Apple forced to publish that Samsung didn't copy them!

[scottish]

Not really related but apple at it again

http://www.macworld.co.uk/apple-busi...newsid=3370881

[peteyt]

Not really related but apple at it again

http://www.macworld.co.uk/apple-busi...newsid=3370881

I hope if they try to enforce this they get hit hard - We need competition. The iPhone was never the first touch screen phone and it won't be the last. It reminds me Harlan Ellison who's tried to sue films for using a basic principle he's wrote about e.g. his film has robots so this robot film is his work ha.

[Recursion]

The UI patent isn't going to be a problem... it's another ridiculous patent with no power behind it.

That MacWorld article is such ******** in terms of fanboyism it makes my blood boil.

[HotelUser]

Good, it's about time Apple were told who's boss and acknowledge something everyone knows to be false - that the Tab cannt be a copy of the iPad. They should stop hiding behind the law and actually allow competition where it is needed.

Let the customers decide what is bad or good, not the courts.


Depends if they want to admit that the iPad isn't cool and pick another fight with Samsung. The only way they can counter claim is if they say the ruling judge was wrong in his decision - that the iPad isn't cool.

It's a strange yet complicated situation.

1. A forced apology isn't a genuine apology
2. They will probably appeal this
3. Microsoft, Google, Samsung, HTC, RIM, Acer, ASUS, HP and more have all fought the patent wars and are just as guilty as Apple
4. It's not like Apple's being force to apologize in America, their home market where they'll continue to pursue patent suits just like every other company.
5. The tab is a copy of the iPad, the iPad consists of elements which were copied from elsewhere. Those foundational elements were proposed off ideas from elsewhere again, this loop is infinite. Everybody steals from everybody in the consumer technology industry, lesson one. If you're going to slate Apple for preaching their own innovation then you're a hypocrite for not slating everybody else for same exact thing.

England has one of the oldest established legal systems in Western Society and Canada's justice system is closely based off England's, but I could never imagine a judge insulting the plaintiff and defendant by telling one company their product isn't as cool as the other companies, and then forcing the other company to publicly apologize. Justice in my eyes shouldn't be about humiliating both parties, it should be about upholding the people's justice righteously, and the American, British and Canadian patent systems could seriously learn a thing or two about true justice.

[Chippiewill]

Microsoft, Google, Samsung, HTC, RIM, Acer, ASUS, HP and more have all fought the patent wars and are just as guilty as Apple.

You cannot deny however that:

a) Apple is throwing around the most lawsuits
b) Most others are only counter patent suits to drop the issue entirely

The judge probably intended it as more of a punishment for abusing the patent system than anything else. Many Judges recently have been just chucking patent cases out for obvious abuse of this system and I hope this continues.

[Recursion]

Apple accounts for 60% of all patent disputes in the mobile market...

[GommeInc]

1. A forced apology isn't a genuine apology
2. They will probably appeal this
3. Microsoft, Google, Samsung, HTC, RIM, Acer, ASUS, HP and more have all fought the patent wars and are just as guilty as Apple
4. It's not like Apple's being force to apologize in America, their home market where they'll continue to pursue patent suits just like every other company.
5. The tab is a copy of the iPad, the iPad consists of elements which were copied from elsewhere. Those foundational elements were proposed off ideas from elsewhere again, this loop is infinite. Everybody steals from everybody in the consumer technology industry, lesson one. If you're going to slate Apple for preaching their own innovation then you're a hypocrite for not slating everybody else for same exact thing.

England has one of the oldest established legal systems in Western Society and Canada's justice system is closely based off England's, but I could never imagine a judge insulting the plaintiff and defendant by telling one company their product isn't as cool as the other companies, and then forcing the other company to publicly apologize. Justice in my eyes shouldn't be about humiliating both parties, it should be about upholding the people's justice righteously, and the American, British and Canadian patent systems could seriously learn a thing or two about true justice.

You cannot deny however that:

a) Apple is throwing around the most lawsuits
b) Most others are only counter patent suits to drop the issue entirely

The judge probably intended it as more of a punishment for abusing the patent system than anything else. Many Judges recently have been just chucking patent cases out for obvious abuse of this system and I hope this continues.

Apple accounts for 60% of all patent disputes in the mobile market...

The above two quotes are by those who look outside the box.

1. It's hilarious, it makes them look stupid which is always good because, let's face it, they've been asking for it given the two above facts - they're riding the patent system to try and gain dominance when it should be the consumer who decides.
2. Naturally, and they will again be put down like the countless times they've appealed - either in the courts, or by reputation.
3. A serial murderer is far worse than a one off killer or someone convicted of manslaughter. I'll let you mull that over.
4. Home markets and international markets are irrelevant. If a company suffers humiliation in one country it will be heard around the world, hence this article exists in the first place :rolleyes:
5. No it isn't, anyone with more than the required brain cells for rational thought can see it isn't a rip off of the iPad. The difference here is open competition decided by what the consumer thinks is right, not what a gutless organisation that is affraid of good, healthy competition and a courtroom in some country thinks should be the competition. Apple is the main offender because it releases self-righteous statements under the tagline "GRAND THEFT" when Apple is the golden turd of hypocrisy and doesn't want to admit it copies from other companies. It's double standards. Every other organisation - Samsung for example - understands the natural course of emulation and product evolution and doesn't pretend it invented the obvious design of a tablet computer (a tablet computer would be just a flat piece of technology with a huge screen taking up one side, how else can one be designed!?)

Also, you seem to be taking the typical Can't-Be-Bothered-To-Read-The-Full-Case-Notes position, although that cannot be blamed purely on merit as the media (especially American and Canadian media) have completely destroyed an interesting case by reporting on just the "it isn't cool enough" statement the judge allegedly made.

What he actually was talking about was the reputation Apple has that the Samsung does not, that the two products are clearly different because Apple products have the established, popular choice reputation while the Samsung has the new-product reputation, or lack of one (to put it in layman's terms). He did the annoying "hip judge" thing and used the word cool in a statement and the media, which likes to portray ignorance, leapt upon those words like an idiot to an iMac screaming "shiny shiny".

Anyone with access to one of a few UK law databases can download the Official Transcript and it is actually quite an interesting read, but as per usual the media like to dumb down their audience.

His Honour Judge Birss QC says just before his conclusion that "To the informed user: From the front, the Samsung belongs to the same family which includes the Apple design (basically the obvious "It has a screen on the front!") but the Samsung products are insubstantial of that family because of the design on the back. Because of this, they do not have the same understated and extreme simplicity which is apparent in the Apple design". He used the words "it's not as cool. The overall impression produced by the Tab is different."

Unfortunately, you fell in the media trap and accuse the English Legal System of being crass, by apparently offending either party when in actual fact neither party is offended (Apple can't be, unless compliments are offensive? ) and Samsung can't be as the judge never outright says it isn't cool, it just isn't as cool and they won the case because the judge has this wonderous gift of common sense and sight, something Apple can't take away with their billions.

[HotelUser]

Apple accounts for 60% of all patent disputes in the mobile market...

That statistic isn't as relavent as who is benefitting more out of ongoing patent disputes in the mobile market. Microsoft is generating almost (if not over) half a billion dollars a year right now from ongoing disputes with Google's Android, and Microsoft hasn't even been moving the mobile software industry forward since wince/mobile pre-iphone crap. Not to mention the money Microsoft collects from all their other non android related patent disputes, I'd wager that Ballmer still knows how to play the game . Microsoft is just as guilty as Apple, who is just as guilty as everyone else. As I state below to Gomme, you can patent-insult a company you don't like because of personal reasons all you want but in the end EVERY COMPANY ABUSES THE SYSTEM. Apple, Samsung, Microsoft alike. The whole system has to be changed, targeting a company you might have a personal vendetta with gets you nowhere with patent wars.

You cannot deny however that:

a) Apple is throwing around the most lawsuits
b) Most others are only counter patent suits to drop the issue entirely

The judge probably intended it as more of a punishment for abusing the patent system than anything else. Many Judges recently have been just chucking patent cases out for obvious abuse of this system and I hope this continues.

In the entire history of the creation of all these companies? Yes I can deny that easily.'

1. It's hilarious, it makes them look stupid

The judge saying it's not copying because Samsung's product is worse is hilarious and makes Samsung look stupid.

which is always good because, let's face it, they've been asking for it given the two above facts - they're riding the patent system to try and gain dominance when it should be the consumer who decides.

I didn't want to be the one who broke the news to you, but your home company has done the exact same thing for years:

http://articles.businessinsider.com/...soft-engineers
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/...-patents/11476
http://www.tomsguide.com/us/microsof...ews-14517.html
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/11/...ndroid-patents
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/USP...-OS,11222.html

2. Naturally, and they will again be put down like the countless times they've appealed - either in the courts, or by reputation.

Big bad companies who abuse the patent system like Microsoft Apple and Samsung have had their losses and victories.

3. A serial murderer is far worse than a one off killer or someone convicted of manslaughter. I'll let you mull that over.

Refer to the above links.

4. Home markets and international markets are irrelevant. If a company suffers humiliation in one country it will be heard around the world, hence this article exists in the first place :rolleyes:

Then I'll re-emphasize that your government's judge is a moron. Nobody I've heard is talking about this "technology news" over here, by the way.

5. No it isn't, anyone with more than the required brain cells for rational thought can see it isn't a rip off of the iPad. The difference here is open competition decided by what the consumer thinks is right, not what a gutless organisation that is affraid of good, healthy competition and a courtroom in some country thinks should be the competition. Apple is the main offender because it releases self-righteous statements under the tagline "GRAND THEFT" when Apple is the golden turd of hypocrisy and doesn't want to admit it copies from other companies. It's double standards. Every other organisation - Samsung for example - understands the natural course of emulation and product evolution and doesn't pretend it invented the obvious design of a tablet computer (a tablet computer would be just a flat piece of technology with a huge screen taking up one side, how else can one be designed!?)

Also, you seem to be taking the typical Can't-Be-Bothered-To-Read-The-Full-Case-Notes position, although that cannot be blamed purely on merit as the media (especially American and Canadian media) have completely destroyed an interesting case by reporting on just the "it isn't cool enough" statement the judge allegedly made.

What he actually was talking about was the reputation Apple has that the Samsung does not, that the two products are clearly different because Apple products have the established, popular choice reputation while the Samsung has the new-product reputation, or lack of one (to put it in layman's terms). He did the annoying "hip judge" thing and used the word cool in a statement and the media, which likes to portray ignorance, leapt upon those words like an idiot to an iMac screaming "shiny shiny".

Anyone with access to one of a few UK law databases can download the Official Transcript and it is actually quite an interesting read, but as per usual the media like to dumb down their audience.

His Honour Judge Birss QC says just before his conclusion that "To the informed user: From the front, the Samsung belongs to the same family which includes the Apple design (basically the obvious "It has a screen on the front!") but the Samsung products are insubstantial of that family because of the design on the back. Because of this, they do not have the same understated and extreme simplicity which is apparent in the Apple design". He used the words "it's not as cool. The overall impression produced by the Tab is different."

Unfortunately, you fell in the media trap and accuse the English Legal System of being crass, by apparently offending either party when in actual fact neither party is offended (Apple can't be, unless compliments are offensive? ) and Samsung can't be as the judge never outright says it isn't cool, it just isn't as cool and they won the case because the judge has this wonderous gift of common sense and sight, something Apple can't take away with their billions.

Apple's claim to these patents has just as much backing them up as your home company Microsoft's patents to page up page down, schedule information and draggable browser tabs. You can rant and rave all you like about just Apple, but I'm not going to bother reading your hypocritical rants if you straight up refuse to adhere to the fact that EVERYONE abuses the patent system. I whole heartedly agree with anyone who states that patents are widely abused, but you sitting here and targeting a specific company just because you don't like that company is straight up ludicrous when every single other major player is guilty of doing the exact same thing and has been for many years.

[GommeInc]

The judge saying it's not copying because Samsung's product is worse is hilarious and makes Samsung look stupid.

Again, you haven't read the actual judgment and are probably basing your hilarious judgments on MacRumor comments or a media company who hasn't bothered reading the full facts. Come back when you've read the case notes. He didn't label the Tab as rubbish or "worse" (which suggests you think the iPad is bad, and the Tab is worse).

I didn't want to be the one who broke the news to you, but your home company has done the exact same thing for years:

http://articles.businessinsider.com/...soft-engineers
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/...-patents/11476
http://www.tomsguide.com/us/microsof...ews-14517.html
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/11/...ndroid-patents
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/USP...-OS,11222.html



Big bad companies who abuse the patent system like Microsoft Apple and Samsung have had their losses and victories.

This thread is about Apple, naturally it's going to be an attack on Apple. Also, you've failed to recognise the fact that Apple is the big abuser of the patent system, and openly persue this idea that they're original and no one else is better - Jobs' idea of Android being grand theft, for example. They're a pathetic company. Other companies abuse the patent system, true - no one has said otherwise - but other companies don't delude themselves with false grandeur.

Oh, and bless you for calling it my home company - I didn't know I sang Microsoft's praises. But you are one to get ideas in your head and attempt to win an argument by planting pointless information to argue with yourself.

Then I'll re-emphasize that your government's judge is a moron. Nobody I've heard is talking about this "technology news" over here, by the way.

Baseless claim. Read the judgment. He's highly intelligent, and wipes the floor with any judge in your country because he's had the guts to stand up and say the patent system is a misuse of a legal systems' time. He has common sense - the Tab IS different to the iPad, which is his conclusion - something anyone with the appropriate brain cells for common sense can understand. Are you just sad that he picked on Apple and strongly believes the patent system is corrupt? Because you seem to be suggesting the patent system is working smoothly and Apple (and other companies) should be deciding on the competition, rather than the consumers.

Apple's claim to these patents has just as much backing them up as your home company Microsoft's patents to page up page down, schedule information and draggable browser tabs. You can rant and rave all you like about just Apple, but I'm not going to bother reading your hypocritical rants if you straight up refuse to adhere to the fact that EVERYONE abuses the patent system. I whole heartedly agree with anyone who states that patents are widely abused, but you sitting here and targeting a specific company just because you don't like that company is straight up ludicrous when every single other major player is guilty of doing the exact same thing and has been for many years.

Apple believe they've invented the bezel that goes around the iPad screen. Enough said. Also, I never said that Apple is the only company - perhaps you should stop being so red headed and backing up your ridiculous cult? Also, you whinge(d) about BlackBerry and RIM to the point that people were seriously contemplating suicide (and it was for really subjective, pointless reasons).

[HotelUser]

Again, you haven't read the actual judgment and are probably basing your hilarious judgments on MacRumor comments or a media company who hasn't bothered reading the full facts. Come back when you've read the case notes. He didn't label the Tab as rubbish or "worse" (which suggests you think the iPad is bad, and the Tab is worse).

I only post on MacRumours when I have a problem with iOS/OS X (which is very rare ) and I don't read their news. The exact quote from the judge is: "do not have the same understated and extreme simplicity which is possessed by the Apple design ... They are not as cool." Thank you for making baseless assumptions of my knowledge of the case, though. Also the word "worse" wasn't used at all by the judge (I was just paraphrasing Birss's opinion), but I'd just like to point out off topic that saying something is worse compared to something else doesn't imply that what you compared it to is bad. Death is worse than life in my opinion, but that doesn't mean I also believe life is bad.

This thread is about Apple, naturally it's going to be an attack on Apple. Also, you've failed to recognise the fact that Apple is the big abuser of the patent system, and openly persue this idea that they're original and no one else is better - Jobs' idea of Android being grand theft, for example. They're a pathetic company. Other companies abuse the patent system, true - no one has said otherwise - but other companies don't delude themselves with false grandeur.

Blah blah blah, you slating Apple for whatever reason you come up with in your head regardless as to whether or not it's true has bored me over the years . Yes they've made mistakes but you've failed to recognize the fact that Apple, Microsoft, Samsung and many others are the big abusers of the patent system, and openly pursue this idea that they're in the habit of making money. Just because you want Apple to be the biggest abuser of the patent system in the entire world doesn't mean they abuse the system any more then Microsoft, Google, Samsung, ASUS, Acer, Oracle, and you've not given me any evidence to suggest otherwise.

Oh, and bless you for calling it my home company - I didn't know I sang Microsoft's praises. But you are one to get ideas in your head and attempt to win an argument by planting pointless information to argue with yourself.

Well you're not exactly posting from an all Apple attire, and I don't think you're running Damn Small Linux as your primary OS

Baseless claim. Read the judgment. He's highly intelligent, and wipes the floor with any judge in your country because he's had the guts to stand up and say the patent system is a misuse of a legal systems' time. He has common sense - the Tab IS different to the iPad, which is his conclusion - something anyone with the appropriate brain cells for common sense can understand. Are you just sad that he picked on Apple and strongly believes the patent system is corrupt? Because you seem to be suggesting the patent system is working smoothly and Apple (and other companies) should be deciding on the competition, rather than the consumers.

You wouldn't of asked me if I'm sad that he picked on Apple if you read in my previous posts that I believe it's a shame that both companies were humiliated, and I stand strongly by my statement that the entire patent system in both our countries as well as in America and elsewhere is highly corrupt and needs to be modified to preserve and pursue what's in the best interests of us the consumers.

It's funny, because I'm just as inclined to pick up a Samsung Galaxy as I am an iPhone the next time I collect on a hardware upgrade from Bell Mobility. I've been a mainstream Android user before I've been an iOS user. I am not anti-Microsoft and I am not anti-Samsung. If you want to call me anti something then you may call me anti-RIM.

Apple believe they've invented the bezel that goes around the iPad screen. Enough said. Also, I never said that Apple is the only company - perhaps you should stop being so red headed and backing up your ridiculous cult? Also, you whinge(d) about BlackBerry and RIM to the point that people were seriously contemplating suicide (and it was for really subjective, pointless reasons).

Ah, here's the RIM dig. I strongly disliked RIM even before it was cool. They're terrible at PR, marketing and keeping up software and hardware wise. If that caused suicide then it's highly unfortunate but my statements against RIM are justified because unfortunately the Canadian Company is suffering more then I'd like it to be.

Apple invented the bezel you say? I hear Microsoft invented pageup/pagedown keys and Yahoo invented Facebooks like button. It's crazy what companies manage to "invent" these days when billions of dollars can be made. As aforementioned I feel the entire patent system is corrupt and many companies abuse it. I really don't know what point you have here, because from the beginning I've been telling you I think the patent system is corrupt, and from the beginning you ignore every single company in the world and only made it your sole purpose to try to trash Apple instead of the patent system. I've already showed you examples of Microsoft abusing the system and pointed out that they make half a billion dollars a year from Android alone. Must I show you examples of Samsung, Google, ASUS blablabla as well? Other companies abuse the patent system other than Apple. You can kick and scream about me pointing that out all you want but it's the truth. The system needs to be changed, not one company specifically.


Edit: Apple was granted a stay on posting the notice. This means Samsung still goes insulted by your judge, and your courts time will continue to be wasted because this means another appeal. The patent system is just a giant mess that benefits nobody other than corporations and already rich lawyers and judges.