Well i don't think this is really going to work because it's all a matter of opinon if we could all agree on one then there would be no need for a debate? You have also missed out so many ways of running a country on there.
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Well i don't think this is really going to work because it's all a matter of opinon if we could all agree on one then there would be no need for a debate? You have also missed out so many ways of running a country on there.
All you have to say is that, despite numerous examples of how people in socialist countrys are actually worse off than those in capitalist countrys?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jippz
I am not saying that it has worked, i'm saying that if we were lead by people who were socialist for just reasons then it could work.
..however thats against human nature, we, as humans, always want to better ourselves. Nobody would train to be a doctor, paying for university, spending hours upon hours studying only at the end of it, to gain a job which has the same salary as a binman and to live in a house just as good as a binmans house is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jippz
In conclusion of that, its pointless even considering or supporting socialism as it can never ever work.
History suggests socialism is a complete failure though, there's no reason at all to believe it could work. One of my favourite ever quotes has to be... "Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it."Quote:
Originally Posted by Jippz
We're coming up with historical events showing socialism doesn't work, your posts are entirely based on an ideology which is the first step to debating politics but you need to know the history as evidence to persuade others.
if guys think socialism sucks then take a good look at where capitalisms got us.
No system is perfect - Loads of countries have a mixture of different systems, usually a mix of capitalism and socialism = Britain. The NHS would not exist in a capitalist frame, because it goes against many capitalist beliefs - the NHS is free healthcare for all citizens of the nation - "free" being the keyword. Same with the law, the law revolves around everyone being treated as equals - in a capitalist state, it could be solved just by paying your way through breaking laws which only exists in America (to an extent).
I don't see people starving in the UK? I'd rather live in a capitalist society than any other.Quote:
Originally Posted by LuketheDuke
Where has it got us?Quote:
Originally Posted by LuketheDuke
Lets think, medicines, technogly, democracy - EVERYTHING has developed thanks to the economic miracle that capitalism is. Do you have a house?, are members of your family employed by private business?, do any of your family own private business?, do your family vote? - if the answer is yes to any one of those questions, its built your life which is far better than those poor souls trapped in the socialist cycle of dictatorship, poverty and death.
Why can you not look at the economics?
Compare;
South Korea to North Korea
United States to Soviet Union
United Kingdom (1970s) to United Kingdom (1980s+)
..now come back and tell me which one sucks.
socialism =/= communism.
I cba to read the whole thread, only just come back from holiday.
Most countries in Europe, UK included are socialists, to lesser or greater extents. Go to the USA and see one of the most truely capitalist countries on the planet to find that they spend the most on healthcare, yet recieve relatively average treatment, find that some cities have near 3rd-world unemployment levels (see New Orleans), that the poor are desperately poor and that the rich live in another world. Then also see the crime that comes with it. That's what happens in a system like that.
The "best" way in my opinion is the way that many of our european neighbours use, a capitalist free market with PR, with good workers' rights and emphasis on improving productivity in the economy, even if this means large investment by the government in transport, health. Some may say that large scale spending by the governement is expensive, but also the governement are more accountable to the public than private business. Health care, for example, is relatively inexpensive compared to the US, yet we have better care and we live longer on average. Trains, we pay the most in Europe, yet get the worst service, look at Switzerland, public ownership over much of the railways and much better services. Using market mechanisms can work in the service sector. Look at the French road system. The Autoroutes are operated and maintained by private companies (not sure if owned, but maybe) and they are in good service. Our road system isn't too bad, but could be improved.
Outright either way doesn't work, you have to use a mixture so you get the best of both.