UK, France, and others preparing to attack Libya.

[StefanWolves]

Ugh just shut up.

No of course its not right - I was well aware and have been well aware of the nastiness of the Gaddafi regime for a long period now, whereas most people in support of this war have probably only heard of him in the past few weeks. But anyway here's a question for you; do you think what Bahrain, Zimbabwe, China, Burma, Ivory Coast, Saudi Arabia and Yemen have done/are doing to their subjects and citizens is right? I very much doubt you do, so whats the point you are trying to make?



You mean like you do by posting news updates in one thread similar to the way a bot does, with no opinion given and when your opinion is challenged you simply ignore it and keep on posting more updates? Pot kettle black springs to mind. If you are in fully support of this war and believe it to be right, you should be able to reply to me and others and prove us wrong, I await a proper reply rather than sly little digs like the one you've just posted.

Anybody want to justify the wests stance on foreign affairs before we end up with more of our girls and boys returning in body bags?

Edited by Infectious (Forum Moderator): Please do not make pointless and rude posts!

[-:Undertaker:-]

Ugh just shut up.

Thats the response you can muster? at the start of this thread you were only too keen on lecturing other people, arguing in favour of this war and throwing insults around at those who disagreed with you. As the saying goes; if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.

You called Ayd and MrJordan ignorant.. I think you have shown that in your own behaviour to be false, perhaps an apology to them is needed?

[The Don]

No of course its not right - I was well aware and have been well aware of the nastiness of the Gaddafi regime for a long period now
If you agree that it's wrong what he is doing, Why do you oppose so much what we are doing?

whereas most people in support of this war have probably only heard of him in the past few weeks. But anyway here's a question for you; do you think what Bahrain, Zimbabwe, China, Burma, Ivory Coast, Saudi Arabia and Yemen have done/are doing to their subjects and citizens is right?
No, I don't think it's right what they are doing. But, it isn't as bad over there as it has been for libya when we decided to get involved. We let it happen for a while, and then it got to the stage where it's at the brink of civil war over there. Then we get involved.

You may think that we are only in it for the oil, but I would like to think that not everything is a conspiracy theory. We didn't do anything at first, when the situation was similar to Bahrain, Zimbabwe, China, Burma, Ivory Coast, Saudi Arabia, but when an Evil dictator starts using his air force, slaughtering innocent people, and the people working for him are no doubt being forced to.

I think that if Abdullah Bin Abdul Aziz (Saudi Arabia's King) Started firing into crowds of protestors and started slaughtering them, then yes, I think we probably would get involved in it, and rightly so.

I very much doubt you do, so whats the point you are trying to make?

It's not as bad, although it is still wrong what is happening over there, but I'm quite sure when any country starts shooting at it's people when they protest for freedom, Somebody should get involved and help.

My replies are in red.

[kuzkasate]

Do you people seriously not know what Gadaffi is like? You think he will just let America, France & UK attack them? Gadaffi himself said that he treats what the UK, France & America did as an act of terrorism. You know what Gadaffi is like and I would not be surprised if he carried out terrorist acts here in the UK.

What is the point in this whole thing? Civilians are still getting killed, only this time not by Gadaffi, but by Ameirca, France and the UK. Here I quote from BBC News "48 civilians have been killed and more than 100 wounded." These people are being killed by America, UK and France. So what is the point?

But why is the US backing force in Libya but not in Yemen or Bahrain where DOZENS have been slaughtered? After all, all three states have been using violence to crush pro-democracy protests. I'll tell you why, because the Arabs are behind it, everybody knows that and quite frankly, the Arabs are licking America's ass, therefore America and the rest of America's ass lickers, close their eyes.

Its pathetic. America only ever attack the weak countries and have trouble handling them, I'd love to see them attack a strong and powerful country.

[Marbian]

Do you people seriously not know what Gadaffi is like? You think he will just let America, France & UK attack them? Gadaffi himself said that he treats what the UK, France & America did as an act of terrorism. You know what Gadaffi is like and I would not be surprised if he carried out terrorist acts here in the UK.

What is the point in this whole thing? Civilians are still getting killed, only this time not by Gadaffi, but by Ameirca, France and the UK. Here I quote from BBC News "48 civilians have been killed and more than 100 wounded." These people are being killed by America, UK and France. So what is the point?

But why is the US backing force in Libya but not in Yemen or Bahrain where DOZENS have been slaughtered? After all, all three states have been using violence to crush pro-democracy protests. I'll tell you why, because the Arabs are behind it, everybody knows that and quite frankly, the Arabs are licking America's ass, therefore America and the rest of America's ass lickers, close their eyes.

Its pathetic. America only ever attack the weak countries and have trouble handling them, I'd love to see them attack a strong and powerful country.

I totally agree. But there is always one thing we all forget... Gaddafi is just like Obama, David Cameron, etc.. What would Obama do if his people went against him, with weapons? Only because we're not Libya, and nothing to do with them... Doesn't mean he is actually a bad person. Our government have killed people, only because it's OUR GOVERNMENT doesn't make us better people...

He now will see us as a threat, not a friend, because we're basically helping the people throw him out. Which quite frankly, is kind of fair. What would we do, if they came here with there army when the big protest was goin on in London saying they will take over the police force because how they use violents on us, and them and there country didnt like it... would david cameron allow them? surely not.

and i know gaddafi is killing people, but what can he do when thugs are using weaponery? let them... yet again, surely not. and im sure if people in england came out with weapons, they'll get the army on the streets too.

[jamiet]

What is the point in this whole thing? Civilians are still getting killed, only this time not by Gadaffi, but by Ameirca, France and the UK. Here I quote from BBC News "48 civilians have been killed and more than 100 wounded." These people are being killed by America, UK and France. So what is the point?

That's completely unconfirmed, that's what libyan state TV are saying you can't believe a word they say.


"There are no independent confirmation of the deaths and UK Finance Minister George Osborne told the BBC that such claims should be treated with caution as the military was striving to avoid civilian casualties."

"Adm Mullen also said he had not received any reports of civilian deaths or injuries."

Source BBC

[-:Undertaker:-]

If you agree that it's wrong what he is doing, Why do you oppose so much what we are doing?

Because of the following reasons;

• We are going in for oil and influence, not for democracy or human rights (see examples of Saudi Arabia and Bahrain).
• We have supported Gaddafi for over a decade upto this point, I am now being told by our politicians that we need to go in to help free the Libyan people when they have been the ones supporting him for 10 years+.
• I do not think the western world has a right anymore to police the world, and only leads to blowback on our own soil.
• We do not have the financial power anymore to act even if we wanted to, the western world is bankrupt and cannot afford this action.
• I do not think British men and women should die when this country has not been threatened.
• I do not like first hand aggression, had Gaddafi declared war on the west then that would be a different story.

No, I don't think it's right what they are doing. But, it isn't as bad over there as it has been for libya when we decided to get involved. We let it happen for a while, and then it got to the stage where it's at the brink of civil war over there. Then we get involved.

The regimes are just as brutal as one another, Saudi Arabia has sent in troops to Bahrain (basically an invasion in all but name) in order to shoot innocents alongside the Bahrain armed forces. The exact same is happening right now in the Ivory Coast, Yemen and Oman - where are their no fly zones?

You may think that we are only in it for the oil, but I would like to think that not everything is a conspiracy theory. We didn't do anything at first, when the situation was similar to Bahrain, Zimbabwe, China, Burma, Ivory Coast, Saudi Arabia, but when an Evil dictator starts using his air force, slaughtering innocent people, and the people working for him are no doubt being forced to.

The exact same has happened, is happening in those countries you listed. Why is it that the west only attacks and acts in the name of democracy (not forgetting that we had previously supported these dictators) when the country involved just happens to have vast mineral reserves, oil reserves and has no real structured armed forces.

Like the playground bully, we'll only pick off the weak guys who have the sweets we want.

I think that if Abdullah Bin Abdul Aziz (Saudi Arabia's King) Started firing into crowds of protestors and started slaughtering them, then yes, I think we probably would get involved in it, and rightly so.

Thats what his troops are doing right now in Bahrain, backing up the Bahrain armed forces.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-shooting.html

It's not as bad, although it is still wrong what is happening over there, but I'm quite sure when any country starts shooting at it's people when they protest for freedom, Somebody should get involved and help.

So where is the west when needed in Tibet, China, Burma, Zimbabwe, Saudi Arabia, Algeria, Oman, Yemen, Bahrain.. to cite recent examples. The idea that we are going in to help the people is ludricious, you are being fed complete nonsense by a group of politicians who had supported Gaddafi and his brutal regime upto only a few weeks ago.

What makes it even more warped is the fact that i'm giving you and others the ongoing example of Bahrain and Saudi Arabia, yet its just being dismissed as though something we do not want to hear. This happens all the time, we get into bed with a brutal dictator (Saddam Hussein, Bin Laden, Mubarak, Ali, Gaddafi) and then when we are shown up for what we are, hypocrites, the same politicians come to the rescue as though they are shining knights of horseback.

45 minutes before Saddam launches his WMD at London/Gulf of Tonkin incident.. we've heard it all before, stop believing this nonsense.

That's completely unconfirmed, that's what libyan state TV are saying you can't believe a word they say.

"There are no independent confirmation of the deaths and UK Finance Minister George Osborne told the BBC that such claims should be treated with caution as the military was striving to avoid civilian casualties."

"Adm Mullen also said he had not received any reports of civilian deaths or injuries."

Source BBC

Like western media? they are at it aswell, here it is from the horses mouth (you wouldn't see this on BBC or Sky);

[kuzkasate]

That's completely unconfirmed, that's what libyan state TV are saying you can't believe a word they say.


"There are no independent confirmation of the deaths and UK Finance Minister George Osborne told the BBC that such claims should be treated with caution as the military was striving to avoid civilian casualties."

"Adm Mullen also said he had not received any reports of civilian deaths or injuries."

Source BBC

See how its only the BBC that reports it as unconfirmed, yet in other countries, like Russia (I know this because I have the Russian News channel, Vesti) it IS confirmed, along with a lot of other countries. The UK, France & America will deny it all they can, because thats what they do, if they do admitt to killing civilians can you imagine how angered the Libyan people will be and the people at home in the UK? Trying to stop Gadaffi killing civilians, yet they go in and kill more? You may think the BBC is un-biased, but trust me, it is not.

[StefanWolves]

me lecturing people? wtf. you only have to look at the size of your posts to realise who it is thats trying to lecture people.

Thats the response you can muster? at the start of this thread you were only too keen on lecturing other people, arguing in favour of this war and throwing insults around at those who disagreed with you. As the saying goes; if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.

You called Ayd and MrJordan ignorant.. I think you have shown that in your own behaviour to be false, perhaps an apology to them is needed?

[Chippiewill]

Because of the following reasons;

• We are going in for oil and influence, not for democracy or human rights (see examples of Saudi Arabia and Bahrain).
• We have supported Gaddafi for over a decade upto this point, I am now being told by our politicians that we need to go in to help free the Libyan people when they have been the ones supporting him for 10 years+.
• I do not think the western world has a right anymore to police the world, and only leads to blowback on our own soil.
• We do not have the financial power anymore to act even if we wanted to, the western world is bankrupt and cannot afford this action.
• I do not think British men and women should die when this country has not been threatened.
• I do not like first hand aggression, had Gaddafi declared war on the west then that would be a different story.

Blablahblahblahblah

We all know the real reason is so that you can slam the bigger parties hoping that someone will take notice and actually vote for UKIP. What you've actually neglected to notice is that UKIP will actually have to make the exact same choice if they ever want to get elected into parliament within the next century.

[*]We are going in for oil and influence, not for democracy or human rights (see examples of Saudi Arabia and Bahrain).

Libya has pretty terrible oil.

[*]We have supported Gaddafi for over a decade upto this point, I am now being told by our politicians that we need to go in to help free the Libyan people when they have been the ones supporting him for 10 years+.

They have to draw a line somewhere, if they start invading countries because 'They're slightly upset about the way things are being run' the chinese will attack 'em whereas if they're terrorising their own people it's a whole different story. It might seem like a sharp contrast but that's politics.
[*]I do not think the western world has a right anymore to police the world, and only leads to blowback on our own soil.
Of course it doesn't have the right to police the world, but everyone has the right to take down some idiot who's firing at his own people.

[*]We do not have the financial power anymore to act even if we wanted to, the western world is bankrupt and cannot afford this action.

Christ, it's as if you think this'll cost a billion pounds per day, all they're doing is dropping a couple of missiles and deploying some planes.

[*]I do not think British men and women should die when this country has not been threatened.

Not yet at least, but if Gaddafi has the nerve to attack his own people then what's to stop him attacking others.

[*]I do not like first hand aggression, had Gaddafi declared war on the west then that would be a different story.

Regardless of the 'real' intentions that you have forged if we were to lose a soldier to save 100 Libyans then that's a victory for everyone except Gaddaff's terrible regime.

Essentially what you're saying is that we should have left Hitler to slaughter the Jews and slowly take over Europe and only react when the entire conquered planet is at our gates trying to invade. What you are suggesting is that we should have let Hitler slowly murder millions of people because "he wasn't attacking us yet".

Basically, you are a supporter of Hitler's holocaust.