EU forces elected British government to renege on Queen's Speech promise

[-:Undertaker:-]

Arguably Britain is a geographical concept which means people in Wales, Scotland and England - we say British to usually mean these people and not including Northern Ireland.

Indeed, there is a British demos certainly I think... although obviously that has been worn down immensely over the past few decades. England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and even the Irish Republic for that matter are all so similar yet look at the fact that a Union that has survived 300 years and was forged in war, blood and industry has 45% of the population in one part of it that don't wish to be a part of it and southern Ireland had left in 1922.

A political union on the continent, which is vastly diverse, would end up in bloodshed. The historical examples are there for all to see.

I would say Europe has a demos, albeit hard to determine. With Schengen people can easily move around the EU and identify as European with no regard to their home nation.

I identify as European, although on a geographical and maybe wider civiliasational context. But there's no such person as a European in the same way there's French, German, Polish, British: we're all so different. Even on holiday anybody can see the slight, yet huge differences between us all. An Indian person may identify sometimes as Asian to outsiders mainly for the ethnic factor, yet look at the cultural gulf between India and Japan. Or Cambodia and Mongolia.

My country is Britain, I am British and the continent which I live on is Europe. I would say that is what the large proportion of people agree with.

[FlyingJesus]

Even on holiday anybody can see the slight, yet huge differences between us all

I see a slight yet huge difference between you and I does that mean you're a new country

You're also still using a totally false definition of "demos" which is pretty much the entire problem with your attempt at reasoning

[-:Undertaker:-]

I see a slight yet huge difference between you and I does that mean you're a new country

You're also still using a totally false definition of "demos" which is pretty much the entire problem with your attempt at reasoning

To be a democracy or a functional state, you need a demos aka a people with something in common for it to work.

Otherwise Yugoslavia, Soviet Union, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Czechslovakia, The Sudan and on and on and on and on and on.

demos

ˈdiːmɒs/
noun
noun: Demos; plural noun: Demoi; noun: demos; plural noun: demoses

the common people of an ancient Greek state.

I'm not going to keep going over this with you if you can't understand it.

[FlyingJesus]

lol that use of common means "not the nobility", not a bunch of people who are supposedly clones. Also we're not an ancient Greek state, so let's use the definition that IS applicable to the present world:
The populace of a democracy as a political unit
Nothing about having to think or look or act like each other, just have to be within a democratic unit

[-:Undertaker:-]

lol that use of common means "not the nobility", not a bunch of people who are supposedly clones.

Those are your words, not mine.

The people of this country share many common instincts and beliefs which make them a nation, as is the case with every other nation.

Also we're not an ancient Greek state, so let's use the definition that IS applicable to the present world:
The populace of a democracy as a political unit
Nothing about having to think or look or act like each other, just have to be within a democratic unit

Like Yugoslavia and Iraq?

Yes, throwing different peoples under the same legal and political system has worked so well in the past hasn't it. :rolleyes:

[FlyingJesus]

I'm not talking about what works, I'm talking what is true and what is made up by you to suit your own purposes

[-:Undertaker:-]

@FlyingJesus;

Oh Tom stop being a John Lennon and pretending all different peoples could live under the same political and legal system. It's such rot and any historian or political theorist would laugh you out of the room. Even the EU/pan-Euro groups know it would need this hence why they pour millions into Euro 'culture' programmes. In any case, by admitting false nations such as the examples I have provided don't work you've invalidated your own argument.

[FlyingJesus]

Oh Tom stop being a John Lennon and pretending all different peoples could live under the same political and legal system.

I've never said that and I certainly don't believe it. I even said in my opening post that I'm not pro-EU, I'm just also not pro-bull

It's such rot and any historian or political theorist would laugh you out of the room. Even the EU/pan-Euro groups know it would need this hence why they pour millions into Euro 'culture' programmes.

That's great but nothing at all to do with what I've said. You're really not very good at this

In any case, by admitting false nations such as the examples I have provided don't work you've invalidated your own argument.

No I haven't because my argument is literally just about the definition of words. What else is it that you think I'm trying to argue here?

[-:Undertaker:-]

@FlyingJesus;

Still all over the place, what a joke.

Once I pin him on why certain nations won't work as they're created from separate cultural groups and lack a common people aka a demos, he falls apart and just witters on about us not being in ancient Greece despite not understanding that the word democracy comes from the word demos as it is generally accepted that for a democracy to function you need a common people who share broadly similar beliefs. Otherwise you end up with Yugoslavia and Iraq style scenarios.

But no, John Lennon Tom knows better.

[FlyingJesus]

Or you know, I never said any of that and you're shooting down straw men. I can't believe I have to say this in every thread but do try at least once reading what my actual argument is instead of making up what you want me to have said and running with it. Mudslinging and ignorance aren't going to help you here, you're just looking stupid as usual by posting a string of lies