Cameron makes offer to Lib Dems on government

[jam666]

WHAT STATISTIC? My party is a minority party but thats irrelevant? The vote for electoral reform is a great deal larger than that against it which is why PR should be pushed in negotiations. The government represents the public, that is their function. If the public wants it then it should be put into place.

This is the third attempt now and you seem to be unable to calculate basic maths. Up until the night of the election when an exit poll was released the labour party did not officially support electoral reform, they simply said that it will LOOK into it. However after the exit poll was released (which was VERY accurate) they changed their tune and vowed for reform to entice the lib dems. Therefore up until that point labour supporters did not vote labour for electoral reform.

Here are the calculations: 36.1% Conservative + 29% Labour = 65.1% which is the MAJORITY of the british people and they did NOT vote for electoral reform.

Well you forgot to read my post. Idiot. I clearly stated that the amnesty is not being implemented because it has not gained popular support, electoral reform on the other hand has. If you can provide me with statistics that show that the Conservatives won more votes than Labour, the Liberal Democrats, UKIP, Green party etc combined then I may agree with you. The government is supposed to represent the British people, as I keep saying with the YouGov poll which you have completely ignored, the British people want electoral reform.

No, electoral reform has not. So please stop stating this point as it is fundamentally flawed. Im sorry but your clearly the idiot here who seems to think that every single person who voted for UKIP, GREEN, LIB DEM, BNP and whoever else went out and voted for them because of PR as the truth is THEY DIDNT.

I never said it didn't favour Labour you just jumped to conclusions. I am fully aware of the electoral system and it undoubtedly favours Labour and the Conservatives over all other parties as I have repeatedly said.

You have still failed to address my point by repeating yourself yet again even though i clearly outlined why FPTP CLEARLY FAVOURS LABOUR over the Conservatives. You, your party and other minority partys simply want PR so they can have a taste of power after over a century of exclusion from government. Im telling you now IT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

So you are admitting that your party is at fault.?

You are on a different planet as i never said anything of the sort i was outlining the opinions and beliefs of the majority of the Conservative Party. Is there something you dont understand about RUMOURS? it means that they are not FACT which entails that they have not being PROVEN.

Thats odd, you seem to be seeing a completely different TV programme to me and everyone else. In fact John Prescott has tweeted about the poll several times. How very strange. Also you can't definitively say that "82% of the Conservative party" want this, it's not a fact at all. Its a sample of a small proportion of the party and judging by Sky News' Polls in the past it won't be very accurate.

Oh im sorry but judging by what you have just said, your YouGov poll cannot definately say that 62% of people want PR. John Prescott can scream and squark all he wants hes not even an MP anymore. I watched Sky News myself and you can go to their website and LOOK UP the first debate and READ what they said and that was that NICK CLEGG won by 51% of the vote so do not start twisitng things.

The 82% figure was NOT FROM SKY NEWS!. I am an OFFICIAL member of the Conservative Party and recieved an EMAIL with the results of the poll of which we were asked about a few days ago. Unfortunately your not and therefore have no right to comment on whether or not the poll was legit. As a result it is a FACT which cannot be disputed as all CURRENT MEMBERS of the Conservative party were asked and the results of the poll were posted.

[MrPinkPanther]

This is the third attempt now and you seem to be unable to calculate basic maths. Up until the night of the election when an exit poll was released the labour party did not officially support electoral reform, they simply said that it will LOOK into it. However after the exit poll was released (which was VERY accurate) they changed their tune and vowed for reform to entice the lib dems. Therefore up until that point labour supporters did not vote labour for electoral reform.

Here are the calculations: 36.1% Conservative + 29% Labour = 65.1% which is the MAJORITY of the british people and they did NOT vote for electoral reform.

For Gods sake, read what I said. It IS in their 2010 Manifesto and always has been.
http://senateforbritain.org/blog/201...endum-by-2011/

No, electoral reform has not. So please stop stating this point as it is fundamentally flawed. Im sorry but your clearly the idiot here who seems to think that every single person who voted for UKIP, GREEN, LIB DEM, BNP and whoever else went out and voted for them because of PR as the truth is THEY DIDNT.

NO but your argument has been throughout this thread that people voted Conservative and therefore do not want electoral reform. I am simply using your prerogative. You cannot have it both ways.

You have still failed to address my point by repeating yourself yet again even though i clearly outlined why FPTP CLEARLY FAVOURS LABOUR over the Conservatives. You, your party and other minority partys simply want PR so they can have a taste of power after over a century of exclusion from government. Im telling you now IT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

ONCE AGAIN CAN YOU NOT READ WHAT I HAVE SAID?

Did I say that it didn't favour Labour over the Tories? NO. It does however favour both Labour AND the Tories over everyone else because it discounts and essentially wastes all their votes. It keeps the constant rotation of Labour and Tory governments which is why the Tories are so eager to keep it.

It favours Labour over the Tories but that doesn't stop it from favouring the Tories over every other non-Labour party. Whilst FPTP is in place there will be an endless rotation of Conservative and Labour governments which is why the Tories are so eager to keep it.

You are on a different planet as i never said anything of the sort i was outlining the opinions and beliefs of the majority of the Conservative Party. Is there something you dont understand about RUMOURS? it means that they are not FACT which entails that they have not being PROVEN.

You can't say its the views of the majority of the Conservative party because you don't know that.

Oh im sorry but judging by what you have just said, your YouGov poll cannot definately say that 62% of people want PR.

I've said the latest YouGov poll shows that 62% of people want PR. I have not definitively said 62% of people want PR because that is wrong unless you poll every person in the country. You on the other hand said "82% of Conservatives are against it. FACT."

I watched Sky News myself and you can go to their website and LOOK UP the first debate and READ what they said and that was that NICK CLEGG won by 51% of the vote so do not start twisitng things.

Well you were obviously watching something different to everyone else because its well known that they changed the results after.

The 82% figure was NOT FROM SKY NEWS!. I am an OFFICIAL member of the Conservative Party and recieved an EMAIL with the results of the poll of which we were asked about a few days ago. Unfortunately your not and therefore have no right to comment on whether or not the poll was legit. As a result it is a FACT which cannot be disputed as all CURRENT MEMBERS of the Conservative party were asked and the results of the poll were posted.

I've been hoping you'd say this. My Brother works for the Conservative party and a local right wing think tank and I just had a little chat with him, no such poll exists. He says Conservative HQ are keeping stum about reception towards the Liberal Democrats at the moment from fear of jeopardising a coalition. Care to explain?

[jam666]

For Gods sake, read what I said. It IS in their 2010 Manifesto and always has been.
http://senateforbritain.org/blog/201...endum-by-2011/

Oh dear, were still not getting anywhere. Of course it been a well known fact that labour want PR for the lords but were talking about the commons here and that page makes absolutely no mention whatsoever on a potential voting system change for the commons.

NO but your argument has been throughout this thread that people voted Conservative and therefore do not want electoral reform. I am simply using your prerogative. You cannot have it both ways.

Im simply having it one way and that is that the people who voted Conservative do NOT want electoral reform as it was not featured in their manifesto and is opposed by the Conservative party therefore all of the voters who did vote for the Conservatives did NOT vote for electoral reform, they instead voted for political reform which are two entirely different things

ONCE AGAIN CAN YOU NOT READ WHAT I HAVE SAID?

Of course I can read what you said and I gave an appropriate response, but have you ever thought about the people who vote conservative but still have a lib or lab MP?, therefore your saying their vote is wasted too, which I agree is but at the end of the day its our electoral system which has elected credible parliaments for decades. The movement for PR only exists for selfish reason from the minority party's.

You can't say its the views of the majority of the Conservative party because you don't know that.

I do. Every single member of the Conservative party was polled and the result was that 82% of Conservatives are against a coalition with the Lib Dems and would much prefer a minority government. Not the people who voted conservative as they might not be conservative party members. They are two entirely different groups of people.

I've said the latest YouGov poll shows that 62% of people want PR. I have not definitively said 62% of people want PR because that is wrong unless you poll every person in the country. You on the other hand said "82% of Conservatives are against it. FACT."

Hang on a minute, your basically just repeating what I said about your figures earlier on. True I said 82% of conservatives are against it FACT because it is a FACT but you can not say anything about the yougov poll implying that it is fact and then come out a few hours later and state exactly what I said about your post earlier on.

Well you were obviously watching something different to everyone else because its well known that they changed the results after.

Yeah im sure my tv wasnt even switched on and therefore cannot possibly comment on the result of the first poll?. I watched it and the instant poll of which sky news agreed with IMMEDIATELY after the first debate was 51%. if you disagree with me then look it up but im simply stating what sky news have stated from the very beginning.

I've been hoping you'd say this. My Brother works for the Conservative party and a local right wing think tank and I just had a little chat with him, no such poll exists. He says Conservative HQ are keeping stum about reception towards the Liberal Democrats at the moment from fear of jeopardising a coalition. Care to explain?

I'd love to explain. Im all for political variation within family's but your situation seems a little too extreme. I myself and other party members were discussing this email in depth at local office today ( I volunteer a few days a week ) and it was very interesting because the poll reflected our opinions on a party wide basis.


However Conservative HQ are not keeping stum about the reception towards the lib dems as they already know the party wide persona of the lib dems and therefore have no chance of jeopardising a potential coalition. Why do you think they polled party members anyway? Ill tell you why and that is to make sure there wont be any jeopardising of a potential coalition as a result of Conservative party members.