You really want him as PM...

[Immenseman]

In yours eyes then, having public spending at unsustainable levels and still refusing to cut them despite record levels of debt & selling gold stocks when at a twenty year low where good decisions? - he nationalised the banks yet the banks are still refusing to lend to struggling business and until they do, then the recession will continue.

Some banks are, you can't generalise and that's a fact, not speculation which your posts are based around. The banks are making things easier for people to live and Gordon Brown and the Labour party in general have had a huge influence in that. For example, my Dad owns numerous properties and the mortgage has halved on some. This will be the same for a lot of families who are having money issues.

[MaryMagdalene]

-:Undertaker:- one day karma will run over your dogma "/ and as for the eponymous question: um no he doesn't have charisma~ i'd elect myself but unfortunately i wasn't educated in useless historic classic studies at oxford university because i was too busy having a lifex

[-:Undertaker:-]

Some banks are, you can't generalise and that's a fact, not speculation which your posts are based around. The banks are making things easier for people to live and Gordon Brown and the Labour party in general have had a huge influence in that. For example, my Dad owns numerous properties and the mortgage has halved on some. This will be the same for a lot of families who are having money issues.

Business owners have told the media time and time again they are not having the loans coming through, therefore they are having to cut jobs as they cannot sustain the business. The other issues I mentioned are also disasterous economic decisions which have cost our country billions and are costing us every second that passess, building up a mountain of debt which is just soaring higher and higher.

When Labour entered office in 1997 they had one of the best balance sheets in the countrys history, when the leave office (the sooner the better) they will leave one of the worst deficits in the countrys history.

[Immenseman]

Business owners have told the media time and time again they are not having the loans coming through, therefore they are having to cut jobs as they cannot sustain the business. The other issues I mentioned are also disasterous economic decisions which have cost our country billions and are costing us every second that passess, building up a mountain of debt which is just soaring higher and higher.

When Labour entered office in 1997 they had one of the best balance sheets in the countrys history, when the leave office (the sooner the better) they will leave one of the worst deficits in the countrys history.

Due to the global recession yeah. Nothing they could do to eradicate that. Also, I think you're forgetting they've done it to improve the quality and standard of lives of people in this country. The tories wouldn't dream of doing such a thing because their middle class support aren't affected anyway. Oh, I so just went there.

You're too influenced by the media and you've even said so yourself in the first line of your post. What are the media famous for? Exaggerating to create controversy and to ensure people are interested.

[GommeInc]

Some banks are, you can't generalise and that's a fact, not speculation which your posts are based around. The banks are making things easier for people to live and Gordon Brown and the Labour party in general have had a huge influence in that. For example, my Dad owns numerous properties and the mortgage has halved on some. This will be the same for a lot of families who are having money issues.

Not really. Care to explain the financial portfolios my family were given today regarding our trust fund and my dad's estate which hasn't recovered as fast as it should since the economic downturn? Seriously, most things are halved so shares and so on can't be sold! The banks are all terrible (because it is a financial portfolio, bank comparisons between all of them are added) and they're all worthless at the moment.

Though I did find something useful:

The UK on its own is a better economy than any countries with the Euro/within the EU. If anything the EU would want Britain to have the Euro just to benefit itself, which of course won't happen unless this Labour government, or the tories stand their ground and not go for the Euro.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Due to the global recession yeah. Nothing they could do to eradicate that. Also, I think you're forgetting they've done it to improve the quality and standard of lives of people in this country. The tories wouldn't dream of doing such a thing because their middle class support aren't affected anyway. Oh, I so just went there.

You're too influenced by the media and you've even said so yourself in the first line of your post. What are the media famous for? Exaggerating to create controversy and to ensure people are interested.

Global recession has nothing to do with what I just posted, the government still refuse to cut public spending and the banks are still refusing to lend out in the United Kingdom. We own the banks, and whole point of nationalising the banks was to get them to lend again yet that has failed.

It is a global recession, however I am not talking about the rest of the world I am talking about the United Kingdom and the disasterous decisions this government has made over the past twelve years. You are using the class argument again so I shall now use it on you; Neil Kinnock. The man who led the Labour party a few decades again, was against the European Union and was against the House of Lords - yet now him and his wife are involved in both and are reeping in millions of taxpayer money for their 'services'. - In the words of Jim Royale; socialism my arse.

Socialists always use the class argument because it is one of the very few things they can do, i'll turn it on its head shall I? - if you ask a prison full of criminals who they would vote for between the Conservatives and Labour I could nearly gurantee the vast majority would rather vote Labour over Conservative.

I know when things are exaggerated thank you very much, I also know that the country is building up a massive mountain of debt which will weigh this country down for many years to come, thanks yet again to Labour.

[LuketheDuke]

Lol Kinnock opposed the fact that there was no entrenched Bill of Human Rights in the EU, that was passed in 1998.

He was against the House of Lords due to the herediatary peers that existed, they were abolished in 2001.

All by a person who Kinnock himself vested belief in, the right hon. Tony Blair.

Also, have you ever heard of Black Wednesday, Undertaker? The National Debt after that little disaster back in 92 was the highest its even been, even by todays standards.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Lol Kinnock opposed the fact that there was no entrenched Bill of Human Rights in the EU, that was passed in 1998.

He was against the House of Lords due to the herediatary peers that existed, they were abolished in 2001.

All by a person who Kinnock himself vested belief in, the right hon. Tony Blair.

Also, have you ever heard of Black Wednesday, Undertaker? The National Debt after that little disaster back in 92 was the highest its even been, even by todays standards.

Kinnock opposed both the European Union and House of Lords when he was fighting his socialist corner against Margaret Thatcher, he had argued for the abolition of the House of Lords when he was leader yet now he has changed his tune and is happy to accept millions from both every year. I thought as a socialist he is supposed to oppose high wages and is supposed to be fighting for the poor yet all I see are him and his wife reeping in millions upon millions, just like Stalin, Kim Jong Il, Lenin, Chairman Mao.. the list goes on and on with historys failures.

I have indeed, however the tories managed the economy then and when they left office in 1997 they had virtually no debt left leaving Labour a clean slate to spend money on, however Labour are refusing to cut spending - that is the vital difference, knowing when to stop.

[LuketheDuke]

He opposed them due to the reasons I stated as I had to learn why he managed to lose the '92 election despite his policy on things like hereditary peers in the Lords being allowed to stand by Maggie T.

Please stop making things up to big up the tories, "no debt" in 1997. The Conservatives "knowing where to stop".

A popular quote on here is pics then it didnt happen, back yourself up.

[-:Undertaker:-]

He opposed them due to the reasons I stated as I had to learn why he managed to lose the '92 election despite his policy on things like hereditary peers in the Lords being allowed to stand by Maggie T.

Please stop making things up to big up the tories, "no debt" in 1997. The Conservatives "knowing where to stop".

A popular quote on here is pics then it didnt happen, back yourself up.

Neil Kinnock was not elected to the House of Lords so so much for his democratic crusade, as always with the Labour failures - they end up in the House of Lords or more often the European Union, just like dear old Peter Mandelson.

If it was not true then Labour would not of been able to spend as much as they have done - simple economics.