Habbox excuses

[---MAD---]

In my opinion, you cannot trust someone just from their rep or post count. Rep can be bought so it pretty much destroys the whole point of the system. I am not sure why Habbox even decided to offer people to be able to purchase rep years ago, my guess is it was a popular request by VIP members ages ago.

Admins/staff are leaving mainly because of the new school term. This is the normal cycle of staff at Habbox and usually most Habbo fansites but more Habbox so because it has more staff than most fansites I think.

Staff usually resign at new school term and then before exams in June or whatever, thats how it usually goes every year.

I am not really sure what you are asking us to do here. Nvrspk4 and joshuar are trying their best to sort the reputation system out but they don't seem to be getting any credit for the extra work they are putting in to try and improve the system as much as possible for everyone to enjoy using .

[today]

In my opinion, you cannot trust someone just from their rep or post count. Rep can be bought so it pretty much destroys the whole point of the system. I am not sure why Habbox even decided to offer people to be able to purchase rep years ago, my guess is it was a popular request by VIP members ages ago.

Get rid of it tbh [:

[LeftForDead]

Was his choice to debate back about it. All he could of said was thank you for this. We will discuss this upon the managers and get back to you.

Thought you wanted them to discuss it with users?:s

[Neversoft]

So can I have my reputation that was unfairly removed back now please.

Sure you can. You can have back the reputation that was unfairly removed. Therefore your reputation will stay as is. Thanks

That was rather unnecessary. :S

[Lycan]

There are still clues about for who has bought rep,

A user whos signed up in the last 4 months with alot of bars and high rep power has bought it..
chances are the user will remain a VIP (because well if they can afford to spend money on rep and can afford to just keep renewing)

And i'm pretty sure rep only kicked in last year as i remember when you coudn't buy rep and i've only been registered for 2 years.

And tbh the same is true about post counts, someone who has a high postcount over a short period of time normally means spammed. while a slower continous post over several years is more trusted.

But thats only how i trust people, sadly i normally look at member with a high post count an rep count more then VIPs.


not sure what that has to o with the thread in its current state, but its nice to see that the thread is still drawing conversation and debate over the problems or feeligs of the members around staff and reputation, even if Danny (Pycan) appears to yell his views rather then use his indoor voice

[Cixso]

I

Oh yes indeed it is usually saying that people have a life outside of Habbox with lots of

Thing is does everyone pitch in together? Does Mr. Mad do any himself when everybody is under pressure. Quite honestly you have taken an inordinant amount of time with this thread. Rep was behind - a pm would have been fine.
So who is wasting the valuable time of Nvrspk4 here making a complete mountain out of a molehill? Instead of doing the rep he has to reply to you and if he didn't you would want to know why.

He can't win in this situation and doesn't a lot of support in this thread from people he should have.

You won't find a harder more committed member of the Habbox staff anywhere and if you are looking for a reason why admin/staff are leaving which puts him under even more pressure you are looking in the wrong direction.

There are still clues about for who has bought rep,

A user whos signed up in the last 4 months with alot of bars and high rep power has bought it..
chances are the user will remain a VIP (because well if they can afford to spend money on rep and can afford to just keep renewing)

And i'm pretty sure rep only kicked in last year as i remember when you coudn't buy rep and i've only been registered for 2 years.

And tbh the same is true about post counts, someone who has a high postcount over a short period of time normally means spammed. while a slower continous post over several years is more trusted.

But thats only how i trust people, sadly i normally look at member with a high post count an rep count more then VIPs.


not sure what that has to o with the thread in its current state, but its nice to see that the thread is still drawing conversation and debate over the problems or feeligs of the members around staff and reputation, even if Danny (Pycan) appears to yell his views rather then use his indoor voice

I'm not going to reply to this thread any longer. My views have been made and it's now up to the staff to do what they want with them.

[Lycan]

In awnser to Nvrs earlier post, i am indeed Male, and i do respect his long detailed responses to each of the problems or queries i have posted. although i'm not sure i like catzys responses to Pycan, Pycan does have very valid points he is just unable to get them across in a post without sounding aggressive or confrontational. although this forum has only a small tollerance for such things , might be nice if one of the admins such as Nvr had a private discussion/debate with Pycan to solve all the queries and problems he has rather then an uncontrolable thread where other users may post to stir danny up or may make pointless remarks to defend managment and other members against clear problems.

There is oviously a problem here with some staff , Infractions and Reputation perhaps its time for big steps to be taken when it comes to the rules on giving infractions and the exchange and purchase of reputation.

I understand that reputation brings in a small amount of money on large bills to pay to keep such a popular forum running and that just because its unpopular and turns a reputation system into a 'who has the most money and can buy respect' system, but perhaps it should be removed, Mad has already spoken out against it, i'm sure Nvr would agree... perhaps a general forum vote is in order?

and in the sake of Infractions, getting an infraction for repping someone or -repping someone shoudn't be the case.... surely the idea of loosing hard earned or alot of rep that the user feels proud of building over many months and years perhaps the infractions and threats of banning should be laxed because someone repped there friend with no reason, i've talked to several people over the last few days who have recieved rude or abusive rep and won't report it incase they loose rep they may not deem to be pointless the managment do. i've started giving out alot of -rep over the last few days because its easier to think of a reason to -rep a post then to +rep it .. and ether way i like to give out rep each day so if the same person makes me laugh i can rep them again!

[nvrspk4]

So why aren't mine?

Which ones specifically?

That's why im saying you need to take a risk.

What risk?

Okay then, as you wish. I'll +rep everybody that you took away and find a good post then?

-Shrug- Go for it. As long as its within the rules, its not a problem.

Urgh! Read all the thread again!

Sorry no, I'd rather not read 15 pages again just for a single point that I don't even know is there

Was it LeftForDead that reported it? I bet it was. I'll report something of his after this.

We, or at least I, do not say anything about people who report things. And that's not to say that it *is* him, however you might have a list of three people you know it has to be for whatever reason, and it may narrow that list down

This is where laziness comes then?

There were 370 new threads and over 3500 new posts today. Its not laziness, its an impossible feat to check every one of those. We do look over the threads, but our resources are limited, like it or not we have to mostly depend on post reports.

Blad3r - Name change.

All posts with that name change

What do you mean?

Perhaps it had no merit.

What on earth is held in the water? Then re say that paragraph because I never understood one thing.

Switch held water with is / was valid. It should make sense then.

Read the whole thing then.

:rolleyes: Sorry I'm not going to read an entire thread for something that isn't there.

No water means? (Is this just an American thing or what?)

It basically means its invalid. I dunno, maybe it is an American saying :S Literally, by not holding water, it means that the thing is sort of insubstantial, IE: it isn't there, therefore it can't hold water.

That made me lol. It obviously is an issue. Obviously.

How is it obviously an issue when 3-5 people have posted in support, and its against the rules?

Read the thread from the beginning.

No offense my friend, but I'm not going to read through the thread again and again, simply to try and find points that you made. Since you made the accusation, you have the burden of proof. If you can't show me it, how can I believe it?

I am guessing that is for the reputation? Now what about the other problems?

All the other problems stem from reputations. The infractions - for reputation. Laziness - because we supposedly don't check reputation and/or don't check all 350 threads / 3500 posts. etc. etc.

I made the report via to MAD, and the contact us link at the bottom of the page. The complain states every quoted bit that I thought was "unnecessarily" done by you. *Is still waiting for a reply*

Well perhaps they felt that the complaint was not valid. The person who did emails is no longer with us. However, its also important to remember that at one point we had no email person, so when Tomlegend took over, the 2,000 emails in the inbox were deleted.

Do you still even have that private complaint I sent you via email?

It states everything in that too.

I wouldn't know, I don't check it After a while, our filters do a cleanup of things over X days old though.

Which I thanked you for. Doesn't mean I still like you? You are doing your "job". My opinion in you does not change.

So now you agree that I'm not lazy and do do my job?

Complaints here. W are not talking about "good" ideas.

If you make a complaint, suggest a fix? Then if its decided that it is an issue, the fix may be implemented.

i love nvrspk4 when he does essays =D

I ove3: you too.

Of course I care about rep...

Big factor of trust...

Unfortunately, the reputation system is no longer about trust, its more about "Who has more friends...or more money...or more rep power."

Was his choice to debate back about it. All he could of said was thank you for this. We will discuss this upon the managers and get back to you.

If we did, you would have never heard from us again. Almost guaranteed. If we didn't actually unearth the issues behind it, we would have nothing to work on, if we decide it was an issue. If we get an idea even, we may say, good idea, I see no reason why this can't happen. It probably won't happen. But if we say, Good idea, and go into the logistics of it, and some proposals for further discussion, it means we may try and do something. Its the same thing here. Sure I could've said "I'll look into it" but 9/10 I wouldn't've done anything then. I debate in here to give the members a *chance* at getting what they want done. Or if they can't I debate so that they know why, and then they can consider these factors in the future. I don't debate *just* to be adversarial. Anyone who wrote this much just to dissent would be, well...:eusa_wall

I can, opensourcehost. Why are admins/staff are leaving? I'm looking in the wrong direction? What are you on about?

What he's trying to say is that our admin team has been halved over the last month or two, leaving more to me, such as odd jobs that nobody else can pick up. Such as responses to Habbox.com things, and Habbo Name changes. There's usually a miscellaneous Admin-In-Training waiting for a spot who does these. We've cut down on the number of admins as well, the second AFM has gone. Admins are leaving because school is coming. Simple as

In my opinion, you cannot trust someone just from their rep or post count. Rep can be bought so it pretty much destroys the whole point of the system. I am not sure why Habbox even decided to offer people to be able to purchase rep years ago, my guess is it was a popular request by VIP members ages ago.

I agree. Now I have to feel old, because I *know* why buying rep was introduced. For the record, this is why rep was introduced. VIP was in place, and back then you still got 15 points for VIP. So, these people were having MASSIVE rep wars, and what they were doing is purchasing ridiculous amounts of VIP, just for the 15/month. Irrational right? I guess not to them. Tidus was one, if anyone remembers them. However I guess since less were buying VIP then, Habbox was harder pressed to pay their server bills (remember, we didn't have Google Ads at that point) and so they offered buying reputation, which was a hit. I think we should look into removing it, however.

Admins/staff are leaving mainly because of the new school term. This is the normal cycle of staff at Habbox and usually most Habbo fansites but more Habbox so because it has more staff than most fansites I think.

Agreed

Staff usually resign at new school term and then before exams in June or whatever, thats how it usually goes every year.

Yeah, and also performance drops till November and till July, because some staff go on temporary breaks, which we allow, because education is top priority.

There are still clues about for who has bought rep,

A user whos signed up in the last 4 months with alot of bars and high rep power has bought it..
chances are the user will remain a VIP (because well if they can afford to spend money on rep and can afford to just keep renewing)

Oh yes, there are clues. But I could show you Rep Buyers in the most unlikely places...of course I wouldn't, because I don't do that. I do, however, speak up, when people who actually earned (or at least recieved from members) rep are abused because its thought they've bought it, cause that's just not right and I'm the only one who can prove it

And i'm pretty sure rep only kicked in last year as i remember when you coudn't buy rep and i've only been registered for 2 years.

Rep has always been here, you've been able to buy rep since...err...I think when JackHB was VIP manager. Might've been after Dave, I can't be sure on that one.

And tbh the same is true about post counts, someone who has a high postcount over a short period of time normally means spammed. while a slower continous post over several years is more trusted.

Not necessarily, because someone can still post crap, just at a slower rate

But thats only how i trust people, sadly i normally look at member with a high post count an rep count more then VIPs.

I personally look at the join date. That is the most indicative factor for me, well as well as their demeanor in the post I am looking at. The way people conduct themselves and express themselves play a huge role in how I judge people. And for me, first impressions are key, though not final

not sure what that has to o with the thread in its current state, but its nice to see that the thread is still drawing conversation and debate over the problems or feeligs of the members around staff and reputation, even if Danny (Pycan) appears to yell his views rather then use his indoor voice

Heh. Each of us has a different way of expressing it, although the way we do often decides how much we can get done with our views

That was rather unnecessary. :S

Yeah, it was a bit overkill, but I felt it was necessary to close the point completely, as that really isn't up for debate, it was blatent rulebreaking and I had consensus on that one from fellow admins Sorry about the overbeating of the point.

In awnser to Nvrs earlier post, i am indeed Male, and i do respect his long detailed responses to each of the problems or queries i have posted. although i'm not sure i like catzys responses to Pycan, Pycan does have very valid points he is just unable to get them across in a post without sounding aggressive or confrontational. although this forum has only a small tollerance for such things , might be nice if one of the admins such as Nvr had a private discussion/debate with Pycan to solve all the queries and problems he has rather then an uncontrolable thread where other users may post to stir danny up or may make pointless remarks to defend managment and other members against clear problems.

Thanks

In defense of Catzsy, I don't think she was posting to rile Pycan, simply to try and calm him down, because Rosie is a very kind and peaceloving person. She was simply trying to point out the other side and settle him down a bit, though of course when we have our blood running it seems that everyone is out to get us, just part of being human

There is oviously a problem here with some staff , Infractions and Reputation perhaps its time for big steps to be taken when it comes to the rules on giving infractions and the exchange and purchase of reputation.

I agree, we should look into abolishing bought rep. The problems with staff and infractions aren't 100% clear to me, as it seems rather evident that the infractions were given for legitimate reasons. Or maybe I'm misinterpreting which infractions you mean.

I understand that reputation brings in a small amount of money on large bills to pay to keep such a popular forum running and that just because its unpopular and turns a reputation system into a 'who has the most money and can buy respect' system, but perhaps it should be removed, Mad has already spoken out against it, i'm sure Nvr would agree... perhaps a general forum vote is in order?

I have agreed in the past, I've never liked it, and have worked to get it removed, just such motions in the past simply were sort of put to the wayside for more important issues. This has already been proposed to the admins, and if we reach a consensus, we may put it out to the Forum users to gauge their reaction (though, fair warning, we may not side with the majority, if its close or something like that, but chances are we will, if we put a poll out.)

and in the sake of Infractions, getting an infraction for repping someone or -repping someone shoudn't be the case.... surely the idea of loosing hard earned or alot of rep that the user feels proud of building over many months and years perhaps the infractions and threats of banning should be laxed because someone repped there friend with no reason, i've talked to several people over the last few days who have recieved rude or abusive rep and won't report it incase they loose rep they may not deem to be pointless the managment do. i've started giving out alot of -rep over the last few days because its easier to think of a reason to -rep a post then to +rep it .. and ether way i like to give out rep each day so if the same person makes me laugh i can rep them again!

You won't get an infraction for one pointless rep. You'd get it for a full page or two (20-40) of them. We really only used bans at the outset, as we've tried to sort this before with simple requests, whence people replied saying "you can't do anything". We were just pointing out the rule *is* in force, and though we try not to invoke it for bans, we do when necessary. The people I have banned in the past (temporarily for the most part) for reputation, are the people who rep half the forum negatively, pretending to be people that they are not. Or the ones who spread er...delicate images, let's say, through the reputation system. Although it is smart..sort of. Harder to get caught, but you have limits



Thanks to Rosie, MAD, and Jay for their comments as well And thanks to Earthquake for the levity

[Soil]

If you have a life and are busy, why not pass your job on then? Resign? Give some other person with no life a chance who will be dedicated and work there *** off.

Everybody has a right to complain, it's exactly what I am doing. Tis' my feedback.

They don't pass on their job because they don't have a life. They like to think they do.
Last time I complained, I got flamed.
[B]I have received over 20 infractions which have been reversed. Half of them from Super Moderators and ---MAD---. They are busy with things "behind the scenes"[, but they have time to give out stupid infractions? Super Moderators try and give out as many infractions as the can. I got two infractions. One of them was given to me by accident. Then a few minutes later, the same super moderator gives me a infraction for double posting :s. Nvrspk4 gave me a infraction for a post which was 6 months old./B]
The management here are pure stupid. That my opinion anyway.
I was perm banned on ksoz for a stupid reason. Nvrspk4 closed a thread. He didnt make a edit or anything. I opened it as I didnt know how it got closed. And then he perm banned me. Pure stupid. I guess little kids will never learn.

Saying "I have a life" or "We have a life" is not really a good excuse unless you start asking far too much of someone (ie to check all reported rep all in 1 day and there are like 10 pages of it). Most management staff have other responsibilities that are behind the scenes so they have other stuff to do besides what people see and usually those (behind the scenes stuff) take priority. Obviously you still cannot use the excuse "I have a life" but should rather say it takes time to deal with it all.

Off course since all staff at Habbox are volunteers, they will usually have a few days of less productivity because of school/work or whatever, but thats normal on any volunteer site run by teenagers such as Habbox.

Volunteers dont usually get paid. You do. So technically you aren't a volunteer. You are a staff. Everything was fine before Seacat / DJ-3000 and Anitar resigned.
The fact is they were 16+. They took on critisim and improved on it.
The new management are 14-15. They hate critism.
Last month or sometime then, the "Report Reputation Problems" thread had over 100 posts. They just deleted them all. [B]Lazy/B].

The priority for nvrsk and josh is to do the vip as people are actually paying for the service , Before you weren't able to remove pointless negative points and no one actually complained, your lucky habbox decided to introduce it.

You could also get your ngative reputation reversed :S It has been there since 2005. Please dont make false statements.

The thing which management don't realise is that we pay the money they get to run habbox. Without us this forum wouldnt be here. So start treating your members with respect like other forums do. You just like to think there are 3-4 people complaining, but from the number of replies in this thread, it just prooves that alot of people arent happy.

Before someone says "Why do you come on habboxforum if you dont like it??"
Answer: There are some great members and some forums I like.

The fact that I have around 20 reversed infractions, prooves that the Super Mods / Admins arent really good.

[Mr.OSH]

The fact that I have around 20 reversed infractions, prooves that the Super Mods / Admins arent really good.

What you have to remember is that regularly we have new additions to the team and when people are new to the way Habbox's moderation team functions they are bound to make mistakes to start with. As for Super Moderator and Administrators, I can safely say the ALL the Super Moderators and Administrator are amazing at what they do. Habbox runs a tight ship with administrators and Super Moderators, they do not employ or keep staff who cannot do a job up to a good standard. I work along side the administrators and the Super moderators and I can tell you all the stick that they get is not warranted. If you could see what people like ---MAD--- and nvrpsk4 do, things that members wouldn't take a second thought about you might think twice before hurling any sort of criticisms am them. The administrators are coping fine at the moment. For reasons of common sense, they do not go employing new Administrators just because one less important task such as reputation takes a little longer to be dealt with. Of course if in a few months time when things are back to normal the delays were massive they might need to think about taking some action but I would be lying if I said I didn't expect things to slow down a little, especially reputation etc as people return from their summer holidays. Anybody who is in any doubt that the current administrators cannot do their job is very very wrong. It's people like ---MAD--- and nvrpsk4 and joshuar who have mad Habbox what it is today.