Cameron announces 'sovereignty act'

[BlueTango]

You lot argue over such stupid things, just put your differences aside and move on with the main discussion of the thread!

I hate David Cameron, always have always will!

[Wig44.]

You lot argue over such stupid things, just put your differences aside and move on with the main discussion of the thread!

I hate David Cameron, always have always will!

Such stupid things? How are they stupid?

[Robbie]

You lot argue over such stupid things, just put your differences aside and move on with the main discussion of the thread!

I hate David Cameron, always have always will!

If you don't understand how things are relevant to the thread, and how they are not pointless, then you should leave the thread as you obviously are not contributing and don't really understand.

[BlueTango]

They're stupid because in about 5 threads now people have just turnt it into a 'what has the eu ever done for us!?!?' thread....

Are you not a super moderator Robbie? Your definition of relevant is slightly unusual. How is a post about the pros and cons of the EU relevant to whether David Cameron can be trusted.
Sure, it vaguely relates to the Lisbon Treaty which has been formed by the EU, but if people want to argue over the EU, why don't they just make one big thread and save themselves the hassle.

[Wig44.]

They're stupid because in about 5 threads now people have just turnt it into a 'what has the eu ever done for us!?!?' thread....

Are you not a super moderator Robbie? Your definition of relevant is slightly unusual. How is a post about the pros and cons of the EU relevant to whether David Cameron can be trusted.
Sure, it vaguely relates to the Lisbon Treaty which has been formed by the EU, but if people want to argue over the EU, why don't they just make one big thread and save themselves the hassle.

The rule about off-topic posting was changed a long time ago to take into account the fact that a conversation in a thread can fall away from the original topic without any irrelevant posts. This has happened here, with the topics being so interconnected.

[Orangeesh]

lets face it, hes a douche bag.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Ardemax;

Since you have some sort of misconception that being part of the EU has more benefits than cons I thought I'd give you just a taste of the real EU:

There are EU laws which could make it a crime to participate in any activity that is 'contrary to the advancement of the EU' therefore members of anti-EU parties and people campaigning against the eu (perhaps even undertaker) could be arrested. Does this sound democratic to you? Personally it reminds me of the PRC.

If Britian entered the eurozone it would be required to hand over all gold and foreign currency (all of our pounds sterling for example) reserves to the ECB - this is to stop any eurozone country wishing to return to its own currency by preventing it from having the financial means to do so.

The proposed EU legal system is 'corpus juris' and this takes away a briton's right to be 'innocent until provent guilty'. I'm going to add a slight bit more detail to this, but very simple detail.

Our process is 1) Suspicion 2) Investigation 3) Arrest 4) Charge.

Continental law is 1) Suspicion 2) Arrest 3) Investigation 4) Charge.

Our Common Law, as far back as 1215 with Magna Carta, states that a citizen can only be judged by his peers (Section 39). These rights protect the individual against arbitrary conviction and imprisonment. Our Common Law recognises several vital rights to the citizen:

• The right of Habeas Corpus (that the accused must be taken to a public court within a very short period of time, usually 24 hours, and the accusers must produce their evidence then and there)
• The right to Trial by Jury at which jurors can in fact even disregard the law if they think it would give an unjust conviction. The jurors are thus ‘sovereign’
• If found innocent, the accused cannot be tried again on the same charge (‘double jeopardy’

In continental europe they have the Inquisitorial system:

• No Habeas Corpus so one can be imprisoned for very long periods (weeks, months, occasionally years) without any evidence being produced against you
• No right to Trial by Jury as their system involves judgements being made by a career judiciary who are the judges and prosecutors and who are, to all intents and purposes, ‘colleagues’ (a quite separate body of lawyers makes the defence and are often treated as inferiors)
• In most instances the accused can be tried a second time for the same offence, since the prosecution has the right of appeal against acquittal.

Following on from this, Europol (the EU 'police force') can detain you for up to 6 months without charging you of anything at all.

I have far, far more to tell. And these examples are by no means the most debilitating for the UK. So, what benefits were you talking about?

Totally agreed, and it seems that he himself and other eurocrats on this forum do not seem to have a reply to this detailed and good post, now theres a suprise!

[Ardemax]

Totally agreed, and it seems that he himself and other eurocrats on this forum do not seem to have a reply to this detailed and good post, now theres a suprise!

my god, shut up.

Edited by invincible (Forum Super Moderator): Please don't be rude

[-:Undertaker:-]

my god, shut up.

Come on Ardemax, reply to his post with your reply instead of ignoring it!

[Wig44.]

Totally agreed, and it seems that he himself and other eurocrats on this forum do not seem to have a reply to this detailed and good post, now theres a suprise!

It's funny, however, that you seem to get a myriad of pro-EU replies when you are not asking them how the EU benefits us, but when you state your beliefs of a Britain without the EU. I want to see evidence, but since none is posted I'll assume they have none.