Keith Vaz's 'Sensible' Immigration Prediction

[Chippiewill]

Dan, this thread isn't about immigration as a whole. It's about the impact of lifting eurozone movement restrictions on Romanians and Bulgarians and the impact IS a little over 1000 a month extra. That is tiny. And considering most of them come here to do jobs people here don't want to do and don't use our health service, don't use our social services and don't use our education services (Since they just send the money back to their families) and still pay taxes. The impact on services is none, or if anything, positive.

[FlyingJesus]

I mentioned the Daily Mail because that's the only place you quoted that has the 187,000 figure - unsourced, of course. Try having an actual response once in a while

[-:Undertaker:-]

Dan, this thread isn't about immigration as a whole. It's about the impact of lifting eurozone movement restrictions on Romanians and Bulgarians and the impact IS a little over 1000 a month extra. That is tiny.

You can break it down however you like, from 1,000 a day to 1 every 24 hours. I don't care how you word it or play with the numbers other than the fact that the numbers have risen signifigantly (as shown by the figures and graph) which is exactly what we warned would happen and which is exactly what your side of the argument said wouldn't happen and had a right giggle at our 'scaremongering'. Well, now the statistics are in (and they are probably even worse than this given the reliability of government stats) and you're all left without a paddle up the creek. It is my turn to pour the scorn: this time rightly.

And my criticisms aren't reserved solely for Romanian and Bulgarian open borders either. The entire system is rotten to the core and reflects the complete opposite of public opinion in Britain. And that is wrong and it is high time it was fixed because patience is running out.

And considering most of them come here to do jobs people here don't want to do and don't use our health service, don't use our social services and don't use our education services (Since they just send the money back to their families) and still pay taxes. The impact on services is none, or if anything, positive.

The one-in, one-out excuse is flawed for a number of reasons -

• A lot of those emigrating are highly skilled, a lot of those coming in are on low skills. A loss in other words.
• Lower skilled jobs are actually a net drain on the treasury in social services used, including Child Benefit which immigrants are entitled to.
• Even if contributions go up (debatable) it still doesn't account for the fact that public spending is planned YEARS in advance meaning areas which are hit hardest by heavy immigration - which is usually the case due to draw factors - are short of cash for services for years.
• The social and cultural consequences on areas hit by mass immigration: social cohesion factors.
• Crime. Are those leaving Britain, often educated and highly skilled, as likely to commit crime as low skilled migrants from second world countries?
• The impact on wage rates with inflation for British workers, mainly the working classes on low skilled jobs.

As I have said countless times, I am not opposed to immigration. But I am opposed to huge numbers and even worse, open borders.

I mentioned the Daily Mail because that's the only place you quoted that has the 187,000 figure - unsourced, of course. Try having an actual response once in a while

The ONS graph should be clear enough for you to understand. See the line suddenly shoots upwards? The clue is in that.

[FlyingJesus]

Yeah I saw it and commented on it in my last post if you ever feel like actually reading what's written in these sorts of threads. What it didn't show in any way is where the 187,000 figure comes from, which is why I've been mentioning that as a point of contest. Feel free to try again any time you feel like it, and perhaps in future you could refrain from pretending that anyone other than you is delusional in any way