Transgender woman wants to fight in women's MMA

[FlyingJesus]

So was Michael Jackson black or white?

Black with vitiligo, but race and gender aren't comparable anyway

[Adam]

Black with vitiligo, but race and gender aren't comparable anyway

Men, as a gender, are stronger/more powerful than woman and that's why IN THIS CASE she shouldn't be allowed to compete. It's quite simple. I can't be arsed getting into a debate because it'll end up not about this subject and more the overall view on transgender which isn't what this particular thread is about.

[FlyingJesus]

Generalisations have no place in debates - clearly not all men are stronger than all women, and if having certain masculine features is your issue then there are a hell of a lot of sportswomen who apparently have no place in female competitions

[Adam]

Generalisations have no place in debates - clearly not all men are stronger than all women, and if having certain masculine features is your issue then there are a hell of a lot of sportswomen who apparently have no place in female competitions

In general. Of course a woman can be stronger than a man, but genetics show us males are stronger than females. That's not sexism or anything, that's scientific fact. Therefore it's not fair on her women opponents.

Call me a bigot or whatver because insults will get you far but: born with a ****, you're a man. If certain psychological issues mean you think you're a woman, you can think it, doesn't change the fact you are a man.

</apparent bigotry>

[FlyingJesus]

I didn't call you a bigot to insult you I called you a bigot because you have bigoted views, ie: you'll firmly believe in certain things despite any argument or proof to the contrary, with no actual backing other than "because". You accepted that women are not by necessity weaker than men, and then totally ignored that point in favour of your original beliefs - that's bigotry. Either not all men are stronger than all women, or they are, you can't claim to agree with both but only support one side of it.

And if you want things to be fair in terms of strength then refer to my second post where I pointed out how absurd it is to shout about physical equality in a competitive field

[The Don]

I'm all for equality and fairness, but I strongly disagree with this. This video will explain why I disagree. EDIT: I don't agree with his opinion on the psychology behind it, simply on why there are physical advantages.

Warning: Contains inappropriate content Hide

[FlyingJesus]

Guy loses all credibility when he says that Fallon is likely to be using male hormones in her training - clearly knows nothing about how the transition from male to female works or how fragile that process can be, and no-one committed to such a procedure would be taking any sort of male hormone since the entire point is to get those levels lowered. That he then goes on to say that MTF trans people probably have resentment towards women (because obviously we all want to be what we hate...) is just hateful and completely goes against his claim that he's for equality. As you get further and further into the video he shows himself up as more and more of a disgusting person who knows nothing about what he's talking about on this issue.

Was wary from the very start considering that he took such pains to try to tell us how much he's for equal opportunities, people who make disclaimers like that tend to be far more damaging than those who blast outright hatred because they make it look like they're trying to help when really they're just as ignorant as anyone else who hasn't been properly involved with the topics they try talking about. He also seems to think that sex changes are done just for the hell of it or as a tool to win medals...

[The Don]

Whilst he does make some redundant points you can't dispute his argument about there being a genetic advantage to transgender athletes. Regardless of what hormones they take, they are still going to have a superior reach,greater bone density, bigger hands (all the parts which were mentioned in the video, which you also failed to address). Your argument against this in a different post (due to it being a competitive sport there are obviously going to be some natural advantages to some of the fighters) is unfair as those physical traits which differ between females isn't nearly as varied as the physical differences between males and females.

[Inseriousity.]

But there's no such thing as a level playing field in sports. Someone is going to be better than you. That's competition. This reminds me of when that female athlete wiped the floor with her opponents and instead of 'well done' it was all 'is she a man? is she taking drugs?' I'm pretty sure that was proven false (although correct me if I'm wrong as I didn't follow the story religiously). It's likely then that she was born with certain physical advantages and boosted by a lot of training meant she won. I see no difference between that story then and this one other than the fact she used to be a man.

[mrwoooooooo]

But there's no such thing as a level playing field in sports. Someone is going to be better than you. That's competition. This reminds me of when that female athlete wiped the floor with her opponents and instead of 'well done' it was all 'is she a man? is she taking drugs?' I'm pretty sure that was proven false (although correct me if I'm wrong as I didn't follow the story religiously). It's likely then that she was born with certain physical advantages and boosted by a lot of training meant she won. I see no difference between that story then and this one other than the fact she used to be a man.

Caster semenya, she was found to have a higher testosterone count than the average e female athlete (hence her masculine looks /build)

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