Sportsssssss banter/arguments

[Catzsy]

I'm currently trying to persuade Matt to hire a 'Sports' moderator.

Someone who knows about football but wouldn't be bias.

Hard job but I have a couple of reccomendations, it's just hard to persuade Matt

It's gotta be worth a try using someone else who knows what they are talking about

@ Jake: If you'd PM'd Matt in the first place to get it reversed it'd have been done a lot quicker without any fuss.

My personal view is that someone heavily involved in a section is not always the one to moderate it especially as a new mod - it would be extremely difficult not to show bias and adds unecessary pressure on the individual as a lot of the members posting he/she will consider to be an e-friend and it would be up to the mod to take action if the rules are broken. I have seen this happen before. It's all down to common sense and as I have always said just because a post gets reported doesn't necessarily mean that the reporter is right - they could have many motives for doing it. If you read a post and have doubts that it breaks the rules then it is best left alone. In my experience it is these 50/50 situations where the infraction/warnings are reversed. Also when a post is reported the whole thread should be read to make sure that any action taken is even handed otherwise somebody could feel they are being targetted and this was not the intention just an error of not reading the thread. I give great kudos to Matt as he is one of the first Forum Managers who does not place a great emphasis on mod logs - he looks at the whole picture and should be commended for it.

[nvrspk4]

I think banter is fine.

I also think that the "sports forum" has taken it upon themselves to redefine banter - rather broadly.

I think Catzsy made a perfect example so I won't bother making one of my own - there is a point where you switch from joking to being rude, basically attacking them.

I think in certain situations moderators might overstep and misclassify an attack as banter, but usually those are pretty well dealt with in the appeals process.

Nice to know when Moderators make a mistake that they PM you with their apologies as has happened as a result of this thread. I'm not going to change my opinion because I get an apology from the Forum Manager and the Super Moderator in question because you shouldn't have to make such a fuss to get it reversed and be accused of personal attacks by management and subject to comments from super moderators such as and I quote "your name looks better in italics".

Over the last two months I have been cautioned twice. Both times after the caution had expired and I was able to complain (seeing as you can't when you're cautioned) the infraction was reversed. That's two weeks of being penalised for absolutely no reason, both by the same Super Moderator.

However, I take my hat off to them that both people who were in the wrong here sent me apologies and told me in unequivocal terms that it was an error of judgement. Stark contrast which from what was said last night on exactly the same topic.

In this instance an AGM had to punish a Super Moderator and spoke to both the FM and the SM (from what I gather) this shouldn't have to happen for them to realise they can't always be right and sometimes, however rare it may be, the user is in fact right.

1) You didn't *have* to make a fuss, you could have taken the correct avenues

2) The name looks better in italics thing is, to me, an obvious joke.

3) You can appeal an infraction while you're cautioned, there's a section on the support system for that purpose.

However, he had labelled it a personal attack as this thread has confirmed so saw no point in doing that. He was unlikely to reverse an infraction on a post he accused me of attacking an individual.

He came to the understanding that he was wrong after understanding it. Had you chosen to use private channels, I daresay the interaction would have been a little less hostile and it would have been easier to fix the misunderstanding

[Immenseman]

1) You didn't *have* to make a fuss, you could have taken the correct avenues

When it constantly happens and I constantly go down such avenues it gets rather tiring when things aren't improving. You can check my own infraction record, see how many have been reversed. That's just mine, I dread to think what others look like.

This isn't like it's the first time it's happened it's like the 10th or something similar. When things are constantly bad you take an alternative route in the rather vain hope things might improve.

2) The name looks better in italics thing is, to me, an obvious joke.

Well it was aimed at me and I don't find it funny. If it was posted on the forum it would have been removed and the moderation in question dealt with upon my request.

3) You can appeal an infraction while you're cautioned, there's a section on the support system for that purpose.

He came to the understanding that he was wrong after understanding it. Had you chosen to use private channels, I daresay the interaction would have been a little less hostile and it would have been easier to fix the misunderstanding

As I said in the thread I was told there was no point because all the Super Moderators agreed with the infraction, including the Forum Manager.

It took intervention from people in a more senior position to sort out my personal issue. Would everyone get this treatment? No. There are people out there who have to put up with awful infractions being given and the fact that the moderation team all discuss them on MSN there is often little hope in getting them removed.

Not in all cases, no. Some, yes. The moderation quite frankly isn't good enough since the new super moderators were chosen. You might think this is people just complaining yet I see thread after thread making complaints. Of course, nothing will be done. We're used to that.

[xxMATTGxx]

When it constantly happens and I constantly go down such avenues it gets rather tiring when things aren't improving. You can check my own infraction record, see how many have been reversed. That's just mine, I dread to think what others look like.

This isn't like it's the first time it's happened it's like the 10th or something similar. When things are constantly bad you take an alternative route in the rather vain hope things might improve.

Well it was aimed at me and I don't find it funny. If it was posted on the forum it would have been removed and the moderation in question dealt with upon my request.



As I said in the thread I was told there was no point because all the Super Moderators agreed with the infraction, including the Forum Manager.

It took intervention from people in a more senior position to sort out my personal issue. Would everyone get this treatment? No. There are people out there who have to put up with awful infractions being given and the fact that the moderation team all discuss them on MSN there is often little hope in getting them removed.

Not in all cases, no. Some, yes. The moderation quite frankly isn't good enough since the new super moderators were chosen. You might think this is people just complaining yet I see thread after thread making complaints. Of course, nothing will be done. We're used to that.

You could have still appealed the infraction even if everyone "did" agree. Why? Because it would of got a second look. When I looked at everything and decided it was unfair then I apologized for my misunderstanding from the start.


Your personal issue, the infraction?

[Immenseman]

You could have still appealed the infraction even if everyone "did" agree. Why? Because it would of got a second look. When I looked at everything and decided it was unfair then I apologized for my misunderstanding from the start.

That's the thing, that post doesn't need a second look. It was an awful decision. It's not like the post ever changed. When you say it's a worthy infraction then I don't see any hope in it getting reversed. I was going to appeal it that night, not through the thread or any forum staff because working with anyone related to the forum is never constructive for me.

Your personal issue, the infraction?

yes.

[xxMATTGxx]

That's the thing, that post doesn't need a second look. It was an awful decision. It's not like the post ever changed. When you say it's a worthy infraction then I don't see any hope in it getting reversed. I was going to appeal it that night, not through the thread or any forum staff because working with anyone related to the forum is never constructive for me.

yes.

I wouldn't call it special treatment, although I don't know what treatment you are actually going on about.

[Immenseman]

Well what I mean is the fact an AGM sent me a PM without me sending them one that the infraction was unfair. My point was I don't think everyone would get a PM so would just have to put up with the forum staff team all siding together like happened in this case. Of course you wouldn't know because the PM wasn't sent to you... :S

[xxMATTGxx]

Well what I mean is the fact an AGM sent me a PM without me sending them one that the infraction was unfair. My point was I don't think everyone would get a PM so would just have to put up with the forum staff team all siding together like happened in this case. Of course you wouldn't know because the PM wasn't sent to you... :S

The whole forum team didn't even know about your infraction. If anyone above thought it was unfair, then fair enough. If they did PM me suggesting they think an infraction is unfair I would have still looked at it again.

If one of Moderators thinks it’s unfair and one of them thinks its fair, then there's a discussion and a final decision is made. The thread should have been looked at before the infraction was given due to the very similar posts above and below. If people have problems with infractions then they can appeal. If they still don't like the result, then they can appeal again and much greater view by other people will also be included before making it a final decision whether it is fair or not. Yes I must admit it was a problem with the Moderation at the time in that thread and also my mistake for not noticing it sooner and misunderstanding it.

[e5]

This threads now turned into the immenseman infractions discussion:rolleyes:. No offence jake because I love you

I want to get to the bottom of whats going to happen to the sports section; it's clearly no good as it is now, too many members are complaining, and even members that don't use the section regularly see a problem with it. Something needs to be done in favour of the majority.

[adaym]

And that would be an attack at me would it? Seeming as I'm the Person C. Thing is, you know that you can't get into trouble for it because you didn't name me, even though, to me, it's pretty obvious that was about me

Sorry I thought person C was a hypothetical.