International Side of Habbox

[Brad]

I agree with both sides here. I agree that when numbers start increasing that role will become needed but until then there's no need of an actual agm role.
The thought of an individual to take such role as to be the representative to be there to help drive that side can be valuable as GoldenMerc and many others have stated it has be be chosen properly.

I always feel whenever a feedback thread is made and there's a disagreement between two sides, everyone starts attacking eachother. A feedback thread is meant for suggestions, ideas, thoughts and in the end, whether or not it gets implemented is not up to anyone else but the AGMs and the GM. let them take what they have seen works and doesn't work. They ultimately have the final decision no matter how many posts we can write "defending" our ideas.

I personally love the idea of an individual as a power head encouraging all departments, and to lead the International side of Habbox to a place where it could potentially have life.
Sometimes all you have to do is give it a chance, if it doesn't work then it didn't work. If it does- perfect!

[Samantha]

It's all fine and good complaining about Habbox's international side when you are no longer part of the staff team, but it seems you're only an 'international Habbox member' when it's suits because you did nothing to improve the international side when you were Forum Manager.

When you were Forum Manager, there were no Happy Hours to boost posting, there weren't any for European members let alone Australian/New Zealand members, and you made probably around 10 (being very generous here) threads that weren't related to anything your job consisted of anyway; not only that, but little to none of them were made in international times, I believe the earliest was around 6:45am - when some European members are already up at that time! Admittedly your posts were suited to international times, but the bulk were posted on a Monday to reach your 15 posts then you'd hardly make any for the rest of the week.

This may sound harsh, but I don't see how someone can bring it up now, then say it shouldn't be down to just senior staff members, when, you were a manager and you still didn't do anything to cater for them; we don't know what it's like being an international forum member, but you do and had the chance to influence the international side so much, why didn't you? Yeah it's a bit late in the day to say this as you resigned months ago, but it was a problem then and is still a problem now!

Now I have nothing against you personally, and I would have said the same to anyone who mentioned it if I could (e.g. if they were a manager before etc.) so don't take this too personally!

As for the new roles - you don't 'need' any new roles, you could literally add the word 'international' to Hannah's usertitle for 'International Help Desk Staff' or to Flairr's for 'International Forum Moderator', but a word/name/role will not do anything so no I don't think any extra roles are needed, just more ideas that may be suited to them more and I agree with @GoldenMerc; if someone shows that drive to make the international side thrive then they could potentially be rewarded/promoted for it!

[scottish]

It's all fine and good complaining about Habbox's international side when you are no longer part of the staff team, but it seems you're only an 'international Habbox member' when it's suits because you did nothing to improve the international side when you were Forum Manager.

When you were Forum Manager, there were no Happy Hours to boost posting, there weren't any for European members let alone Australian/New Zealand members, and you made probably around 10 (being very generous here) threads that weren't related to anything your job consisted of anyway; not only that, but little to none of them were made in international times, I believe the earliest was around 6:45am - when some European members are already up at that time! Admittedly your posts were suited to international times, but the bulk were posted on a Monday to reach your 15 posts then you'd hardly make any for the rest of the week.

This may sound harsh, but I don't see how someone can bring it up now, then say it shouldn't be down to just senior staff members, when, you were a manager and you still didn't do anything to cater for them; we don't know what it's like being an international forum member, but you do and had the chance to influence the international side so much, why didn't you? Yeah it's a bit late in the day to say this as you resigned months ago, but it was a problem then and is still a problem now!

Now I have nothing against you personally, and I would have said the same to anyone who mentioned it if I could (e.g. if they were a manager before etc.) so don't take this too personally!

As for the new roles - you don't 'need' any new roles, you could literally add the word 'international' to Hannah's usertitle for 'International Help Desk Staff' or to Flairr's for 'International Forum Moderator', but a word/name/role will not do anything so no I don't think any extra roles are needed, just more ideas that may be suited to them more and I agree with @GoldenMerc; if someone shows that drive to make the international side thrive then they could potentially be rewarded/promoted for it!

oh shit son. I agree completely

[Martin]

Personally I don't think having an international AGM would work. There are plenty of ways the international side of things can be boosted without someone having those kind of permissions/authority. We have had plenty of international managers in the past and it hasn't really helped things that much, at the end of the day it's enthusiastic staff members who are keen to advertise and improve that side of things that we need. Sure, seniors are helpful too and will be great to monitor and supervise these staff during overnight periods, but at the end of the day it's down to the staff. When there are occasionally late night events they seem to be really popular, so there is definitely a market there, just need to ensure it's advertised really well.

Events organisers are able to add their own events now etc, so already it's much easier for things to run overnight than it used to be. You need a decent set of international events hosts/habboxlive DJ's and helpdesk staff and instantly things can improve. These staff members can easily be managed by current management too, there will be overlaps where both will be online, and there's plenty of ways to communicate.

I think having a separate side for the international stuff would cause even more segregation and cause communication to lapse even further, when really it's just a bit of teamwork and enthusiasm that's needed, and for the managers to put measures into place to actively encourage the international side of things to flourish, through the help of their international staff.

Back in 2011 we had quite a few international DJ's and events hosts and they were really good at keeping things alive at night, (the helpdesk would often be populated overnight too) yet we didn't need any additional agm roles or anything for this. Although I'll admit back then we also had GMT managers who were addicts and would stay online until 3/4am anyway as I did when I was agm. Insomnia rules!

[Matt]

It's all fine and good complaining about Habbox's international side when you are no longer part of the staff team, but it seems you're only an 'international Habbox member' when it's suits because you did nothing to improve the international side when you were Forum Manager.

When you were Forum Manager, there were no Happy Hours to boost posting, there weren't any for European members let alone Australian/New Zealand members, and you made probably around 10 (being very generous here) threads that weren't related to anything your job consisted of anyway; not only that, but little to none of them were made in international times, I believe the earliest was around 6:45am - when some European members are already up at that time! Admittedly your posts were suited to international times, but the bulk were posted on a Monday to reach your 15 posts then you'd hardly make any for the rest of the week.

This may sound harsh, but I don't see how someone can bring it up now, then say it shouldn't be down to just senior staff members, when, you were a manager and you still didn't do anything to cater for them; we don't know what it's like being an international forum member, but you do and had the chance to influence the international side so much, why didn't you? Yeah it's a bit late in the day to say this as you resigned months ago, but it was a problem then and is still a problem now!

Now I have nothing against you personally, and I would have said the same to anyone who mentioned it if I could (e.g. if they were a manager before etc.) so don't take this too personally!

As for the new roles - you don't 'need' any new roles, you could literally add the word 'international' to Hannah's usertitle for 'International Help Desk Staff' or to Flairr's for 'International Forum Moderator', but a word/name/role will not do anything so no I don't think any extra roles are needed, just more ideas that may be suited to them more and I agree with @GoldenMerc; if someone shows that drive to make the international side thrive then they could potentially be rewarded/promoted for it!

I'll mention a few things you've pointed out.

This whole time i've been arguing for someone to be in higher management from an International background because I think there needs to be someone in place for this whole international thing to work. It's all good and fine for a manager to start fighting for an international side to Habbox but as we know managers don't seem to last as long nowadays and it's so so hard for an international manager (especially if they're one of the only international managers at Habbox) to, on their own, increase the International fanbase when it's only them fighting for it. Yeah it's easy for you to say that nothing was done in terms of the international side to the forum when I was manager because I feel (and always have done) that Habbox doesn't have the structure in place to even appeal to an international audience. It doesn't just lie within one department, hence why I've been trying to say that Habbox needs someone in a position of power to help lead it. Call them a figurehead or whatever, but I literally saw no point in me alone, fighting for a bigger international audience as it was only me fighting for it. I lasted 6 months in the role because I started Uni again and left, then a UK-based forum manager was put in the role. Even if I had have done anything to aid in making the international side bigger, I was replaced with a UK-based staff member that wouldn't be online at the same times as me - leaving like one other international manager at the time to maybe carry it on. It isn't just a matter of me recruiting, then leaving, and it all being fine - it needs to be consistent and continuous in order for it to work.

I feel it's like, just because i've made a thread addressing the issue it's my fault for not doing enough in my managerial role. "You're a manager, so here have the responsibility of generating an international clientele for Habbox all on your own and from scratch". I really don't feel that's even fair and I'd be exactly the same if I was in a Senior role being told I need to do more to recruit and create something with the pre-exisiting structure Habbox has (which caters more for a UK timezone). I'll admit, I don't have the time or even the dedication to do that as it takes a hell of a lot of work - something which I just can't dedicate to Habbox because of my other commitments. If I had been in an AGM role and you were telling me I did nothing for the International timezone then fair enough, but as I've said before, I believe it needs someone in the General Management role to dedicate the time to help structure it. As a manager I agree that I did have the capacity to increase the international clientele greatly, but I simply couldn't dedicate that much effort to doing so. If it was as clear-cut as "you're international so go and recruit or increase activity - oh look more international people" then yeah that's awesome, but it's not like that.

Also quickly, the reason I didn't do the Happy Hours is because they're a redundant idea, give people tokens for posting when they hardly ever use tokens anyway. The times I was online meant hardly anyone was online meaning hardly anyone would 'reap the rewards' for posting. There's people with 30k+ tokens, having happy hours to increase their tokens is/was a silly idea when there's nothing actually worthwhile to spend them on. I'd already asked around and seen what people's attitudes were. The only times people used their tokens was when an icon was released that was actually popular. Hardly anyone was buying icons, you got people like Dan buying bulk and he was literally it. I wasn't totally oblivious to the things happening

I also didn't realise you paid so much attention to my posts Sam. I'll just say, the amount of times I got top poster and was actively posting a lot more than 15 posts was a sign I was trying. You make it out like I was doing the bare minimum when actually I would disagree. I could even say the same for you at this current moment in time but hey that's my opinion from what I've seen so far.

I feel like, although you told me you aren't attacking me personally, it definitely felt like that. So i've put across my thoughts (call them excuses if you want) on the issue and why I did (or did not) do what I did when I was manager.

[Samantha]

I'll mention a few things you've pointed out.

This whole time i've been arguing for someone to be in higher management from an International background because I think there needs to be someone in place for this whole international thing to work. It's all good and fine for a manager to start fighting for an international side to Habbox but as we know managers don't seem to last as long nowadays and it's so so hard for an international manager (especially if they're one of the only international managers at Habbox) to, on their own, increase the International fanbase when it's only them fighting for it. Yeah it's easy for you to say that nothing was done in terms of the international side to the forum when I was manager because I feel (and always have done) that Habbox doesn't have the structure in place to even appeal to an international audience. It doesn't just lie within one department, hence why I've been trying to say that Habbox needs someone in a position of power to help lead it. Call them a figurehead or whatever, but I literally saw no point in me alone, fighting for a bigger international audience as it was only me fighting for it. I lasted 6 months in the role because I started Uni again and left, then a UK-based forum manager was put in the role. Even if I had have done anything to aid in making the international side bigger, I was replaced with a UK-based staff member that wouldn't be online at the same times as me - leaving like one other international manager at the time to maybe carry it on. It isn't just a matter of me recruiting, then leaving, and it all being fine - it needs to be consistent and continuous in order for it to work.

I feel it's like, just because i've made a thread addressing the issue it's my fault for not doing enough in my managerial role. "You're a manager, so here have the responsibility of generating an international clientele for Habbox all on your own and from scratch". I really don't feel that's even fair and I'd be exactly the same if I was in a Senior role being told I need to do more to recruit and create something with the pre-exisiting structure Habbox has (which caters more for a UK timezone). I'll admit, I don't have the time or even the dedication to do that as it takes a hell of a lot of work - something which I just can't dedicate to Habbox because of my other commitments. If I had been in an AGM role and you were telling me I did nothing for the International timezone then fair enough, but as I've said before, I believe it needs someone in the General Management role to dedicate the time to help structure it. As a manager I agree that I did have the capacity to increase the international clientele greatly, but I simply couldn't dedicate that much effort to doing so. If it was as clear-cut as "you're international so go and recruit or increase activity - oh look more international people" then yeah that's awesome, but it's not like that.

Also quickly, the reason I didn't do the Happy Hours is because they're a redundant idea, give people tokens for posting when they hardly ever use tokens anyway. The times I was online meant hardly anyone was online meaning hardly anyone would 'reap the rewards' for posting. There's people with 30k+ tokens, having happy hours to increase their tokens is/was a silly idea when there's nothing actually worthwhile to spend them on. I'd already asked around and seen what people's attitudes were. The only times people used their tokens was when an icon was released that was actually popular. Hardly anyone was buying icons, you got people like Dan buying bulk and he was literally it. I wasn't totally oblivious to the things happening

I also didn't realise you paid so much attention to my posts Sam. I'll just say, the amount of times I got top poster and was actively posting a lot more than 15 posts was a sign I was trying. You make it out like I was doing the bare minimum when actually I would disagree. I could even say the same for you at this current moment in time but hey that's my opinion from what I've seen so far.

I feel like, although you told me you aren't attacking me personally, it definitely felt like that. So i've put across my thoughts (call them excuses if you want) on the issue and why I did (or did not) do what I did when I was manager.

Was it brought up to General Management then so they could see you were voicing your concerns and actually wanted something done about it? This is a genuine question as I'm not sure as I wasn't in a manager's position at the time. I know you address why it wouldn't be kept on further down, but instead of doing nothing for the international side you could have attempted something, nothing will happen if nothing is tried and tested to see if it works.

The role of having someone higher up doesn't really need to happen, likewise with everything at Habbox it can obtained by people having the drive and passion to work their way up, and, if they're international then it's definitely a bonus and it won't go unnoticed.

Also, I'm not saying it's your fault for the state Habbox's international side is in at the moment, I'm saying it might not be as bad, or it might be somewhat known if you had done more as an international manager (this is talking about all those who were in international and did nothing for that side). However, reiterating my point about something could easily be tried - Sophie as an example tried an international Saturday Night Quiz, it failed, but at least it showed she was trying to do something! It doesn't take so much effort, just to help that little bit.

Happy Hours are not a redundant idea, well they aren't to me - you never did one and automatically assumed they're pointless so didn't bother? It's fine saying you asked people, but you didn't put any into action so you wouldn't have fully known if anything would have improved or not. Happy Hours aren't exactly a time to 'reap the rewards' to me, they're a time to give that little boost in posting numbers, and sometimes they help, sometimes they don't. The one I did last night didn't get many posts, and I don't think any threads were created, but the one before that was very popular and the amount of posts we have this week alone, for one reason, is down to the Happy Hours as they are being rewarded for posting! The thing is with Tokens, you need to make sure you make things worthwhile in the shop, there are 3 amazing icons currently (Cool Toast, Flirty Fox and Crying Bear), and they've been selling fairly well. Also, if you don't for example, lower prices and actually manage the Token shop, like a shop then what's the point in having it at all? I do understand some things might not be worthwhile getting, and I will probably think of more things to add to it so thank you for giving me your opinion on that!

I looked at your posts/threads last night, I haven't paid too much attention to yours before, apart from some of them that interested me back then. I won't deny the fact you were high on the posting statistics in the week, but you did post most of yours on the Monday then sort of just posted a little during the week. However, you need to remember back then the amount of posts people were getting were also less posts during the week!

I knew you would say I wasn't doing much though, I was waiting for it! However, we've gone from having a dead forum to something that's actually getting more and more popular in terms of posting - within the start of me being Forum Manager we've gained over 300 posts in a week (which doesn't seem like a lot), but I would rather start off slow and work up! I'm unsure if you've seen the two competitions the forum currently has running (one partnering with another department), or the one that took place last month too. I can assure you I am not doing the 'bare minimum' and if I was I would be contacted by laura, who, knows full well what's happening in the department and (is happy with my progress) something is returning with a new lease of life. However, I've had to put that on hold as I'm away from tomorrow and want to make sure it runs smoothly and is better. If you believe I'm doing nothing though, that's fine and you're entitled to your opinion and an observation.

[Matt]

Was it brought up to General Management then so they could see you were voicing your concerns and actually wanted something done about it? This is a genuine question as I'm not sure as I wasn't in a manager's position at the time. I know you address why it wouldn't be kept on further down, but instead of doing nothing for the international side you could have attempted something, nothing will happen if nothing is tried and tested to see if it works.

The role of having someone higher up doesn't really need to happen, likewise with everything at Habbox it can obtained by people having the drive and passion to work their way up, and, if they're international then it's definitely a bonus and it won't go unnoticed.

Also, I'm not saying it's your fault for the state Habbox's international side is in at the moment, I'm saying it might not be as bad, or it might be somewhat known if you had done more as an international manager (this is talking about all those who were in international and did nothing for that side). However, reiterating my point about something could easily be tried - Sophie as an example tried an international Saturday Night Quiz, it failed, but at least it showed she was trying to do something! It doesn't take so much effort, just to help that little bit.

Happy Hours are not a redundant idea, well they aren't to me - you never did one and automatically assumed they're pointless so didn't bother? It's fine saying you asked people, but you didn't put any into action so you wouldn't have fully known if anything would have improved or not. Happy Hours aren't exactly a time to 'reap the rewards' to me, they're a time to give that little boost in posting numbers, and sometimes they help, sometimes they don't. The one I did last night didn't get many posts, and I don't think any threads were created, but the one before that was very popular and the amount of posts we have this week alone, for one reason, is down to the Happy Hours as they are being rewarded for posting! The thing is with Tokens, you need to make sure you make things worthwhile in the shop, there are 3 amazing icons currently (Cool Toast, Flirty Fox and Crying Bear), and they've been selling fairly well. Also, if you don't for example, lower prices and actually manage the Token shop, like a shop then what's the point in having it at all? I do understand some things might not be worthwhile getting, and I will probably think of more things to add to it so thank you for giving me your opinion on that!

I looked at your posts/threads last night, I haven't paid too much attention to yours before, apart from some of them that interested me back then. I won't deny the fact you were high on the posting statistics in the week, but you did post most of yours on the Monday then sort of just posted a little during the week. However, you need to remember back then the amount of posts people were getting were also less posts during the week!

I knew you would say I wasn't doing much though, I was waiting for it! However, we've gone from having a dead forum to something that's actually getting more and more popular in terms of posting - within the start of me being Forum Manager we've gained over 300 posts in a week (which doesn't seem like a lot), but I would rather start off slow and work up! I'm unsure if you've seen the two competitions the forum currently has running (one partnering with another department), or the one that took place last month too. I can assure you I am not doing the 'bare minimum' and if I was I would be contacted by laura, who, knows full well what's happening in the department and (is happy with my progress) something is returning with a new lease of life. However, I've had to put that on hold as I'm away from tomorrow and want to make sure it runs smoothly and is better. If you believe I'm doing nothing though, that's fine and you're entitled to your opinion and an observation.

Going back to when I was in the Events department and I was the non-GMT Senior, I tried so hard to get the international side of Habbox to work. I've been in the shoes of a senior that's tried to recruit and advertise on behalf of the whole of Habbox and it was literally the most draining thing. There was the Manager at the time who was so focused on trying to revive Events and make it a success that it meant I was literally manning the international side of it on my own. Not one AGM or the GM at the time stepped in to check, they just saw that events were being hosted and that was the main thing. If there was an international AGM or someone who was there when I was hosting events at 2-3-4am to support me and throw in ideas, then maybe when I came round to Forum Manager I wouldn't be so deflated. I tried when I was Events Senior, I was literally the face of the international side at Habbox (along with the team of EOs such as Brad and Sarah who ran the international side) yet no one offered support because there was no one there to offer it. Yeah I probably could've asked but it's the job of General Management to be helping out and actually offering to help. Then what happened was once I got Events Manager my timezone was blamed for miscommunication and decisions being made without my knowledge and that's why I lasted just over a month as the Events Manager and quit. That is why I didn't dedicate my time as FM to the international side of things because I had done in the past and the hard work was chucked in my face.

Also, you keep referring to my posts all being done by Monday and then nothing happened. I'm not sure where you keep getting Monday from because I literally posted throughout the week and mainly on weekends (when I was actually at home and didn't have work or Uni to go to). So to say I posted them all on Monday to ensure I got over 15 is just rubbish. I never actually cared about the 15 post minimum as it just happened and was more directed at moderator activity rather than myself as manager.

I'm kinda done with this thread now. It's clear it won't be happening so unless you want to reply Sam then you can close this

[GoldenMerc]

Its really not complex.

If Habbox had more than 10 intl members
If Habbox had someone who could fit the role

MAYBE

but it doesn't so unless you can whip up 30-40 active intl its absolutely pointless

[FlyingJesus]

Habbox doesn't have the structure in place to even appeal to an international audience

We have 24/7 slots available for all community staff, what "structure" are you expecting that can magically make everyone in Australia want to be staff?

"You're a manager, so here have the responsibility of generating an international clientele for Habbox all on your own and from scratch". I really don't feel that's even fair

You're right that isn't fair, which is why this whole thing isn't a viable idea.

[Matt]

We have 24/7 slots available for all community staff, what "structure" are you expecting that can magically make everyone in Australia want to be staff?

A structure that actually appeals to international staff? Management/Staff in place to provide support when those international staff are actually online, someone in higher management that isn't UK-based, all the things i've been repeating throughout this thread that we already know you disagree with.

You're right that isn't fair, which is why this whole thing isn't a viable idea.

So come up with a viable idea that will actually work instead of shooting me down as soon as I try and suggest one myself. Oh and seniors doing all the work doesn't count as a viable idea.