be in when I hopefully get into & leave Cambridge (all assuming I do) is £30k. Then i can go into the working world and get a job. If it pays less than £21k, the debt is basically non-existent. If I get a job that pays more, I then by that time have enough money to know I can pay that off reasonably in 10 years - £3k per year leaving me with £18k (or more) to spend on living & luxuries. If I'm earning 30k+ (or whatever it is) and it's earning interest (at the current rate of 1.2%) I'd be able to pay it off in 6-7 years - £5k per year leaving me 25k to spend on living/luxuries.

If I went now my family would have to fork out £15k+ AND money for living. WITH interest if we couldn't pay it upfront. So really...I think students win.

Well you are wrong about the interest - all the loan attracts it. Also they are switching to RPI and it is estimated they will rise to 4.4 % pretty quickly. You are lucky to have a family who could fork out 15k for you. Most famililies could not afford to and so they would have to borrow the living expenses as well. so that raises it to about 40/ 50k. As far as a job goes - most student's do have them but obviously you are not expecting them to work full-time whilst studying for a degree are you? Part time work and what they can borrow for living expenses leaves them pretty much on the breadline as it is. We will have to agree to disagree on this one because I believe we should be investing in the future of this country by supporting those who undoubtably will paying more tax in the future than those who don't go to University.

[FlyingJesus]

Rosie are you suggesting then that the living costs of being a student (ie: the money not concerned with tuition fees) is over and around 20k? I don't know how much living as a student costs but that doesn't add up right with the other figures you're stating as 6k x 3 = 18k, so taking it to 40k adds on 22k in these expenses, in which case I can't work out where you're getting 15k as a figure for the total current debt for uni leavers

[Spuds]

The Government lie and they're going to find out in 2011 that they can't do it anymore. The workers unions will be hitting the streets which will bring down cities when subways, buses etc stop and they'll be uniting with students. #solidarity

[Catzsy]

Rosie are you suggesting then that the living costs of being a student (ie: the money not concerned with tuition fees) is over and around 20k? I don't know how much living as a student costs but that doesn't add up right with the other figures you're stating as 6k x 3 = 18k, so taking it to 40k adds on 22k in these expenses, in which case I can't work out where you're getting 15k as a figure for the total current debt for uni leavers

Because at the moment I get a maintenance grant + maintenance loan which will all be gone under the new system.

[-:Undertaker:-]

The Government lie and they're going to find out in 2011 that they can't do it anymore. The workers unions will be hitting the streets which will bring down cities when subways, buses etc stop and they'll be uniting with students. #solidarity

Oh yes the Unions, the Unions who do the dirty work of the Labour Party. Funny how we never had this madness back in 2001 when Labour did more or less the exact same thing, but then I guess thats just the thuggish mentality of the left in general which we saw in the 1980s.

I'm not sure what your political stance is yourself, but you should be aware that half the people complaining on this forum are only complaining because its the Conservatives/Liberal Democrats doing this, as opposed to the Labour Party - which, again, did more or less the same thing back in 2001 after promising not to before the General Election yet they all still think Labour are somehow more trustworthy and just when it comes to this.

Thus proving they are so deep into party politics, they don't actually care about the issue at hand or the country itself.