EU Referendum Megathread (Brexit) [Archive] - Page 3

-:Undertaker:-

24-06-2016, 08:46 AM

Update on Labour situation before I go for a sleep (finally!) -

http://order-order.com/2016/06/24/live-plot-remove-corbyn/

Here is the situation with Labour as of 9:30am. Corbyn is “definitely” facing a live plot to remove him as leader – the Shadow Cabinet meets at 10am where it is possible Shadow ministers will tell him to resign or threaten to resign themselves. Labour MPs are putting heavy pressure on Shadow ministers to man up and tell him to go immediately. Shadow Cabinet members are spreading rumours that Corbyn and McDonnell personally voted to Leave…

There are rumours of a letter of no confidence in circulation, though it has yet to reach some moderates Guido has spoken to. That could take a few days to come to fruition. Angela Eagle, a possible successor, has dodged questions about whether Corbyn should resign. John McDonnell is named as either being “behind” moves against Corbyn or as a potential successor. McDonnell’s team, including his top aide James Meadway, were in Portcullis House this morning where they were described as jubilant by a witness. Sadiq Khan is meeting Labour MPs in parliament too. Could a second party leader be out this weekend?

Empired

24-06-2016, 08:58 AM

Scotland will definitely go.
Ugh can I go with them.

I'm so disappointed idk what to do today now.

lemons

24-06-2016, 09:28 AM

question

now that david cameron is resigning will there be a general election or just a new conservative replacement who will become prime minister?

dbgtz

24-06-2016, 10:06 AM

question

now that david cameron is resigning will there be a general election or just a new conservative replacement who will become prime minister?

The latter unless there's a vote of no confidence in parliament. Important to note we don't actually elect the PM.

FlyingJesus

24-06-2016, 10:17 AM

lol people putting up those stupid e-petitions asking for a second referendum, pretty sure democracy doesn't work by asking the same question over and over until you get the answer you wanted. Try China

Inseriousity.

24-06-2016, 10:34 AM

So far, everything's unfolding in the way that I expected it would so I think we can weather the storm in the short term and bounce back just as strong or even stronger in the long term.

Here's a blog post I wrote last month but never really posted anywhere so I thought I'd post it here.

It’s not the End of the World
It’s less than a month to go until the vote to stay or leave the European Union. Project Fear is underway where both sides battle it out to scaremonger as much as possible. For the Remain campaign, if you leave, there’ll be dangerous criminals in your streets because of the lack of EU co-operation and security. For the Leave campaign, if you stay, there’ll be dangerous criminals in your streets because of open borders.

Regardless of the outcome of the vote, 24th June will be a normal day. The sky won’t fall down, the world will keep turning and we will go about our day-to-day lives as if nothing had happened. This is good news. For starters, I like the sky exactly where it is. It also means that when we vote, it’ll be about principle and what you believe in rather than which campaign manages to scare you the most.

The Leave campaign believes in protecting our sovereignty, making sure we take control of our own laws. The Remain campaign believes that sacrificing a little of our sovereignty is a small price to pay for the security and stability the EU provides. Both principles are perfectly valid so the question of the campaign has become about how secure and stable the EU is. If Project Fear can convince you that it would be a catastrophe to leave, the Remain campaign is convinced they can persuade people to sacrifice their sovereignty.

The problem here is that no-one can say for certain what will happen in the future. This is partly because the only people who will have any influence in future discussions are in Government. They are unable to be forthcoming at the moment as they are working for a Remain outcome. It is not in their interests to say what their Plan B is if the country votes to Leave.

I won’t go through every single scaremongering claim from the Remain campaign as the referendum would be over by the time I finished writing this blog. I will address the main issue: the economy.

“The markets will crash and Britain will be plunged into a recession. We will lose access to the single market. People will lose their jobs.” A lot of EU leaders have jumped on the bandwagon saying that they will be brutal with the Brits in the event of Brexit. They will raise tariffs, they won’t work with us and we will lose our influence. The problem is that their economies would be just as fragile. It is not in their economic interests to play hard ball. As Michael Gove put it, “You do not close the shop to your best customer.” I think it would be safe to call their bluff. Politicians are happy to say these things during a campaign to try to get the outcome they want but once the choice to leave has been made, they will have to consider the practical realities of the situation. They won’t want to damage their own economy out of spite.

If the country votes to leave then there are two years under Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty (it can be extended to three) to negotiate an exit strategy where these issues can be addressed. We can also start up trade deals with other countries that we are currently unable to. We will not leave straightaway and there is sufficient time to get a good deal. It would not be in our interests or other EU countries to be spiteful and challenging. Our economies require us to work together, to trade with each other and that wouldn’t suddenly stop simply because we voted to leave.

I think that it would be disingenuous to say that there would be no negative consequences. However, the country will bounce back. I believe that the United Kingdom will thrive and be more prosperous outside the EU in the long term. We can take back control of our laws and spend the millions a week we send to Europe on our priorities like the NHS, schools or taking care of the elderly. We have the skills, the people and the determination to succeed.

We just have to believe in ourselves.

xxMATTGxx

24-06-2016, 11:12 AM

Nicola Sturgeon said the Scottish Government will begin to prepare the legislation required to enable a second independence referendum to take place.

The First Minister said the option of a second independence referendum "must be on the table and it is on the table" after Scotland overwhelmingly voted to remain in the EU.

She said it is "highly likely" a second independence referendum will take place.

She added she will take "all possible steps and explore all options" to secure Scotland's continuing place in the EU.

She said it is "democratically unacceptable" that Scotland would be taken out of the EU "against its will".

She added: "I am proud of Scotland and how we voted yesterday. We proved we are a modern, outward looking, open and inclusive country and we said clearly that we don't want to leave the EU."

Source: ITV

Cerys

24-06-2016, 11:13 AM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36621777

'Two Labour MPs have submitted a motion of no confidence in Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn.

Margaret Hodge and Ann Coffey confirmed the move in a letter to the chairman of the Parliamentary Labour Party.
The motion has no formal constitutional force but calls for a discussion at their next PLP meeting on Monday.

It will be up to the PLP chairman to decide whether it is debated. If accepted it would be followed by a secret ballot of Labour MPs on Tuesday.'

So it begins rip

FlyingJesus

24-06-2016, 11:16 AM

How is it democratically unacceptable that a small part of a sovereign nation didn't get its own way

dbgtz

24-06-2016, 11:20 AM

Christ the article hasn't even been invoked yet has it? Cool your beans Nicola

lemons

24-06-2016, 11:20 AM

vote yes scotland!

lemons

24-06-2016, 12:18 PM

746240420540092417

scottish

24-06-2016, 12:30 PM

i'll be voting leave this time in the Scottish Referendum lads

xxMATTGxx

24-06-2016, 12:35 PM

i'll be voting leave this time in the Scottish Referendum lads

Don't blame you this time round.

Inseriousity.

24-06-2016, 12:41 PM

Scotland won't have another referendum

xxMATTGxx

24-06-2016, 12:47 PM

Scotland won't have another referendum

Never say never

Inseriousity.

24-06-2016, 12:50 PM

dbgtz

24-06-2016, 01:12 PM

Lol Spain is to Gibraltar what Argentina is to the Falklands.

Either way I think everyone is jumping the gun a bit. Cameron is essentially leaving it to the next leader to sort out negotiations, assuming either a) the next Conservative leader doesn't want to leave so doesn't honour the result or b) a parliamentary vote of no confidence happens, it's quite possible we will not leave. Basically, your best bet is to contact your local MP especially if they are a Conservative.

-:Undertaker:-

24-06-2016, 01:14 PM

Okay, Scotland won't have another referendum any time soon. They had one in 2014 and voted to stay in the UK. Yes, Sturgeon can argue that the terms and conditions have changed and start the posturing required. Ultimately, however, it requires the approval of the government to grant the country the referendum and it simply won't be doing that.

Indeed and she'll legally be required to commit to joining the Euro should Scotland wish to join the EU. I'd like to see her sell that.

I also love how everyone is now an economist on social media. A small drop (self-correction) in the markets and currency and it'll blow over.

746294885645434880

746316465704472576

746264426714652672

Oleh

24-06-2016, 02:53 PM

Woke up at 8am to some lovely news. Went back to sleep a happy individual. Great stuff!

buttons

24-06-2016, 02:55 PM

David

24-06-2016, 02:56 PM

http://video.metro.co.uk/video/met/2016/06/24/1484670079041976243/960x540_1484670079041976243.mp4

lol

David

24-06-2016, 03:17 PM

http://i.imgur.com/eHNkBOB.png

FlyingJesus

24-06-2016, 04:12 PM

746291293282770944

-:Undertaker:-

24-06-2016, 04:19 PM

Great Britain is already leading Europe.

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and....

746365358680969216

746300728323497984

Kardan

24-06-2016, 04:28 PM

Came back to say congrats -:Undertaker:-;

Also Dan - what happens to UKIP now? Haven't they lost their unique selling point now? I was going to ask yesterday whether it would be better for UKIP to lose the referendum (as SNP surged after they lost their referendum) - but alas I imagine leaving the EU is more important than seeing Farage in a position of power.

Also, can anyone even name a conservative MP that would do a decent job of leading the country? As much as I'm a labour supporter, I can't believe I'm saying that Cameron leaving is a bad thing.

-:Undertaker:-

24-06-2016, 04:33 PM

@Kardan (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=3428);

Thank you very much. :)

And as for Ukip who knows, but it has fulfilled it's historic destiny in what it was set up for so I wouldn't mind if it folded now. It really is quite amazing to think that you could say Nigel Farage is now the most influential politician of the last few decades and he never even made it into the House of Commons.

As for the next Prime Minister, I would like either Boris Johnson MP, Priti Patel MP or David Davies MP tbh.

FlyingJesus

24-06-2016, 04:46 PM

Yeah I keep saying to the sour faced children having tantrums over the result that they can at least be happy that UKIP no longer has a reason to exist :P

Cerys

24-06-2016, 04:55 PM

I doubt just cos they've got what they want that they'll give up and call it a day haha

They can now be like 'oh we got you out of it now vote us in and we'll continue to make England better woo' rip

Also I completely agree Kardan, out of all the known tories who have a shot at replacing Cameron, I much prefer Cameron over them all even though I'd rather not

Anyone but Boris or Gove though :s

scottish

24-06-2016, 04:58 PM

http://video.metro.co.uk/video/met/2016/06/24/1484670079041976243/960x540_1484670079041976243.mp4

lol

lmfao anyone who believes farage is an idiot.

he already proved that before.

FlyingJesus

24-06-2016, 05:02 PM

Inseriousity.

24-06-2016, 05:11 PM

All these totes open minded young voters seem to be forgetting that only a few months back they were trying to run e-petitions to get Cameron out of office, now he's suddenly a hero of the left who deserves another chance. Classic underdog syndrome

lol omg at this e-petition:

EU Referendum Rules triggering a 2nd EU Referendum

We the undersigned call upon HM Government to implement a rule that if the remain or leave vote is less than 60% based a turnout less than 75% there should be another referendum.

So basically, they've looked at the results/turnout. 52/48 to leave, 72% turnout and just rounded up to the closest thing. It's currently got over 150k signatures which clearly shows how stupid social media campaigns can be.

Oh btw -:Undertaker:-; I noticed that Liverpool voted to remain. I'm sure you're pleased with the result overall but must've been a punch in the gut to see that, especially with all the leafleting you've done!

buttons

24-06-2016, 05:14 PM

#triggered

Red

24-06-2016, 05:17 PM

i just don't understand the scotland thing, we voted to stay with the uk and create decisions together because "we're better together" but now everyone is ok if we separate from the UK just so we can stay with the EU? is it worse for scotland to be without the united kingdom than it is to be with the EU? :S i get that it's because we voted to stay and that won't be honoured, that lack of decision power was the reason i voted to leave the UK in the first place, but as we stayed with the UK we have to accept the decision from everyone.. it's like democracy is only ok if it goes scotland's way.

Was the EU ref talked about during Scottish ref? Yes it shouldn't be an issue because Scotland voted to stay which means voting as one country, not seperating your own interests. Literally cannot stand Nicola Sturgeon. Haven't heard anyone really complain here about it. Hilarious if Sinn Fein think they would win with one here.

-:Undertaker:-

24-06-2016, 05:29 PM

@Inseriousity. (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=26409); I thought Liverpool would go Remain tbh but I hope I helped bring that percentage down a bit. ;)

It'd be interesting to see the split between northern Liverpool (more deprived, my area) and southern Liverpool.

You had a huge landslide in Middlesborough for Leave if my memory is correct? I was made up with Sunderland and Newcastle.

Inseriousity.

24-06-2016, 05:37 PM

Yes although that wasn't much of a surprise. Very solid white working class area.

!:random!:!

24-06-2016, 05:40 PM

BORIS FOR PM xD least he would funny I guess... I couldn't vote for remain or leave since am only 16 so... but from what I understood leaving was right to gain control over our boarders and who should enter our country (a bit like Australia) and give more money to the NHS but I believe only George Osborn can decide that? and if we stayed more immigrants would be entering the country. At the end of the day not wanting lots of immigrants in the country does not make you racist as I've seen people who supported remain calling people that voted to leave, its wanting to know who is coming in the country. I suppose you only really have to look at other independent countries and see how successful they are. I believe if I was given the choice to vote I would have voted to leave. I was speaking with my boyfriends dad today about the whole 10% decrease of the British pound and he said by middle of next month it will be back to normal again he believes this happened as many thought the country would stay in EU so made many investments through the stock market and then sold them last night when finding out we were leaving. I think all the people spitting their dummies out need to face the facts whats done is done that's end of it.

Phil

24-06-2016, 06:07 PM

This "article" pretty much sums up the general feeling in Ireland today http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2016/06/24/fuckin-gobshites/

Real shame the vote has gone the way it did, hopefully the effects won't be as detrimental to us as everyone believes. Either way we may carry on!

FlyingJesus

24-06-2016, 06:46 PM

lol omg at this e-petition:

EU Referendum Rules triggering a 2nd EU Referendum

We the undersigned call upon HM Government to implement a rule that if the remain or leave vote is less than 60% based a turnout less than 75% there should be another referendum.

So basically, they've looked at the results/turnout. 52/48 to leave, 72% turnout and just rounded up to the closest thing. It's currently got over 150k signatures which clearly shows how stupid social media campaigns can be.

Yeah that's the one my idiot friends have been posting around as though it's somehow championing freedom and WHAT'S RIGHT!!!!!!!

They prob should have asked for terms like that before the referendum, not once it's done...

Cerys

24-06-2016, 07:22 PM

Just been to Andrews dad's house and he was talking about the EU vote yesterday, he lives in Birstall, and he said there were armed police checking you before you went into the polling station. I guess they didn't wanna take any chances

Chris

24-06-2016, 07:43 PM

Very happy with the outcome, but actually quite surprised! The coming years are going to be very exciting! :D

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 07:49 PM

The best news yet is reading already that Commonwealth countries such as Ghana, Canada, Australia and India are already wanting to start bilateral trade agreement talks with Great Britain (we couldn't do that whilst in EU). The new PM ought to set up a Ministry of Trade and get as many signed as possible! :D

http://pulse.com.gh/business/after-brexit-ghana-britain-trade-talks-begin-immediately-hannah-tetteh-id5188747.html

Ghana eager to start bilateral trade talks with Great Britain immediately

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/ae/Flag_of_the_United_Kingdom.svg/125px-Flag_of_the_United_Kingdom.svg.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/d/d2/Commonwealth_Flag_-_2013.svg/125px-Commonwealth_Flag_-_2013.svg.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/19/Flag_of_Ghana.svg/125px-Flag_of_Ghana.svg.png
Great Britain and Ghana (former colony) are both members of the Commonwealth (centre) which is headed by Queen Elizabeth II

Hannah Tetteh, Minister of Foreign Affairs and Regional Integration has revealed that Ghana will begin bilateral trade agreement talks with Britain immediately.

This is after the UK voted on Thursday to exit the European Union, presenting the opportunity for Ghana to renegotiate all trade agreements done with the EU that covered the UK. It stands to reason that Ghana would seek to renegotiate these agreements with Britain alone, given that the UK may well be the single biggest trade destination for Ghana in the EU.

“Even though Britain has not formally exited the EU, and the UK remains bound by previous agreements signed under the EU, Ghana will immediately start talks with the UK on a bilateral trade agreement” she said.

abc

25-06-2016, 08:10 PM

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 08:14 PM

Yet the Leave campaign are like "shit, we didn't think we would actually win. We better read Article 50 for the first time". Jobs are being lost.
Yes... GREAT NEWS!

The only jobs being lost are David Cameron, George Osborne and all the British MEPs.

A Prime Minister resigned. The £ plummeted. The FTSE 100 lost significant ground. But then the £ rallied past February levels, and the FTSE closed on a weekly high: 2.4% up on last Friday, its best performance in 4 months. President Obama decided we wouldn't be at the 'back of the queue' after all and that our 'special relationship' was still strong. The French President confirmed the Le Touquet agreement would stay in place. The President of the European Commission stated Brexit negations would be 'orderly' and stressed the UK would continue to be a 'close partner' of the EU. A big bank denied reports it would shift 2,000 staff overseas. The CBI, vehemently anti-Brexit during the referendum campaign, stated British business was resilient and would adapt. Several countries outside the EU stated they wished to begin bi-lateral trade talks with the UK immediately. If this was the predicted apocalypse, well, it was a very British one. It was all over by teatime. Not a bad first day of freedom.

Apart from the market correcting itself shortly yesterday because of speculation, nothing has happened. All is well. :)

scottish

25-06-2016, 08:33 PM

So you mean the GBP isn't at it's worst rate since 2009?

Also, can't MPs still ignore that and vote against leaving the EU? If majority were for remain at least.

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 08:40 PM

So you mean the GBP isn't at it's worst rate since 2009?

That's incorrect or at least the goalposts being used are incorrect.

746474176819650561

It's currency markets correcting itself. Speculators in currency and investment markets often speculate on outcomes and they speculated wrongly on this. As the post above said, immediately after the vote when markets opened we saw big movements but by the end of the day markets had rallied back to more or less the same. Everything is absolutely fine now and even those who were predicting doom like the CBI have said actually er it'll be fine.

Also, can't MPs still ignore that and vote against leaving the EU? If majority were for remain at least.

They can if they want to pour fuel on the fire and turn Ukip into the SNP, sure.

abc

25-06-2016, 08:43 PM

The only jobs being lost are David Cameron, George Osborne and all the British MEPs.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA Delusional.

Morgan Stanley is moving 1,000 jobs out of UK
JP Morgan is moving minimum 1,000 jobs out of UK
Deutsche Bank is moving several thousand jobs out of UK
HSBC will cut minimum 1,000 jobs in UK due to Brexit

PriceWaterhouseCoopers estimates that Brexit could cost between 70,000-100,000 financial services jobs by 2020.

Bank analysts at Keefe, Bruyette & Woods have estimated that the big U.S. banks allow could move just over 7,200 workers outside of London.

Lloyds of London, the insurance firm, has said that a material number of the 34,000 employees in the insurance industry could be moved out of the U.K.

FlyingJesus

25-06-2016, 08:56 PM

Yet the Leave campaign are like "shit, we didn't think we would actually win.

About 4 people that have been cherrypicked for the news are thinking that

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 08:57 PM

Here's a visual of currency markets from 2012 to right now.

http://www.ezimba.com/work/160626C/ezimba18991710947200.png

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Morgan Stanley is moving 1,000 jobs out of UK

Morgan Stanley denies this.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/morgan-stanley-brexit-eu-referendum-jobs-dublin-frankfurt-a7100911.html

JP Morgan is moving minimum 1,000 jobs out of UK

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-jpmorgan-forex-idUSKCN0ZA2YL

Deutsche Bank is moving several thousand jobs out of UK

I can find no evidence or rebuttal of this but the bank is cutting 3,000 jobs from Germany.

http://www.ft.com/fastft/2016/06/23/deutsche-bank-to-cut-3000-jobs-in-germany/

HSBC will cut minimum 1,000 jobs in UK due to Brexit

Untrue.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36629745

PriceWaterhouseCoopers estimates that Brexit could cost between 70,000-100,000 financial services jobs by 2020.

Ah right another scary estimate.

Bank analysts at Keefe, Bruyette & Woods have estimated that the big U.S. banks allow could move just over 7,200 workers outside of London.

snort.

Lloyds of London, the insurance firm, has said that a material number of the 34,000 employees in the insurance industry could be moved out of the U.K.

Lloyds have done the opposite and assured staff and customers...

http://uk.businessinsider.com/lloyds-ceo-memo-to-staff-contingency-planning-underway-2016-6

scottish

25-06-2016, 09:16 PM

That's incorrect or at least the goalposts being used are incorrect.

746474176819650561

It's currency markets correcting itself. Speculators in currency and investment markets often speculate on outcomes and they speculated wrongly on this. As the post above said, immediately after the vote when markets opened we saw big movements but by the end of the day markets had rallied back to more or less the same. Everything is absolutely fine now and even those who were predicting doom like the CBI have said actually er it'll be fine.

They can if they want to pour fuel on the fire and turn Ukip into the SNP, sure.

27th Feb it dipped to 1.38660 and has been pretty steadily closing at 1.40+ since then (roughly 1.43).

Prior to referendum announcements (e.g. 19th) it was steady at 1.43 then went up a bit in anticipation of Remain win, after this it sunk to 1.34 (lowest it's been in god knows how long) then settled around 1.36753.

In the last 10 years the only time it's been below 1.36753 was 25th Jan 2009 at which point it hit 1.36450 (ignoring the 1.34101 it hit during Referendum).

So no, it's not incorrect.

I wonder if Leave would win if there was a second referendum, I wonder how many people based a large portion of their thought with Leave on the 350m to the NHS claim that was quickly retracted following a win? Would also convince the what 28% who didn't show up to stick their vote in.

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 09:35 PM

27th Feb it dipped to 1.38660 and has been pretty steadily closing at 1.40+ since then (roughly 1.43).

Prior to referendum announcements (e.g. 19th) it was steady at 1.43 then went up a bit in anticipation of Remain win, after this it sunk to 1.34 (lowest it's been in god knows how long) then settled around 1.36753.

In the last 10 years the only time it's been below 1.36753 was 25th Jan 2009 at which point it hit 1.36450 (ignoring the 1.34101 it hit during Referendum).

So no, it's not incorrect.

The graph says it all with various currencies. A non-event.

746668372864151552

Strong confidence in the British economy.

I wonder if Leave would win if there was a second referendum, I wonder how many people based a large portion of their thought with Leave on the 350m to the NHS claim that was quickly retracted following a win? Would also convince the what 28% who didn't show up to stick their vote in.

The answer to both your questions can be found in today's polling.

746808977908994048

746808671431168000

scottish

25-06-2016, 09:47 PM

The graph says it all with various currencies. A non-event.

The answer to both your questions can be found in today's polling.

746808977908994048

746808671431168000

Various currencies such as which?

I'd expect these will be the Euro and the GBP?

Well no, those polls are useless.

Firstly, 80% of the people polled could be 'Leave' voters resulting in a heavy amount of 'Leave' voters being unhappy after the result due to the retracted statements such as the 350M to spend on NHS/Education/etc.

If you ask 50% Leave voters and 50% Remain voters and the result is 50% are happy and 50% are unhappy that's not really surprising is it? However if the pollsters weigh more on the Leave side and are unhappy then that's a completely different story.

Secondly, we have proven time and time again polls are hugely inaccurate, for example your favourite Twitter Britain Elects published results of the 'on the day' poll which had 52% Remain, 48% Leave then 54% Remain and 46% Leave later on the same day. On the days leading up there was polls saying 55% Remain/45% Leave. Didn't the polls also show hugely different results for our Indyref?

How did that turn out for us? :P

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 09:55 PM

scottish

25-06-2016, 10:19 PM

@scottish (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=53890);

The currency comparisons I posted earlier are with the GBP to Krona, Euro, Dollar and Swiss Franc from 2012 to present.

I am having great fun watching mainly students insult older people and claim that somehow their vote is worth more, claiming that 52% of the population are nasty uneducated racists fooled by Rupert Murdoch, watching them throwing abuse at Boris Johnson and blocking his car in the road like spoilt brats, having them sign a petition demanding another vote and politicians telling us we didn't quite "get the message" but we did and we thought the message was shit.

Sally, aged 21 and studying film at "unay" believes her vote is worth more than Doris, aged 87 who lived through WWII and worked for 50 years. :P

It's quite possibly the biggest tantrum ever thrown in history.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/06/25/15/35A2E00600000578-3659769-image-a-42_1466866769068.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/06/25/15/35A203E000000578-3659769-image-a-38_1466866633410.jpg http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/06/25/15/35A27F6A00000578-3659769-Angry_Remain_fans_protest_the_result_of_the_EU_ref erendum_in_Lon-m-26_1466865696140.jpg

lmao.

That's life at the end of the day, people will complain about something if it doesn't go the way they want especially if they feel strongly about it. If it was a remain vote I'm sure you wouldn't shut up and just stop caring about the UK leaving the EU and be just sit happily with this.

I personally don't care what people voted for at the end of the day and couldn't care what their age is.

I do however agree with the petition due to the fact their most important propaganda piece was pulled hours following the result. I'm not saying that due to the fact that Leave won, similarly if we had a Remain vote and our poster and main propaganda piece said we'll gain 350M a year from the EU for remaining in the EU then on the day of the result we retract that statement and said yeah that's completely wrong I'd agree with a petition at that point as in either case that's going to have a huge impact on the voters and could be a main item to swing voters either way. The fact it was an outright lie in my mind warrants justification for the petition and a second referendum.

If I voted Leave due to that I'd be pretty pissed off.

Regarding currencies, we'll see if it continues to be a problem. Obviously our GBP > USD conversion is probably the most important (or at least from my view I'd consider it the most important) so any changes in this is visible to me. Obviously other currencies such as the Krona has been horrendously bad in the past and our value vs it has increased over the past few years (i.e. with your SEK we went to 13.26211 last year from about 10.5 in the years prior and we're down to 11.57419 now, so obviously not as bad as it's been in the past but if it continues to dip in the next few weeks then it very well could be).

Just seen an interesting comment by Teebs; http://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2016/jun/25/brexit-live-emergency-meetings-eu-uk-leave-vote#comment-77205935

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 10:31 PM

746820394217259008

Interesting that more Remain voters are happy with the result than Leavers unhappy.

In time that figure will be sure to grow. A lot of people never liked the EU but fell for the scaremongering, I know them personally.

That's life at the end of the day, people will complain about something if it doesn't go the way they want especially if they feel strongly about it. If it was a remain vote I'm sure you wouldn't shut up and just stop caring about the UK leaving the EU and be just sit happily with this.

I wouldn't be pleased with it but I would accept it. At the last General Election the party I did not want into government won a thumping majority and the party I supported only got 1 MP despite coming third nationally. Did I demand another election or whinge? No I did not.

I do however agree with the petition due to the fact their most important propaganda piece was pulled hours following the result. I'm not saying that due to the fact that Leave won, similarly if we had a Remain vote and our poster and main propaganda piece said we'll gain 350M a year from the EU for remaining in the EU then on the day of the result we retract that statement and said yeah that's completely wrong I'd agree with a petition at that point as in either case that's going to have a huge impact on the voters and could be a main item to swing voters either way. The fact it was an outright lie in my mind warrants justification for the petition and a second referendum.

I do not think you've understood the point about the 350 million. Firstly, you're not voting on a government or manifesto you're voting on the issue. Secondly, Farage who distanced himself from the claim had nothing to do with Vote Leave. Thirdly, the claim is still valid as when we do withdraw from the European Union the government will be fit to spend that 350 million on whichever it sees fit or has a mandate to do. The NHS claim was simply saying that we would have 350 million to spend on the NHS, not that the government (whoever it is) would enact. It could be split between the NHS, defence, care of the elderly, foreign aid - whatever the elected government upon withdrawal from the EU has a mandate to spend it in.

I personally would like to see it used on defence and/or launching our own (serious) space agency as we should be a player in that but we're not.

If I voted Leave due to that I'd be pretty pissed off.

People voted Leave because of sovereignty and immigration, not soley the (true) fact we could spend EU membership contributions elsewhere.

Regarding currencies, we'll see if it continues to be a problem. Obviously our GBP > USD conversion is probably the most important (or at least from my view I'd consider it the most important) so any changes in this is visible to me. Obviously other currencies such as the Krona has been horrendously bad in the past and our value vs it has increased over the past few years (i.e. with your SEK we went to 13.26211 last year from about 10.5 in the years prior and we're down to 11.57419 now, so obviously not as bad as it's been in the past but if it continues to dip in the next few weeks then it very well could be).

Just seen an interesting comment by Teebs; http://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2016/jun/25/brexit-live-emergency-meetings-eu-uk-leave-vote#comment-77205935

I wouldn't mind if the GBP dropped further as it'd help boost our exports and encourage more people to visit and invest here tbh.

Infact, there's a possibility in future years that as the Eurozone and EU continue to decay and potentially collapse, that we and Switzerland will benefit from capital flight (a good thing) from the collapsing Eurozone but which will push our currency up in a short space of time (instability).

scottish

25-06-2016, 10:31 PM

Also quite interesting

China Daily reports an estimate doing the rounds is that it will require 500 British negotiators and 10 years before any such deal could materialize, suggesting that the economic case for a Leave vote was never as strong as its advocates had claimed.

Chinese investors are also said to be concerned for their interests in the UK, as many chose to base their European operations in Britain to take advantage of the friendlier business climate and access to the 28-nation free market.

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 10:37 PM

@scottish (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=53890);

A strange estimate given non-EU Switzerland managed to sign an FTA with China after a period of 3 years.

http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/europpblog/2015/05/05/what-the-eu-could-learn-from-switzerlands-free-trade-agreement-with-china/

In July 2014, the free trade agreement signed between China and Switzerland formally took effect. The deal was the culmination of talks that began with a joint feasibility study in 2010, followed by nine rounds of negotiations between 2011-13. The agreement represented the second such deal by China with a European economy, (after Iceland, whose agreement also came into force in July of last year), and one of the largest of Beijing’s free trade agreements with an OECD member state.

It is worth noting that the EU currently does not have a FTA in place with China.

My bet is that the soon-to-be independent Great Britain will complete an FTA with China before/if the EU ever does. A benefit Britain has over Switzerland and Iceland is that when it comes to negotiating with Peking over this, no doubt our former colony Hong Kong (financial centre like London) will push heavily for it.

David

25-06-2016, 10:50 PM

Anyone seen this

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/brexit-latest-france-uk-eu-referendum-result-britain-trolled-over-leave-vote-a7102596.html

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

scottish

25-06-2016, 10:52 PM

746820394217259008

Interesting that more Remain voters are happy with the result than Leavers unhappy.

In time that figure will be sure to grow. A lot of people never liked the EU but fell for the scaremongering, I know them personally.

I wouldn't be pleased with it but I would accept it. At the last General Election the party I did not want into government won a thumping majority and the party I supported only got 1 MP despite coming third nationally. Did I demand another election or whinge? No I did not.

I do not think you've understood the point about the 350 million. Firstly, you're not voting on a government or manifesto you're voting on the issue. Secondly, Farage who distanced himself from the claim had nothing to do with Vote Leave. Thirdly, the claim is still valid as when we do withdraw from the European Union the government will be fit to spend that 350 million on whichever it sees fit or has a mandate to do. The NHS claim was simply saying that we would have 350 million to spend on the NHS, not that the government (whoever it is) would enact. It could be split between the NHS, defence, care of the elderly, foreign aid - whatever the elected government upon withdrawal from the EU has a mandate to spend it in.

I personally would like to see it used on defence and/or launching our own (serious) space agency as we should be a player in that but we're not.

People voted Leave because of sovereignty and immigration, not soley the (true) fact we could spend EU membership contributions elsewhere.

I wouldn't mind if the GBP dropped further as it'd help boost our exports and encourage more people to visit and invest here tbh.

Infact, there's a possibility in future years that as the Eurozone and EU continue to decay and potentially collapse, that we and Switzerland will benefit from capital flight (a good thing) from the collapsing Eurozone but which will push our currency up in a short space of time (instability).

Again, as polls have shown recently they're hugely inaccurate and how many people were polled? 30? 300? 3000? 30000? all hugely relevant imo. We've seen over past few years that those polls are often completely wrong :P

In time it really depends how it turns out, if our economy hits the shit then obviously everyone's going to be unhappy (apart from the Leave voters who don't notice the difference, i.e. 'the elite' as they're often called). If the UK excels then most people will be happy including Remain voters. So it's all down to how this turns out often the short-medium term.

Yes, UKIP lost and only got 1 MP but was any of the major reasons why any other party got voted get retracted immediately upon the vote? Not that I'm aware.

I understood it entirely, hence me being on the 'Remain' side :P Farage distanced himself from the claim after the vote was in. Are there any sources of him saying this is a flat out lie during the campaign? I would be interested to see that. The whole 'We send the EU £350 million a week, let's fund our NHS instead' and 'Let's given our NHS the £350 million the EU takes every week' were probably one of the most used propaganda pieces for Vote Leave, so obviously not everyone voted based on this but I'm sure it had a huge impact (otherwise it wouldn't be of been used...).

At the same time as increasing costs for a huge amount of imports (overall imports are about 1.65x exports, no idea on exact stats for countries as I don't have that much of an interest in looking). That would hit a lot of companies as well as ultimately the consumers.

I don't think a few pence per pound is going to affect tourism really.

There's every chance, at the same time our currency could plummet and have the our lowest valued pound we've ever had. But until that happens it's speculation.

- - - Updated - - -

Anyone seen this

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/brexit-latest-france-uk-eu-referendum-result-britain-trolled-over-leave-vote-a7102596.html

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

Lmao, doesn't France want to leave too now (or at least one party)?

scottish

25-06-2016, 11:16 PM

Also just came across this:

http://news.sky.com/story/1717499/tata-steel-bidders-get-cold-feet-over-brexit

The bidders who were likely to take over Tata Steel (11,000 jobs) are unlikely to proceed with this after the Brexit vote.

Several bidders for Tata Steel's British operations are close to abandoning talks with their Indian owner as the outcome of the EU referendum threatens to deepen the crisis enveloping the UK's biggest steel producer.

Sky News has learnt that the billionaire tycoon Wilbur Ross, who is among seven bidders shortlisted for Tata Steel's UK business, has signalled that exiting the EU would diminish the prospects of him pursuing a takeover.

A number of other prospective buyers are understood to have similar concerns about the potential impact of Brexit on global demand for steel, the robustness of new trade deals negotiated by the Government, and the ability to sell steel produced in the UK in the European single market.

"Wilbur has been reasonably open that this deal is far less attractive if Brexit happens," said a person who has discussed the Tata Steel situation with Mr Ross.

Sources said this weekend that Tata Steel, which employs roughly 11,000 people in the UK, had raised the possibility of putting its British business into some form of liquidation, although they added that no decisions had been taken.

From what I believe majority of those 11,000 are at their largest site in Wales.

Good thing Wales voted Leave :P

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 11:21 PM

@scottish (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=53890);

That's otherwise known as bartering. He's obviously looking to push for a cheaper price. The idea that people put business off or stop trading with one another because of a political union is frankly absurd. Businessmen and investors invest because a product/service is good, not because we're in or out of the EU.

It's like in the next few months I have no doubt that some companies which have been planning layoffs anyway will put it down to "Brexit uncertainty". All spin.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/25/view-from-germany-hans-kundnani-britain-eu-vote-leave?CMP=soc_3156

France by the way is one of the next likely to hold a referendum and leave, although I would put odds more likely on the Netherlands and Denmark first being non-Euro countries. I could see in the French Presidential elections Marine Le Pen pledging a vote (as she just has done) and Sarkozy/someone else matching it.

746288558353297408

The Party for Freedom (PVV) is currently leading the Dutch polls and is now promising a referendum too. Netherlands GE is in March 2017.

lemons

25-06-2016, 11:22 PM

746841297953169408

interesting ! theyre obviously expecting a general election sooner than later

could lib dems rise from the ashes?

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 11:27 PM

746841297953169408

interesting ! theyre obviously expecting a general election sooner than later

could lib dems rise from the ashes?

I hope the Trading Standards Authority make them change their name then. "Democrats" :P :rolleyes:

scottish

25-06-2016, 11:32 PM

@scottish (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=53890);

That's otherwise known as bartering He's obviously looking to push for a cheaper price. The idea that people put business off or stop trading with one another because of a political union is frankly absurd. Businessmen and investors invest because a product/service is good, not because we're in or out of the EU.

It's like in the next few months I have no doubt that some companies which have been planning layoffs anyway will put it down to "Brexit uncertainty". All spin.

It's not about being in or out of the EU, it's the economic stability and trading.

As a very plain example if we're unable to freely trade with every country in the EU our exports are drastically a lot worse off (i'm unsure how much steel is sold in the UK, and how much is exported etc, but if a lot is exported then there's suddenly a seriously higher risk to owning a steel business than there was last week).

Now obviously that won't be the case, and as the article discusses the robustness of new trade agreements and ability to sell steel in the European single market will have an impact on this.

So the article seems fine, if there's good trade agreements then it may even be more favourable owning the factory. But as it stands main investors are getting cold feet due to uncertainty and I'm sure there'll be a lot more investors etc that will be in a similar position over the next few months (or years).

With regards to that comment I posted what do you think of that? http://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2016/jun/25/brexit-live-emergency-meetings-eu-uk-leave-vote#comment-77205935

How do you think it'll proceed from here?

Also, if we do then impose Article 50, within those 2 years do we then start trade negotiations with other countries effective from UK-EU Termination date (i.e. 2 years from date it's imposed)? Or would the trade negotiations be unable to take place until the UK-EU termination date?

lemons

25-06-2016, 11:37 PM

It will be very interesting to see where both the tory and labour parties go from here because views among their MPs don't seem to be very consistent

-:Undertaker:-

25-06-2016, 11:45 PM

It's not about being in or out of the EU, it's the economic stability and trading.

As a very plain example if we're unable to freely trade with every country in the EU our exports are drastically a lot worse off (i'm unsure how much steel is sold in the UK, and how much is exported etc, but if a lot is exported then there's suddenly a seriously higher risk to owning a steel business than there was last week).

Now obviously that won't be the case, and as the article discusses the robustness of new trade agreements and ability to sell steel in the European single market will have an impact on this.

So the article seems fine, if there's good trade agreements then it may even be more favourable owning the factory. But as it stands main investors are getting cold feet due to uncertainty and I'm sure there'll be a lot more investors etc that will be in a similar position over the next few months (or years).

It'll be fine. Thus far there's been a lot of subdued and soothing talk which contrasts greatly with the doom forecasts we were treated to before we voted to Leave. The sky hasn't fallen in and it won't fall in: have some confidence that this country can stand on her own two feet.

If you look at the political reactions so far, the panic has actually been at the EU end: they're terrified now that this is going to spread.

With regards to that comment I posted what do you think of that? http://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2016/jun/25/brexit-live-emergency-meetings-eu-uk-leave-vote#comment-77205935

How do you think it'll proceed from here?

Also, if we do then impose Article 50, within those 2 years do we then start trade negotiations with other countries effective from UK-EU Termination date (i.e. 2 years from date it's imposed)? Or would the trade negotiations be unable to take place until the UK-EU termination date?

I simply think people are looking for excuses that we're not leaving when we are. The reason why Article 50 hasn't been triggered just yet - and I agree with it and have said in the past there's no need to instantly trigger it - is because Britain will want to lobby officials in European capitals before negotiations actually formally start. That way, the actual negotiations ought to have a baseline in which discussions will take place on when the Treaty clause has been activated. This is pretty standard stuff: you know when leaders go to televised meetings like the European Council most of the negotiations have already taken place behind the scenes, the face-to-face negotations are often mainly for the PR political benefit of the leaders attending.

On trade deals with other countries, talks can begin immediately yeah. We'll not yet be taking our seat at the World Trade Organisation (WTO) but talks on a bilateral basis can take place now so that they can be introduced when EU withdrawal is completed. I expect in many cases that these should be concluded quickly if there's already an EU FTA in place (as we're already operating under that) but we'd be looking at deepening some of the trade deals. For example, I think African nations in particular will be eager to push for more open agricultural agreements with us than they currently have under the existing EU deals as France as the biggest farming country in the EU has often blocked any attempt to open agricultural trade up to Africa.

scottish

26-06-2016, 12:07 AM

With regards to your previous comments about racist, I imagine the following is some reason as to why people view the Leave voters as racist

https://www.facebook.com/sarah.leblanc.718/media_set?set=a.10101369198638985&type=3&pnref=story

Added to the fact that the older generation voted leave (which most people will assume are more typically racist than someone our age).

Obviously in reality this is the very minority of voters, but if they're the ones who are standing out then people will end up making a stereotype :P

-:Undertaker:-

26-06-2016, 12:25 AM

Labour's civil war is now underway folks.

746860149562806273

746863914563026946

The dismissal of Benn will for certain mean a leadership challenge.

With regards to your previous comments about racist, I imagine the following is some reason as to why people view the Leave voters as racist

Anyone who views 52% of the population as racist due to Twitter posts by trolls need their head checking.

I have spoken about the student crybabies and petition signers throwing a tantrum but there's plenty of people out there - the vast overwhelming portion of that vote - who voted Remain who are decent folk who just happen to have a different opinion to myself and the majority.

https://www.facebook.com/sarah.leblanc.718/media_set?set=a.10101369198638985&type=3&pnref=story

Added to the fact that the older generation voted leave (which most people will assume are more typically racist than someone our age).

Obviously in reality this is the very minority of voters, but if they're the ones who are standing out then people will end up making a stereotype :P

I don't yet think it has occurred to the yoof but *maybe* just maybe older people voted to Leave in overwhelming numbers because they don't like the European Union after 43 years experience of it. Maybe, having had a full 43-year experience of this organisation they don't like it, felt betrayed when they voted in under false pretences back in 1975, and having experienced life properly rather than just living on a student loan and having a "gap yah" paid for by mummy and daddy they've voted for a better future for their children and/or grandchildren?

It's funny how the side wanting closer relations with the black/brown/yellow/white Commonwealth over the white EU can be called racist. :P

RyRy

26-06-2016, 01:26 AM

746841297953169408

interesting ! theyre obviously expecting a general election sooner than later

could lib dems rise from the ashes?

I find that the most disgusting, deliberate OPPORTUNISTIC attack on this referendum I have ever seen so far.

52% OF PEOPLE VOTED TO LEAVE. I'm not surprised that Lib Dems would say this though, this is the same party who said they'd get rid of student fees then when given the option to do so, and then went completely against that pledge. This will resonate with young voters but that in itself is worrying, because there will be those who got stung by Lib Dems over the student fees who will vote for them again.

And as it'll mostly be University students who voted for them first time round, you can be sure I will ear bash any university student aka 'educated' person, who votes for them a second time round. Heres hoping my friends aren't those with a selective memory.

-:Undertaker:-

26-06-2016, 01:33 AM

RyRy;

What's funny as well is that for years the Liberal Democrats pushed for - specifically - an In/Out referendum. :P

https://englanduniteddotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/12/nick-clegg-its-time-for-a-referendum-on-the-eu.jpg

RyRy

26-06-2016, 01:38 AM

-:Undertaker:-;

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cl1hNYgWkAE8Isk.jpg:large

Even Farron himself voted for it, but like literally most remain people I've spoken to, it's only a valid referendum when remain wins.

wixard

26-06-2016, 09:40 AM

patiently waiting for information regarding the common travel area (to determine my rights here)

all information given by leave campaign before it suggested it would be unaffected, now it's looking otherwise

buttons

26-06-2016, 09:41 AM

@RyRy (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=81175);

What's funny as well is that for years the Liberal Democrats pushed for - specifically - an In/Out referendum. :P

https://englanduniteddotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/12/nick-clegg-its-time-for-a-referendum-on-the-eu.jpg
30 yrs? did we have a referendum before early on and what happened?

scottish

26-06-2016, 09:48 AM

I find that the most disgusting, deliberate OPPORTUNISTIC attack on this referendum I have ever seen so far.

52% OF PEOPLE VOTED TO LEAVE. I'm not surprised that Lib Dems would say this though, this is the same party who said they'd get rid of student fees then when given the option to do so, and then went completely against that pledge. This will resonate with young voters but that in itself is worrying, because there will be those who got stung by Lib Dems over the student fees who will vote for them again.

And as it'll mostly be University students who voted for them first time round, you can be sure I will ear bash any university student aka 'educated' person, who votes for them a second time round. Heres hoping my friends aren't those with a selective memory.

I imagine that's what the next GE will be, In or Out parties. At least I can hope that will be the case.

I'm sure people will listen to you :P

@<b><a href="https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=81175" target="_blank">RyRy</a></b>;

What's funny as well is that for years the Liberal Democrats pushed for - specifically - an In/Out referendum. :P

https://englanduniteddotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/12/nick-clegg-its-time-for-a-referendum-on-the-eu.jpg

and I'm sure he's the first politician in the world to retract something after they got a result that they don't agree with.

@<b><a href="https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=24233" target="_blank">-:Undertaker:-</a></b>;

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cl1hNYgWkAE8Isk.jpg:large

Even Farron himself voted for it, but like literally most remain people I've spoken to, it's only a valid referendum when remain wins.

Of course, if they vote for the ref then remain wins they get goodie points because they've voted to initiate the referendum that gave people the choice.

Now that it's not a favourable result they'll do anything they can to avoid that outcome, and as such will probably get quite a surge in voters (i.e. if they're the only party who announce this then I'd imagine more Remain voters will be voting them for that policy alone. I'd suspect most parties will be a In/Out though.)

It's like you don't know the first thing about politicians.

- - - Updated - - -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCghi2rVaWY

lol

Inseriousity.

26-06-2016, 10:00 AM

The problem is to win a general election, you need the support of England as that's where the vast majority of seats are. You also need the support of the older generation as they are more likely to vote. Both of whom supported Leave in large numbers. If Parliament tries to circumvent the democratic decision of the referendum via some political maneuvering, they will find their careers shortened.

scottish

26-06-2016, 10:03 AM

But at the same time, those parties which are a Out party will also face losing a large amount of their voters who went with remain I'd imagine (if this does turn out to be the case).

So this could be an interesting time.

Inseriousity.

26-06-2016, 10:11 AM

Where? Which parties?

scottish

26-06-2016, 10:20 AM

Everywhere and every.

For example in the other thread we've seen that the Labour voters were like 50/50, so in the event that we have a GE and labour come out as saying if you vote us we'll not be leaving the EU, a heavy amount of the 'leave' voters are going to bail on labour, where as they may gain a lot of the remain voters.

At the same time lets say UKIP (for a laugh, lets not pretend they'll ever get in power) come out and say they'll be leaving the EU in the event they get power, then they'll likely get a lot of those leave voters.

But obviously that's speculation, like everything that's been posted about the EURef over the past 2 years.

Time will tell.

Pound seems steady at 1.36753 for now lets hope it continues to stay stable.

Inseriousity.

26-06-2016, 10:25 AM

Personally I think it'd just be the fringe parties like the Lib Dems/UKIP/Greens that would do something like this. It's too risky for the bigger parties.

FlyingJesus

26-06-2016, 10:41 AM

Anyone knowvhow these figures on what age votes what came about? Is it more nonsense polling of a tiny selection or did they genuinely sort through each and every ballot putting them in little piles

-:Undertaker:-

26-06-2016, 01:27 PM

Any party which attempts to overturn the democratic will of the British people is committing electoral suicide. And possibly inviting violence.

There's no doubt this is the most extraordinary and ground-shaking moment in our post-war history now. The old order is shattered beyond repair.

http://www.ezimba.com/work/160627C/ezimba16961016667400.png

Lucy

26-06-2016, 01:48 PM

I was away over the weekend so have missed a lot of the referendum posts, I have seen a lot of complaining and moaning from people in the remain camp. I find the stupidest argument being that a 52% majority is not big enough and the referendum needs to be held again. A majority is a majority and you cannot just start implementing rules after the referendum, in reality the four percent win was a majority of over a million people (i haven't looked at the exact numbers as yet). I think people just need to get on with it, 24 hours or so after "Brexit" was decided there hasn't been any major catastrophe, as far as I know no companies have posted an intent on leaving britain, the FTSE recovered to just a 3% loss yesterday and the Bank of England has vowed to fight with England, I suppose the only major drop is the British pound which will only help any exporters, but short term gain for long term gain? I think we just need to work very hard and power forwards, I think Jeremy Clarkson said it best.

Oh and I also wanted to add that Sturgeons agenda getting shot down by the EU I find hilarious.

746350798112710660

lemons

26-06-2016, 03:23 PM

turns out that the 2nd ref petition (which now has 3,264,565 signatures - obvs not all from UK) was made by a leave supporter over a month ago lol!

http://news.sky.com/story/1717815/second-referendum-petition-was-set-up-by-outer

The petition for a second referendum on EU membership, which has now topped three million supporters, was set up by a leave campaigner a month ago when he thought his side would lose.

Oliver Healey has disclosed that because there was "no guarantee of a leave victory at that time" he set up the petition "with the intention of making it harder for 'remain' to further shackle us to the EU".

In a Facebook post, the English Democrats member said he felt it was time to "clarify my position on the issue even if it looks bad" and stressed that the remain side had "hijacked" the petition on the government website.

He said: "I am genuinely appalled by the behaviour of some of the remain campaign, how they are conducting themselves post-referendum not just with this petition but generally.

"The referendum was fairly funded; democratically endorsed, every vote was weighted equally and I believe this was a true reflection of the mood of the country. To my fellow leavers, now doubting their decision please keep the faith, we will be fine just stick with it."

still stupid

we just need to get on with it and someone needs to whip out article 50 asap

Inseriousity.

26-06-2016, 03:49 PM

lol I saw that. Makes it even more amusing that he would get the right numbers spot on to round up both turnout and the percentage.

FlyingJesus

26-06-2016, 04:13 PM

Thing is it makes sense to make that sort of petition BEFORE the referendum takes place, taking it on afterwards with the same wording doesn't make any sense at all and is just a social media tantrum

lemons

26-06-2016, 05:21 PM

747115980074160128

https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2015-10/7/8/enhanced/webdr14/enhanced-1405-1444221685-1.png

Inseriousity.

26-06-2016, 06:32 PM

I got bored and posted a blog about the future (https://inseriousity.wordpress.com/2016/06/26/where-do-we-go-from-here/) if anyone is interested.

I really like Theresa May but not sure if she'd gather enough support when she stayed in the background during the campaign instead of putting her neck on the line.

FlyingJesus

26-06-2016, 06:58 PM

dat power stance tho

-:Undertaker:-

26-06-2016, 07:35 PM

I hope May is blocked.

She was known to want to Leave but bottled it and half-arsed backed Remain for the sake of her career. Yesterday's woman. It's the same with that Savid Javid who is another one who was known to want to Leave but also bottled it on the basis that it'd do his career good. Discredited. It's great to see the odds on Osborne now behind even those who have ruled themselves out - we still haven't seen him since Thursday. His career is dead in the water.

Boris Johnson or David Davies would be nice. Or as many are now speculating Andrea Leadsom. New PM has to be a Leaver as IDS has said.

MKR&*42

26-06-2016, 07:36 PM

me, @Red (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=81989);, @Inseriousity. (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=26409); or was it @Intersocial (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=86637); and I thinkkkk @-:Undertaker:- (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=24233); were online for the scottish referendum

i'll come on if other people are online

Really late reply from me, but I was online for the Scottish referendum I ... think? I no longer use Habbo so I won't be on for any future referendums.

As for this result, I am very disappointed with the result and also, like many people including leave voters, quite surprised leave won.
--
Also, May has played this very well by not choosing to 100% defend either side. I think she knew full on well what she was doing and it's really going to pay off for her.

-:Undertaker:-

26-06-2016, 08:45 PM

More good news in terms of potential trade deals.

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/06/26/president-iceland-welcomes-brexit-looks-forward-strengthened-relations-britain/

President of Iceland welcomes Brexit, looks forward to stronger relations with Great Britain

https://jesuslordofall.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/icfla.jpg

The President of Iceland has welcomed Britain’s exit from the European Union, voicing hopes that the UK will now strengthen it’s relationship with Iceland, Greenland and Norway.

President Ólafur Ragnar Grímsson said the vote to leave the EU represented a “serious setback” for the leaders of the EU, and opened the door to a new “triangle of nations” working together outside of the EU, shifting power in the north of Europe away from the European Union.

“It is now obvious that here in the North Atlantic will be a triangle of nations that all stand outside of the European Union: Greenland, Iceland, Great Britain, Faroe Islands and Norway,” he said, adding: “This key area in the North will be outside of the influence of the European Union.”

A new political party in Hong Kong has also been set up to push for the growing movement for the city to come under British authority again.

Not going to happen but Hong Kong will be a powerful voice when it comes to us pushing for a trade deal with China.

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/06/26/just-days-brexit-hong-kong-protesters-call-country-rejoin-uk/

Hong Kong protestors call for city to come under British sovereignty again following Brexit

http://media.breitbart.com/media/2016/06/Hong-Kong-640x480.png

Just days after the British people voted to regain their independence from an unelected bureaucracy, campaigners in Hong Kong have launched a political party agitating for the city to be returned to British rule as a transitional stage towards independence.

Billy Chiu is a young campaigner who first rose to prominence three years ago when he waved the British colonial flag in protest at Chinese rule, having broken in to a military facility. Today, he called a press conference to announce the launch of the Alliance to Resume British Sovereignty Over Hong Kong and Independence.

Hong Kong was formally handed back to Beijing by the British in 1997, with the Sino-British Joint Declaration ostensibly preserving its liberties for 50 years. But there are growing concerns that freedoms enshrined in the agreement are being steadily eroded by the Chinese Communist Party, leading to increasingly vociferous calls for true independence.

FlyingJesus

26-06-2016, 10:13 PM

Iceland deal depends on how the football goes tomorrow

Zak

27-06-2016, 11:48 AM

Anyone seen this

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/brexit-latest-france-uk-eu-referendum-result-britain-trolled-over-leave-vote-a7102596.html

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

Certainly no xenophobia in that article

dbgtz

27-06-2016, 11:59 AM

Anyone else seen IDS backtrack on the NHS £350 million claim :)

I hope May is blocked.

She was known to want to Leave but bottled it and half-arsed backed Remain for the sake of her career. Yesterday's woman. It's the same with that Savid Javid who is another one who was known to want to Leave but also bottled it on the basis that it'd do his career good. Discredited. It's great to see the odds on Osborne now behind even those who have ruled themselves out - we still haven't seen him since Thursday. His career is dead in the water.

Boris Johnson or David Davies would be nice. Or as many are now speculating Andrea Leadsom. New PM has to be a Leaver as IDS has said.

What? You hope May isn't voted as leader because she chose Remain to benefit her career, but choosing Boris Johnson would be nice?! Out of everyone in this whole shit show of a referendum, he's easily the biggest opportunist of the lot. As far as I'm concerned, he's the scummiest politician in this country right now and I would much prefer May over him, and I quite despise May. Though, I'd rather a new election altogether once all the parties have sorted their shit out.

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 12:33 PM

Anyone else seen IDS backtrack on the NHS £350 million claim :)

What's so hard to understand about the NHS point, I mean really? Vote Leave was a campaign, not a government. It is up to the government which is elected how that £350 million is spent whether it is on defence, the NHS, the police, science, care of the elderly - whatever. You could hardly have a poster listing all the government departments you're going to spend the money on because then it ceases to be a poster and becomes a document. In any case, we're about two years away still from having that £350 million a week back in our pockets and then we can decide as a country how it is spent.

Whether all of it on the NHS or not, at least it will be spent here on our own people.

What? You hope May isn't voted as leader because she chose Remain to benefit her career, but choosing Boris Johnson would be nice?! Out of everyone in this whole shit show of a referendum, he's easily the biggest opportunist of the lot. As far as I'm concerned, he's the scummiest politician in this country right now and I would much prefer May over him, and I quite despise May. Though, I'd rather a new election altogether once all the parties have sorted their shit out.

May was known to want to leave given her time as Home Secretary her hands were tied in being unable to carry out election promises due to EU law on immigration as well as the issue over the deportation of terrorists and criminals. The point is however that whilst her failure as Home Secretary has been due to the fact her hands have been tied by EU law, she should have stuck her neck out on the line like Johnson and especially Gove did (over court supremacy) and campaigned for Leave.

Instead she came out in favour of Remain and sat on her hands. We need a PM with backbone to lead our withdrawal, not a hand sitter.

scottish

27-06-2016, 12:36 PM

Pound on another steady decrease today, went from 1.36753 to 1.31709 currently.

rip

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 12:53 PM

Former Governor of the Bank of England, Lord Mervyn King, has said the Remain campaign and Governent treated people "like idiots" over economic "scare stories"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QP7Ps1A107Y

How Osborne can stay in office any longer I have no idea. How can markets have faith in him given his forecasts were completely wrong?

dbgtz

27-06-2016, 03:04 PM

What's so hard to understand about the NHS point, I mean really? Vote Leave was a campaign, not a government. It is up to the government which is elected how that £350 million is spent whether it is on defence, the NHS, the police, science, care of the elderly - whatever. You could hardly have a poster listing all the government departments you're going to spend the money on because then it ceases to be a poster and becomes a document. In any case, we're about two years away still from having that £350 million a week back in our pockets and then we can decide as a country how it is spent.

Whether all of it on the NHS or not, at least it will be spent here on our own people.

Aside from the inevitable "it's not £350 million", that's not the point. It was a big chunk of their campaign and yes, right now they don't get to decide where it goes but they're essentially saying it can't be done, similarly to how Dan Hannan has sad that immigration would probably not go down despite that being probably the main reason for most of the leave votes. Yes, he's also not in government but you shouldn't spout shit that you yourself do not believe will happen and will make no attempt to change in the future.

I also want to say, as a quick edit here, are you seriously so hateful of the EU that you will just sit here and defend people misleading and lying others? Whether you like it or not people genuinely believed that there will be £350 million a week which will go to services such as healthcare because they were lead to believe so, now as a result (at least for the short term), people are going to suffer and see absolutely no benefit whatsoever. Before you try and say "oh but Remain lied too", no shit but I'm not defending that.

Oh let's also not forget everyone wanting to be in the single market too...

May was known to want to leave given her time as Home Secretary her hands were tied in being unable to carry out election promises due to EU law on immigration as well as the issue over the deportation of terrorists and criminals. The point is however that whilst her failure as Home Secretary has been due to the fact her hands have been tied by EU law, she should have stuck her neck out on the line like Johnson and especially Gove did (over court supremacy) and campaigned for Leave.

Instead she came out in favour of Remain and sat on her hands. We need a PM with backbone to lead our withdrawal, not a hand sitter.

You seem to be replying as if I'm defending Theresa May; I am not. I am simply saying that Boris did exactly what she has done i.e. what's best for him but you simply don't see that because he's "on your side" (which, he isn't).

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 03:38 PM

Aside from the inevitable "it's not £350 million", that's not the point. It was a big chunk of their campaign and yes, right now they don't get to decide where it goes but they're essentially saying it can't be done, similarly to how Dan Hannan has sad that immigration would probably not go down despite that being probably the main reason for most of the leave votes. Yes, he's also not in government but you shouldn't spout shit that you yourself do not believe will happen and will make no attempt to change in the future.

I haven't really seen much indication that it will not be done, if we were serious about it then the person most likely to implement such a pledge was Boris Johnson MP. If he comes Prime Minister and in two years time does not pledge a substantial amount towards then NHS, then you and I will be able to vote him out which is much better than the current situation where the EU takes most of that money and then spends the rest here with not a care in the world what you and I think. That's what this issue is really about.

On Daniel Hannan MEP again this man is not even in the House of Commons so I have no idea why you are taking everything so seriously, we do not yet know the deal we will reach. My inkling is that we're heading towards EEA membership but with Freedom of Movement ended under such a deal - Andrea Leadsom MP who is a prominent Leave campaigner has stated Freedom of Movement will be ended in the negotiations as has Boris Johnson MP in his Telegraph column. If we can keep full access to the Single Market and curtail Freedom of Movement then that will be ideal, however if the European Union attempts to force FoM in return for full SM access then I suspect - and rightly so - that we shall reject such an offer and take EFTA or a simple FTA which is my ultimate choice.

I do think you are getting a bit ahead of yourself here as are some Leavers. It's been 4 days since the referendum and we've 2 years+ to go.

I also want to say, as a quick edit here, are you seriously so hateful of the EU that you will just sit here and defend people misleading and lying others? Whether you like it or not people genuinely believed that there will be £350 million a week which will go to services such as healthcare because they were lead to believe so, now as a result (at least for the short term), people are going to suffer and see absolutely no benefit whatsoever. Before you try and say "oh but Remain lied too", no shit but I'm not defending that.

If the European Union was giving us £350m a week then I would still vote to Leave, I don't know how clear I have to be about this as I always have been. This to me has never been solely about tomato regulations, fish quotas or membership costs: this is about sovereignty and the supremacy of our courts and by voting to Leave my ambition has been achieved now whether or not £350m is spent on the Royal Navy, the NHS or Foreign Aid. It really is of no consequence to myself as I would pay almost any heavy monetary price to have achieved what we have now achieved. This was all about principles, not money.

In terms of any pledges by politicians this is exactly the reason why I wanted our self-government back. Because let's for instance say that a Johnson Ministry doesn't spent the £350 million a week on the NHS - well we can now vote that government out and hold it to account at election time. When the European Union was taking and spending this money, you had no democratic ability to hold it to account nor did I. I have never claimed that by leaving our politicians will suddenly all become salt of the earth characters: they're politicians at the end of the day and you should still distrust them as far as you can throw them. The point is though that you will shortly now have the power to hold them accountable and that's what this is all about.

Oh let's also not forget everyone wanting to be in the single market too...

Single Market access will depend on Freedom of Movement. The country/parliament will not be blackmailed into FoM by the EU in return for full SM access.

747401555586932736

747346925586784256

Leadsom is considering a leadership run. There's enough MPs to block any deal allowing FoM and there's Ukip pressure if need be.

You seem to be replying as if I'm defending Theresa May; I am not. I am simply saying that Boris did exactly what she has done i.e. what's best for him but you simply don't see that because he's "on your side" (which, he isn't).

You seem to think I am an avid Boris Johnson MP fan. I'm not. If I had my way, David Davies MP would become Prime Minister as he is much more in line with myself on civil liberties and education than Boris. However, faced between Johnson and May at least Johnson put his neck on the line and helped gain this country's independence and self-government back and for that I really do not mind if he is rewarded for it. May gambled and she lost, tough titty.

dbgtz

27-06-2016, 04:20 PM

I haven't really seen much indication that it will not be done, if we were serious about it then the person most likely to implement such a pledge was Boris Johnson MP. If he comes Prime Minister and in two years time does not pledge a substantial amount towards then NHS, then you and I will be able to vote him out which is much better than the current situation where the EU takes most of that money and then spends the rest here with not a care in the world what you and I think. That's what this issue is really about.

On Daniel Hannan MEP again this man is not even in the House of Commons so I have no idea why you are taking everything so seriously, we do not yet know the deal we will reach. My inkling is that we're heading towards EEA membership but with Freedom of Movement ended under such a deal - Andrea Leadsom MP who is a prominent Leave campaigner has stated Freedom of Movement will be ended in the negotiations as has Boris Johnson MP in his Telegraph column. If we can keep full access to the Single Market and curtail Freedom of Movement then that will be ideal, however if the European Union attempts to force FoM in return for full SM access then I suspect - and rightly so - that we shall reject such an offer and take EFTA or a simple FTA which is my ultimate choice.

I do think you are getting a bit ahead of yourself here as are some Leavers. It's been 4 days since the referendum and we've 2 years+ to go.

Aside from the fact there isn't £350 million to begin with, should Boris become PM he is very much an advocate of the single market which will cost us a significant chunk still.

Perhaps he's not in the HoC, but he was still very much on the leave side and I believe on the actual campaign. When someone part of a campaign goes back on something they said, it doesn't exactly inspire much hope. Boris is also full of shit so I wouldn't believe a word he said.

I'm not getting ahead of myself when people in the Leave campaign start retracting their statements almost immediately.

If the European Union was giving us £350m a week then I would still vote to Leave, I don't know how clear I have to be about this as I always have been. This to me has never been solely about tomato regulations, fish quotas or membership costs: this is about sovereignty and the supremacy of our courts and by voting to Leave my ambition has been achieved now whether or not £350m is spent on the Royal Navy, the NHS or Foreign Aid. It really is of no consequence to myself as I would pay almost any heavy monetary price to have achieved what we have now achieved. This was all about principles, not money.

In terms of any pledges by politicians this is exactly the reason why I wanted our self-government back. Because let's for instance say that a Johnson Ministry doesn't spent the £350 million a week on the NHS - well we can now vote that government out and hold it to account at election time. When the European Union was taking and spending this money, you had no democratic ability to hold it to account nor did I. I have never claimed that by leaving our politicians will suddenly all become salt of the earth characters: they're politicians at the end of the day and you should still distrust them as far as you can throw them. The point is though that you will shortly now have the power to hold them accountable and that's what this is all about.

You seem to be mistaken about what I'm saying. Whatever your personal reasons are, I'm not fussed. But you're defending people who mislead others who voted leave because of those reasons because it suits you. It's not even really about the EU as a whole, it's about politicians spouting such obvious lies and getting away with it.

Single Market access will depend on Freedom of Movement. The country/parliament will not be blackmailed into FoM by the EU in return for full SM access.

747401555586932736

747346925586784256

Leadsom is considering a leadership run. There's enough MPs to block any deal allowing FoM and there's Ukip pressure if need be.

Yes, linking me to something Boris Johnson says, I'm really going to believe that. A simple Google will list out all of his crap I'm sure. Anyway, what you've just done is linked to two peoples opinions who currently have no real say in the matter, yet not long before tell me to ignore Dan Hannan as he has no real say in the matter :P

You seem to think I am an avid Boris Johnson MP fan. I'm not. If I had my way, David Davies MP would become Prime Minister as he is much more in line with myself on civil liberties and education than Boris. However, faced between Johnson and May at least Johnson put his neck on the line and helped gain this country's independence and self-government back and for that I really do not mind if he is rewarded for it. May gambled and she lost, tough titty.

You said not long ago,

Boris Johnson or David Davies would be nice
so you must be a fan to a certain extent, especially as you list him before the one you claim to like more.

So basically what you're saying is, you don't mind politicians lying and being self serving so long as it suits you?

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 04:32 PM

Aside from the fact there isn't £350 million to begin with, should Boris become PM he is very much an advocate of the single market which will cost us a significant chunk still.

That's if we have to pay something in the agreement.

And even if we do like Norway, it is still a hell of a lot less than we pay now.

Perhaps he's not in the HoC, but he was still very much on the leave side and I believe on the actual campaign. When someone part of a campaign goes back on something they said, it doesn't exactly inspire much hope. Boris is also full of shit so I wouldn't believe a word he said.

I'm not getting ahead of myself when people in the Leave campaign start retracting their statements almost immediately.

But you wanted the money to go to the EU so why does it bother you? The only people it should be bothering are people who voted Leave, and not once have I seen any Leavers complain about this given we do not yet even know what deal we'll end up with. The vast majority of Leave voters were voting on sovereignty, democracy and immigration - not the hypothetical budget of the NHS. In any case, whether £350m or £100m goes to the NHS in the end and the rest on the Royal Navy or care of the elderly I again could not care less. The money is going to be spent on our own people, that's key.

You seem to be mistaken about what I'm saying. Whatever your personal reasons are, I'm not fussed. But you're defending people who mislead others who voted leave because of those reasons because it suits you. It's not even really about the EU as a whole, it's about politicians spouting such obvious lies and getting away with it.

I'm not defending them. I said we don't yet know the final deal.

I'm not a Conservative Party member, supporter, activist or an advisor to a Tory MP, so challenging me on whether they'll carry through on promises is pointless. I'll know when you know which is when Article 50 negotiations are completed and the new Ministry starts spending that former EU budget cash.

Yes, linking me to something Boris Johnson says, I'm really going to believe that. A simple Google will list out all of his crap I'm sure. Anyway, what you've just done is linked to two peoples opinions who currently have no real say in the matter, yet not long before tell me to ignore Dan Hannan as he has no real say in the matter :P

Yes but come on we know Johnson is either going to be Prime Minister or be in the cabinet, more weight than what an MEP says.

You said not long ago,

so you must be a fan to a certain extent, especially as you list him before the one you claim to like more.

I like the fact he put his neck on the line and helped win the referendum, yes. George Galloway also helped but it doesn't mean I am a fan.

I've simply said I would prefer Johnson over May but neither are my top choice. Is that a crime?

So basically what you're saying is, you don't mind politicians lying and being self serving so long as it suits you?

Don't put words into my mouth, I haven't said anything of the sort.

We're 4 days after the vote, wait and see what the deal we come to looks like and what the next Ministry - whether Johnson, Leadsom, May or other - does. I supported the Leave campaign to get back our sovereignty, I am as of yet undecided how I will vote (if) at the next General Election.

dbgtz

27-06-2016, 05:51 PM

That's if we have to pay something in the agreement.

And even if we do like Norway, it is still a hell of a lot less than we pay now.

Depends how you look at it. Some say after our returns from rebate and direct EU spending, we pay less but I haven't looked too much into it I have to say. Either way, it's still money taken from the supposed NHS fund.

But you wanted the money to go to the EU so why does it bother you? The only people it should be bothering are people who voted Leave, and not once have I seen any Leavers complain about this given we do not yet even know what deal we'll end up with. The vast majority of Leave voters were voting on sovereignty, democracy and immigration - not the hypothetical budget of the NHS. In any case, whether £350m or £100m goes to the NHS in the end and the rest on the Royal Navy or care of the elderly I again could not care less. The money is going to be spent on our own people, that's key.

You assume I want money to go to the EU, no. I voted remain because I detested the spew from the Leave campaign. The vast majority, perhaps, but still entirely possible without the NHS lie the vote would have been remain.

That is until you fight to privatise it though, since that's your ultimate desire and is another reason why people like Farage and Boris piss me off using the NHS and welfare as reasoning to "reclaim" £350.

I'm not defending them. I said we don't yet know the final deal.

I'm not a Conservative Party member, supporter, activist or an advisor to a Tory MP, so challenging me on whether they'll carry through on promises is pointless. I'll know when you know which is when Article 50 negotiations are completed and the new Ministry starts spending that former EU budget cash.

You are defending them by justifying their lie about £350 million. Even if all the savings from the direct contribution of the EU go to the NHS, it will not be £350 million!! That's the lie!! It was literally my first point in my first reply back!!

Yes but come on we know Johnson is either going to be Prime Minister or be in the cabinet, more weight than what an MEP says.

The key here is going. He currently has absolutely no authority on the matter and even if he did, that doesn't make what he says automatically correct or even truthful. He's bullshitted this entire campaign and it's painful you either don't want to or can't see it.

I like the fact he put his neck on the line and helped win the referendum, yes. George Galloway also helped but it doesn't mean I am a fan.

I've simply said I would prefer Johnson over May but neither are my top choice. Is that a crime?

No but don't say you like him then say I seem confused about how you're a fan of his.

Don't put words into my mouth, I haven't said anything of the sort.

We're 4 days after the vote, wait and see what the deal we come to looks like and what the next Ministry - whether Johnson, Leadsom, May or other - does. I supported the Leave campaign to get back our sovereignty, I am as of yet undecided how I will vote (if) at the next General Election.

Well I deduced from the fact you don't mind him being rewarded after winning the referendum, the side which you support and also was the best chance for him to further his career, all despite the fact it was built on a shit load of lies. What else would you say that was? :P If this was someone on the Remain side, you'd be going mental and possibly already have done.

Zak

27-06-2016, 06:04 PM

Anyone else think they are trying to oust Corbyn before the general election? Labour's argument will be "we'll hold another referendum/not enact article 50" if you vote for us? Corbyn wouldn't win anything, hence why they want him out?

I know very little about politics, so if I'm way off please let me know.

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 06:08 PM

@dbgtz (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=28789);

I have literally no idea what you want from me here other than to say generally politicians are liars and always will be.

At the end of the day you voted Remain which would have had the money you have such an issue with going to the European Union coffers and being spent on Spanish sewers, French farmers or Estonian motorways rather than things here: whether it's the NHS, Royal Navy or care of the elderly. So you're making a mountain of a molehill out of something neither of us yet know what the politicians who promised certain things will do and something you obviously didn't care about anyway hence you voted Remain. Thanks to the Leave vote, you'll now have the ability to hold them to account properly at election time.

I thought our campaign was pretty good and made the points well about sovereignty, supremacy of our courts, the costs of membership and other things. You disagree and voted the other way, so okay that's fine. I voted Leave not because of a £350m boost to the NHS but for various reasons, as did many.

What more do you want me to say? I know as much as you do about the EEA/EFTA/FTA/Other deal that will come in two years time. Patience for now.

Anyone else think they are trying to oust Corbyn before the general election? Labour's argument will be "we'll hold another referendum/not enact article 50" if you vote for us? Corbyn wouldn't win anything, hence why they want him out?

I know very little about politics, so if I'm way off please let me know.

Not sure really, I don't think Labour would dare ignore the result or else it'd be electoral suicide. What's happening is there's a split between the Labour membership who elected Corbyn and the MPs who are overwhelmingly against him. Brexit has just been the pretext for making a move against his leadership really. I think Labour are in serious trouble with or without Corbyn to be honest, look at the Leave percentages in northern towns and cities.

lemons

27-06-2016, 06:16 PM

747490064234590209

747473864700141568

also this was hilarious

747438995408306176

wixard

27-06-2016, 06:18 PM

good on them, if you give the UK an inch they'll take a mile

just want it triggered or nobody will hire me until my status is known!!!!

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 06:27 PM

good on them, if you give the UK an inch they'll take a mile

You sound annoyed that we've left and want to play hardball.

Are you worried where the money is now going to come from for countries like your own? Could it be that the likes of Great Britain, Denmark, Germany, the Netherlands and others are absolutely fed up of paying for small countries which have always been economic basketcases?

You have all taken an inch and mile and now the party is over.

just want it triggered or nobody will hire me until my status is known!!!!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Travel_Area

How many times do we have to go through this? 1923.

dbgtz

27-06-2016, 06:27 PM

@dbgtz (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=28789);

I have literally no idea what you want from me here other than to say generally politicians are liars and always will be.

At the end of the day you voted Remain which would have had the money you have such an issue with going to the European Union coffers and being spent on Spanish sewers, French farmers or Estonian motorways rather than things here: whether it's the NHS, Royal Navy or care of the elderly. So you're making a mountain of a molehill out of something neither of us yet know what the politicians who promised certain things will do and something you obviously didn't care about anyway hence you voted Remain. Thanks to the Leave vote, you'll now have the ability to hold them to account properly at election time.

I thought our campaign was pretty good and made the points well about sovereignty, supremacy of our courts, the costs of membership and other things. You disagree and voted the other way, so okay that's fine. I voted Leave not because of a £350m boost to the NHS but for various reasons, as did many.

What more do you want me to say? I know as much as you do about the EEA/EFTA/FTA/Other deal that will come in two years time. Patience for now.

Yes they are liars, but again not my point. My point is you're tolerating it because it suits you.

The points about the cost of membership well? Hardly. Ignoring all the supposed economics benefits of the EU as that's up for debate, they conveniently ignored direct UK investment and the rebate in order to inflate the figure as high as possible.
Regarding ECJ and ECHR, is there anything to suggest we will even pull out of these since leaving the EU is not the same thing.

At least we have an increase in debt interest to look forward to now!

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 06:31 PM

dbgtz;

How am I tolerating it? I said I would wait and see what resulting deal is.

The points about the cost of membership well? Hardly. Ignoring all the supposed economics benefits of the EU as that's up for debate, they conveniently ignored direct UK investment and the rebate in order to inflate the figure as high as possible.

Money that we didn't have control over but which we do now.

Regarding ECJ and ECHR, is there anything to suggest we will even pull out of these since leaving the EU is not the same thing.
ECJ we will be withdrawing from as that is the court of the EU. ECHR withdrawal not quite yet, but that is hopefully our next target.

At least we have an increase in debt interest to look forward to now!

UK gilts have fallen on the bond markets since Thursday and it's cheaper than ever for us to borrow.

wixard

27-06-2016, 06:34 PM

You sound annoyed that we've left and want to play hardball.

Are you worried where the money is now going to come from for countries like your own? Could it be that the likes of Great Britain, Denmark, Germany, the Netherlands and others are absolutely fed up of paying for small countries which have always been economic basketcases?

You have all taken an inch and mile and now the party is over.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Travel_Area

How many times do we have to go through this? 1923.

1923 was before we both became members of the EU, literally nobody knows what is going to happen. WE want to keep the CTA, the U.K. sounds like they want to keep it, but it will have to go through the EU. There's also the issue of the north and south re boarders which I'm sure you're aware of. I've seen contradictory statements regarding the CTA, our Taoiseach himself has come out and said he doesn't know what will happen.

I'm not annoyed in the slightest and I don't want a second referendum, re Ireland we can only hope to benefit from your losses. I am however annoyed that we have been given no confirmation regarding the CTA, which is why I want the process to begin ASAP. I have set up a life here and I'm in a long term relationship, without confirmation of my status who will want to hire me?

I do appreciate anything you have to offer me though

edit: apparently Cameron meets Kenny tonorrow to discuss it and can shed some light on it for us.

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 06:42 PM

1923 was before we both became members of the EU, literally nobody knows what is going to happen. WE want to keep the CTA, the U.K. sounds like they want to keep it, but it will have to go through the EU. There's also the issue of the north and south re boarders which I'm sure you're aware of. I've seen contradictory statements regarding the CTA, our Taoiseach himself has come out and said he doesn't know what will happen.

I'm not annoyed in the slightest and I don't want a second referendum, re Ireland we can only hope to benefit from your losses. I am however annoyed that we have been given no confirmation regarding the CTA, which is why I want the process to begin ASAP. I have set up a life here and I'm in a long term relationship, without confirmation of the CTA who will want to hire me?

I do appreciate anything you have to offer me though

Our losses? I think you've got it back to front. We've always been one of the top contributors into this paying for countries such as your own. That's coming to an end now so I think you've got the wrong end of the stick. It's the Republic which will now have to pay more in as well as the other states to fill the UK shortfall. :) Enjoy! At least you managed to get decades worth of money out of it in return for your independence, we've been milked the entire 43 years we've been a member.

On working here, I think you've got wrong impression. Nobody has said anybody will be sent home and nobody has said that people with links or a reason to be here won't be allowed to be here. Even if the border between Ulster and the Republic is re-introduced, there's no reason at all why the CTA cannot be maintained. As far as I know Her Majesty's Government is keen on retaining the CTA, however if your masters in Brussels say otherwise then that's not our problem but your problem.

dbgtz

27-06-2016, 06:50 PM

dbgtz;

How am I tolerating it? I said I would wait and see what resulting deal is.

You're tolerating Leave using misleading statistics and giving false promises. You've probably commented on Remain using fear tactics and found that infuriating, but seem to be perfectly fine with Leave.

Money that we didn't have control over but which we do now.

But an entirely different sum of money is my point. I don't care if it's actually £1 or £100 billion, £350 million was misleading as hell.

ECJ we will be withdrawing from as that is the court of the EU. ECHR withdrawal not quite yet, but that is hopefully our next target.

OK (this was a genuine question lmao)

UK gilts have fallen on the bond markets since Thursday and it's cheaper than ever for us to borrow.

We've only just been downgraded it seems.

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 06:54 PM

You're tolerating Leave using misleading statistics and giving false promises. You've probably commented on Remain using fear tactics and found that infuriating, but seem to be perfectly fine with Leave.

What do you mean tolerating?

Since when was I on the board of Vote Leave? I make my own points on here without consulting Dominic Cummings.

But an entirely different sum of money is my point. I don't care if it's actually £1 or £100 billion, £350 million was misleading as hell.

All depends how you work it out. The good news being that "How much do we pay into the EU?" won't even be a question anymore pretty soon.

We've only just been downgraded it seems.

I think one agency downgraded on Friday. I wouldn't pay much attention to the ratings agencies anyway, after all these were the same companies and analysts that prior to 2008 claimed that Greece, Spain, Ireland, Portugal and so on were all solvent and sustainable. Look at the actual gilt price and we're doing fine.

wixard

27-06-2016, 06:57 PM

Our losses? I think you've got it back to front. We've always been one of the top contributors into this paying for countries such as your own. That's coming to an end now so I think you've got the wrong end of the stick. It's the Republic which will now have to pay more in as well as the other states to fill the UK shortfall. :) Enjoy! At least you managed to get decades worth of money out of it in return for your independence, we've been milked the entire 43 years we've been a member.

On working here, again you're overreacting. Nobody has said anybody will be sent home and nobody has said that people with links or a reason to be here won't be allowed to be here. Even if the border between Ulster and the Republic is re-introduced, there's no reason at all why the CTA cannot be maintained.

you're very defensive, I only said I hope we can gain from your losses and I meant along the lines of the movement of FDI and funds to Ireland, the attraction for multinationals due to English as a first language, and my personal favourite: duty free x

i never spoke ill about the outcome in this thread at all, I havent established a career here, I'm working retail until September when I graduate my postgrad. I think I have rational reason to worry when i want to be applying for jobs in the next few weeks, and there has been nothing said about the CTA. My fear isn't being deported or kicked out, it's at my opportunities being tainted by the delay

dbgtz

27-06-2016, 07:07 PM

What do you mean tolerating?

Since when was I on the board of Vote Leave? I make my own points on here without consulting Dominic Cummings.

You're tolerating it by being OK with the £350 million figure. You're tolerating it by being OK with Boris Johnson (who didn't even turn up to a Brexit debate today I should add - and I say him specifically because he was very much Remain and judging by the fact he wrote a Leave and Remain article recently then he probably has no real preference). Etc.

All depends how you work it out. The good news being that "How much do we pay into the EU?" won't even be a question anymore pretty soon.

I mean, regardless if Brexit happens or not (I'm still banking on not) it probably will since we will be involved in some shape or form :P

I think one agency downgraded on Friday. I wouldn't pay much attention to the ratings agencies anyway, after all these were the same companies and analysts that prior to 2008 claimed that Greece, Spain, Ireland, Portugal and so on were all solvent and sustainable. Look at the actual gilt price and we're doing fine.

Yes. People are tired of experts!

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 07:08 PM

you're very defensive, I only said I hope we can gain from your losses and I meant along the lines of the movement of FDI and funds to Ireland, the attraction for multinationals due to English as a first language, and my personal favourite: duty free x

i never spoke ill about the outcome in this thread at all, I havent established a career here, I'm working retail until September when I graduate my postgrad. I think I have rational reason to worry when i want to be applying for jobs in the next few weeks, and there has been nothing said about the CTA. My fear isn't being deported or kicked out, it's at my opportunities being tainted by the delay

Fair enough but I don't think you'll have anything at all to worry about. If you're educated as you are, well spoken and settled here then a company or our government isn't going to not hire you/block you from employment just because we've left the EU. I cannot see circumstances at all where CTA would be ended.

wixard

27-06-2016, 07:13 PM

Fair enough but I don't think you'll have anything at all to worry about. If you're educated as you are, well spoken and settled here then a company or our government isn't going to not hire you/block you from employment just because we've left the EU. I cannot see circumstances at all where CTA would be ended.

Fingers crossed eh. Saw a really nice article about how Ireland/UK never identified as European and how our cultures are intertwined, would be a shame to lose it. I'm keeping a close eye on updates so will post in here if anything new is said.

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 07:15 PM

You're tolerating it by being OK with the £350 million figure. You're tolerating it by being OK with Boris Johnson (who didn't even turn up to a Brexit debate today I should add - and I say him specifically because he was very much Remain and judging by the fact he wrote a Leave and Remain article recently then he probably has no real preference). Etc.

I have said I couldn't care if it's £10m, £200m, £350m or £700m a week - it is our money and it is (finally) coming home to be spent on people here.

Never said Boris Johnson is a conviction or honest politician either, I just said in light of the campaign he's more deserving than hand sitter May.

I mean, regardless if Brexit happens or not (I'm still banking on not) it probably will since we will be involved in some shape or form :P

We won't be paying into EU coffers anymore. Now it's true if we join ETFA, the EEA or sign an FTA then there will be small payments to operate the bureaucracy for those agreements but gone are the days when we're paying for French farmers, Spanish art galleries and Polish bridges.

Yes. People are tired of experts!

Laugh about it all you wish but didn't loads of supposed experts like the Treasury and the Chancellor warn us that if we left the EU then the world would fall in, the economy would go bust and an emergency budget would be needed? Today, 4 days later, and the world is still turning.

Fingers crossed eh. Saw a really nice article about how Ireland/UK never identified as European and how our cultures are intertwined, would be a shame to lose it. I'm keeping a close eye on updates so will post in here if anything new is said.

Indeed, these islands have always been a round peg in a square hole when it comes to mainland Europe.

I would love to see Ireland come out of the EU and join the Commonwealth alongside other Anglo-Irish heritage countries. Maybe one day eh. ;)

lemons

27-06-2016, 07:20 PM

747508868893249537

joint bid how does that work :S

dbgtz

27-06-2016, 07:22 PM

I have said I couldn't care if it's £10m, £200m, £350m or £700m a week - it is our money and it is (finally) coming home to be spent on people here.

Never said Boris Johnson is a conviction or honest politician either, I just said in light of the campaign he's more deserving than hand sitter May.

One opportunist is better than the other then

We won't be paying into EU coffers anymore. Now it's true if we join ETFA, the EEA or sign an FTA then there will be small payments to operate the bureaucracy for those agreements but gone are the days when we're paying for French farmers, Spanish art galleries and Polish bridges.

I suppose.

Laugh about it all you wish but didn't loads of supposed experts like the Treasury and the Chancellor warn us that if we left the EU then the world would fall in, the economy would go bust and an emergency budget would be needed? Today, 4 days later, and the world is still turning.

I mean, the outlook isn't great right now economically speaking... You also forget Cameron said he would invoke Article 50 before the result, but is now no longer doing so.

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 07:27 PM

lemons;

i think means one as PM and other as Chancellor.

Boris and Gove are running on that 'ticket' too. quite american tbh not keen on it.

One opportunist is better than the other then

Sometimes. I haven't got a vote as I am not a member of the Conservative Party so that's a dilemma any voters will have to face. :P

I mean, the outlook isn't great right now economically speaking... You also forget Cameron said he would invoke Article 50 before the result, but is now no longer doing so.

Looks fine to me. The initial shock on Friday and earlier today was mainly the markets correcting themselves as a win for Remain has been priced in so loads of hedge funds and speculators had lost out. If it were turning out bad, then other countries wouldn't be lining up (as they are) to start trade talk deals with us.

lemons

27-06-2016, 08:14 PM

interesting well if there are to be 'joint bids' at least one of them ought to be from the leave campaign

-:Undertaker:-

27-06-2016, 08:28 PM

India accentuates the positives on Brexit

New Delhi is looking to quickly negotiate a Free Trade Deal (FTA) with their former colonial master Great Britain

http://us.123rf.com/450wm/tintin75/tintin751304/tintin75130400026/19350392-this-flag-represents-the-relationship-between-uk-union-and-india.jpg?ver=6

As the UK’s Brexit vote sparks widespread global dismay, some lawmakers and businesspeople in India are seeing the upside of their former colonial power’s decision.

Indian policymakers believe New Delhi could quickly negotiate a new trade agreement with a Britain disentangled from the EU, which has failed to conclude talks on a trade deal with India.

“The UK is going to look to build its relationships with the rest of the world, and will seek to pursue new opportunities with us,” Jayant Sinha, India’s deputy finance minister, told the Financial Times.

Talks on an India-EU trade deal began nearly a decade ago but quickly stalled. Swapan Dasgupta, an independent member of parliament close to the ruling Bharatiya Janata party, said concluding an India-UK trade deal would be far easier.

“If an FTA [free-trade agreement] negotiating unit is 25 constituent countries with their own pluses and minuses, you are not going to get to some sort of common ground where the losses balance the gains,” he said. “But there is a far greater chance of it with the UK. We understand each other, and there is very little clash in what we want.”

BK Goenka, chairman of Welspun Group, a textile and pipe manufacturer with revenues of about $3bn a year, agreed that Brexit would open new opportunities. “For us, I think it will be better,” he told the Financial Times. “Tariffs on both sides will come down. It’s a win-win scenario for both our countries.”

Mr Goenka said he would seek to take advantage of the relatively weak pound to acquire UK textile brands and distribution companies. “This is the time to invest in the UK,” he said.

More excellent news, exactly what I always wanted. That's now India, Australia, New Zealand, Ghana, Iceland and Canada publically pushing for talks.

Again we won't be able to sign until we've withdraw from the EU but we'll certainly start negotiations soon.

abc

27-06-2016, 09:52 PM

Yes great news. Pound is taking a pounding. Our imports just became more expensive.

-:Undertaker:-

28-06-2016, 11:10 AM

Extraordinary in the European Parliament today. End of an era.

747730290294980608

747726757034360832

747726376266960896

747736766090616832

I am also reading rumours flying about and confirmed by the Polish Government by its reaction that France and Germany are to present an "ultimatum" to the EU to become a federal superstate in order to prevent countries following Britain in a contagion.

Leaked report suggests France and Germany are to demand the EU becomes one country (a superstate) following Brexit

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CltZg-0WgAAstcq.jpg

It appears The Brits may have dodged more than a bullet in their decision to leave The EU. The foreign ministers of France and Germany are reportedly due to reveal a blueprint to effectively do away with individual member states in what is being described as an "ultimatum."

As The Express reports, the shockingly predictable final solution to Europe's Brexit-driven existential crisis is an apparently long-held plan to morph the continent’s countries into one giant superstate. The radical proposals mean EU countries will lose the right to have their own army, criminal law, taxation system or central bank, with all those powers being transferred to Brussels. According to the Daily Express, the nine-page report has "outraged" some EU leaders.

Germany's foreign minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier and his French counterpart Jean-Marc Ayrault today presented a proposal for closer EU integration based on three key areas - internal and external security, the migrant crisis, and economic cooperation.

But the plans have been described as an 'ultimatum' in Poland, with claims it would mean countries transfer their armies, economic systems and border controls to the EU. Controversially member states would also lose what few controls they have left over their own borders, including the procedure for admitting and relocating refugees.

Thank fuck we got out.

lemons

28-06-2016, 02:14 PM

747794765287133184

-:Undertaker:-

28-06-2016, 02:59 PM

http://www.mumsnet.com/uploads/talk/201606/large-154257-andrea-leadsom.jpg

747792017741189121

Zak

28-06-2016, 04:45 PM

I'll leave this to Dan because I have no idea. There's a lot of talk about EFTA but is there a possibility that the UK could join something like NAFTA?

-:Undertaker:-

29-06-2016, 10:18 AM

I'll leave this to Dan because I have no idea. There's a lot of talk about EFTA but is there a possibility that the UK could join something like NAFTA?

EFTA is most likely, yeah. Switzerland is in EFTA. If you're in EFTA you don't have full access to the Single Market but you have access to most of it and you're not as bound to it as say Norway is if you choose bilateral route like the Swiss. My second best choice would be EFTA with my ideal choice a simple Free Trade Deal (FTA) with the EU. I haven't heard about NAFTA rumours and I would be surprised if we joined NAFTA as our membership might be seen to "unbalance" it but then again it would make sense for us to join given Canada and America are in and we'd consequently fit quite nicely into it given we have the same common law, outlook etc.

EFTA members: Switzerland, Norway, Iceland and Liechtenstein.

NAFTA members: United States, Canada and Mexico.

-:Undertaker:-

29-06-2016, 10:38 AM

Update on Conservative leadership race.

Team Boris: John Whittingdale and Liz Truss have joined Dom Raab and George Eustice backing Boris. Johnson is well ahead in Guido’s spreadsheet of public MP declarations and the Sun predicts he has 100 names coming. Michael Gove met with some 20 MPs last night to discuss how to convince wavering Leavers to endorse BoJo. Stressing Gove’s expected role as the chief EU negotiator should help reassure apprehensive Outers that Brexit will be delivered…

Team Leadsom: Andrea Leadsom has the tentative support of up to 60 Leave MPs if she runs. A group of them met in her office yesterday. At 6 pm Boris turned up and the MPs left, Johnson and Leadsom then had a ten minute one-on-one summit to try to agree terms of her joining the ticket. No deal was reached, Andrea is playing hardball and has also had talks with Theresa May’s team…

Team May: Theresa May has only eight MPs publicly backing her on Guido’s spreadsheet. The private number is much higher – several Leave MPs have told Guido they are considering endorsing her and she expects to clean up a lot of the payroll vote. Smoothie George Hollingberry has been hitting the phones on her behalf with some success. Her team have been working hard and should get in touch ASAP with more names.

Team Crabbe & Javid: ‘Crabbid’ had a flurry of backers come out for their joint ticket yesterday, more are promised following a drinks party last night. Liam Fox is expected to announce his bid tomorrow with the support of 20 plus MPs, unless someone manages to square him off quickly with a Cabinet post offer. There were widespread rumours yesterday that Priti Patel was considering u-turning and mounting a bid, though she is still expected to take a well deserved top job with Boris. Johnson is the early leader…

Gove as Chief negotiator sounds good.

Zak

29-06-2016, 08:46 PM

EFTA is most likely, yeah. Switzerland is in EFTA. If you're in EFTA you don't have full access to the Single Market but you have access to most of it and you're not as bound to it as say Norway is if you choose bilateral route like the Swiss. My second best choice would be EFTA with my ideal choice a simple Free Trade Deal (FTA) with the EU. I haven't heard about NAFTA rumours and I would be surprised if we joined NAFTA as our membership might be seen to "unbalance" it but then again it would make sense for us to join given Canada and America are in and we'd consequently fit quite nicely into it given we have the same common law, outlook etc.

EFTA members: Switzerland, Norway, Iceland and Liechtenstein.

NAFTA members: United States, Canada and Mexico.

Yeah I thought about it the other day. It would be a bit disjointed if we were to join NAFTA, if it's even possible. I don't think there are rumours (I haven't checked) it's just something I was aware of. I'll have to look into the EFTA and FTA's as I know virtually nothing about them!

+ to your post above. I've heard Gove is an 'intellectual powerhouse' and has a lot of respect amongst the MPs

-:Undertaker:-

30-06-2016, 10:23 AM

Nicola Sturgeon has been knocked back by various European governments now. Who does she think she is?

this made me lol

748100281519456260

lemons

30-06-2016, 10:55 AM

boris not running for PM

Lewis

30-06-2016, 11:05 AM

Yep just read that, I'm shocked Boris has dropped out :(

MKR&*42

30-06-2016, 11:11 AM

I am very pleased Boris is not running; he's a bumbling idiot.

This should hopefully give Theresa May a chance, realistically it's probably either going to be her or Gove now.

-:Undertaker:-

30-06-2016, 11:16 AM

what's this like of May a lot of people seem to have?

she 100% failed as Home Secretary. yes due to EU rules but why did she then not back Leave. and she's already flipped on the ECHR issue.

hopefully we get either Gove, Leadsom or Fox.

748476163790671872

if Gove is to win then 3 of the last 4 PMs will have been Scottish.

Lewis

30-06-2016, 11:20 AM

We need someone who actually campaigned for leave to be PM. Hopefully not Theresa May

lemons

30-06-2016, 11:50 AM

leadsom or may for me

Empired

30-06-2016, 01:06 PM

I am very pleased Boris is not running; he's a bumbling idiot.

This should hopefully give Theresa May a chance, realistically it's probably either going to be her or Gove now.
Same! I can't believe the number of idiots I've seen posting being like haha boris is so funny at least we'd have an entertaining PM.
And I've just been sat there like ??? Is that how we're choosing people to run our country now??

I don't even care who goes for PM now as long as Gove doesn't get it.

Cerys

30-06-2016, 01:32 PM

Preach it empz, as long as Gove doesn't get it I don't really care. Well I do but like not as much haha.
I think we'd be more screwed if Gove gets it than we would've been with Boris.

Personally I'd pick May but that's just because she campaigned remain so hopefully she'd just ignore the referendum! Don't really know much about any of them apart from that but all the candidates don't seem ideal

-:Undertaker:-

30-06-2016, 01:34 PM

Cerys

30-06-2016, 01:38 PM

lego_hmm

are you one of the students who demanded another vote via petition cos it didn't go your way

No hahaha ofcourse not, that petition has zero ground to it and they should all quit their whining as it's getting old now!

However if there is a realistic chance that the UK can avoid going down the drain (this is my opinion which won't change so don't go all quotes here and statistics here like you usually do) then I'm all for it. But I'm not gonna scream it out for everyone to hear like them nonces on the petition did, whatever happens happens and you've gotta roll with it.

scottish

30-06-2016, 04:56 PM

gbp to usd back down to 1.32 today

hopefully Gove gets PM

-:Undertaker:-

30-06-2016, 05:20 PM

here they are by voting

Leadsom confirming for me hence i'm leaning to her, apart from her vote on the airstrikes (which they all did).

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CmMcgoqWYAAORaO.jpg

scottish

30-06-2016, 05:22 PM

Gove if all else fails May.

lemons

30-06-2016, 06:09 PM

michael gove as PM how embarrassing

https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2013-09/enhanced/webdr03/30/13/anigif_enhanced-buzz-9268-1380562149-20.gif

wixard

01-07-2016, 01:08 PM

if anyone is interested in an outline of the brexit plan

http://thebrexitplan.com/

Lewis

01-07-2016, 01:15 PM

if anyone is interested in an outline of the brexit plan

http://thebrexitplan.com/

lmao I thought it was something somewhat legit (a site giving a basic idea) for a minute

xxMATTGxx

01-07-2016, 01:41 PM

if anyone is interested in an outline of the brexit plan

http://thebrexitplan.com/

Haha, that's brilliant.

Empired

01-07-2016, 02:49 PM

if anyone is interested in an outline of the brexit plan

http://thebrexitplan.com/
I clicked on it at first, saw the list and was like ??? that's boring and exited it
then saw the comments below, went back to have a look and actually tried the button hahahaha

-:Undertaker:-

02-07-2016, 12:27 AM

Reading the accounts of when David Cameron knew he'd lost that night and his political career was over.

The books, memoirs and accounts to be written over the next couple of years about this will be fascinating.

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02154/Enoch-Powell_2154287i.jpg
The late Enoch Powell

Mr Cameron's wife Samantha, close friend and Conservative Party chairman Lord Feldman, chief of staff Ed Llewellyn and deputy Kate Fall were among the aides who gathered to watch TV coverage in the evening. The Newcastle figures gave the PM the first indication that things were not going his way. And when Leave secured a big win in Sunderland the mood in the famous building darkened quickly.

At around 3am, with the outcome becoming clear, Mr Cameron held a council of war in his study with Chancellor George Osborne, Mr Llewellyn, Ms Fall, Lord Feldman and communications director Craig Oliver. They discussed whether he should stay on, but he was adamant that his life would become impossible as Brexit MPs would be constantly at his throat.

Quoting Enoch Powell, he said: 'All political lives end in failure.'

Half an hour later, Mr Cameron beckoned Cabinet Office minister Matthew Hancock into his study. He was 'calm, philosophical, and neither angry nor visibly upset', according to extracts from Mr Seldon's updated biography published in The Times. Mr Cameron told the minister: 'I'm going to have to go ... I don't want to lead a government where I don't agree with its policy.'

Later the PM's head of operations Liz Sugg asked if it was really necessary for him to stand down as he was 'best person to lead this country'. But Mr Cameron apparently replied that he had 'made up my mind'. As the moment when he would have to go outside and face the media approached, he and Samantha walked through the long corridor at Number 10 and were applauded by staff and officials.

How ironic and fitting of history that his career and Britain's EU membership would be ended by quoting the intellectual Godfather of Tory euroscepticism.

abc

02-07-2016, 02:43 AM

What a shame, a good PM gone due to many idiots voting for something they now regret.

-:Undertaker:-

03-07-2016, 01:16 PM

748646933577629696

lollllllllllllllllllllllllllllll i've seen by far enough to believe the voting age should be raised to 25 minimum. students STILL having a massive tantrum

scottish

05-07-2016, 06:04 PM

another hit today down to 1.30

Zak

06-07-2016, 11:42 AM

another hit today down to 1.30

Think I saw it at 1.27 yesterday. It'll make a comeback, uncertainty wreaks havoc on economies.

scottish

06-07-2016, 12:36 PM

Of course it will, but how many years :P

Zak

07-07-2016, 09:20 AM

A good few years yet :P

xxMATTGxx

11-07-2016, 05:36 PM

New Jobs and investments from Boeing even though we are leaving the EU:

The UK government will buy nine new marine patrol planes from Boeing in a decade-long deal worth £3bn.

The Ministry of Defence's deal for the submarine-hunting P-8A Poseidon aircraft also covers training, maintenance and support.

Boeing will build a new £100m facility for the planes at RAF Lossiemouth in Moray.

The US company will also deliver 50 Apache AH-64E attack helicopters to the British Army.

Boeing expects to create about 2,000 new UK jobs in the coming years by expanding its maintenance and support operations for both military and commercial customers in Europe.

Prime Minister David Cameron announced the P-8A deal on Monday at the start of the Farnborough Airshow.

He said it showed that the UK was open for business despite the referendum vote to leave the EU.

"Whatever uncertainties our country faces, I want the message to go out loud and clear: the UK will continue to lead the world in both civil and defence aerospace," Mr Cameron said.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36763212

Lucy

12-07-2016, 02:12 AM

New Jobs and investments from Boeing even though we are leaving the EU:

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36763212

That is some very good news to hear, I have heard a few pieces of news like this recently after the referendum and it does fill more confidence :)

-:Undertaker:-

12-07-2016, 11:08 AM

Another one.

http://order-order.com/2016/07/12/siemens-stays/

Siemens was splashed all over the papers this morning with an announcement from CEO Joe Kaeser that ze German mega-corp was “here to stay.” During the referendum campaign, Siemens was one of the most high-profile companies to back Remain. They even threatened to leave Britain, claiming:

“This uncertainty, and threat of increased costs, could make the UK a less attractive place to do business and may become a factor when Siemens is considering future investment here."

Did anyone swallow Siemens’ spin?

Today their CEO says with his tail between his legs: “We never said the UK is in bad shape if it leaves the EU”. Another Project Fear porky doesn’t come true…

The poll on HxF is interesting too. Given the younger demographic of this forum, you would expect - as with previous polls - a handful of eurosceptics on here and the majority in favour of staying: yet it's virtually a 50/50 split on the forum. Habbox is a lot more anti-EU/eurosceptic than the national age average. :P

FlyingJesus

12-07-2016, 11:32 AM

I don't like Guido but those Siemens jokes are excellent

-:Undertaker:-

20-07-2016, 04:49 PM

Question. Is anyone who voted Remain now happy with the result? Do they think things have turned out better than they initially believed? Vice versa too.

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Two more countries join the list wanting to sign trade deals with us.

The Don

20-07-2016, 06:11 PM

-:Undertaker:-

22-07-2016, 06:03 PM

An interesting insight into the Leave campaign itself and strategy over the referendum, featuring one of the two brains behind Leave: Matthew Elliott. The books on this period will be so interesting, maybe they'll go some way to filling my bookshelf back up given how half my books on the EU are now useless. :P

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CynLykO_W9g

“At 10pm on the 23 of June, the consensus was that Vote Leave had lost. A contact of mine at Number 10 texted me to say, ‘You’re toast'”

-:Undertaker:-

28-07-2016, 04:10 PM

Slimy BBC at it again.

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xxMATTGxx

28-07-2016, 04:56 PM

Slimy BBC at it again.

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That tweet would make more sense if he took a picture of the BBC but instead he's used Sky News...

-:Undertaker:-

28-07-2016, 04:59 PM

xxMATTGxx; lmao how did i miss that

yes sky. credit to BBC i checked twitter and they haven't done the link with Brexit line

-:Undertaker:-

09-10-2016, 01:07 PM

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/oct/08/homophobic-attacks-double-after-brexit-vote

Have you ever heard such rubbish?

Next we'll be treated to correlations like "Marmalade sales dipped 506% since Brexit" and "Slips at work rise 47% since Brexit"

Give me a break.

AgnesIO

09-10-2016, 06:55 PM

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/10/06/british-pound-sterling-crashes-to-fresh-three-decade-low.html

yay brexit

*the homophobic attack correlation did make me smile though

-:Undertaker:-

13-10-2016, 06:13 PM

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Excellent. Well that's just what we voted for, not a fudge.

Why excellent? Because it means negotiations should be short. I think we'll finalise & withdraw by winter 2017 tbh.

AgnesIO

14-10-2016, 07:50 AM

The pound has continued its collapse, which will lead to an increase in prices in both exports and imports. Great news.

-:Undertaker:-

14-10-2016, 10:06 AM

The pound has continued its collapse, which will lead to an increase in prices in both exports and imports. Great news.

You do realise it has been Bank of England policy now for a few years to have a weaker GBP for exports/FDI?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/oct/10/fall-in-sterling-is-a-welcome-change-says-mervyn-king-brexit-vote

Fall in Sterling is a welcome change, says former Bank of England Governor Lord Mervyn King

http://static.theglobeandmail.ca/163/report-on-business/international-business/european-business/article29755750.ece/ALTERNATES/w620/mervyn-king25rb1.JPG

The collapse in the value of the pound since Britain voted to leave the EU has been described by Lord Mervyn King, former governor of the Bank of England, as a welcome change.

Lord King, who ran the Bank during the 2008 banking crisis, told Sky News: “The economy was slowing somewhat before the vote and we are in a position where the rest of the world is not offering us much help.

“So, from that point of view the fall in sterling is a welcome change.”

King, who left the Bank in 2013, said shortly after the EU referendum that he had been baffled by a warning that there would need to be an emergency budget in the event of Brexit.

Commenting on the pound’s sharp moves since the vote, he told Sky on Monday: “The whole thing has generated reactions which are over the top.”

Some economists argue that a fall in the pound could force the UK economy to rebalance towards more exports because British products become more competitive on overseas markets when the currency is weaker.

-:Undertaker:-

14-10-2016, 11:31 AM

News just coming in that a Committee for Brexit has been set up... with the most eurosceptic ministers dominating it.

I think today may be the day I sign up to the Conservative and Unionist Party. Our coup de'tat of the Tory Party is complete.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-10-14/u-k-s-may-loads-team-for-eu-talks-with-pro-brexit-ministers

U.K.’s May Loads Team for EU Talks With Hard Brexit Ministers

https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/nintchdbpict000264524986.jpg?w=960

The U.K.’s exit negotiations with the European Union will be controlled by a select group of 12 ministers that includes all of the most Euroskeptic members of Theresa May’s cabinet, a further sign that the premier may be planning a clean break with the EU.

The committee will “oversee the negotiations on the withdrawal from the European Union and formation of a new relationship between the United Kingdom and the European Union; and policy on international trade,” according to an unpublished U.K. government document obtained by Bloomberg.

The group includes all six members of May’s cabinet who campaigned to leave the EU at the June referendum: Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson, International Trade Secretary Liam Fox, Brexit Secretary David Davis, International Development Secretary Priti Patel, Transport Secretary Chris Grayling, and Andrea Leadsom, the environment secretary.

The committee’s make-up suggests that May is planning a so-called hard Brexit, in which the government prioritizes immigration controls ahead of access to trade goods and services freely in the EU’s single market.

AgnesIO

15-10-2016, 12:07 PM

You do realise it has been Bank of England policy now for a few years to have a weaker GBP for exports/FDI?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/oct/10/fall-in-sterling-is-a-welcome-change-says-mervyn-king-brexit-vote

Fall in Sterling is a welcome change, says former Bank of England Governor Lord Mervyn King

http://static.theglobeandmail.ca/163/report-on-business/international-business/european-business/article29755750.ece/ALTERNATES/w620/mervyn-king25rb1.JPG

Only really applicable to the professional services industry, which is ironic as those are the jobs that the people who voted Brexit aren't actually qualified to do.

Britain doesn't manufacture raw materials, meaning we have to import them to make a product to export. Thus, it is bad news for the common man.

-:Undertaker:-

15-10-2016, 03:50 PM

AgnesIO; Not really as it makes manufacturing cheaper here so hopefully more manufacturers start up as a result.

Remainers claim a low sterling is a disaster and Leavers claim it is a blessing. Reality is it's neither but somewhere in the middle.

AgnesIO

15-10-2016, 08:45 PM

@AgnesIO (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=36885); Not really as it makes manufacturing cheaper here so hopefully more manufacturers start up as a result.

Remainers claim a low sterling is a disaster and Leavers claim it is a blessing. Reality is it's neither but somewhere in the middle.

... we don't have raw materials.

-:Undertaker:-

18-11-2016, 08:48 PM

Not that it matters but I saw some journalist claim on US news that we 'regret' our vote. What? here's latest YouGov tracker.

No significant shift either way. Statistical noise within MoE.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cxj2jyTXgAAs2q3.jpg

-:Undertaker:-

11-12-2016, 08:17 PM

07598131147841536

-:Undertaker:-

06-01-2017, 12:35 PM

Only one poll but...

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Kind of backs up what I always said would happen. I always said that once we had left, we would wonder why on earth it took us so long to leave. Non-EU Norway was always the key example of this, with 70%+ of the population against joining the EU.

I expect that number will climb in time, at a quicker pace especially if the EU decides to play dirty in negotiations.

AgnesIO

06-01-2017, 11:11 PM

wixard

07-01-2017, 11:56 AM

how are the EU playing dirty, you voted to leave why should they allow you to reap EU benefits

-:Undertaker:-

07-01-2017, 12:49 PM

how are the EU playing dirty, you voted to leave why should they allow you to reap EU benefits

Wow that's hugely ironic coming from you. Haven't you been moaning about the possibility of the border being erected between the United Kingdom and Republic of Ireland again? Haven't you been moaning about a possible end to the CTA between RoI and UK?

You left the United Kingdom in 1922, so why should YOU be allowed to reap British benefits?

Empired

07-01-2017, 01:15 PM

Ok dan but also you didn't answer her question

-:Undertaker:-

07-01-2017, 02:04 PM

Ok dan but also you didn't answer her question

If you're really interested to know then I actually don't care whether they play nice. To me, if they decide to erect tariffs on our financial services then we just do the same on their agricultural/industrial goods coming here. And we get to leave earlier and simply revert to WTO standards & tariffs barriers. Oh well. Keeping an open as possible relationship with trade (outside the Single Market) would benefit us both, but if they want to play dirty and play difficult in order to 'spite' us then so what?

Our position is that we want as much access to the Single Market as possible and in return they get as much access to British markets: mutually beneficial. The same goes for continued partnership on Erasmus and intelligence sharing (of which we're #1).

Zak

07-01-2017, 05:36 PM

Irony is EU harps on about unity, peace and equality but will be quick to kick us in the nuts once negotiations begin. They're bullies with a "do or we say, or else" mentality lol

-:Undertaker:-

26-01-2017, 02:03 PM

An Opinium Poll came out and it's interesting. Suggests more of public are moving to backing Brexit as time goes on.

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A small but significant chunk of Remain voters now say Brexit was the right decision, Opinium's polling finds.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C3DQUUzWEAIdQYB.jpg

-:Undertaker:-

05-02-2017, 08:01 PM

Forgot to post this other day, hugely historic moment to witness.

A position held only by lonely hard eurosceptics like Enoch Powell, Tony Benn and Nigel Farage is now mainstream consensus. :)

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Now the bill goes to the House of Lords and is expected to become law within a matter of weeks.

-:Undertaker:-

11-11-2017, 05:24 PM

We've just gone past the halfway point.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=wzOoeo-Xj6Q

-:Undertaker:-

23-06-2018, 12:28 PM

This time 2 years ago...

Happy Independence Day https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/ae/Flag_of_the_United_Kingdom.svg/22px-Flag_of_the_United_Kingdom.svg.png

279 days to go.

https://media.tenor.com/images/923d31405bf0a2e8e2f7146a68d96938/tenor.gif

-:Undertaker:-

21-09-2018, 10:31 PM

FlyingJesus

21-09-2018, 10:43 PM

Suggestion @lawrawrrr (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=61966); @despect (https://www.habboxforum.com/member.php?u=59633);

We rename this thread to Brexit Countdown Megathread

For all posts as the time comes closer (188 days)

Considering the length of this thread (which can be very offputting for those not involved thus far) you're probably better off making a new one for you and dogbeats to spam in :P I mean for Brexit discussion

-:Undertaker:-

05-02-2019, 12:38 PM

From the 52% to 52 days left! So close now.

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Zak

05-02-2019, 02:04 PM

From the 52% to 52 days left! So close now.

1092754728004567040

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1092752280544313347

y u destroy our economy though dan :'( ....... ;)

dbgtz

05-02-2019, 11:07 PM

why are you joking when companies are now starting to move at least part of their operations and/or cancel investment

-:Undertaker:-

05-02-2019, 11:41 PM

Like I have always said,

Sovereignty and Democracy > GDP figures

Zak

06-02-2019, 08:44 AM

why are you joking when companies are now starting to move at least part of their operations and/or cancel investment

Armageddon.

-:Undertaker:-

06-02-2019, 09:56 AM

I'm so scared someone get me my blankie.

dbgtz

06-02-2019, 11:17 PM

you both seem to think this is completely irrelevant to ordinary people
if investment starts waning, people lose jobs...

Like I have always said,

Sovereignty and Democracy > GDP figures

why not just admit you're wrong for once rather than bringing up something irrelevant and then maybe you'd actually learn something

-:Undertaker:-

07-02-2019, 10:17 AM

you both seem to think this is completely irrelevant to ordinary people
if investment starts waning, people lose jobs...

why not just admit you're wrong for once rather than bringing up something irrelevant and then maybe you'd actually learn something

That's the problem isn't it for continuity Remain? If, could, might, may.

Given all previous predictions of disaster were found to be hollow, why should we believe a word now?

dbgtz

07-02-2019, 10:44 PM

do i literally have to point you to the nissan thread

-:Undertaker:-

16-02-2019, 07:05 AM

1096665491085524995

https://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/72x72/1f6a8.pnghttps://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/72x72/1f6a8.pnghttps://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/72x72/1f6a8.png

-:Undertaker:-

01-03-2019, 03:32 AM

It's now only 28 days until Brexit and at this moment of posting...

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With the events of the last week, I now feel the PM will get her tweaked(?) Withdrawal Agreement through the House of Commons before March 29th 2019, although I think the penalty will be her career. My bet is on the WA passing, and a new PM by the Autumn.

lawrawrrr

03-03-2019, 11:14 PM

i've only really just caught up on a week's worth of brexit news when I had a chance today... saw Barnier said it might be delayed, is this likely? I can't really imagine anything being agreed and passed in the short time left?

-:Undertaker:-

04-03-2019, 12:46 AM

1102176813135073280

i've only really just caught up on a week's worth of brexit news when I had a chance today... saw Barnier said it might be delayed, is this likely? I can't really imagine anything being agreed and passed in the short time left?

I think there's a chance they won't seek an extension if the deal passes on 12th March (or before) when it returns to the House of Commons. I think there's still (just) the time for the bill to also pass the House of Lords and receive Royal Assent. Only just.

From what I read, they've already prepared Parliament for round-the-clock sittings to pass all the relevant legislation that also has to go through. The House of Lords will also likely not play 'ping pong' if time is limited and will nod it all through. If her Withdrawal Agreement is defeated again on the 12th though, there's no longer time to try a third time without a delay.

Of course, extending because they can't pass the Withdrawal Agreement may not even be possible... the French have said that they will not agree to an extension if Parliament cannot come to an agreement. Too right in my view, as what does delaying achieve?

lawrawrrr

06-03-2019, 10:24 PM

1102176813135073280

I think there's a chance they won't seek an extension if the deal passes on 12th March (or before) when it returns to the House of Commons. I think there's still (just) the time for the bill to also pass the House of Lords and receive Royal Assent. Only just.

From what I read, they've already prepared Parliament for round-the-clock sittings to pass all the relevant legislation that also has to go through. The House of Lords will also likely not play 'ping pong' if time is limited and will nod it all through. If her Withdrawal Agreement is defeated again on the 12th though, there's no longer time to try a third time without a delay.

Of course, extending because they can't pass the Withdrawal Agreement may not even be possible... the French have said that they will not agree to an extension if Parliament cannot come to an agreement. Too right in my view, as what does delaying achieve?

I just can't see any kind of deal being passed though? From what I've seen there's no majority for anything, be that Brexit, soft brexit or hard Brexit. I don't think anything will actually be passed, potentially for a very long time?

Seatherny

06-03-2019, 10:49 PM

Either accept the deal and just move on or have a another referendum considering how the public were misled (the publics fault for being naive too) or cancel Brexit. The way they are behaving, there will never be any majority for any deal.
It was affected the GBP so much and due to this it has cost the British people so much that most people do not understand.

-:Undertaker:-

07-03-2019, 02:25 AM

I just can't see any kind of deal being passed though? From what I've seen there's no majority for anything, be that Brexit, soft brexit or hard Brexit. I don't think anything will actually be passed, potentially for a very long time?

I would now revise what I said after reports tonight of Cox getting nowhere in Brussels and say that her deal will be defeated again in the House of Commons next week. Of course, it's all very fluid - so changes day by day. It's an interesting theory that they are running the clock down still, as evidenced by the tweets below. I really do hope so - and you're right, there is no majority in the Commons for anything.

The problem is, ultimately, that the House of Commons doesn't represent the public on this issue which is why we had a referendum in the first place. But that's being compounded by the fact the HoC *still* seemingly believes 650 votes are worth more than 17.4m.

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Either accept the deal and just move on or have a another referendum considering how the public were misled (the publics fault for being naive too) or cancel Brexit. The way they are behaving, there will never be any majority for any deal.
It was affected the GBP so much and due to this it has cost the British people so much that most people do not understand.

Not sure what the public were actually naive about, the ballot paper was very simple - Leave or Remain. Accepting this Withdrawal Agreement? no thanks. The word Leave didn't have "subject to an agreement" next to it - it simply said Leave. If the EU can't come to an agreement without trying to annex part of our country (Northern Ireland) then we say No Thanks and Leave without a deal.

I wanted a Deal and believed it was possible until just before Christmas, so I am no headbanger on this. But even I, as sceptical about the EU as I am, could not have believed just how unreasonably they would behave. They want access to our fishing waters, our adherence to their ECJ court, part of our country to follow all of their laws and for them to be able to set our tariffs.

Can you name a single FTA in the world that any country has signed along those lines? It's vassaldom.