The difference between a Argument and a Debate

[JackBuddy]

[quote=Favourtism;4410620]Have you not seen Jays posts? [quote]
You never told me why you closed my thread, I explained that the other one was closed, but you chose to ignore me.

I don't see how you can say that considering I continued to moderate the thread over the 260 replies it had. The thread was closed for a very good reason, members were posting off-topic, being rude to members and being rude to the new HabboX's who also use this forum. As a mod we have to follow the mod guide and enforce the rules even if a couple of member's like yourself were having a good debate.

With the new thread being posted, personally I didn't have a problem with it as long as you kept it clean and stayed on-topic.

Well there was an active discussion, you only needed to edit some posts and give warnings, no reason to close it.
You should also explain at the end of the thread why you closed it too...

[Mentor]

I don't really think i need to point out the correlation between "opposing viewpoints." and "oral disagreement; verbal opposition;"

Unless you plan to debate telepathically at least.

[Catzsy]

Habbo X thread
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=450530

I have been through the above Habbox X thread and out of 265 posts there were 12 edits of minor rudeness although I cannot for the life of me think what was rude about this:S
Link: http://www.habboxforum.com/showpost....4&postcount=16

That is not even a 5% rule breaking average and there was really nothing
very rude at all.

In addition there were approximately 8 off topics by about 3 people one of which was this - again it was a reasonable question.

Link:http://www.habboxforum.com/showpost....&postcount=264

This just looks like a long normal Habbo UK thread to me with a lot of strong opinions I agree but it was certainly not continuous rule breaking of a serious nature or hardly warrants as much spamming at all.

In my opinion closing this thread was harsh particuarly as there was very little rule breaking apparent when it was. I also see a lot of closed threads where people have duplicated subjects or put threads in the forum where there is a stickie which used to be merged with the appropriate thread:S

Then when JackBuddy wanted to continue the discussion on the Habbox X's it was closed straightway - I can see no reason for this at all, myself as there was no rule breaking in it and people would have only replied if they were interested in doing so.

Link: http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=450915


I would say that there was not really any reason at all to close this and although the rules are there to be followed it is obvious that a lot of people were genuinely interested in contributing to this thread including a lot of staff and Miss Alice.

The Habbo Section members is large are very loyal to this forum and I believe perhaps a little more common sense should have been applied here and maybe an Smod to check that threads are being closed correctly?

I am happy to nominate this for the council agenda if people want it.

Thanks

[GommeInc]

Habbo X thread
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=450530

I have been through the above Habbox X thread and out of 265 posts there were 12 edits of minor rudeness although I cannot for the life of me think what was rude about this:S
Link: http://www.habboxforum.com/showpost....4&postcount=16

That is not even a 5% rule breaking average and there was really nothing
very rude at all.

In addition there were approximately 8 off topics by about 3 people one of which was this - again it was a reasonable question.

Link:http://www.habboxforum.com/showpost....&postcount=264

This just looks like a long normal Habbo UK thread to me with a lot of strong opinions I agree but it was certainly not continuous rule breaking of a serious nature or hardly warrants as much spamming at all.

In my opinion closing this thread was harsh particuarly as there was very little rule breaking apparent when it was. I also see a lot of closed threads where people have duplicated subjects or put threads in the forum where there is a stickie which used to be merged with the appropriate thread:S

Then when JackBuddy wanted to continue the discussion on the Habbox X's it was closed straightway - I can see no reason for this at all, myself as there was no rule breaking in it and people would have only replied if they were interested in doing so.

Link: http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=450915


I would say that there was not really any reason at all to close this and although the rules are there to be followed it is obvious that a lot of people were genuinely interested in contributing to this thread including a lot of staff and Miss Alice.

The Habbo Section members is large are very loyal to this forum and I believe perhaps a little more common sense should have been applied here and maybe an Smod to check that threads are being closed correctly?

I am happy to nominate this for the council agenda if people want it.

Thanks

Perhaps we could put something out about this for the council? Not sure how we could work around that though... Shall we discuss using the PM medium?

[Catzsy]

Perhaps we could put something out about this for the council? Not sure how we could work around that though... Shall we discuss using the PM medium?

Well we could talk about it in the Council Forum to get others views as there does seem to be a misunderstanding or varying standards in moderation when it comes to closing threads

[Favourtism]

[quote=JackBuddy;4411430][quote=Favourtism;4410620]Have you not seen Jays posts?

You never told me why you closed my thread, I explained that the other one was closed, but you chose to ignore me.


Well there was an active discussion, you only needed to edit some posts and give warnings, no reason to close it.
You should also explain at the end of the thread why you closed it too...

The previous thread about X's had just bene closed for lots of rulebreaking etc and then you create a new one. This new thread is just going to be the sam as the last one: basically a ray of insults towards habbo experts.

Habbo X thread
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=450530

I have been through the above Habbox X thread and out of 265 posts there were 12 edits of minor rudeness although I cannot for the life of me think what was rude about this:S
Link: http://www.habboxforum.com/showpost....4&postcount=16

That is not even a 5% rule breaking average and there was really nothing
very rude at all.

In addition there were approximately 8 off topics by about 3 people one of which was this - again it was a reasonable question.

Link:http://www.habboxforum.com/showpost....&postcount=264

This just looks like a long normal Habbo UK thread to me with a lot of strong opinions I agree but it was certainly not continuous rule breaking of a serious nature or hardly warrants as much spamming at all.

In my opinion closing this thread was harsh particuarly as there was very little rule breaking apparent when it was. I also see a lot of closed threads where people have duplicated subjects or put threads in the forum where there is a stickie which used to be merged with the appropriate thread:S

Then when JackBuddy wanted to continue the discussion on the Habbox X's it was closed straightway - I can see no reason for this at all, myself as there was no rule breaking in it and people would have only replied if they were interested in doing so.

Link: http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=450915


I would say that there was not really any reason at all to close this and although the rules are there to be followed it is obvious that a lot of people were genuinely interested in contributing to this thread including a lot of staff and Miss Alice.

The Habbo Section members is large are very loyal to this forum and I believe perhaps a little more common sense should have been applied here and maybe an Smod to check that threads are being closed correctly?

I am happy to nominate this for the council agenda if people want it.

Thanks

I would not of closed the original thread personally but another moderator did which I cannot be held responsible for. Then another thread was created and because the other thread was closed, I felt I should backup that moderator so I closed the new thread as all it would be is another attack on habbo experts.

[Agesilaus]

This is a very good post and it boils down to the age old arguement which
indirectly & partially led to me leaving the staff because I was so incensed that my training programme idea was hijacked and I was not going to have a part in it which led me to become revolting (yes I know to some I am just revolting ) The Mod staff need a structured training programme. It's really not good for the forum or the mods to have 10/12 new entrants just thrust onto the forum with 'read the guide and if you need to know anything pm me'. There could be one in place but having read this thread I tend to think not. If there is now please accept my apologies.

I have a great deal of respect for you reading my reasonably long post. I find some people don't like doing that. When I have a lot to say about an issue, I have a lot of points to make and it's good to see that someone has taken the time to listen.

About what you're saying here - a training system would be a good idea. With what we have now, we check infractions and if there is a problem with an infraction I tell the moderator who issued the infraction (well I do), this makes them better because they know what happened and if they disagree they can discuss that with me.

Another thing...

It's really not good for the forum or the mods to have 10/12 new entrants just thrust onto the forum with 'read the guide and if you need to know anything pm me'.

I find this only works with some mods. I get a little worried when a new mod doesn't ask questions about what to do and whatever when they might be inexperienced and might not have had a moderator's job on Habbox before, and are making mistakes/feeling nervous on their first time. I don't know if they're nervous to ask, they should never be. As long as they are asking someone when they're not sure, I'm happy.

There is a safety net in place for incorrect infractions because the Smods check each one but there doesn't seem to be any real 'quality control' about things like thread closures or even general attitudes of Mods.

Much like I said before, however, if we see moderators not doing exactly the correct thing, we send them PMs and help them out. It would be nice to have 'Problem Tracker' where everytime a moderator does something not exactly right or makes a mistake, we know about it. But that is just my imagination.

Habbo X thread
http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=450530

I have been through the above Habbox X thread and out of 265 posts there were 12 edits of minor rudeness although I cannot for the life of me think what was rude about this:S
Link: http://www.habboxforum.com/showpost....4&postcount=16

That is not even a 5% rule breaking average and there was really nothing
very rude at all.

I think there might have been a mistake made. I haven't gone through the thread, but from what you're saying here, I would, personally, allow that discussion to continue.

I also see a lot of closed threads where people have duplicated subjects or put threads in the forum where there is a stickie which used to be merged with the appropriate thread:S

If someone accidentally makes 2 threads saying the same thing with the same topic, then we can close one thread and allow the other one to continue. If someone makes a topic where the same topic is already undergoing discussion, we can close it and give a link to the active discussion. If there are two threads with some discussion about the same topic, then we can merge them (that's just logic in my opinion). Unless forum rules or management say otherwise, that's how I go about those situations anyway, and I'd say a lot of the others would do that as well?

Then when JackBuddy wanted to continue the discussion on the Habbox X's it was closed straightway - I can see no reason for this at all, myself as there was no rule breaking in it and people would have only replied if they were interested in doing so.

Link: http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=450915

I've had a look at this myself and I don't agree with the action taken. LIke I said before about this - if that thread was to lead into an argument and closed, and then another one lead into an argument (argument with rule breaking posts that is), then if ANOTHER thread is created about the same topic, then I wouldn't disagree with the moderator closing that thread and instructing the member not to create another thread about it.

The previous thread about X's had just bene closed for lots of rulebreaking etc and then you create a new one. This new thread is just going to be the sam as the last one: basically a ray of insults towards habbo experts.

It's a bit hard to say it's a definitely going to happen again. There is the possibility of members looking back at what happened in the other thread and say 'well I don't think we should argue in this thread because it might get closed' and they might not. But I do agree that if threads about the same topic are constantly closed for arguing and rule breaking and then created again, there is only one thing to expect.

I felt I should backup that moderator so I closed the new thread as all it would be is another attack on habbo experts.

I can understand why you've done this, but the moderator before has already done his stuff with the other thread and now I relate back to what I've been saying on this issue. I'm not telling everyone else not to do it, I just disagree with it.

[JackBuddy]

[quote=Favourtism;4412203][quote=JackBuddy;4411430]

Have you not seen Jays posts?
The previous thread about X's had just bene closed for lots of rulebreaking etc and then you create a new one. This new thread is just going to be the sam as the last one: basically a ray of insults towards habbo experts.


I would not of closed the original thread personally but another moderator did which I cannot be held responsible for. Then another thread was created and because the other thread was closed, I felt I should backup that moderator so I closed the new thread as all it would be is another attack on habbo experts.

We weren't insulting. There is nothing wrong with debating or discussing X's, afterall... it is a relevant thread. For all I know the other thread could have been closed for any reason. The MOD who closed it did not state why.

It was an interesting thread which was stupidly closed. As said above, maybe you should have dished out more warnings. Or even better, left us to it.