Forum going down hill?

[Tomm]

I'll also go ahead and agree with this. I've seen quite a large number of threads that were closed for arguing. Quick frankly I don't see at all why this is a problem, assuming the argument does not resort to personal offensive comments. As pointed out by GommeInc and Mentor, this is one of the fundamental principles of a forum, denying it would be denying the concept of a forum.

Totally agree. Alot of places seem to think the word "argument" is a bad word, loads of forums follow this and it's come from absolutely no where :S An argument is like a box filled with opinions and facts, you give this box to another person, to which they reply with a box of their own facts and opinions. But according to this forum and quite alot of others, an argument consists purely of flaming, swearing and name calling - THIS IS NOT TRUE. Moderators who think an argument is bad need a kick in the teeth, and members who think this too require the same treatment. Nothing is more frustrating than a forum that clearly doesn't understand the backbone and fibre of a forum; arguments, discussions and open debate. Something that seems to die off.

Not forgeting the "pointless post" edits. A pointless post should be pointless, since when were posts unrelated to the forum subject pointless?! Posts that relate to other posts should be allowed, an example is in this thread, where kk. got the evil red edit :rolleyes:


It's been pretty dead since long before exams were even being thought of.

[Robbie]

I'll also go ahead and agree with this. I've seen quite a large number of threads that were closed for arguing. Quick frankly I don't see at all why this is a problem, assuming the argument does not resort to personal offensive comments. As pointed out by GommeInc and Mentor, this is one of the fundamental principles of a forum, denying it would be denying the concept of a forum.

We're not supposed to close threads or use the infraction unless it turns personal. I'll direct Matt or Garion here so they can re-itterate it to the other mods.

[StefanWolves]

We have more guests than members, put a limit of how many threads a guest can view before having to register. Then they will want to post.

I've been trying to push this through for weeks now, but management just do not seem interested and seem adamant on not taking action.

I agree, forum is quietening down, could be a few reasons for this, but I think people are loosing interest in the forum.

I think HxF should re-launch when they decide to upgrade to vBulletin 4.0. Why not? The forum needs it, and would be a great time to do it.

[buttons]

this time last year there was a lot of activity and most people from then don't post anymore so i don't think it's change of season

i really couldn't (still can't if yesterdays anything to go by) post without it being "posting to cause arguments" so i just gave up and don't post at all now, every now and then i'll post in the very few interesting threads otherwise i just leave it due to the crappy moderation - bet that'll be seen as posting to cause arguments! and i'm not overexaggerating

[Nixt]

this time last year there was a lot of activity and most people from then don't post anymore so i don't think it's change of season

i really couldn't (still can't if yesterdays anything to go by) post without it being "posting to cause arguments" so i just gave up and don't post at all now, every now and then i'll post in the very few interesting threads otherwise i just leave it due to the crappy moderation - bet that'll be seen as posting to cause arguments! and i'm not overexaggerating

Your post doesn't appear to be causing arguments at all, and this is an issue several people have highlighted and so I would be very intrigued to see exactly what you mean? It is quite worrying if you find that Moderators are punishing you for every post you make - as this is the impression you are giving.

[StefanWolves]

To be honest I totally agree Buttons.

Back in the day, when I used to be a tad fiery and confrontational, I used to post and it used to cause arguments. Not necessarily myself causing the argument, just something I said annoyed someone else. I used to get an infraction/warning for this. However, even AFTER I was trying to NOT cause arguments, moderators would still jump on my back and put all their red writing over what I was saying, probably cause of reputation. Yes I agree I may have done things in the past to annoy people, whatnot, but when people actually try to change and moderators keep still jumping on your back giving you a hard time, it is sort of demoralizing - and you think, what's the point? Then you get to the stage where you just don't bother posting anymore, because you just know what you're saying is going to get mauled over by moderators and members.

This Forum does need change, as much as Staff try to shrug it off, and try to deny it, they know, something needs to be done, and soon - why not a relaunch sometime next year?

The themes need to change when it comes to VB 4.0, because the forum is changing and the styles are kind of looking outdated and blocky. Also, this forums themes just do not match up with www.habbox.com theme, which is another reason for change. I'm not going to babel on much more about themes cause I know for a fact sometime next year when we upgrade to vBulletin 4.0 that themes will DEFINITELY change and become more modern.

Rules & Moderating need looking at, arguments are part and parcel of life and will always happen, as long as they don't get offensive then they're fine, moderators and Staff need to give some sort of leeway, if they carry on people are going to be scared to even post. At the moment, the forum is being over moderators, in my opinion, which has driven many many members away or have been banned. Which is not good. One example is Immenseman - Yes, he's like Marmite, love him or hate him, but he was a hugely active and good contributor to this forum, and did a lot for it, was always posting etc. Without people like this, the forum will just die. What I'm trying to say is, this forum needs controversial people, you need people that make things happen and who liven things up, by banning/persistent punishment of these members you are driving the forum down hill.

The forum also needs to gain more members, that's why I thought the cap on the amount of threads guests could view was a brilliant idea (e.g. Unregistered members could only view 10 threads per day, after that they would need to create an account to see more threads), it would create more members and bring in more activitity. But it got thrown out by the minority of people, mainly Staff, who didn't like it. I however still think this is a great idea, and should be considered. Most forums use it, why not HxF? why do we have to be different? we're missing out on it's benefits. In my opinion the biggest challenge this forum has is gaining more members, and it certainly needs looking at deeply.

This forum needs to know what direction it is going in, cause at the moment it is just wallowing around and doesn't know what it is, it needs direction, and change.

That's my opinion anyway.

[FlyingJesus]

I've been trying to push this through for weeks now, but management just do not seem interested and seem adamant on not taking action.

You should know by now why this is, you've been told enough times.

I think HxF should re-launch when they decide to upgrade to vBulletin 4.0. Why not? The forum needs it, and would be a great time to do it.

What do you mean by re-launch? Others have said it in the thread but is the idea just to have one massive membership drive and change everything all at once?

this time last year there was a lot of activity and most people from then don't post anymore so i don't think it's change of season

i really couldn't (still can't if yesterdays anything to go by) post without it being "posting to cause arguments" so i just gave up and don't post at all now, every now and then i'll post in the very few interesting threads otherwise i just leave it due to the crappy moderation - bet that'll be seen as posting to cause arguments! and i'm not overexaggerating

tbh I haven't noticed moderation being that strict in the extreme but that's probably because I'm often careful with what I'm posting these days. That said I've had infractions and warnings recently that I can't really argue against but seem to be rather nitpicking and laying a bit too much on the idea of not having arguments or insulting people, both of which I don't see a problem with if done properly. Overall I think moderation's pretty good, but the issue of arguments is a bit out of hand even I'd agree. We've come a long way since old spam and totally in the wrong direction I think.

Back in the day

Join Date: Jul 2009

lol

At the moment, the forum is being over moderators, in my opinion, which has driven many many members away or have been banned. Which is not good. One example is Immenseman - Yes, he's like Marmite, love him or hate him, but he was a hugely active and good contributor to this forum, and did a lot for it, was always posting etc.

Lots of posts =/= good contributions
He was obviously banned for a reason if not multiple and mounting reasons, personally I'd say Wootzeh had done far more in terms of community here (rather than just having a following of 12 year olds) and he's also been banned, but I'm not suggesting that banning him has brought about the downfall of the forum.

this forum needs controversial people, you need people that make things happen and who liven things up, by banning/persistent punishment of these members you are driving the forum down hill.

True, but controversial doesn't have to mean rulebreaking. Pleke and Greco were controversial, Joe/Helen/Ryan/Alex etc were controversial, Lee and Allan were controversial but all of these were beneficial only in that they brought some form of amusement to the place, whereas these days "controversial" members seem to just be the whiny oh-no-I-got-an-infraction-I-hate-moderation kids.

The forum also needs to gain more members, that's why I thought the cap on the amount of threads guests could view was a brilliant idea (e.g. Unregistered members could only view 10 threads per day, after that they would need to create an account to see more threads), it would create more members and bring in more activitity. But it got thrown out by the minority of people, mainly Staff, who didn't like it. I however still think this is a great idea, and should be considered. Most forums use it, why not HxF? why do we have to be different? we're missing out on it's benefits. In my opinion the biggest challenge this forum has is gaining more members, and it certainly needs looking at deeply.

Again, you have been told all of this before plenty of times and failed to come up with any reason other than "why not" in its favour. The minority that argued against it were the ones who actually had reasons rather than just posting "yh gd idea x" and not returning.

[StefanWolves]

To your remark about me only being registered since July, I have been on this forum for years on multiple accounts, so don't jump to conclusions.

The fact that you haven't proven to me any conclusive proof that this sort of system wouldn't work is a bit of a worry, seeing as though you are criticizing me for not providing proof, when I really can't because I don't know where to look. All I know is most successful forums use it, most forums I go on use it. So it must work.

As for your question about the re-launch, I meant change in attitude of Staff & moderators, change in rules, change in UI, and a surge to try and gain more members, a fresh start for VB 4.0 - That's what I meant.

[The Professor]

To your remark about me only being registered since July, I have been on this forum for years on multiple accounts, so don't jump to conclusions.

The fact that you haven't proven to me any conclusive proof that this sort of system wouldn't work is a bit of a worry, seeing as though you are criticizing me for not providing proof, when I really can't because I don't know where to look. All I know is most successful forums use it, most forums I go on use it. So it must work.

As for your question about the re-launch, I meant change in attitude of Staff & moderators, change in rules, change in UI, and a surge to try and gain more members, a fresh start for VB 4.0 - That's what I meant.

Yawn, read that thread before, its your job to convince us not our job to disprove you. If you can't convince people it obviously can't be a clear cut genius idea!

Change in attitude of moderators can't really happen unless you get new moderators, attitude isn't the issue anyway its the implementation of certain rules. Change in skins and a membership drive should suffice, maybe get rid of all that horrible red writing and have a slick looking mod edit box thing ala warez-bb, red writing seems very 2004 Oh and enable some of the cooler features, badges and eshop where you buy coloured names and features and stuff, just make it a bit more interesting!

[hah]

Yawn, read that thread before, its your job to convince us not our job to disprove you. If you can't convince people it obviously can't be a clear cut genius idea!

Change in attitude of moderators can't really happen unless you get new moderators, attitude isn't the issue anyway its the implementation of certain rules. Change in skins and a membership drive should suffice, maybe get rid of all that horrible red writing and have a slick looking mod edit box thing ala warez-bb, red writing seems very 2004 Oh and enable some of the cooler features, badges and eshop where you buy coloured names and features and stuff, just make it a bit more interesting!

i like all them ideas, especially the mod edit box and maybe have an admin one also