The Monarchy

[iBlueBox]

With It being the Queens Diamond Jubilee this year.


What are your thoughts on the historical British Monarchy?

[Shar]

I dislike the entire concept of hereditary monarchy. There are pros and cons that come with it though as it does have mass support and the monarchy also brings a lot of tourists to London so it is also a money maker BUT I hate how some events are funded with tax payer money such as the royal wedding etc.

[Ellz]

I don't really have an opinion but for some reason i find anything to do with the Monarchy really fascinating!

I do think the Queen is doing well and will no doubt beat Victoria's record *touches wood*

[FlyingJesus]

It's all good in the hood

[Mathew]

Yeah I'm a big Royalist and think the Royal Family are what defines Britain. I think the main problem is that we're paying for the security of about 40 members of the royal family, when it only really needs to be the main ones. Prince Edward came to my school last January and the amount of planning and security around the area was absolutely crazy. We had sniffer dogs coming in a couple of weeks before, then people over the weekend... lockers had to emptied.. etc. Obviously he's one of the main members but any further down the line I wouldn't say it's needed!

[-:Undertaker:-]

I dislike the entire concept of hereditary monarchy. There are pros and cons that come with it though as it does have mass support and the monarchy also brings a lot of tourists to London so it is also a money maker BUT I hate how some events are funded with tax payer money such as the royal wedding etc.

Ah right, do you also hate the concept of inheritance then? when a mother or father dies, all property/titles go to the child (including yourself)? I always hear this stance against a hereditary system yet I never hear people apply that standard in their own lives or rally against it in other walks of life, such as when the children of 'celebrities' become 'celebrities' themselves who are then worshiped in the same sad way that most celebrities are who after all only read out scripts for a living. Or indeed, it happens in politics aswell - look at David and Edward Miliband, or Tony and Hiliary Benn, George H Bush and George W Bush, William Clinton and Hiliary Clinton or Ron Paul and Rand Paul and many more numerous examples so even if you did abolish the Monarchy and replace it with a Republic you'd still have political families/relations within it. Its peculiar that this argument is only used when arguing against the Monarchy, besides its a non-argument - it happens in all walks of life and it always will.

Myself, I am a Royalist - its plain simple fact that the most stable nations have a Royal Family as opposed to a Republic.

[CrazyLemurs]

The monarchy is fine, and provides an invaluable source of funds for the British economy.
Heck we're known internationally for the monarch's tiny power yet extraordinary presence.
The Queen can do next to nothing when it comes to running the country, yet she is still the icon.

And inheriting the throne is all well, but when it gets to the stage we've had the same family for 3 centuries it could get unfair.


I'm currently on my iPhone if you are seeing this message! I cannot participate in spam wars xx

[FlyingJesus]

I think people often disregard (or may simply be unaware of) the amount of good that many royals do aside from bring in tourism - the most prominent to my mind being the Prince's Trust which is frankly the best youth support programme I've ever seen come into existence. Even indirectly as figureheads of charities and such they have tremendous influence and unless you're a staunch communist I don't think you can realistically scoff at them too much

[Inseriousity.]

I think people often disregard (or may simply be unaware of) the amount of good that many royals do aside from bring in tourism - the most prominent to my mind being the Prince's Trust which is frankly the best youth support programme I've ever seen come into existence. Even indirectly as figureheads of charities and such they have tremendous influence and unless you're a staunch communist I don't think you can realistically scoff at them too much

Agreed about the Princes Trust which is why I'm not much a fan of the 'prince charles should abdicate and let his younger son take the throne' argument(with other reasons). They do a lot of good for this country and I'm amazed at how many official visits and trips they do. If I'm as active as they are when I'm their age, I'll be a very happy guy! My nana can hardly walk around the house without agonizing painand she's 3 years younger than the Queen!

Despite that, there are still a few things that make me uneasy. Prince Andrew (? I think this is his name lol) as a trade envoy being described as arrogant and patronizing by people we're supposed to be doing business withand while he's no longerofficially in the role, I wonder howmuch the 'down to earth' PRof the royal family we get is true.

[Mathew]

Heck we're known internationally for the monarch's tiny power yet extraordinary presence.
The Queen can do next to nothing when it comes to running the country, yet she is still the icon.
Tiny power? Far from! She has the power to dissolve the government and form a new one whenever she pleases. Obviously she chooses not to abuse it, but it still remains! :)

[jasey]

I adore monarchies and I wish that the wonderful French monarchy was still in power. I am happy that countries like the United Kingdom have a royal family to admire.

[Qzaki]

It has its advantages and disadvantages but it makes us unique & brings us tourists, i likey!

[Shar]

Ah right, do you also hate the concept of inheritance then? when a mother or father dies, all property/titles go to the child (including yourself)? I always hear this stance against a hereditary system yet I never hear people apply that standard in their own lives or rally against it in other walks of life, such as when the children of 'celebrities' become 'celebrities' themselves who are then worshiped in the same sad way that most celebrities are who after all only read out scripts for a living. Or indeed, it happens in politics aswell - look at David and Edward Miliband, or Tony and Hiliary Benn, George H Bush and George W Bush, William Clinton and Hiliary Clinton or Ron Paul and Rand Paul and many more numerous examples so even if you did abolish the Monarchy and replace it with a Republic you'd still have political families/relations within it. Its peculiar that this argument is only used when arguing against the Monarchy, besides its a non-argument - it happens in all walks of life and it always will.

Myself, I am a Royalist - its plain simple fact that the most stable nations have a Royal Family as opposed to a Republic.
No, I don't support that either, people should own their own wealth not live off an inheritance.

[iBlueBox]

A Major reason why I'm a big Monarchy fan is the whole History of it.

As a Student studying History in College and hopefully in uni,

I love the whole historical side of it such as Elizabeths finances, James I's wasteful of his wealth with the tensions between him and Parliament.

[-:Undertaker:-]

No, I don't support that either, people should own their own wealth not live off an inheritance.

So you'll be turning down your inheritance from your parents?

If so, I can't argue with that - as long as you don't advocate forcing something like that on the rest of us.

[Shar]

So you'll be turning down your inheritance from your parents?

If so, I can't argue with that - as long as you don't advocate forcing something like that on the rest of us.
What inheritance? I have no money to my name at all, I have to work hard to earn money.

[GommeInc]

What inheritance? I have no money to my name at all, I have to work hard to earn money.
You may not, but your parents, spouse, friends, family and random strangers may leave you something. What would you do if they did? I can see your point in inheritance, like if it was immediately surrendered to the state to benefit the country, but life isn't that simple :P

[Shar]

You may not, but your parents, spouse, friends, family and random strangers may leave you something. What would you do if they did? I can see your point in inheritance, like if it was immediately surrendered to the state to benefit the country, but life isn't that simple :P
I've been thinking about this and trying to see it from different angles. If a stranger left me money I wouldn't accept it because its not mine to take haha. I don't know if I'd accept the money if it was from a relative, it depends on what situation you in financially. I'd like to think I wouldn't accept it and even if I did I most definitely would not be one of those people who receive a big sum of money and decide to stop working. I know that sounds like I'm contradicting myself, and I slightly am I suppose, but what I'm trying to say is that regardless of inherited wealth I wouldn't want my social position to change unless I myself earn it. I.e. people shouldn't judge me by the amount of money I have but by how hard I'm working to earn that money.
Also, inherited wealth would only concern an affect the individual and their family, not the whole country like hereditary monarchy does :P

p.s. sorry if that doesn't make sense

[Eoin247]

Ah right, do you also hate the concept of inheritance then? when a mother or father dies, all property/titles go to the child (including yourself)? I always hear this stance against a hereditary system yet I never hear people apply that standard in their own lives or rally against it in other walks of life, such as when the children of 'celebrities' become 'celebrities' themselves who are then worshiped in the same sad way that most celebrities are who after all only read out scripts for a living. Or indeed, it happens in politics aswell - look at David and Edward Miliband, or Tony and Hiliary Benn, George H Bush and George W Bush, William Clinton and Hiliary Clinton or Ron Paul and Rand Paul and many more numerous examples so even if you did abolish the Monarchy and replace it with a Republic you'd still have political families/relations within it. Its peculiar that this argument is only used when arguing against the Monarchy, besides its a non-argument - it happens in all walks of life and it always will.

Myself, I am a Royalist - its plain simple fact that the most stable nations have a Royal Family as opposed to a Republic.


So you'll be turning down your inheritance from your parents?

If so, I can't argue with that - as long as you don't advocate forcing something like that on the rest of us.


First of all ever hear of wills?

The main difference between your inheritance argument and relating it to royals, is no matter what my parents might choose to eventually give me some day, i don't expect to be treated differently because of who i am a son of.

I'm not going to partake in a long debate on this (again), because whenever i open my mouth about anything to do with the UK monarchy i get lots of people moaning that i can't have an opinion on this because i'm not from the UK. So i'm just going to finish making my point and i'll leave this thread.

But while you're mentioning Ron Paul ( a man you avidly support). After reading books, articles and speeches by him, it would seem that he would never be in favour of any form of monarchy (constitutional or otherwise). Actualy i asked a friend about this last year (who first introduced me to Ron Paul years back). He didn't seem to know much about Ron Paul's views with regards to the UK's version of monarchy (he did show me videos of Ron Paul criticising Monarchies in general, not what i was looking for though) . But he told me that he thinks the reason Ron Paul doesn't seem to speak of this is purely for possible future diplomatic relations with the UK (He was and is a presidential hopeful of course).

[Eoin247]

(i tried adding this to my earlier post but lag made my edit go out of the 15 minute limit for editing)

(continuing from above post)

You talk about politicians and celebrities. There are far more examples of sons/daughters not following in their parents footsteps.
Also with regards to celebrities/politicians/wealth in families. For the most part it never stays beyong a generation, maybe two. Ever hear of the saying "After a gatherer comes a scatterer"?

Anyway, the users of this forum decided i long time ago that i am not allowed to discuss the UK monarchy. Apparently it's a topic only for citizens of the UK.

So i'll leave it at that.

[dbgtz]

First of all ever hear of wills?

The main difference between your inheritance argument and relating it to royals, is no matter what my parents might choose to eventually give me some day, i don't expect to be treated differently because of who i am a son of.

I'm not going to partake in a long debate on this (again), because whenever i open my mouth about anything to do with the UK monarchy i get lots of people moaning that i can't have an opinion on this because i'm not from the UK. So i'm just going to finish making my point and i'll leave this thread.

But while you're mentioning Ron Paul ( a man you avidly support). After reading books, articles and speeches by him, it would seem that he would never be in favour of any form of monarchy (constitutional or otherwise). Actualy i asked a friend about this last year (who first introduced me to Ron Paul years back). He didn't seem to know much about Ron Paul's views with regards to the UK's version of monarchy (he did show me videos of Ron Paul criticising Monarchies in general, not what i was looking for though) . But he told me that he thinks the reason Ron Paul doesn't seem to speak of this is purely for possible future diplomatic relations with the UK (He was and is a presidential hopeful of course).

Bear in mind that the UK monarchy is purely a figurehead and actually has no real power at all.

[-:Undertaker:-]

But while you're mentioning Ron Paul ( a man you avidly support). After reading books, articles and speeches by him, it would seem that he would never be in favour of any form of monarchy (constitutional or otherwise). Actualy i asked a friend about this last year (who first introduced me to Ron Paul years back). He didn't seem to know much about Ron Paul's views with regards to the UK's version of monarchy (he did show me videos of Ron Paul criticising Monarchies in general, not what i was looking for though) . But he told me that he thinks the reason Ron Paul doesn't seem to speak of this is purely for possible future diplomatic relations with the UK (He was and is a presidential hopeful of course).

Ron Paul supports the Constitutional Republic which is what the United States is intended to be, as do I - for the United States it works. The United Kingdom on the other hand is simply the same, but a Constitutional Monarchy which I find better than a Republic simply because I like the tradition and I find it much more reliable and a respectful office for Head of State as opposed to an unpopular politician. The two systems are the best systems of government ever devised, although I strongly favour the Westminister model.

If Ron Paul was elected President, he would operate in a way similar to Queen Elizabeth II - as a constitutional figurehead as the constitution intended, however slightly more political.


Anyway, the users of this forum decided i long time ago that i am not allowed to discuss the UK monarchy. Apparently it's a topic only for citizens of the UK.

By all means we'd like to hear how abolishing a tried and tested system which has evolved over the centuries to give us the best parliamentary system is desirable, which I presume is your position.

[Shar]

Bear in mind that the UK monarchy is purely a figurehead and actually has no real power at all.
I wouldn't say that the monarch has no real power but a lot of it has decreased over time and has gone to the prime minister.

[dbgtz]

I wouldn't say that the monarch has no real power but a lot of it has decreased over time and has gone to the prime minister.

She really does have no political powers, she only has influence.

[-:Undertaker:-]

The Sovereign has supreme powers but does not exercise them, she is bound by the constitution.