Habbox Forum Activity and Suggestions for Change

[Immenseman]

Before I start this thread is not about being negative or to criticise. This thread is about recognising what I believe is a current issue at Habbox Forum and discussing ways, with the people that are important - the members - to solve the problem and look to management to implement, where possible, the suggestions that we make.

It is my personal belief, shared with a number of people I have spoken to in regard to the issue, that in general activity on Habbox Forum has began to falter in recent weeks. I will give you the example that frustrates me:

CHF: Currently Active Users: 90 (56 members and 34 guests)
HxF: Currently Active Users: 113 (48 members and 65 guests)

Yes, we have more active users overall but it is the amount of members that is important. Yes, this is just what I've checked a second ago but I have seen it happening on several occasions and when I resigned as AFM HxF would always have more members online than CHF. They were never real 'rivals', but now they are.

I was meaning to make a similar thread and was going to draw pretty much the same comparisons you have with regards to ClubHabbo. With all due respect to CH, HxF has always been seen as the bigger and better fan site. I'd like to make it clear now that I still believe it is however the gulf has decreased considerably.

Now there is where the issue is in my opinion. We all know CH has attracted newer users, I'd say it has a bigger influence than Habbox on the actual Habbo client itself. This has been the case since I started using both forums in 2006/2007. HxF was more established but CH was more attractive to the newer user.

Two years on they are seeing the beneficial side of this. Those newer users are sticking around and making their forum more active than Habbox. OK, they don't have the same amount of users but if you look on there "New Posts" then you do the same on HxF - they have much more active posters throughout the day.

For example, our highest poster is like 22k (excluding jins test clone) and there highest is 33k. Our highest would only be 3rd on that site and that'd be close in itself. I know this is a small representation but I think it sums up my point that although they still have less members it seems to be a lot busier.

So, what are the reasons for this change in Forum activity?

• The Forum demographic has changed.

The Forum consists of quite a lot of die hard members who have been here for quite a while; from the 'older' generation of Habbos. As they grow older, their interest in such a Forum begins to wane and they have further commitments such as school / college / university / work. Thus, the time they can spend on HxF is reduced and this has a significant impact on Forum activity as a whole. Yes, we have had new members and yes, some of them have stayed using HxF but the majority of registered members don't post or have never posted.

The regular posters who are leaving or not posting as frequent any more aren't being replaced by new active users. That's the issue. It's always going to be the same for any forum - people come people go. The problem here is those who come aren't really posting - certainly not to the extent of the people who have left anyway.

• It is an awkward time of year.
  

I touched on the fact above that a lot of people are going to school / college / university / work. This is the time of year where a lot of people just start there new courses and are beginning to adjust to this change as it can be a lot of work. Therefore they don't have enough time right now to use the internet and chat on Habbox Forum. In theory this should improve as the year continues.

It's an awkward time for all fan sites though. I actively use quite a few - it's not the same on those. I know summer is going to be the most active period and this arguably the quietest period so the contrast between the two might be making the problem seem worse than it actually just. Just a suggestion.

• We are not retaining new members.

It seems to me that a lot of the time someone signs up and posts saying hello, perhaps makes a couple of threads or posts and then never comes back online. What we need to look at is why this is and how we can retain them in the future.

These are three key issues I can think of, I am sure there are many more - if you can think of any issues that you think are contributing to the change in HxF's member activity then please feel free to suggest them. However I would ask that you keep this constructive! I really don't want to see something like "well the Moderators are ****". If you think Moderation is bad, give examples, back up your points and explain WHY you think Moderation is bad so we can look at how to solve the problem (sorry to use the Moderation team as an example, they are the most commonly victimised).

I don't think it really has the pull back factor. Unless you want to be on HxF, you're not going to stay. When I first joined I was determined to be a Rare Values Reporter P). If you didn't have such determination then I don't think you would really visit again. The community is hardly thriving.

Adding onto the example you gave. HxF is seen as the harshest fan site - it's strict and this keeps people away. I know for a fact that this is true because I've heard so many people say it. This doesn't bother me because I'm used to it and don't really mind it (hence why I'm the most active member :eusa_danc) but it's bound to have a detrimental effect on the amount of people posting and signing up.

So now it seems important to discuss ways to improve the influx and retention of members as well as the improvement of current member activity if possible:

• Change / Remove the post approval procedure.
  

Yes, I can see it's benefits. It does very well to minimise the impact of spam bots on Habbox Forum. Yes it works fine on a lot of other Forums. In my opinion though, Habbox Forum is uniquely different.
I believe that the process of having posts approved is limiting the retention of new members and perhaps even the return of members who were previously banned. My experience in Moderation showed me that the post approval process was neglected by Moderation - and it could well still be. Not only that, our Moderators are not professionals but volunteers and they do not work on a time shift. If someone posts a thread and fails to receive a reply for a couple of hours because there are no moderators online to approve his thread, he's going to get frustrated and leave. I know I would.
Do the benefits outweigh the negatives of this though? The answer would be yes, in my opinion. We would get the occasional spam bot posting on the Forum. Normally, Moderators are quick to get rid of these though. Additionally, so what if you get three or four threads about Nike trainers on the Forum for half an hour? Most people are not stupid enough to go along with it anyway.
The other negative would be members coming onto cause trouble... I don't know how many of you remember SOLAR FLARE!!!!, but the post approval system would most certainly see him ruined. Once again though, the Moderators are usually quick to deal with this and indeed they are grateful for something to do. Not that I encourage rule breaking and not that I am suggesting we abolish the rules, people like SOLAR FLARE!!! caused controversy that made the Forum interesting once in a while. People don't like the images he posted, but it's quite funny to see Goatse spammed on the Forum... what I am trying to say is that Habbox Forum seems to have become too robotic, which leads me onto my next point.

I agree. I want to see it taken down to 5 to be honest. It will still eradicate the issues of spam bots which was the biggest problem. The current regulations on post approval is keeping people away. Why should they have to wait 15 posts before they can post freely?

A key concept of a forum is being able to discuss. If a new member is to post in a discussion their post won't be added straight away. It must be incredibly frustrating for them. Even when it is added the thread could be on the second page or something so their post is totally ignored.

They are basically excluded for their first 15 posts, which can be around a week say they make a couple of posts a day. A week is more than enough for people to get fed up and give up with the system and just stop posting altogether. It's happened and will continue to happen until necessary changes are implemented.

• Abolish the automatic ban procedure (i.e. after receiving x amount of infractions y is banned automatically).
  

This is no doubt going to be a controversial suggestion and it is certainly not one that I believe will be implemented. Most people are pro-automatic banning and indeed, so am I to a certain extent. However, I think automatic banning removes the 'personal' touch Moderation used to have. You might wonder how I think this impacts on members activity but I think it goes back to the point that it creates an atmosphere of that Habbox is run by robots. I just feel it's unnecessary and too uptight, and will make current members feel less constricted.
Instead of this I would suggest general banning guidelines for Super Moderators and a guidelines for when normal Moderators should suggest that someone gets banned. Return the personal touch to Moderation and take away the way in which anyone can get banned for pretty much anything. It creates a unified law for all but it does not take into account a Moderator's expert personal knowledge.

Funnily enough I actually disagree with you here. I think that the current system is better than leaving things done to discretion. Primarily because people are incapable of making decisions correctly in the related departments - it will be awful.

Also, I think the current system you know exactly what's going to happen and in some cases will encourage people to behave. I know when I had 4 infractions I made sure I didn't get my 5th for the caution.

Although it would eradicate such issues, I got my 5th. Cautioned for a week. Got it reversed when I returned. Then it happened again. Two weeks caution when they both reversed.

I can see both side of the argument but I think it's easier for the moderation department and it's made unequivocal to the members how the discipline system works so if they fall foul of it then it's completely their own fault because they knew what was coming.

• Introduce a new Habbox Council, or some form of Member Representatives.

There are two instances, in the form of the Habbox Council and the Community Support Team that have taken similar roles to what I am suggesting. There was a problem however. To quote a former member of both: "we were given a role and never the powers to complete it nor the support to get anything important up and running". So my suggestion would be to implement a new form of these organisations, perhaps have a small group (I would say around three) of members who are voted by the community to represent the community. They would then have regular meetings with Catzsy and they would together create and most importantly IMPLEMENT the ideas they come up with. Devolve power to the people and they stay happy. Give no one authority and don't try turn this into a hierarchy or a department.

Nvrspk4 was never keen on the idea if memory serves correctly so I doubt he has changed his mind. It wasn't handled right the first time and I think he was in charge of it so I don't see how things will get any better now that he's an even more advanced position.

Anyway, things do have to change. I've had enough of management posting saying change will happen and they are acknowledging the problems and trying to resolve them. I actually want to see action now and things implemented and scrapped as they need to be. I'm sure I'm living in false hope that things will improve though because management seem to have adopted a "put up or shut up" mentality.

It all comes down to complacency really. They thought they would always be the biggest forum when in reality it's not going to be like that. They need to get back to grass roots level and start getting the new members in rather than just relying on word of mouth for Habbox to get around. Recruitment campaign is needed, could be a job for the new member representatives campaign you suggested

Well without a doubt the forum was much better when ---MAD--- was in charge. What a controversial statement.

I'm not saying get rid of Nebula, it's not even related, but it's just an observation...

I agree.

[Mr-Trainor]

I think that moderators need to check it for often, and as for reducing spam. I think not, I once made an account for the specific intention of pissing someone off once and all I had to do was make 15 quick posts in 'welcome to habbox' (then wait an hour for my user group to change) and I was able to post because it's not limited. Also having post count increase in the welcome forum seems pointless aswell because:

a) Spambots can get posting easily
b) People can boost their post count by making a 2 second post.


Basically I think all moderators should be able to allow new posts, even if not in their section and post count shouldn't increase in the 'welcome to habbox' forum.

I believe that isn't possible. Super moderators have mod tools in all section and can therefore approve posts anywhere. However, moderators only have their tools in the sections they moderate. So to approve posts in every section, they'd need mod tools in every section but that's the job of a super mod

[lick]

anyone who posts after this is dating rozi

[Hecktix]

Im gonna have to keep this short as im on my phone, ill try and post a better response when im home tomorrow.

- The damned Post Approval System.
I hate this system and I often moan about it to other department members. In my personal opinion posts should be approved within 10 minutes or less. However in reality it can take well over an hour. On numerous occasions within unapproved posts you find two similar threads as the user has got confused and posted their thread again as they thought their first post had failed. Naturally this is gonna lose us new members. So I agree here. It's more trouble than its worth.

I cannot comment on bringing in new members as really the only way to do this is via Habbo and I dont use Habbo

[Plank]

I don't post much any more, just because I got bored basically :S This place doesn't feel the same as it used to be

Also, what has happened to the weekly updates?

[lick]

Mattgarner got bored of adding full stops to rules and changing forum names so he stopped

[xxMATTGxx]

I believe we are reducing the 'Post Approving' system down to around 5 posts. Which I shall look into tomorrow. I believe removing the automatic caution/ban system will cause more problems than it is at the moment and this way there will be good enough evidence that they have actually broken the rules and so on. To let people know that the other week that I made a thread addressing the moderation department on things what they should and shouldn't be doing. I'm also thinking about bringing something else into action to keep mistakes to a minimum. Although we are humans and everyone makes mistakes. But you have heard that line for a while now.

anyone who posts after this is dating rozi

Serious, just behave yourself and don't post stupid things.

Mattgarner got bored of adding full stops to rules and changing forum names so he stopped

Not really.

[lick]

I believe we are reducing the 'Post Approving' system down to around 5 posts. Which I shall look into tomorrow. I believe removing the automatic caution/ban system will cause more problems than it is at the moment and this way there will be good enough evidence that they have actually broken the rules and so on. To let people know that the other week that I made a thread addressing the moderation department on things what they should and shouldn't be doing. I'm also thinking about bringing something else into action to keep mistakes to a minimum. Although we are humans and everyone makes mistakes. But you have heard that line for a while now.



Serious, just behave yourself and don't post stupid things.



Not really.

Thats not stupid :S:S:S

Yes really

[Immenseman]

I believe we are reducing the 'Post Approving' system down to around 5 posts. Which I shall look into tomorrow. I believe removing the automatic caution/ban system will cause more problems than it is at the moment and this way there will be good enough evidence that they have actually broken the rules and so on. To let people know that the other week that I made a thread addressing the moderation department on things what they should and shouldn't be doing. I'm also thinking about bringing something else into action to keep mistakes to a minimum. Although we are humans and everyone makes mistakes. But you have heard that line for a while now.

Good. I hope to see it changed tomorrow then.

Serious, just behave yourself and don't post stupid things.

Not really.

Well at the time it was made very clear to us as users that management realise Habbox is a diverse place and to ensure it continues to do so well minor changes will be made on a weekly basis. As I said at the time it didn't last very long.

The thing is there could be beneficial changes every week, easily. You just don't bother - it's more of a 3 or so weekly thing rather than the weekly updates we were first promised. No surprise though.

[Chippiewill]

I believe that isn't possible. Super moderators have mod tools in all section and can therefore approve posts anywhere. However, moderators only have their tools in the sections they moderate. So to approve posts in every section, they'd need mod tools in every section but that's the job of a super mod

Hmm, if groups work in the only logicial way then I can't see it being difficult. On phpbb3 you would just make a new group that can do nothing except moderate new posters in every forum and then you would stick every single user who you want moderating new posters in it. Then again, I have never used VB and it may be more simplified.