EMA (Education Maintenance Allowance)

[GommeInc]

If you think its so unfair why keep receiving it then, you don't HAVE to get it, so obviously you don't otherwise you wouldn't ask for it.

The whole system is unfair. You seem to have no argument other than "jealousy" which is blind and somewhat brain dead as you appear to not be taking in any arguments and therefore don't come out with a counter-argument :/ You may be receiving EMA payments, and find it unfair when others who are in a similar circumstance don't receive it, even though when you take the amount of family members into account, and the amount the parents earn into account, you're in the same boat :/

The whole EMA system is terribly flawed and makes no rational sense as a concept. Alot of money must be wasted through the EMA - £30 a week calculating at about over £1,000 per year (taking into account summer, christmas, easter etc) or £10 a week being around £300-500 when all that money could go towards something actually maintaing education, which would be train and bus passes which don't even cost half that (about £400 est. I make it) and they could get free equipment for some pupils e.g. art, photography tax free making less money wasted for things irrelevant for maintaining education - and resit fees don't cost the world either. That sort of system makes more sense and requires less effort on both the student AND the agency sides, than a system which seems to be dangling the carrot infront of people, and alot of people who do receive the EMA spend it on things completely irrelevant. It's no wonder this country doesn't understand the value of money, when education is a gift not to be wasted on people who apparently need money to get out of bed to go places. Don't give them the money, remind them of how lucky they are and give them support through other means which won't cause conflicts and a huge mess at the end of the day.

[StefanWolves]

The whole system is unfair. You seem to have no argument other than "jealousy" which is blind and somewhat brain dead as you appear to not be taking in any arguments and therefore don't come out with a counter-argument :/ You may be receiving EMA payments, and find it unfair when others who are in a similar circumstance don't receive it, even though when you take the amount of family members into account, and the amount the parents earn into account, you're in the same boat :/

The whole EMA system is terribly flawed and makes no rational sense as a concept. Alot of money must be wasted through the EMA - £30 a week calculating at about over £1,000 per year (taking into account summer, christmas, easter etc) or £10 a week being around £300-500 when all that money could go towards something actually maintaing education, which would be train and bus passes which don't even cost half that (about £400 est. I make it) and they could get free equipment for some pupils e.g. art, photography tax free making less money wasted for things irrelevant for maintaining education - and resit fees don't cost the world either. That sort of system makes more sense and requires less effort on both the student AND the agency sides, than a system which seems to be dangling the carrot infront of people, and alot of people who do receive the EMA spend it on things completely irrelevant. It's no wonder this country doesn't understand the value of money, when education is a gift not to be wasted on people who apparently need money to get out of bed to go places. Don't give them the money, remind them of how lucky they are and give them support through other means which won't cause conflicts and a huge mess at the end of the day.

Ugh, did you ever receive/are receiving EMA? my guess is no.

Were you ever eligible for EMA? my guess is no.

Would you of needed EMA? my guess is no.

You can't comment on behalf of the MILLIONS of students in this country who NEED EMA, you have no understanding of how much EMA will help out a large part of the child population in this country, some people are not as privilieged as you, It's becoming blatantly obvious that you live in a fairly wealthy family where government help (money) is not needed, so you or anyone else (that is not receiving EMA) on this forum doesn't have ANY rights to say that EMA is and I quote;

Alot of money must be wasted through the EMA

~ and you are persistantly saying that instead of EMA, give us bus passes/free train passes, how would that help? most people I know don't use the bus, to get to school or anything like that, they would only use it for going up town, no one I know uses the trains, we use the trams, but that's only to get up town (I fail to see how this would help any students at all, it would actually cause more problems, isn't our transport service in this country bad enough already? imagine what it would be like if millions of students getting free transport? big no no). you are also saying 'Instead of giving them money, just give them school equipment' - erm? what do you think the whole point of EMA is?

Yes, I agree, some people will not spend it on the right things, but the vast majority will, honestly how many druggies/binge drinkers/chavs (these are the ones that give us teenagers a bad name, and these are the ones that would obviously miss-use this money) do you see at school ever getting to college/6th form? yes some do, but the vast majority don't.

I'm sorry if I'm coming across as all grouchy, but honestly, when people say money like this is a 'waste of money' really pisses me off, you have no right to say that, especially in this economic climate when MOST people who are eligible for EMA will use it on the right things.

And I cannot believe you said this:

It's no wonder this country doesn't understand the value of money, when education is a gift not to be wasted on people who apparently need money to get out of bed to go places. Don't give them the money, remind them of how lucky they are and give them support through other means which won't cause conflicts and a huge mess at the end of the day.

So you're saying that all the people who receive EMA are only going to school to receive EMA? yes I agree, the government does use it as an incentive to go to college, but even if I weren't eligible for EMA I'd still be going to college, so I do not see why you have bought this crap up.

EMA does not cause a huge mess, it stops the huge mess from happening.

[GommeInc]

You can't comment on behalf of the MILLIONS of students in this country WHO need EMA, you have no understanding of how much EMA will help out a large part of the child population in this country, some people are not as privilieged as you, It's becoming blatantly obvious that you live in a fairly wealthy family where government help (money) is not needed, so you or anyone else (that is not receiving EMA) on this forum doesn't have ANY rights to say that EMA is and I quote; ~ and you are persistantly saying that instead of EMA, give us bus passes/free train passes, how would that help? most people I know don't use the bus, to get to school or anything like that, they would only use it for going up town, no one I know uses the trains, we use the trams, but that's only to get up town.

I've never said the EMA doesn't help students - my argument is that it doesn't help students in the way that is feasible and useful to a decent range of students in the country Also, free bus and train passes WILL help. That's what the EMA is designed to help with, to get to school and go have a decent education. Food isn't a problem, you get fed at home all the time :/ How do you go to education then? You seem to digging a hole of "I'm one of these people who shouldn't have the EMA, I just like free money". What do you spend the EMA on then? Because from what I can tell it has nothing to do with the "E" in EMA, especially when transport costs are usually the only problem with getting to and from and educational establishment. I don't get any part of your argument, you seem to just want money. If you want money, go get a job rather than waste benefits for something completely irrelevant :/ Not being rude, but being honest. It doesn't make anyone look good. It's like being a beggar or tramp, but contracted and systematic. If the EMA was actually maintain education, by free transport and monetary assistant when necessary, the system would be fine, but it seems to be for the lazy (because loads only take it to get to school/college, as proven in this thread by a select few AND for people too lazy to get a job to get money for personal use).

Yes, I agree, some people will not spend it on the right things, but the vast majority will, honestly how many druggies/binge drinkers/chavs do you see at school ever getting to college/6th form? yes some do, but the vast majority don't.

I'm sorry if I'm coming across as all grouchy, but honestly, when people say money like this is a 'waste of money' really pisses me off, you have no right to say that, especially in this economic climate when MOST people who are eligible for EMA will use it on the right things.

I do have a right to say that actually, everyone does Wanna guess where that money comes from? And the economic downturn is partly due to handing out money with no return e.g. mortgages to the poor and giving out money to the poor, while getting no money back in return.

Seriously, you don't understand my point. Education isn't actually that expensive. The only expenses are on transport and usually equipment, and if the EMA transformed into an agency which gave out free bus/train passes (as well as other schemes), free equipment depending on the course and monetary assistance with things like re-sits, then you've got quite a good system with very little flaws and it covers all the problems, rather than literally waste unnecessary amounts of money. EMA is for educational purposes - personal purposes is what a job is for.

So you're saying that all the people who receive EMA are only going to school to receive EMA? yes I agree, the government does use it as an incentive to go to college, but even if I weren't eligible for EMA I'd still be going to college, so I do not see why you have bought this crap up.

EMA does not cause a huge mess, it stops the huge mess from happening.

It is the case for quite alot of people, so it's not crap. You've yet to give me a response that makes the EMA look like a good system as it is now. Your excuse is to defend it, like Smeagol and the one ring :/ Why is the EMA important for you? What does it do for your education? Because you've not answered. If you actually answered maybe we could waste less time ranting aimlessly at each other :/

[StefanWolves]

I've never said the EMA doesn't help students - my argument is that it doesn't help students in the way that is feasible and useful to a decent range of students in the country Also, free bus and train passes WILL help. That's what the EMA is designed to help with, to get to school and go have a decent education. Food isn't a problem, you get fed at home all the time :/ How do you go to education then? You seem to digging a hole of "I'm one of these people who shouldn't have the EMA, I just like free money". What do you spend the EMA on then? Because from what I can tell it has nothing to do with the "E" in EMA, especially when transport costs are usually the only problem with getting to and from and educational establishment. I don't get any part of your argument, you seem to just want money. If you want money, go get a job rather than waste benefits for something completely irrelevant :/ Not being rude, but being honest. It doesn't make anyone look good. It's like being a beggar or tramp, but contracted and systematic. If the EMA was actually maintain education, by free transport and monetary assistant when necessary, the system would be fine, but it seems to be for the lazy (because loads only take it to get to school/college, as proven in this thread by a select few AND for people too lazy to get a job to get money for personal use).


I do have a right to say that actually, everyone does Wanna guess where that money comes from? And the economic downturn is partly due to handing out money with no return e.g. mortgages to the poor and giving out money to the poor, while getting no money back in return.

Seriously, you don't understand my point. Education isn't actually that expensive. The only expenses are on transport and usually equipment, and if the EMA transformed into an agency which gave out free bus/train passes (as well as other schemes), free equipment depending on the course and monetary assistance with things like re-sits, then you've got quite a good system with very little flaws and it covers all the problems, rather than literally waste unnecessary amounts of money. EMA is for educational purposes - personal purposes is what a job is for.

I think you should re-read my post, as I edited it.

And seeing as though I'm 16, going to 6th form for 4 days a week, leaves only 1/2 days for work, I work on 1 day for 5 hours, which gets me £25 (which along with my EMA is just enough every week for me to support myself, with a little bit of help from my family, who are currently UNEMPLOYED), leaving the other two days for staying at home doing school work, so I don't know where you argument is going with that one.

Bus passes and train passes would not help, anyone, at all, terrible argument.

[GommeInc]

I think you should re-read my post, as I edited it.

And seeing as though I'm 16, going to 6th form for 4 days a week, leaves only 1/2 days for work, I work on 1 day for 5 hours, which gets me £25 (which along with my EMA is just enough every week for me to support myself, with a little bit of help from my family, who are currently UNEMPLOYED), leaving the other two days for staying at home doing school work, so I don't know where you argument is going with that one.

Bus passes and train passes would not help, anyone, at all, terrible argument.

Why is it terrible? You don't give an answer, which is leading me to believe even more that the EMA is the young beggars holy grail

[StefanWolves]

Why is it terrible? You don't give an answer, which is leading me to believe even more that the EMA is the young beggars holy grail

Did you read my above posts? before this debate goes any further, how old are you? are you/did you receive EMA? my guess is no anyway.

I don't see you giving me any proof that EMA is a bad idea, I don't see you linking to any studies/polls supporting your argument, all I see is a few fellow people on this forum supporting your idea, mainly because they are not receiving EMA.

[GommeInc]

Did you read my above posts? before this debate goes any further, how old are you? are you/did you receive EMA? my guess is no anyway.

I don't see you giving me any proof that EMA is a bad idea, I don't see you linking to any studies/polls supporting your argument, all I see is a few fellow people on this forum supporting your idea, mainly because they are not receiving EMA.

So we're agreed then, it is a stupid idea? It is well known that some people do not use the EMA to maintain their education I don't need proof for that. It is also well known that the system is flawed for not taking into consideration a need by need basis of how many are in the family and how much income is taken into account to support that family. Below are the requirements:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Educatio.../EMA/DG_066945

What is EMA?

Basically, EMA is cash in your hands to help you carry on learning. If you’re 16, 17 or 18 and have left, or are about to leave, compulsory education, then it could be for you.

EMA spells fewer money worries with up to £30 a week during term time – leaving you to get on with your studies.

To find out if you are eligible, see ‘EMA: how much, how often’.

^ What helps to carry on learning? This is common sense, by the way - transport and equipment costs. What has been suggested? Cutting out the transport and equipment costs, which will cost less than the current EMA system. What else does money need to be spent on? School uniform? You'd already have it and people over 16+ don't tend to have a use for uniform anymore. What else do you need to spend it on? Nothing, because nothing else is educational. Fact.

What could EMA do for you?
EMA is paid straight into your bank account

Whatever you decide to do, EMA could help you with the cost of books, travel, equipment or anything useful to continue learning.

It’s worth up to £30 a week, and it’s paid straight into your bank account, not to your parents or your college.

See, even the EMA website says it is there for costs of books, travel, equipment and anything of use. The quote above makes me believe that you don't know anything about the EMA and what it is for, especially when you said this:

...
Bus passes and train passes would not help, anyone, at all, terrible argument.

Which is why it would be better if the EMA cut out the middle man of giving students the money; but gave out free bus passes (as stated by the EMA, is a use for the money. FACT.), monetary assistance for equipment (also stated as a use by the EMA. FACT.) and other money concerns e.g. resits.

Seriously, you receive the EMA, yet know nothing about it's use :/

If you want money for personal use, get a job :/ Yes, college takes up alot of time, but that's what it is there for - to take up time to give you an education. A small, weekend job will give you enough money. The importance of saving is a great deal. Seriously, the EMA is based around greed. Whoever it was who said "people who disagree with the EMA are the only ones who don't get it" is proof of that :/

[StefanWolves]

So we're agreed then, it is a stupid idea? It is well known that some people do not use the EMA to maintain their education I don't need proof for that. It is also well known that the system is flawed for not taking into consideration a need by need basis of how many are in the family and how much income is taken into account to support that family. Below are the requirements:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Educatio.../EMA/DG_066945


^ What helps to carry on learning? This is common sense, by the way - transport and equipment costs. What has been suggested? Cutting out the transport and equipment costs, which will cost less than the current EMA system. What else does money need to be spent on? School uniform? You'd already have it and people over 16+ don't tend to have a use for uniform anymore. What else do you need to spend it on? Nothing, because nothing else is educational. Fact.


See, even the EMA website says it is there for costs of books, travel, equipment and anything of use. The quote above makes me believe that you don't know anything about the EMA and what it is for, especially when you said this:



Which is why it would be better if the EMA cut out the middle man of giving students the money; but gave out free bus passes (as stated by the EMA, is a use for the money. FACT.), monetary assistance for equipment (also stated as a use by the EMA. FACT.) and other money concerns e.g. resits.

Seriously, you receive the EMA, yet know nothing about it's use :/

If you want money for personal use, get a job :/ Yes, college takes up alot of time, but that's what it is there for - to take up time to give you an education. A small, weekend job will give you enough money. The importance of saving is a great deal. Seriously, the EMA is based around greed. Whoever it was who said "people who disagree with the EMA are the only ones who don't get it" is proof of that :/

Ugh, you seriously don't get the current situation for most families, do you? yes EMA is for Education costs, obviously, it can be saved up over the two years to help pay for University fees? ever thought of that?

Millions of people are in a bad way at the moment, money is hard to get your hands on, yes this money is for education, and most of mine will go on that, even if you and your narrow minded opinion doesn't agree with it.

Read my views on thos from page 1-now, then you will see why EMA will help many people, not just for education purposes, but for others in this terrible economic climate.

[GommeInc]

Ugh, you seriously don't get the current situation for most families, do you? yes EMA is for Education costs, obviously, it can be saved up over the two years to help pay for University fees? ever thought of that?

Millions of people are in a bad way at the moment, money is hard to get your hands on, yes this money is for education, and most of mine will go on that, even if you and your narrow minded opinion doesn't agree with it.

Read my views on thos from page 1-now, then you will see why EMA will help many people, not just for education purposes, but for others in this terrible economic climate.

Ever heard of student loans? You can also get a job at university, AND the EMA isn't there to help pay for university - it's there for students aged 16 to 18. So you're avoiding the point, again. And it is for educational purposes, fact. If you can't understand that, stop spending on useless things. The economic climate isn't even that bad, so you're digging a well into something completely unrelated to the central point of the EMA. Besides, there are other benefit aids to your disposal. But the EMA, is yet again, for educational purposes and the EMA clearly states "transport, books, equipment and anything useful to continue learning." It's not narrow mindedness, just picking out that greed is a terrible desire - and it seems to be what you are suffering from, no offense :/

[StefanWolves]

Ever heard of student loans?

Wow, so now you're suggesting for students to get in debt before they even get to go to Uni? I know it happens, but if saving up EMA helps me to get to Uni without being in as much debt, then so be it.

You can also get a job at university, AND the EMA isn't there to help pay for university

So now you are suggesting if people want to go to Uni, that they should, get in debt, then study, and have a job, all at the same time? wow? how many people do you see doing that?

it's there for students aged 16 to 18. So you're avoiding the point, again.

Lol, no, I'm not avoiding the point, just rubbing your face in another way that EMA could be used for EDUCATION MAINTENANCE, didn't you know Uni is also a part of the Education? :rolleyes: -sarcasm-

And it is for educational purposes, fact. If you can't understand that, stop spending on useless things.

So, now, I'm spending me EMA on useless things? seeing as though I haven't got any EMA yet (as I haven't yet started 6th form), way to go, nice jumping to conclusions their, however, yes, I have spent £350 of my EMA, on a laptop which I will be using for school work, Oh wait, that's something else that I will be using for education! thanks to my EMA, I leant the money off my nan until just before Chistmas, so when I have got enough EMA in my bank account, I will pay her back.

The economic climate isn't even that bad

Wow, understatement of the year? say that to the hundreds of thousands of people who have been made unemployed this year, FACT, my parents are a couple of those.

so you're digging a well into something completely unrelated to the central point of the EMA.

No i'm not, you are the trying to ram crap alternatives to EMA down peoples throats.

Yet again, I don't see you providing any proof of ANYONE saying that EMA is a waste and is not needed, all I see is you giving you opinions and your alternatives, with other people on this forum who are not receiving EMA agreeing with them.