A question to people who post in this section regularly

[Agesilaus]

Informing of mistakes is far too gentle, they should be warned for continually abusing their powers. Afterall, badly reading the threads and infracting for the wrong reasons is, in terms of power, abuse.

All infractions and warnings are checked by a Super Moderator, and if a Super Moderator gave you the warning/infraction, it is checked by a different Super Moderator. This is to double check that the warning/infraction is fair. Reporting infraction/warnings ensures it further since a different moderator (one that might not have checked it might look into it) and it will be reviewed again. So up to 3 different Super Moderators can check to see if the offence deserved that form of action.

There is a limit to educating a lost cause, and if they don't learn to read the main part of a story, why keep them when they're causing problems down the line for someone to remove the warnings? This is, of course related to the main reason this thread was created.

This is also a responsibility the Super Moderator has, which is to make sure warnings and infractions are fairly given by all moderators and other Super Moderators. That's apart of our job and personally, I don't mind going through infractions and warnings to check for any mistakes and reverse if necessary.

[Adzeh]

Malfunctioning was the best way to put it, and there a few moderators who do like to abuse their ability to warn and infract and they don't seem to learn. Their excuse is that "If you want it removed, report it" and they probably know they've done wrong.Obviously you can educate them, but if they don't learn, why keep them when they're causing problems for the administrators who have to remove the warnings? Abusing their powers doesn't necessarily mean, they're going to use them because they're higher than anyone, it means they're using them wrongly by using them whenever they see fit. They are, in this case abusing their powers. If they were abusing members, I would of simply said they're abusing the members, which is completely different.

There is a limit to educating a lost cause, and if they don't learn to read the main part of a story, why keep them when they're causing problems down the line for someone to remove the warnings? This is, of course related to the main reason this thread was created. There is something wrong with the moderation team, they're not learning to read into things. Someone may call another an idiot, but is that offensive? Not entirely, most of the time it's used playfully and truthfully. How else would you call someone idiotic, especially when the person on the receiving end is normally an idiot. It's not about the moderator having a personal look at something, if they remove threads which they predict will be argumentative in the very negative side of the word, then they shouldn't of been hired because their personal judgement is what, in reality, they're hired for. To hire a Moderator, they must have an analytic mind and read the facts before taking action with a personality that does this.

You do raise a very good point and I respect you for that.

I think you misunderstood my explanation of abuse of powers, or I simply didn't explain it well. In my opinion abuse of moderator powers is when a moderator will take action in a thread for the sake of it, not because they feel that a rule is being broken. It has always been an issue in some areas of the forum, where moderators are continually editing threads and posts, in order to boost their moderator logs for the particular month. This is an issue that I want to raise with the forum management when I get chance.

In actual fact, when I was a moderator back in the day, we were encouraged to gain as many moderator logs as possible. Those who did not gain many moderator logs in a particular period were warned, and then ultimately dismissed. There was no consideration put it to the point that a moderator can be good, even if they have very few logs. This can of course mean that they are lazy, or infact mean that they are extremely good at application of the rules, and know when it is necessary to infract/warn or edit posts/threads.

Yes there is a limit to education and, while it does not happen very often, moderators who are clearly not up to the job are dismissed. However this happens very rarely since we have such a good Forum Management team; weak moderators are identified during their trial periods and if the management feel they are not improving, these trialists will not make the cut to full time staff.

[Catzsy]

A moderator is a person, not a piece of technology, and cannot therefore malfunction . I will also say that a mistake by a moderator does not count as a abuse. Abuse of powers is a serious affair, and is where a moderator knowingly uses their superior powers within a forum, without any need or warrant for it. In this case, the moderator is either severly warned or dismissed completely.

I would never for a moment agree that we should warn our moderators for making mistakes. Education and advice are the best way to ensure that the mistakes are not repeated, since it shows compassion to the staff from the management, instead of cold hard slavedriving. Remember, our moderators are volunteers, and it is not good practice for managers to be harsh on the efforts of a volunteer.

If mistakes are continually being made, then of course further action is needed. But in my experience, once a mistake has been made and the moderator in question has been confronted about it, the mistake will not happen again. The moderators do receive monthly reports by the management in which their infraction reversal ratios are discussed and any problems with moderating by the entire team, or individuals, are discussed.



Well I would agree that it was wrong to close a thread due to this, however I still back Aflux and his ability as a moderator; he is commited and professional in the way he does his work, qualities which are often hard to come by.

It is places like this that issues need to be brought up, and then the issues can be discussed with staff members in question. Providing the staff member can accept that they are in the wrong, and take measures to ensure that they shape their future work accordingly, I have absolutely no quarrels with a mistake being made.

If users in the Web section feel that moderation is becoming to harsh, they are always welcome to PM the (Assistant) Forum Manager who can look into it. A good measure of excessively harsh moderating is the infraction/warning reversal ratio in particular sections.

I did not comment on Aflux's ability as a moderator or indeed want to question it - I am sure he is all those things you say and we have all made mistakes. There is no denying that. This is the feedback section though and the thread starter made a valid point. Personally as a new Mod or Smod I think i would refrain from commenting in these threads until I had gained some experience and leave it to the ones who have been doing the job a lot longer otherwise they could risk looking silly.

[Mentor]

Does that mean that all you guys come here for is an argument? Clearly the forum has gone to pot, but not by effect of management :S

I come to many forums and use many services for precisely that reason. Its not called a discussion board for nothing, its not called a forum for nothing? Wana look up the means of both those words? Debate and Argument are the core reason forums exist.

What do you talk about if everyone always agrees on everything?

Personally as a new Mod or Smod I think i would refrain from commenting in these threads until I had gained some experience and leave it to the ones who have been doing the job a lot longer otherwise they could risk looking silly.

I would kinda disagree, if you cant antiquity deafened or justify a decision, then you really shouldn't have made it. Id rather look silly than incompetent.

[Catzsy]

I come to many forums and use many services for precisely that reason. Its not called a discussion board for nothing, its not called a forum for nothing? Wana look up the means of both those words? Debate and Argument are the core reason forums exist.

What do you talk about if everyone always agrees on everything?


I would kinda disagree, if you cant antiquity deafened or justify a decision, then you really shouldn't have made it. Id rather look silly than incompetent.

Well yes that is true as well.

[GommeInc]

What do you talk about if everyone always agrees on everything?

How nice a cake is. Although, would you be able to agree to the same amount of niceness as someone else?

But as you have said, the core reason for forums is for arguments which, if no one has noticed, is the core of debating. You have an argument, someone has a counter argument, hey presto, a debate!

[Adzeh]

I come to many forums and use many services for precisely that reason. Its not called a discussion board for nothing, its not called a forum for nothing? Wana look up the means of both those words? Debate and Argument are the core reason forums exist.

I fail to see the need for you to say something like that. In this context it just sounds rude and abtrusive and simply insults my intelligence; I would find it hard to believe that an Assistant General Manager of a site with a forum such as this would not know the meaning of the word "forum" .

Yes this forum is for discussion and debating, but if you* have just come for a full blown, mindless argument with other users, and are happy to turn genuinely friendly discussion threads into unwarranted and sometimes abusive arguments, then this forum is unfortunately not the place for you.

I also disagree with your last statement, in my opinion, forums exist for discussion and information gaining/giving between users in a socially positive environment.

* The word you is used as a general term for the members of this forum, not as a specific term for any one member .

[Mentor]

I fail to see the need for you to say something like that. In this context it just sounds rude and abtrusive and simply insults my intelligence; I would find it hard to believe that an Assistant General Manager of a site with a forum such as this would not know the meaning of the word "forum" .

So rather than a simple misunderstanding, youd rather i take it that you for all intensive purpose's asked "Do all you guys come to a debate to a debate"... ? o.0

Yes this forum is for discussion and debating, but if you* have just come for a full blown, mindless argument with other users, and are happy to turn genuinely friendly discussion threads into unwarranted and sometimes abusive arguments, then this forum is unfortunately not the place for you.

So where agreed forums are a place for civil debate and augment?

* The word you is used as a general term for the members of this forum, not as a specific term for any one member .

Alot of people, me included, probably find it rude when you talk down to them. May i remind you, despite your position you are also a member of this forum, just like everyone else.

[Adzeh]

Now that just seems pedantic to me. I see no instance in any of my posts within this thread where I have talked down to anybody; I am under no impression that I am not a user of this board, and I actually find it quite insulting for anybody to suggest that I am looking down on anybody simply because of my position as AGM.

So rather than a simple misunderstanding, youd rather i take it that you for all intensive purpose's asked "Do all you guys come to a debate to a debate"... ? o.0

I never understood that... I never asked the question in that way, I simply asked the question "Does that mean that all you guys come here for is an argument?" to support my point made in that particular post. Obviously it was implied that by "argument" I was referring to the more heated arguments that take place on this board.

[Catzsy]

Now that just seems pedantic to me. I see no instance in any of my posts within this thread where I have talked down to anybody; I am under no impression that I am not a user of this board, and I actually find it quite insulting for anybody to suggest that I am looking down on anybody simply because of my position as AGM.



I never understood that... I never asked the question in that way, I simply asked the question "Does that mean that all you guys come here for is an argument?" to support my point made in that particular post. Obviously it was implied that by "argument" I was referring to the more heated arguments that take place on this board.

Well I hate to say this Adzeh, I agree with Mentor, but they do come across as being somewhat superior even though perhaps it is not a conscious thing. Indeed I have seen this slightly snooty tone practised by quite a few of the staff lately. Sorry